Bitcoin Forum
April 24, 2024, 05:12:33 AM *
News: Latest Bitcoin Core release: 27.0 [Torrent]
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register More  
Pages: 1 2 3 4 [All]
  Print  
Author Topic: Greenlandic tupilaks (and other traditional arctic crafts and knives)  (Read 21190 times)
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
August 30, 2011, 07:09:05 PM
Last edit: October 18, 2011, 02:48:50 PM by netrin
 #1

Hi sub-arctic friends,

I'm selling Greenlandic tupilaks which are traditional magic figures made from bone (sorry I'm not exporting human bone, don't ask), claws, tusks, or more recently from precious metals. These often-grotesque statues are used to curse or magically kill enemies, though none of those I'm selling will have been 'activated' Smiley. All of them are hand made from native wild animals such as reindeer, muskox, pheasant, fox, seal, whale, walrus, and polar bear (can not export sea mamals to most countries).

Shipping is a bit slow and expensive from Greenland, but otherwise I can get good deals on the pieces and the profits will be shared with the artists. They come in numerous shapes and sizes, from cute to ugly and scary. Key chains are about 7 BTC, large complex pieces can be 50 BTC or much more. I'm also selling beautiful hand-made modern and traditional knives, but first, I'd like to scope out the interest. Let me know what country you are in so we can trade only legal animal products. Note that the Greenlanders use and consume all of the animal even when killed in self defense, the sale of these products support the local economy.

Wikipedia has a decent description

Google images





Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
1713935553
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1713935553

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1713935553
Reply with quote  #2

1713935553
Report to moderator
1713935553
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1713935553

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1713935553
Reply with quote  #2

1713935553
Report to moderator
"Governments are good at cutting off the heads of a centrally controlled networks like Napster, but pure P2P networks like Gnutella and Tor seem to be holding their own." -- Satoshi
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction.
1713935553
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1713935553

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1713935553
Reply with quote  #2

1713935553
Report to moderator
1713935553
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1713935553

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1713935553
Reply with quote  #2

1713935553
Report to moderator
1713935553
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1713935553

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1713935553
Reply with quote  #2

1713935553
Report to moderator
ErgoOne
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 126
Merit: 100


View Profile
August 31, 2011, 01:36:44 AM
 #2

You have some lovely stuff on offer!  How did you come into contact with the artists?  Are you from Greenland yourself?

I'm in the United States, and collect art.  I might be interested in both small/inexpensive pieces of work that I can give as gifts for birthdays and Christmas, and also larger/more elaborate work for my own collection.  I'd prefer to avoid items made from material from polar bears or other endangered species; it's one thing for the Inuit to hunt them or defend themselves from attack, and a completely different matter for somebody to buy items made of that stuff and thereby bump up collector demand for it.  However, any material from reindeer, fox, and other non-endangered species (land animals mostly) would be fine.  I'd also prefer to avoid items intended to curse enemies, just so that I can honestly tell recipients what their gift is for and not freak them out. (Some relatives are prone to be superstitious or might have religious objections.)  But charms and other items whose original intent was not to hurt people would be fine.

You can PM me or get my email address from my web site, which is listed on my profile.
kgo
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 548
Merit: 500


View Profile
August 31, 2011, 02:01:57 AM
 #3

I'll take a 3 BTC one, made out of the most endangered animal you're allowed to ship to the US, with the most malevolent purpose within that price range.  That is, I'd prefer one that's supposed to kill over one to curse, and one that's designed to kill your enemy, his children, and his children's children over one that's just supposed to kill your enemy.

Shoot me a pm with the shipping costs before you buy anything though.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
August 31, 2011, 02:40:03 AM
Last edit: October 18, 2011, 02:40:25 PM by netrin
 #4

Greenlandic Tupilak

Handmade cursed figures carved from reindeer antler

18cm (7 inches)

USD$ 160 or EUR€ 125, free shipping world-wide (latest price)






Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
August 31, 2011, 03:00:00 AM
Last edit: September 14, 2011, 06:30:12 AM by netrin
 #5

You have some lovely stuff on offer!  How did you come into contact with the artists?  Are you from Greenland yourself?

I know some of the artists personally, which is a given considering there are only 57 000 people on the entire island though it's 3x bigger than Texas or France.


I'm in the United States, and collect art.  I might be interested in both small/inexpensive pieces of work that I can give as gifts for birthdays and Christmas

That would be a good idea. You'll get nailed on the shipping, but I can bundle a bunch in the same package for about the same shipping price. I'll take a photograph of some samples in the small/inexpensive range.


I'd prefer to avoid items made from material from polar bears or other endangered species; it's one thing for the Inuit to hunt them or defend themselves from attack, and a completely different matter for somebody to buy items made of that stuff and thereby bump up collector demand for it.

Mentioning polar bear was a marketing stunt. It's available but few can afford it. We try to scare the bears away from town, not kill them. I prefer to think the Greenlanders would not be tempted to poach bears for any price.

Note that seal are not endangered, but I believe the US has an import ban on all sea mammalian products. I'll double check.


I'd also prefer to avoid items intended to curse enemies, just so that I can honestly tell recipients what their gift is for and not freak them out. (Some relatives are prone to be superstitious or might have religious objections.)  But charms and other items whose original intent was not to hurt people would be fine.

The tradition is to curse. In fact... this gets complicated... people only die because they've disrespected life, whether animals or fellow man. If someone dies, it's assumed he was cursed. Maybe he deserved it. For example, when a seal is hunted it is thanked, the seal is respected, the spirit is fed water and offered gifts. If the seal is honored he may help the hunter in the future otherwise he may harm the hunter. A great hunter respects his prey. If he dies, it was probably because someone was jealous.

Anyway, in the past tupilak were pretty rare. Today with some tourist opportunity tupilak are more common and no curse is attached to them. To activate them you'd take some hair from the victim, perhaps some blood, and drown it with the tupilak. Or something like that. I'll go search for a more authoritative exploitation explanation.

Its all intent, but the tradition is for magic not beauty. Other fine bone sculptures and figures are also common today such as polar bears and whale (made from reindeer bone/antler). These can be necklaces too. In fact, seal claws are pretty wild looking, though I don't think I can export them to the States.


I'll take a 3 BTC one, made out of the most endangered animal you're allowed to ship to the US

What are endangered and what are illegal to import have little to do with each other. Some seal and whale which are not endangered are still illegal to be imported into the United States. I won't trade in endangered species anyway. How about the most 'exotic' from an American perspective, like muskox, sledge dog, arctic hare?


malevolent purpose within that price range.  That is, I'd prefer one that's supposed to kill over one to curse, and one that's designed to kill your enemy, his children, and his children's children over one that's just supposed to kill your enemy.

Interesting. Well part of that is upon you, like digging up their ancestors or extracting their blood, semen, spit, etc. I'll see what I can dig up. Smiley


Shoot me a pm with the shipping costs before you buy anything though.

If you get some friends together, I can send a combined package. Otherwise I think the shipping cost might be on par with the piece. Though, Kgo, as we've done business together in the past, I might use you as the guinea pig sale. I'll accept the risks.

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
kgo
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 548
Merit: 500


View Profile
August 31, 2011, 03:10:48 AM
 #6

I'll take a 3 BTC one, made out of the most endangered animal you're allowed to ship to the US

What are 'endangered' and what are illegal to import have little to do with each other. Some seal and whale which are not endangered are still illegal to be imported into the United States. I won't trade in endangered species anyway. How about the most 'exotic' from an American perspective, like muskox, sledge dog, arctic hare?


muskox sounds the most exotic to me if that's possible.

Quote

If you get some friends together, I can send a combined package. Otherwise I think the shipping cost might be on par with the piece. Though, Kgo, as we've done business together in the past, I might use you as the guinea pig sale. I'll accept the risks.

I was thinking I could go as high as 5 for a 3BTC item + shipping if you want to price that out. 

netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
August 31, 2011, 03:21:46 AM
Last edit: October 18, 2011, 02:44:37 PM by netrin
 #7

Muskox bone is textured and very beautiful. I'm sailing and climbing north of Kapisillit near the icesheet (1657m, top right of map) late tomorrow and should be back next week with photos of some bone options. I'll also have more clarity on US shipping and import law then (if not tomorrow).



UPDATE: OK, so these pieces are nearly the same shape. They are carved into humpback whale tails (a glorious site to see the broad tail as these beasts dive deep).  On the left below is reindeer antler (reversed in the other photo). The reindeer is a particularly nice piece because the colors look a bit like a whale does (though much lighter). But in the middle below is muskox horn carved quite thin (but still indestructible) and colors come through in beautiful patterns. In other words, it matches everything. You boys might not know this, but your girlfriends want this.

These whale tails and Nuummioq are going for $32 or €25.





Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
typhoon
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 22
Merit: 0


View Profile
August 31, 2011, 04:23:55 PM
 #8

I am interested in some bigger pieces.  I am in the United States of America.  Can you show me some pieces you can offer?  Thank you!
RandyFolds
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 448
Merit: 250



View Profile
September 07, 2011, 01:48:24 AM
 #9

Can you upload some more pics of actual pieces to get a good comparison of the materials? I am very interested in a variety pack. I've got some cursin' to do.
Xenland
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 980
Merit: 1003


I'm not just any shaman, I'm a Sha256man


View Profile
September 09, 2011, 08:13:35 AM
 #10

Very interested!,

This is amazing work's from what I've seen so far.
I live in California, United States. Would you mind give me some quotes on what you offer and some possible shipping costs?
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
September 09, 2011, 03:46:07 PM
Last edit: October 18, 2011, 02:43:42 PM by netrin
 #11

Bitcoin Classifieds: Tupilak Oqaq ("tongue") cursed figure, reindeer

Handmade cursed figures carved from reindeer antler

14cm (5 inches) from Kulusuk, East Greenland

USD$ 320 or EUR€ 250, Free shipping world-wide (check realtime price)






Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
Anonymous
Guest

September 09, 2011, 03:49:46 PM
 #12

Are you yourself Greenlandic, or just visiting the area?
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
September 09, 2011, 05:09:37 PM
 #13

I am not Greenlandic. I moved from Denmark to Nuuk two years ago.

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
fcmatt
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2072
Merit: 1001


View Profile
September 11, 2011, 11:40:55 PM
 #14

where can one see what is for sale? just slap up a very simple web page showing the pieces and the
price next to it with your email address to work out a sale.

you have to take a risk here.. buy several pieces and put it up for all to see with a price tag please.
Minsc
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 210
Merit: 100


View Profile
September 13, 2011, 11:55:56 PM
 #15

where can one see what is for sale? just slap up a very simple web page showing the pieces and the
price next to it with your email address to work out a sale.

you have to take a risk here.. buy several pieces and put it up for all to see with a price tag please.

This.  Get some free website and list your items.  I won't buy till around Christmas.

1DcXvfJdeJch9uptKopte5XQarTtj5ZjpL
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
September 14, 2011, 03:40:01 AM
Last edit: October 18, 2011, 02:42:14 PM by netrin
 #16

Tupilak keychain from Greenland

Handmade cursed figures carved from reindeer antler

4cm-7cm (1.5-3 inches)

USD$ 25 or EUR€ 20, Free shipping world-wide (check realtime price)






Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
kgo
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 548
Merit: 500


View Profile
September 14, 2011, 03:45:36 AM
 #17

I'm good for one.  pm me a payment address.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
September 14, 2011, 04:01:30 AM
Last edit: October 18, 2011, 02:46:48 PM by netrin
 #18

Bitcoin Classifieds: Greenlandic Muskox Necklace

Hand carved from muskox horn, smooth and polished, revealing the beautiful semi-transparent textures.

4cm (1.5 inches)

USD$ 32 or EUR€ 25, Free shipping world-wide (check realtime price)

I'm not happy with these photos. The polished horn is like cloudy flowing ice. You can faintly see the black strip through the piece, a millimeters under the surface. In fact, I think I might keep it. Smiley




Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
September 14, 2011, 05:31:59 AM
Last edit: December 12, 2011, 12:17:18 AM by netrin
 #19

Greenlandic cursed Tupilak

Handmade cursed figures carved from reindeer antler

All of these specific pieces have been sold

10-11cm (4 inches)

USD$ 64 or EUR€ 50, Free shipping world-wide (check realtime price)









Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
Xenland
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 980
Merit: 1003


I'm not just any shaman, I'm a Sha256man


View Profile
September 14, 2011, 07:11:16 AM
 #20

omg, this is sooo legit looking... Now i just gotta scrap 20 BTC....

Does that shipping include USA? or just Greenland pricing?
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
September 16, 2011, 12:23:42 AM
 #21

Hi Everyone,

The artists are pretty excited about the Tupilak project and look forward to hearing some feedback about their creations from people in the Americas, Europe, Asia, Africa, Australia, and all the islands of the world. While many don't even have an email address, most understand that displaying their work on the net could bring many benefits, including a steadier income, new techniques, tools, and cultural exchange. Some, to be honest, couldn't care less as long as I pay them cash (same for bitcoin).

I don't think this would be possible without bitcoin. I believe that bitcoin helps bring the world to higher latitudes from where we can send a slice of the Arctic back. Most here, just as anywhere, don't want to deal with international money transfers, pay pal, and certainly not fraud. The fact that I can pay artists in cash, receive digital cash from customers, and send a package the same day is a game changer. None the less, this is an experiment, a proof of concept. I posted photos from a sample of pieces with more soon to come. If it works out, we'll display more variety of works, from hunting knives, masks, kayak (qajaq) accessories, drums... But to get things started on Tupilaks, I've slashed prices 15% to 35% and shipping is free, by which I really mean free, to just about anywhere in the world.

I'd love to know what you all think, ideas for new pieces, or how we could make things better.

Thanks for your support,
Netrin

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
kgo
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 548
Merit: 500


View Profile
September 16, 2011, 03:23:21 AM
 #22

Netrin extended the new discount to me even though I had already ordered.  He's a class act.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
September 17, 2011, 02:23:15 AM
Last edit: October 18, 2011, 02:37:38 PM by netrin
 #23

Ulu, Greenlandic knife

Ulu are Inuit knives, traditionally used by women to cut the deep fatty skin of whale, seal, and walrus. They're great for chopping up veggies and herbs.

10 cm (4 inch) curved steal blade

USD$ 230 or EUR€ 180, Free world-wide shipping (latest price)

These pieces are completely hand made by an expert artisan in Nuuk, Greenland. The blade is forged by hand. The handle is polished reindeer antler. Both are connected by an elegant brass whale motif.





Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
September 17, 2011, 03:08:03 AM
Last edit: October 18, 2011, 02:38:55 PM by netrin
 #24

Muskox horn Tupilak from Greenland

Handmade cursed figures carved from muskox horn


13cm (5 inches)

USD$ 63 or EUR€ 50, Free shipping world-wide (latest price)

Muskox horn is a softer material than reindeer antler. Because detail work is more difficult to produce than with reindeer, muskox tupilak are uncommon. The semi-transparent creamy textured fibers of muskox horn make a beautiful decoration in a sunlit window.






Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
September 19, 2011, 10:54:59 PM
 #25

Tupilak keychain Auction starting at 1 BTC

I've posted an auction up on Tosaki's new Bitmit auction site. I've been playing with the site for a few hours now and it looks solid and Tosaki's been very responsive to my feedback. Just to test it out, I've started an auction at 1 BTC for a tupilak keychain. The bid will expire in a week.





Handmade cursed figures carved from reindeer antler

4cm-7cm (1.5-3 inches)

FREE Shipping worldwide

Greenlandic tupilaks are traditional magic figures made from bone, claws, tusks, or more recently from precious metals. These often-grotesque statues are used to curse or magically kill enemies, though none of those I'm selling will have been 'activated'. All of them are hand made from native wild animals such as reindeer, muskox, pheasant, fox, (seal, whale, and polar bear not available for export). Reindeer antler is most common because it is very durable and lends itself to detailed carving. Less common are muskox horn, which is a beautiful semi-transparent textured material, but softer and not as easily carved. Reindeer and muskox can be exported to most countries.

Tupilak come in numerous shapes and sizes, from cute to ugly and scary. These keychains are about the size of a finger.

Profits will be shared with the artists. Note that the Greenlanders use and consume all of the animal even when killed in self defense. The sale of these products support the local economy.

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
Dansker
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 740
Merit: 500


Hello world!


View Profile
September 23, 2011, 07:06:28 PM
 #26

Just going to bump this, because it is awesome.

netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
September 23, 2011, 10:44:37 PM
 #27

Just going to bump this, because it is awesome.

Tusind tak skal du have!

Hey, why not bid on the auction. It's currently cheaper than the shipping stamps! http://en.bitmit.net/trade/i/24-tupilak-keychain-from-greenland

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
kgo
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 548
Merit: 500


View Profile
September 28, 2011, 05:43:49 PM
 #28

I just got my Tupilak, complete with instructions suitable for my nefarious purposes.

Even though I saw a picture of it, I was still really impressed with the actual item.

As netrin said, shipping was a little slow, but it was totally worth the wait.
V4Vendettas
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 294
Merit: 250



View Profile
October 08, 2011, 06:55:52 PM
 #29

These are awsome!

netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
October 08, 2011, 07:32:08 PM
 #30

Thanks. These are only some samples I've picked up in the last month, and are currently decorating my home. If there is any one style (here or elsewhere on the net), I'm sure I can find something similar or even commission a new piece.

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
bulanula
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 518
Merit: 500



View Profile
October 08, 2011, 07:33:14 PM
 #31

They are cursed. Please avoid.  Grin
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
October 08, 2011, 07:45:20 PM
 #32

They are cursed. Please avoid.  Grin

Actually they are not ...yet. Wink I'll include some instructions with each delivery. Typically, you dig up ancestor (or children) bones, collect some artifact of your specific victim (blood, hair will do) and send them off to sea or deep into a glacier. Real 'activated' curses are difficult to find, because they've typically been buried, lost or drowned along with their victim.

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
TyGrr
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 84
Merit: 10



View Profile
October 09, 2011, 04:32:19 PM
 #33

The black magic near the Thai Cambodian boarder is very much like this. The witches here have the whole country scared, no joke.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
October 09, 2011, 10:50:55 PM
Last edit: October 09, 2011, 11:14:23 PM by netrin
 #34

Interesting. I'd like to know a bit more about these witches. Are they related to krasue ghosts? Do they use artifacts like tupilak or voodoo dolls?



In Greenland, there are shamans but they are not evil. I don't think there's a tradition of an 'occupational witch' conjuring devious plans alone. They say there is no such word 'alone' rather, in the arctic one is 'dead'. There is a tradition of qivitoq which is something like wanderer spirit. People removed themselves from the community due to shame, elderly who wish not to be a burden, women who couldn't bare children, etc. Basically they wander off into the cold and return to nature. If their body is not found, perhaps they are still wandering, most certainly as a spirit, for no one can survive the winter darkness alone. Many abnormalities and misfortune are attributed to the qivitoq spirit.

Creating tupilak was not an occupational tradition, but very personal and secret. It is believed that often someone dies because someone/thing willed him harm. A hunter who disrespects his prey may be killed by the offended animal spirit or a jealous lover may have created a tupilak leading to his misfortune. I believe there were a lot more deaths attributed to tupilak than the number of cursed tupilak ever created, but we'll never know.

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
October 09, 2011, 11:05:55 PM
 #35


Here's a story Knud Rasmussen collected prior to 1921

NUKÚNGUASIK, WHO ESCAPED FROM THE TUPILAK

NUKÚNGUASIK, it is said, had land in a place with many brothers. When the brothers made a catch, they gave him meat for the pot; he himself had no wife. One day he rowed northward in his kayak, and suddenly he took it into his head to row over to a big island which he had never visited before, and now wished to see. He landed, and went up to look at the land, and it was very beautiful there.

 And here he came upon the middle one of many brothers, busy with something or other down in a hollow, and whispering all the time. So he crawled stealthily towards him, and when he had come closer, he heard him whispering these words:

 "You are to bite Nukúnguasik to death; you are to bite Nukúnguasik to death."

 And then it was clear that he was making a Tupilak, and stood there now telling it what to do. But suddenly Nukúnguasik slapped him on the side and said: "But where is this Nukúnguasik?"

 And the man was so frightened at this that he fell down dead.

 And then Nukúnguasik saw that the man had been letting the Tupilak sniff at his body. And the Tupilak was now alive, and lay there sniffing. But Nukúnguasik, being afraid of the Tupilak....

(I'll let you finish the second half of the story from whence I nicked it http://www.sacred-texts.com/nam/inu/eft/eft07.htm)

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
RandyFolds
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 448
Merit: 250



View Profile
October 10, 2011, 06:04:36 AM
 #36

Well now I'm just worried. Will my tupilak eat me if I mess up the programming??
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
October 10, 2011, 08:10:12 AM
 #37

I don't recommend commanding the tupilak to "eat me!" ... but just to be on the safe side, I'll do a bit more research. Smiley

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
RandyFolds
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 448
Merit: 250



View Profile
October 10, 2011, 11:59:51 PM
 #38

I don't recommend commanding the tupilak to "eat me!" ... but just to be on the safe side, I'll do a bit more research. Smiley

I was just cracking a joke about the end of the story. I ended up reading a bunch of the folk-lore on that site. It's friggin' awesome, but sort of difficult to keep track of due to the crazy names.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
October 11, 2011, 01:34:02 AM
 #39

In the tupilak story, I thought the prepositions were confusing. "he saw that he let him sniff him". I guess I could rewrite them as Knud originally wrote them in Danish. I don't know the name Nukúnguasik, it looks East Greenlandic, but similar to Nukanunnguaq or the old spelling Nukánguaĸ which is like sweet little (younger) brother.

While looking that name up in the official name book, I came across 'Anarfinnguaq', 'Anarfínguaĸ' and 'Anarfik' which at best translates as something like

sweet delicate toilet

But it's a bit more crazy in Greenlandic, because words are built up from stems. So anar encompasses everything shitty, from smell to color to texture. Fik is just the place of and the -guaq ending gives it the charming diminutive character, a bit like -ie in doggie, sweetie, or -ita in Spanish. I don't know anyone with that name, never seen it written, but there it is in the 'official' record.

Glad you enjoyed the stories.

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
Minsc
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 210
Merit: 100


View Profile
October 18, 2011, 06:00:03 AM
 #40

They are cursed. Please avoid.  Grin

Actually they are not ...yet. Wink I'll include some instructions with each delivery. Typically, you dig up ancestor (or children) bones, collect some artifact of your specific victim (blood, hair will do) and send them off to sea or deep into a glacier. Real 'activated' curses are difficult to find, because they've typically been buried, lost or drowned along with their victim.

The description said they're cursed.  So that's just advertising?

And are they made of bone?  You sometimes suggest it but you also say you can't export it out of Greenland so it sounds like a no.

1DcXvfJdeJch9uptKopte5XQarTtj5ZjpL
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
October 18, 2011, 02:23:18 PM
 #41

The description said they're cursed.  So that's just advertising?

And are they made of bone?  You sometimes suggest it but you also say you can't export it out of Greenland so it sounds like a no.

Tupilak are cursed, but not yet applied to a specific victim. The curse could be activated before shipping, but to whom would I apply the curse? My customers? Smiley The tupilak are the real deal. You basically give the tupilak pieces of your victim so that he can smell and taste your victim and then you set him free. I suspect most people would prefer to keep them in the house as decoration and only activate (and lose) them later. It's up to you. If you prefer, send me pieces of your victim and I (or someone more experienced) will activate them for you; I just hope he doesn't eat his way out of the postal system.

Most of the tupilak are made from reindeer antler which is indeed bone. Some of the pieces I have are made from muskox horn, which is a bit softer, translucent and beautiful, but doesn't lend itself as well to detail work. The most beautiful, in my opinion, are made walrus ivory, but are illegal to import most everywhere. The most powerful tupilak are often made from the bones of the victims' ancestors (or deceased children). But no, I am not exporting human bone, unless you manage a museum and are prepared for enormous paper work.

So, tupilak are made from bone and they are as cursed as you choose to make them.

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
October 18, 2011, 03:06:20 PM
Last edit: November 03, 2011, 03:01:56 AM by netrin
 #42

25% off

...all tupilakker and knives ordered before November. I simply can't keep up with the exchange rate and have set all prices in USD and EUR, but will adjust later if/when BTC stops hyperinflating (50%+ monthly depreciation). Pick up some curses while their CHEAP!

EDIT: Kjj picked up two pieces on the cheap. Is the thin muskox carving a gift?

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
Minsc
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 210
Merit: 100


View Profile
October 18, 2011, 08:58:49 PM
 #43

Tupilak are cursed, but not yet applied to a specific victim. The curse could be activated before shipping, but to whom would I apply the curse? My customers? Smiley The tupilak are the real deal. You basically give the tupilak pieces of your victim so that he can smell and taste your victim and then you set him free. I suspect most people would prefer to keep them in the house as decoration and only activate (and lose) them later. It's up to you. If you prefer, send me pieces of your victim and I (or someone more experienced) will activate them for you; I just hope he doesn't eat his way out of the postal system.

So those things can't bring good luck like all the genie rings sold on the metaphysical category of eBay?

1DcXvfJdeJch9uptKopte5XQarTtj5ZjpL
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
October 18, 2011, 11:56:38 PM
Last edit: October 19, 2011, 12:15:13 AM by netrin
 #44

So those things can't bring good luck like all the genie rings sold on the metaphysical category of eBay?

Life is pain, my friend. Anyone who tells you otherwise is only trying to sell you something.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

For more cliche collected by Knud Rasmussen while traveling throughout the North: "The great peril of our existence lies in the fact that our diet consists entirely of souls."

Once the anirniq (spirit) of the dead - animal or human - is liberated, it is free to take revenge. The spirit of the dead can only be placated by obedience to custom, avoiding taboos, and performing the right rituals.

In the Arctic, we don't believe. We fear.


Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
Mushroomized
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1470
Merit: 1002


Hello!


View Profile
October 31, 2011, 10:42:57 AM
 #45

These are really cool  Cheesy

hi
cablepair
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 896
Merit: 1000


Buy this account on March-2019. New Owner here!!


View Profile WWW
October 31, 2011, 12:53:40 PM
 #46

Tupilaks are what killed Steve Jobs, buyer beware!
Xenland
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 980
Merit: 1003


I'm not just any shaman, I'm a Sha256man


View Profile
November 03, 2011, 02:36:32 AM
 #47

If being one of the most remembered people of our times is what happens with people with tupilaks... count me in!
Actually have been pretty inquiries of these things and I might be able to purchase one very very soon.

PM'ing you OP.
tosaki
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 401
Merit: 252



View Profile
November 09, 2011, 01:32:16 PM
 #48

do you also have cute ones in stock ? I need one friendly or cute looking, price range and size could be like http://en.bitmit.net/trade/i/50-cursed-tupilak-reindeer-bone-carving-from-greenland
RandyFolds
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 448
Merit: 250



View Profile
November 09, 2011, 10:37:23 PM
 #49

do you also have cute ones in stock ? I need one friendly or cute looking, price range and size could be like http://en.bitmit.net/trade/i/50-cursed-tupilak-reindeer-bone-carving-from-greenland

You want a cute demonic curse? That's just mean.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
November 10, 2011, 12:39:58 AM
 #50

What do you mean by 'cute'. Cuddly with a smiling face? How about a polar bear head?

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
tosaki
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 401
Merit: 252



View Profile
November 10, 2011, 01:54:32 PM
 #51

okay maybe cute is the wrong description. e.g. for me is the left one on your banner more sympathetic/friendly/cute than the one on the right hand side.
I would prefer it
BitcoinMint.US
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 284
Merit: 251



View Profile
November 23, 2011, 11:07:37 PM
 #52

These often-grotesque statues are used to curse or magically kill enemies, though none of those I'm selling will have been 'activated' Smiley.

Do we have the option of having them activated?


25% off

Wish I had seen this sale.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
November 23, 2011, 11:48:57 PM
 #53

Do we have the option of having them activated?

That's an interesting question. Yes, I suppose you could send a sample of your victim to a third party (me?). Though, do you realize you could just as easily do it yourself? I'm not a big fan of harming anyone, particularly not those I don't know, who've done me no harm. But theoretically this would be possible.

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
BitcoinMint.US
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 284
Merit: 251



View Profile
November 24, 2011, 04:13:03 AM
 #54

Do we have the option of having them activated?

That's an interesting question. Yes, I suppose you could send a sample of your victim to a third party (me?). Though, do you realize you could just as easily do it yourself? I'm not a big fan of harming anyone, particularly not those I don't know, who've done me no harm. But theoretically this would be possible.

Sorry. I overlooked the post where you explained this. I'll keep my eyes open for the next sale.  Wink  PM me if you're interested in trading for silver.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
November 24, 2011, 06:53:38 AM
 #55

I wouldn't hold my breath for another sale, as I was shipping them below cost. I've just set all the prices in EUR and USD and am done with it. As for silver, that is an option I'd accept!

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
chieffery
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 98
Merit: 10


Feedback: +6


View Profile
November 24, 2011, 07:58:59 AM
 #56


Here's a story Knud Rasmussen collected prior to 1921

NUKÚNGUASIK, WHO ESCAPED FROM THE TUPILAK

NUKÚNGUASIK, it is said, had land in a place with many brothers. When the brothers made a catch, they gave him meat for the pot; he himself had no wife. One day he rowed northward in his kayak, and suddenly he took it into his head to row over to a big island which he had never visited before, and now wished to see. He landed, and went up to look at the land, and it was very beautiful there.

 And here he came upon the middle one of many brothers, busy with something or other down in a hollow, and whispering all the time. So he crawled stealthily towards him, and when he had come closer, he heard him whispering these words:

 "You are to bite Nukúnguasik to death; you are to bite Nukúnguasik to death."

 And then it was clear that he was making a Tupilak, and stood there now telling it what to do. But suddenly Nukúnguasik slapped him on the side and said: "But where is this Nukúnguasik?"

 And the man was so frightened at this that he fell down dead.

 And then Nukúnguasik saw that the man had been letting the Tupilak sniff at his body. And the Tupilak was now alive, and lay there sniffing. But Nukúnguasik, being afraid of the Tupilak....

(I'll let you finish the second half of the story from whence I nicked it http://www.sacred-texts.com/nam/inu/eft/eft07.htm)


What the hell did I just read...

BTC - 194ihPS7DTegoerp1WdRKED7PQCosyq2eL
LTC - LdTHdHo5GDDnQW5gSMNZ7zr8HFitZ7qRmC
RandyFolds
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 448
Merit: 250



View Profile
November 24, 2011, 09:13:46 PM
 #57

What the hell did I just read...

Seriously...I spent like, ten hours a couple months back reading through a bunch of awesome Greenlandic mythology. It's...unique, to say the least. I feel like the movement to record oral histories has lost steam in the past fifty years. There are still a bunch of projects to preserve them, but it seems like they are more focused on the preservation of the language rather than the culture. I just want my stories!

netrin, how can I find more? Are there some better-translated works that you can refer me to?
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
November 24, 2011, 10:30:41 PM
 #58

What did you read? I don't know many myth books, none in English.

There's a huge collection of modern Arctic (and Antarctic) literature that will get the testosterone flowing. Knud Rasmussen, Peter Freuchen, Ludvig Mylius-Erichsen, Roald Amundsen, Robert Peary, Ernest Shackleton, Robert Scott. I just finished a good read by Alvah Simon titled "North to the Night".

Not the way I heard it but...

As I remember it, he’d fashioned a chisel from his own excrement to chip his way out. In Peter Freuchen’s account of his 1924 journey through Canada’s far north, the Danish explorer recounted how in a driving storm his sled dogs had refused to go any further. He took refuge under his dog sled, overturned against the wind side of a large boulder.

While he slept, snow had buried his makeshift shelter and he awoke to find himself entombed and his feet painfully frozen. Barely able to move, he’d scraped at the hardened snow. After many hours of agonizing effort, Freuchen remembered how, during the previous day, his sled dogs’ turds had frozen solid almost instantaneously in the extreme cold.

Freuchen thus thought to resort to his frozen poo chisel. Despite narrowly escaping a slow death he lost an entire foot to frostbite.

Perhaps what pushed the lead over the edge and off the page was this addition:

His is not the only such tale to come out of the north. Famed Canadian ethno-botanist, Wade Davis, recounts a similar story collected from an Inuit community on Baffin Island.

An elder had resisted a 1950’s Canadian government plan to relocate the Inuit into settlements. In an effort to force him to move, his family took away all his tools and implements.

The elder stole out of the igloo that night and dropping his caribou and seal skin drawers in the harsh cold, he defecated and shaped the rapidly freezing feces into a knife. He spit on it to form a sharp saliva edge and butchered a dog. Using the dog’s ribcage as a sled and the hide to hitch onto another dog, he “put the shit knife in his belt and disappeared into the night.”

http://www.mywestworld.com/living/monster-mush-the-yukon-quest/

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
Xenland
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 980
Merit: 1003


I'm not just any shaman, I'm a Sha256man


View Profile
November 27, 2011, 10:58:18 AM
 #59

They came sooner then I expected!
I'm using one for a Christmas gift and the other for a table piece!

Here are some pics to show how well they travel.

I could have swore I heard one of the buggers gasp for air
when I ripped open the packaging Wink



Thank Netrin, I will be buying from you again in the future. Cheesy
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
November 27, 2011, 12:57:48 PM
 #60

Hey Xenland, that was kinda fast, and on a Sunday!? Actually, I don't really know when they left the island. It's just that the storms seemed to keep the planes grounded for weeks (one might have slipped away without me noticing). Did you keep the stamps and postmark? Also, the packaging doubled as a note. Hope you didn't throw that out nor that the tupilakker ate it.

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
November 27, 2011, 01:42:19 PM
 #61

Hey Goat/Ty, I'm still quite keen on trading oolong.

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
Xenland
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 980
Merit: 1003


I'm not just any shaman, I'm a Sha256man


View Profile
November 28, 2011, 05:02:09 AM
Last edit: November 28, 2011, 03:47:53 PM by Xenland
 #62

Hey Xenland, that was kinda fast, and on a Sunday!? Actually, I don't really know when they left the island. It's just that the storms seemed to keep the planes grounded for weeks (one might have slipped away without me noticing). Did you keep the stamps and postmark? Also, the packaging doubled as a note. Hope you didn't throw that out nor that the tupilakker ate it.

Indeed cool looking stamps, I kept the stamp and a tupliakker ate his way half way through the bag Tongue

I read the entire story that the packaging came with, it was entertaining.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
December 10, 2011, 02:28:56 AM
Last edit: December 10, 2011, 03:06:08 AM by netrin
 #63

Seriously...I spent like, ten hours a couple months back reading through a bunch of awesome Greenlandic mythology. It's...unique, to say the least. I feel like the movement to record oral histories has lost steam in the past fifty years. There are still a bunch of projects to preserve them, but it seems like they are more focused on the preservation of the language rather than the culture. I just want my stories!

netrin, how can I find more? Are there some better-translated works that you can refer me to?






I saw 'Atanarjuat' many years ago. I thought it was pretty good. Maybe you'd enjoy these films. Donations appreciated (they don't yet accept bitcoin):

Fast Runner Trilogy


I've loaned out a few kilos of books and at least a dozen DVD's and VHS tapes in the past few weeks. Except for a lot of material on climate change, ice cores, and mineral surveys, it's nearly all in Danish or W. Greenlandic, except for one short film I think you might enjoy:

Echos
A film by Ivalo Frank
2010

It's just a snapshot of a couple in Ikateq, an American airbase abandoned after WWII. Check out these photos of 300,000 rusty barrels. I thought I'd be able to see them from satellite images only about 10 km west of Tasiilaq (50km from Kulusuk).

Many of the videos are real old, a few clips from Knud Rasmussen must be about 100 years old. I just watched one film "Eskimo Vinter / Sælfolket" (Eskimo Winter / Seal people) with footage from the 60's in Canada and Greenland. Dudes making igloos, and sleds from frozen fish halves wrapped in seal skin for ski blades lashed to a reindeer antler frame. Another series that might be fascinating are documentaries of the Sirius patrol. There are a bunch of brilliant films I saw at the Inuit Circumpolar Conference last year in Nuuk, with some wild arctic mythological themes. Let me know if you're into film and I'll dig some of the best up.

As for written stories, again, nearly everything I've come across is in either Danish or Greenlandic, but many of them must have been translated from Canadian French, English, Inuktuk, maybe Russian (Chukotka).

Birgitte Sonne wrote an anthro thesis in English "The Happy Family - Myths and Ritual and Society on Nunivak" (Copenhagen, 1979)

Knud Rasmussen, who died in 1933 wrote and collected stories from all over the Arctic. He drove a team of dogs up Greenland across Canada to Alaska and was denied entry into Russia. Much of his collection was published in English after he died and matching location to story is unreliable, but the stories are all authentic.

Margaret Lantis, an American anthropologist, collected stories in northern Canada during the late 30's and published material for a half century more.

Perhaps you can find myths published by Hans Himmelheber a contemporary of Lantis in English and German. Paul Ivanoff and Edward Curtis' collections are likely perceived through thick Christian lenses. The linguist L. Hammerich translated a few Inuit stories into English himself.

It's interesting that you notice the steam drop in the past fifty years. My trail seems to end about 1970. There must be more material, I just don't know about it. What got you into the topic?


Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
likuidxd
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 476
Merit: 500


View Profile
December 25, 2011, 02:37:44 AM
 #64

Received mine today just in time to give it for christmas! Thanks you!

Even came with a hand written note, wow!

netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
December 25, 2011, 07:51:42 AM
 #65

Wow, that was close. Glad it worked out.

By popular request I've asked around for matching earrings and necklaces. These are available carved from in reindeer antler. I've also made requests for several pieces of jewelry made from gorgeous muskox horn. Fine detail is not possible with muskox horn, so it's less appropriate for carving, though one guy is making me matching lucky whale tail earrings.

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
netrin (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322
Merit: 251


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
December 25, 2011, 08:31:22 AM
Last edit: December 25, 2011, 08:57:57 AM by netrin
 #66

I'll definitely post photos, but it'll be a while. The earring would look quite a bit like these necklaces (half dollar) but smaller (US penny), they can be post or dangly and would cost about $50 for a pair. I'll also pick up a bunch of abstract muskox pieces of various sizes and prices.


(click to expand)

Is anyone interested in pre-ordering very thin muskox necklaces or pins, similar to the middle photo above (perhaps even thinner)? They are not traditional, somewhat my own idea, a bit fragile, though we're experimenting to perfection. When thin, colors blend through the translucent creamy-grained texture of the muskox horn. The piece will stand out while matching any skin color or piece of clothing.


Also, many of the hunters find huge hunks of ruby in the spring. If I can get a permit, might you be interested in big pieces of raw, but not gem-quality corundum? For an idea of what I'm talking about, check out Google images. The middle photo (not mine) is from Qaqat, the last photo (mine) is from Qeqertarsuatsiaat:


(click to expand)

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
Troll Toll
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 116
Merit: 10



View Profile
December 27, 2011, 04:49:11 PM
 #67

Received the whale tail I bought! The handwritten note was perfect, very nice. The girlfriend will love it once she gets back from visiting her family in rochester, ny. Can't wait for new products, would definitely purchase again.

tt

You gotta pay
kibblesnbits
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 557
Merit: 500


View Profile
June 12, 2012, 03:42:44 AM
 #68

Bump, I'd be interested in some pieces as well.

ASICMINERTUBE
   
  The Best $/Gh Bitcoin Miner So Far
   ►►►   DISCOVER NOW !!!   ◄◄◄
Pages: 1 2 3 4 [All]
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!