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Other => Meta => Topic started by: ABitNut on March 23, 2015, 10:12:44 AM



Title: Trust spam happens
Post by: ABitNut on March 23, 2015, 10:12:44 AM
I guess I stepped on someone's toes enough to warrant some old-fashioned trust spamming! Someone actually went through the effort to create several accounts only to give some negative feedback to me.

I'm flattered, impressed and disappointed at the same time.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Blazr on March 23, 2015, 10:14:46 AM
This is obvious spamming. Hopefully theymos or another admin will remove it.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Muhammed Zakir on March 23, 2015, 10:16:04 AM
Those who have "mind" knows they are from sockpuppets.

BTW, can you tell us who is this "someone"? I think it is most probably a MSDN key seller.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: ABitNut on March 23, 2015, 10:19:53 AM
Those who have "mind" knows they are from sockpuppets.

BTW, can you tell us who is this "someone"? I think it is most probably a MSDN key seller.

I cannot conclusively say who is behind it. Quite likely it's one of the Microsoft key sellers, but it doesn't really matter. It's all newbie accounts and under the untrusted feedback anyway. I'm just surprised that they would actually go through this length to achieve.... what? Nothing if you ask me.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: FuckIdolPlus on March 23, 2015, 10:25:47 AM
I think that is untrusted feedback, it's all over Vod's profile too.
Vod deserved it, and you too kind of deserve some negative trust (for starting the flame regarding MSDN sales)  ::) But this is not the way how this should happen.
This is totally wrong. Admins would surely remove it :)


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Quickseller on March 23, 2015, 12:27:57 PM
Oh gosh lol. I don't think anyone is going to take that feedback seriously.

I do like the ones where it says to check the reference for more details but then there is no reference.

It is spam but I am not sure it will get removed   


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: qwer312 on March 23, 2015, 12:30:06 PM
should admins disable leaving trust from newbies to avoid this kind of case?


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Grand_Voyageur on March 23, 2015, 12:33:17 PM
should admins disable leaving trust from newbies to avoid this kind of case?

IMO a ban of trust spammers (alt-accounts from someone here, for sure) could be more useful.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: dogie on March 23, 2015, 01:42:29 PM
Another important issue is that someone's found an effective way to register and control multiple accounts. That's not a good thing.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Wardrick on March 23, 2015, 02:38:21 PM
There's a lot of bans that may be useful, but the forum doesn't have the man power or time to keep up with it all. It also doesn't change the fact they can just create new accounts and do the same thing.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: redsn0w on March 23, 2015, 02:42:56 PM
should admins disable leaving trust from newbies to avoid this kind of case?

It will not stop this problem, they will wait until all the account turn in jr. member and they start again to spam your trust page. It seems there is not a valid solution, and the troll/spammer will return always here in the forum.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Vod on March 23, 2015, 02:53:27 PM
I guess I stepped on someone's toes enough to warrant some old-fashioned trust spamming! Someone actually went through the effort to create several accounts only to give some negative feedback to me.

I'm flattered, impressed and disappointed at the same time.

13 fake accounts created for me!   :D

I'm going through them all and flagging them as fake accounts, since they are using existing usernames and just adding a "-1" to it.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: funtotry on March 23, 2015, 02:55:00 PM
Yea even though the usernames are not the same it is clearly scamming. What did you do that make him mad though? I doubt that he would be doing this just for fun or a personal grudge. Is there and evidence of scamming?


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: CrackedLogic on March 23, 2015, 04:02:07 PM
Wow, you must of really pissed him off. 30 false negative feedbacks :-\. Behavior like this makes me reconsider of trading on the forums.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: funtotry on March 23, 2015, 07:15:03 PM
Wow, you must of really pissed him off. 30 false negative feedbacks :-\. Behavior like this makes me reconsider of trading on the forums.
The effort that he put into making all these 30 accounts and leaving trust on each single account. Thats just childish. Do we have any facts on what potential scammed happen yet? Or is it just complete random trust attack.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: CrackedLogic on March 23, 2015, 07:22:13 PM
Wow, you must of really pissed him off. 30 false negative feedbacks :-\. Behavior like this makes me reconsider of trading on the forums.
The effort that he put into making all these 30 accounts and leaving trust on each single account. Thats just childish. Do we have any facts on what potential scammed happen yet? Or is it just complete random trust attack.
Nothing of solid evidence yet, all that I know is that the MSDN seller could be the root of all these accounts. I wouldn't call it a random trust attack as it only happen after the debate between Vod and FuckIdolPlus.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: ajw7989 on March 24, 2015, 11:44:48 AM
I guess I stepped on someone's toes enough to warrant some old-fashioned trust spamming! Someone actually went through the effort to create several accounts only to give some negative feedback to me.

I'm flattered, impressed and disappointed at the same time.

Really? You decide to negative trust spam all users selling anything you think is bad. I have been selling MSDN keys since december and have no unresolved complaints. I have been selling products on this forum for a long time and never had a problem (longer than your account existed). I can assure you the negative trust I left you is because you have no reason to leave me negative trust for something so ridiculous. I never dealt with you and I advertise my products exactly how they are. I dont say they are not MSDN keys when they are. GO through the digital goods section and I bet you 80% of the stuff would not meet your approval does not mean they are not allowed on this forum.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Mt. Gox on March 24, 2015, 12:01:04 PM
Does it really matter? Everyone in this thread including the OP is just making mountains out of molehills. If whoever sends you trust is not in the default trust list then it doesn't make a single iota of difference because nobody will pay any attention to it at all. Gavin Andresen has negative trust. Theymos has negative trust. Even SATOSHI has negative trust.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: qwer312 on March 24, 2015, 12:39:10 PM
Does it really matter? Everyone in this thread including the OP is just making mountains out of molehills. If whoever sends you trust is not in the default trust list then it doesn't make a single iota of difference because nobody will pay any attention to it at all. Gavin Andresen has negative trust. Theymos has negative trust. Even SATOSHI has negative trust.

some other people will never know that those trust is not true at all and some will see that and will believe those


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: ajw7989 on March 24, 2015, 01:08:29 PM
Does it really matter? Everyone in this thread including the OP is just making mountains out of molehills. If whoever sends you trust is not in the default trust list then it doesn't make a single iota of difference because nobody will pay any attention to it at all. Gavin Andresen has negative trust. Theymos has negative trust. Even SATOSHI has negative trust.

some other people will never know that those trust is not true at all and some will see that and will believe those

I agree with this statement which is what pisses me off. I take care of my customers and always provide great support on any product I sell to avoid negative trust. I sell things as a side thing but its not my main reason for being on this board unlike most other MSDN key sellers. So its not like when I stop selling these keys I will disappear. I will still be active on btctalk and that trust will stay. If I somehow scammed OP or broke the rules of btctalk then the negative trust would be appropriate but for what I did its ridiculous and undeserved. I dont false advertise the keys at all.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: tspacepilot on March 24, 2015, 01:17:14 PM
I think that is untrusted feedback, it's all over Vod's profile too.
Vod deserved it, and you too kind of deserve some negative trust (for starting the flame regarding MSDN sales)  ::) But this is not the way how this should happen.
This is totally wrong. Admins would surely remove it :)

I got into it a little bit with Vod yesterday because I also don't understand how/why MSCORP intellectual property has anything to do with the bitcoinforum or why he's going around neg-repping anyone who deals with this stuff.  Why are people on default trust acting as MSCORP representatives I can't understand.

FuckIdolPlus, are you starting shit related to MSCORP?  Why?

(I'm not saying you deserve the trust spam, just asking why/if this is the case.)


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: erikalui on March 24, 2015, 02:51:47 PM
I was told earlier by a member that creating multiple accounts is allowed and giving negative or positive feedback also via those accounts is allowed. Trust isn't moderated and so I don't think it can be removed and most members don't take it seriously if it appears spammy but you have got negative feedback by so many users for different reasons and some look valid "Never dealed with this person , Giving bad feedbacks , he should mind his own bussiness." "I Never deal with you, why do you leave "Negative feedback" for me?"


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Quickseller on March 24, 2015, 02:59:45 PM
I think that is untrusted feedback, it's all over Vod's profile too.
Vod deserved it, and you too kind of deserve some negative trust (for starting the flame regarding MSDN sales)  ::) But this is not the way how this should happen.
This is totally wrong. Admins would surely remove it :)

I got into it a little bit with Vod yesterday because I also don't understand how/why MSCORP intellectual property has anything to do with the bitcoinforum or why he's going around neg-repping anyone who deals with this stuff.  Why are people on default trust acting as MSCORP representatives I can't understand.

FuckIdolPlus, are you starting shit related to MSCORP?  Why?

(I'm not saying you deserve the trust spam, just asking why/if this is the case.)
He has a financial interest in Microsoft/Microsoft products. People selling Microsoft products at a discount will make it so the time he invested in becoming a Microsoft certified engineer potentially worth less


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: tspacepilot on March 24, 2015, 03:30:40 PM
I think that is untrusted feedback, it's all over Vod's profile too.
Vod deserved it, and you too kind of deserve some negative trust (for starting the flame regarding MSDN sales)  ::) But this is not the way how this should happen.
This is totally wrong. Admins would surely remove it :)

I got into it a little bit with Vod yesterday because I also don't understand how/why MSCORP intellectual property has anything to do with the bitcoinforum or why he's going around neg-repping anyone who deals with this stuff.  Why are people on default trust acting as MSCORP representatives I can't understand.

FuckIdolPlus, are you starting shit related to MSCORP?  Why?

(I'm not saying you deserve the trust spam, just asking why/if this is the case.)
He has a financial interest in Microsoft/Microsoft products. People selling Microsoft products at a discount will make it so the time he invested in becoming a Microsoft certified engineer potentially worth less

Yah, we discussused that in the other thread.  I've removed Vod's ratings from my trust network because of this.  I'm not interested in what the microsoft police consider good or bad.  Too bad he's on default trust so microsoft is essentially moderating bitcoin deals :(


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: abyrnes81 on March 24, 2015, 03:33:20 PM
I think that is untrusted feedback, it's all over Vod's profile too.
Vod deserved it, and you too kind of deserve some negative trust (for starting the flame regarding MSDN sales)  ::) But this is not the way how this should happen.
This is totally wrong. Admins would surely remove it :)

I got into it a little bit with Vod yesterday because I also don't understand how/why MSCORP intellectual property has anything to do with the bitcoinforum or why he's going around neg-repping anyone who deals with this stuff.  Why are people on default trust acting as MSCORP representatives I can't understand.

FuckIdolPlus, are you starting shit related to MSCORP?  Why?

(I'm not saying you deserve the trust spam, just asking why/if this is the case.)
He has a financial interest in Microsoft/Microsoft products. People selling Microsoft products at a discount will make it so the time he invested in becoming a Microsoft certified engineer potentially worth less

Yah, we discussused that in the other thread.  I've removed Vod's ratings from my trust network because of this.  I'm not interested in what the microsoft police consider good or bad.  Too bad he's on default trust so microsoft is essentially moderating bitcoin deals :(

You are right "personal compliant" should not be involved in this forum because everyone can give a negative trust to another users (that work for another "society") and this is not really "fair".


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Vod on March 24, 2015, 04:07:38 PM
I agree with this statement which is what pisses me off. I take care of my customers and always provide great support on any product I sell to avoid negative trust.

An honest thief.  Good for you.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: ABitNut on March 25, 2015, 01:14:30 AM
I guess I stepped on someone's toes enough to warrant some old-fashioned trust spamming! Someone actually went through the effort to create several accounts only to give some negative feedback to me.

I'm flattered, impressed and disappointed at the same time.

Really? You decide to negative trust spam all users selling anything you think is bad. I have been selling MSDN keys since december and have no unresolved complaints. I have been selling products on this forum for a long time and never had a problem (longer than your account existed). I can assure you the negative trust I left you is because you have no reason to leave me negative trust for something so ridiculous. I never dealt with you and I advertise my products exactly how they are. I dont say they are not MSDN keys when they are. GO through the digital goods section and I bet you 80% of the stuff would not meet your approval does not mean they are not allowed on this forum.

This thread was made before you left me any feedback. It is about the trust spam (new accounts created solely to put some negative feedback on me). I found that noteworthy. I am not asking anyone to remove them. While I disagree with the feedback you left on me it is not trust spam. I disagree with the logic in you feedback. First of all, I'm not leaving negative feedback for all sellers selling anything I think is bad. I left feedback on sellers of Starbucks gift cards because there is credit card fraud involved. I left feedback on sellers of Microsoft product keys because there is fraud involved as well. That you have no unresolved customer complaints is all fine and dandy, but that doesn't make what you're doing legit.

If there is something factually wrong about the feedback I gave you then please let me know and I will amend it.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: alani123 on March 25, 2015, 01:17:02 AM
Another important issue is that someone's found an effective way to register and control multiple accounts. That's not a good thing.

Most of the spammy ones were left at the same day but we don't know if it happened at the exact same time. So it's not 100% sure that someone was using multiple accounts simultaneously.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: funtotry on March 25, 2015, 01:40:02 PM
Another important issue is that someone's found an effective way to register and control multiple accounts. That's not a good thing.

Most of the spammy ones were left at the same day but we don't know if it happened at the exact same time. So it's not 100% sure that someone was using multiple accounts simultaneously.
If all were in the same day then it could just be a bunch of unhappy customers all finding out about some scam or something all at once but it doesn't really look the case. Logging in and logging out of all these accounts takes a while so I wouldn't be surprised if these were all done in 2 or 3 hours at once. I haven't had time to check all the accounts but are they all mostly newbies or actual established accounts with variation (not all the same register date etc.)


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Vod on March 25, 2015, 09:12:54 PM
I'm up to 35 spam trust ratings now, all from newbie accounts with no activity.

I must be very important to someone out there!


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: alani123 on March 25, 2015, 09:15:08 PM
maybe newbie accounts shouldn't be allowed to give trust ratings in the same way they can't vote on polls


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: funtotry on March 26, 2015, 12:46:45 AM
maybe newbie accounts shouldn't be allowed to give trust ratings in the same way they can't vote on polls
I disagree. Newbies do business, in fact a large percentage of gift card market is newbies, because non-bitcoiners find this great deal and sign up for an account here. Disallowing newbies wouldn't fix anything with trust spam since the vast majority of trust left here is by people higher than junior member.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Vod on March 26, 2015, 12:48:45 AM
maybe newbie accounts shouldn't be allowed to give trust ratings in the same way they can't vote on polls
I disagree. Newbies do business, in fact a large percentage of gift card market is newbies, because non-bitcoiners find this great deal and sign up for an account here. Disallowing newbies wouldn't fix anything with trust spam since the vast majority of trust left here is by people higher than junior member.

That's because a large percentage of the gift cards are purchased with stolen credit cards.  People burn through newbie accounts because they are easy to create.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: EcuaMobi on March 26, 2015, 01:13:11 AM
maybe newbie accounts shouldn't be allowed to give trust ratings in the same way they can't vote on polls
I disagree. Newbies do business, in fact a large percentage of gift card market is newbies, because non-bitcoiners find this great deal and sign up for an account here. Disallowing newbies wouldn't fix anything with trust spam since the vast majority of trust left here is by people higher than junior member.

That's because a lathe percentage of the gift cards are purchased with stolen credit cards.  People burn through newbie accounts because they are easy to create.

Agreed. I really don't think there are too many people that make deals as soon as they join bitcointalk for the first time. Almost all newbies making deals are old members hiding behind alt accounts.

Besides if a newbie makes deals at least for a little while they will be junior in a couple of weeks. So allowing only Jr. members and above to leave feedback would make sense to me.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: alani123 on March 26, 2015, 06:20:07 AM
maybe newbie accounts shouldn't be allowed to give trust ratings in the same way they can't vote on polls
I disagree. Newbies do business, in fact a large percentage of gift card market is newbies, because non-bitcoiners find this great deal and sign up for an account here. Disallowing newbies wouldn't fix anything with trust spam since the vast majority of trust left here is by people higher than junior member.

It takes 30 activity points to get a newbie account turn into a Jr. Member...


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: tspacepilot on March 26, 2015, 01:28:15 PM
maybe newbie accounts shouldn't be allowed to give trust ratings in the same way they can't vote on polls

That does seem like it might fix the issue associated with this particular thread.  If you have to wait a month to use your brand new 20 accounts drop trust spam, presumably your head would have cooled off in those 4 weeks and you'd have thought of something more useful to do.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Vod on March 27, 2015, 01:16:37 AM
I removed negative trust off two accounts that stopped selling MSDN keys.  The trust spam seems to have stopped for me.   :-\


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: funtotry on March 31, 2015, 05:54:45 PM
maybe newbie accounts shouldn't be allowed to give trust ratings in the same way they can't vote on polls
I disagree. Newbies do business, in fact a large percentage of gift card market is newbies, because non-bitcoiners find this great deal and sign up for an account here. Disallowing newbies wouldn't fix anything with trust spam since the vast majority of trust left here is by people higher than junior member.

It takes 30 activity points to get a newbie account turn into a Jr. Member...
Which is 3 14 day periods, a month and a half. If the user really wants to get into the bitcoin world I am sure they will wait about 42 days until they can be part of the trust member.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: tspacepilot on March 31, 2015, 08:32:49 PM
maybe newbie accounts shouldn't be allowed to give trust ratings in the same way they can't vote on polls
I disagree. Newbies do business, in fact a large percentage of gift card market is newbies, because non-bitcoiners find this great deal and sign up for an account here. Disallowing newbies wouldn't fix anything with trust spam since the vast majority of trust left here is by people higher than junior member.

It takes 30 activity points to get a newbie account turn into a Jr. Member...
Which is 3 14 day periods, a month and a half. If the user really wants to get into the bitcoin world I am sure they will wait about 42 days until they can be part of the trust member.

Of course they will.  The point here was that someone or some ones were creating a bunch of accounts just to drop a bunch of negative trust, ie trust spam.  Presuambly if you have to wait a month and a half, you'll have calmed down a bit in that time and so creating a bunch of accounts just to trust spam won't really happen.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: SaltySpitoon on March 31, 2015, 09:19:17 PM
maybe newbie accounts shouldn't be allowed to give trust ratings in the same way they can't vote on polls
I disagree. Newbies do business, in fact a large percentage of gift card market is newbies, because non-bitcoiners find this great deal and sign up for an account here. Disallowing newbies wouldn't fix anything with trust spam since the vast majority of trust left here is by people higher than junior member.

It takes 30 activity points to get a newbie account turn into a Jr. Member...
Which is 3 14 day periods, a month and a half. If the user really wants to get into the bitcoin world I am sure they will wait about 42 days until they can be part of the trust member.

Of course they will.  The point here was that someone or some ones were creating a bunch of accounts just to drop a bunch of negative trust, ie trust spam.  Presuambly if you have to wait a month and a half, you'll have calmed down a bit in that time and so creating a bunch of accounts just to trust spam won't really happen.

Orrrr, you give scammers 42 days of immunity before the newbie they just got scammed or almost scammed can speak out against them. Can anyone show a single example of where trust spam by newbies has caused any effect on anyone in the slightest? Maybe point out a thread where someone refused to deal with someone because they had 50 negatives from untrusted newbies?


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: tspacepilot on March 31, 2015, 11:19:59 PM
maybe newbie accounts shouldn't be allowed to give trust ratings in the same way they can't vote on polls
I disagree. Newbies do business, in fact a large percentage of gift card market is newbies, because non-bitcoiners find this great deal and sign up for an account here. Disallowing newbies wouldn't fix anything with trust spam since the vast majority of trust left here is by people higher than junior member.

It takes 30 activity points to get a newbie account turn into a Jr. Member...
Which is 3 14 day periods, a month and a half. If the user really wants to get into the bitcoin world I am sure they will wait about 42 days until they can be part of the trust member.

Of course they will.  The point here was that someone or some ones were creating a bunch of accounts just to drop a bunch of negative trust, ie trust spam.  Presuambly if you have to wait a month and a half, you'll have calmed down a bit in that time and so creating a bunch of accounts just to trust spam won't really happen.

Orrrr, you give scammers 42 days of immunity before the newbie they just got scammed or almost scammed can speak out against them. Can anyone show a single example of where trust spam by newbies has caused any effect on anyone in the slightest? Maybe point out a thread where someone refused to deal with someone because they had 50 negatives from untrusted newbies?

This is also a good point.  But doesn't this cut both ways, if everyone ignores trust from newbies then how is removing their ability to put that equivalent to removing their voice to "speak out".  Presumably they can still post issues in "scam accusations".  But if 50 accounts try to post the same scam accusation just to rage-spam the forum, the mods will presumably delete those threads.

I admit, I'm not passionate about this either way, and I haven't had any trust-spam issues.  I just thought that the waiting period on feedback may have made sense.  But I may be wrong...


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: SaltySpitoon on April 01, 2015, 12:22:32 AM
Orrrr, you give scammers 42 days of immunity before the newbie they just got scammed or almost scammed can speak out against them. Can anyone show a single example of where trust spam by newbies has caused any effect on anyone in the slightest? Maybe point out a thread where someone refused to deal with someone because they had 50 negatives from untrusted newbies?

This is also a good point.  But doesn't this cut both ways, if everyone ignores trust from newbies then how is removing their ability to put that equivalent to removing their voice to "speak out".  Presumably they can still post issues in "scam accusations".  But if 50 accounts try to post the same scam accusation just to rage-spam the forum, the mods will presumably delete those threads.

I admit, I'm not passionate about this either way, and I haven't had any trust-spam issues.  I just thought that the waiting period on feedback may have made sense.  But I may be wrong...

The point is, that newbie's feedback (and everyone's for that matter) is pretty much disregarded unless you include a reference link, and an accurate description of what the negative is for. I haven't seen a single case since the trust system was implemented where trust spam has been any sort of issue. I've seen people annoyed that they recieved a negative, but I haven't seen a single case where a false negative from trust spammers has inhibited anyone in any way. I dont see why we need to propose fixes for something that isn't a problem. If it becomes a problem, we should fix it.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: tspacepilot on April 01, 2015, 02:22:31 AM
Orrrr, you give scammers 42 days of immunity before the newbie they just got scammed or almost scammed can speak out against them. Can anyone show a single example of where trust spam by newbies has caused any effect on anyone in the slightest? Maybe point out a thread where someone refused to deal with someone because they had 50 negatives from untrusted newbies?

This is also a good point.  But doesn't this cut both ways, if everyone ignores trust from newbies then how is removing their ability to put that equivalent to removing their voice to "speak out".  Presumably they can still post issues in "scam accusations".  But if 50 accounts try to post the same scam accusation just to rage-spam the forum, the mods will presumably delete those threads.

I admit, I'm not passionate about this either way, and I haven't had any trust-spam issues.  I just thought that the waiting period on feedback may have made sense.  But I may be wrong...

The point is, that newbie's feedback (and everyone's for that matter) is pretty much disregarded unless you include a reference link, and an accurate description of what the negative is for. I haven't seen a single case since the trust system was implemented where trust spam has been any sort of issue. I've seen people annoyed that they recieved a negative, but I haven't seen a single case where a false negative from trust spammers has inhibited anyone in any way. I dont see why we need to propose fixes for something that isn't a problem. If it becomes a problem, we should fix it.

I understand.  My only reply would be that annoyances are, in a sense, problems.  Minor ones by definition, yes.  But many annoyances can certainly become problematic.  In any case, I won't say anything more on this because I've never been trust spammed and therefore never even been annoyed by it. 


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: EcuaMobi on April 05, 2015, 08:26:58 PM
 I just left a review noting symantec (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=382389) hacks websites to steal keys and resell them (after he publicly admitted so) and I instantly got trust spam from several accounts, very similarly as OP. So I'm pretty sure he's the one who left that spam for OP too.

Edit: After leaving a review on his shill accounts noting they belong to symantec he removed almost all of the spam from my profile.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Quickseller on April 05, 2015, 11:07:13 PM
I just left a review noting symantec (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=382389) hacks websites to steal keys and resell them (after he publicly admitted so) and I instantly got trust spam from several accounts, very similarly as OP. So I'm pretty sure he's the one who left that spam for OP too.
haha wow that is a lot of negative feedback. Well I guess we now know who was behind all those spam negatives that Vod got not long ago. None of them have any credibility though, especially considering that they all have negative trust


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: symantec on April 06, 2015, 03:41:46 AM
I just left a review noting symantec (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=382389) hacks websites to steal keys and resell them (after he publicly admitted so) and I instantly got trust spam from several accounts, very similarly as OP. So I'm pretty sure he's the one who left that spam for OP too.

Oh...A dog miserable, why look at things like the others here.

Why when I open toppic scam, you jump into my toppic and give a response -> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.0


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: symantec on April 06, 2015, 03:44:58 AM
]haha wow that is a lot of negative feedback. Well I guess we now know who was behind all those spam negatives that Vod got not long ago. None of them have any credibility though, especially considering that they all have negative trust

Behind these negative people who are taking advantage of them as a hobby and with the ignorance of working to impose on everyone here.

Why do not know is he ignorant when using Trust:
- Positive - You trust this person or had a successful trade.
- Neutral - Comments. Your rating will not affect this person's trust score.
- Negative - You were scammed or you strongly believe that this person is a scammer.




Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: EcuaMobi on April 06, 2015, 03:59:30 AM

Why when I open toppic scam, you jump into my toppic and give a response -> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.0


To try to clear things up. That's what people are supposed to do in a scam accusation. Unfortunately you weren't helpful so I had to give up.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10990891#msg10990891


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: chmod755 on April 06, 2015, 04:11:01 AM
I recently (April 4) received many negative ratings from new accounts - that guy copied my own comments --> 0/10 for effort.

I didn't give a bad rating to symantec, but maybe he maintains more than one bitcointalk account


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: EcuaMobi on April 06, 2015, 04:23:06 AM
I recently (April 4) received many negative ratings from new accounts - that guy copied my own comments --> 0/10 for effort.

I didn't give a bad rating to symantec, but maybe he maintains more than one bitcointalk account

Yes I'm pretty sure he has at least 2 additional accounts he uses to sell keys (not 100% sure so I won't mention the accounts) and who knows if others besides those.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: symantec on April 06, 2015, 05:59:43 AM
To try to clear things up. That's what people are supposed to do in a scam accusation. Unfortunately you weren't helpful so I had to give up.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10990891#msg10990891

Read it before you open your mouth dog here

- Positive - You trust this person or had a successful trade.
- Neutral - Comments. Your rating will not affect this person's trust score.
- Negative - You were scammed or you strongly believe that this person is a scammer.


This is the last time I speak in this topic:

1. You and the people Indian and China are the same: Because I call this the dog

2. You guys are calling for more people to participate to war with me

3. He and others are abusing the system you trust to apply to everyone

4. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548 (This is my topic aims to warn everyone to be careful when trade with him)


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As for my own: I still staying true to conscience and my man and I is not scam anyone here. Here I always have customers and partners trust me

Those who are taking advantage of trust: Stop the ignorance of him when imposing it for everyone

Especially pay attention to the following topics: This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1013646
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=987244.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1007956.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1007795


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Muhammed Zakir on April 06, 2015, 06:50:04 AM
[ size=12pt]Read it before you open your mouth dog here

- Positive - You trust this person or had a successful trade.
- Neutral - Comments. Your rating will not affect this person's trust score.
- Negative - You were scammed or you strongly believe that this person is a scammer.

They are simple rules for leaving feedback. There are many more rules for leaving trust feedback. Don't claim things only with those three lines. :)

This is the last time I speak in this topic:

I don't want you to stop posting in this thread, I want you to stop using unnecessary BBCodes and speak calmly.

1. You and the people Indian and China are the same: Because I call this the dog

This shows how exactly is your personality.

2. You guys are calling for more people to participate to war with me

I (we) aren't in for a war. It looks like you are in for a war. You even can't talk correctly.

3. He and others are abusing the system you trust to apply to everyone

I didn't understand this. However, I am fairly sure you have misunderstood.

4. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548 (This is my topic aims to warn everyone to be careful when trade with him)

Warning is good but you should clarify all things or atleast the questions asked by members. What you did were reposting same post(s).


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As for my own: I still staying true to conscience and my man and I is not scam anyone here. Here I always have customers and partners trust me

Negative trust feedback wasn't for scamming, it was for bad attitude and possible-false scam accusation.

Those who are taking advantage of trust: Stop the ignorance of him when imposing it for everyone

You did see his profile, right? We aren't ignoring him, you couldn't even make a truthful scam accusation and came up with bad behavior.

Especially pay attention to the following topics: This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1013646
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=987244.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1007956.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1007795[/size]

Yes, self-moderated threads are bad for sales but there can be good intentions too(not saying FuckIdolPlus has/had good/bad intention).

P.S. You can clearly understand what does the forum warning mean. IMHO you have a few misunderstandings but you aren't ready to ask them. :)


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: symantec on April 06, 2015, 07:30:35 AM
Yes, self-moderated threads are bad for sales but there can be good intentions too(not saying FuckIdolPlus has/had good/bad intention).

P.S. You can clearly understand what does the forum warning mean. IMHO you have a few misunderstandings but you aren't ready to ask them. :)

Better go suck travel mouth bitch Indian:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10986221#msg10986221
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10987699#msg10987699
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10987962#msg10987962
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10990204#msg10990204
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991113#msg10991113
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991220#msg10991220
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991683#msg10991683

Important Messages: https://i.imgur.com/OChMSjX.png and https://i.imgur.com/hLDpXFW.png

What is happening when you avoid him questions: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991993#msg10991993

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I will find here: Skype: tanya.kuthiala.3 and E-Mail: tanya.kuthiala.3@gmail.com and I'll figure out something like this

https://www.facebook.com/tanya.kuthiala.3 or https://www.facebook.com/tanya.kuthiala (This is Indians, in the state of Kerala)

PS: Here's a bitch in Indians...That is why Muhammad Zakir trying to justify the actions of this scam

Muhammad Zakir - https://i.imgur.com/Rmv7Hju.png (This is Indians, in the state of Kerala)


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Muhammed Zakir on April 06, 2015, 08:01:40 AM
[ size=12pt]Better go suck travel mouth bitch Indian:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10986221#msg10986221
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10987699#msg10987699
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10987962#msg10987962
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10990204#msg10990204
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991113#msg10991113
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991220#msg10991220
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991683#msg10991683

What is with my messages? I was trying to ask FuckIdolPlus to know more about this. If you look my posts, you can clearly see that I have done the same thing earlier.

Important Messages: https://i.imgur.com/OChMSjX.png

I asked her to give the password to me or a trusted person so that I or anyone else can verify what she is claiming is true or not.

and https://i.imgur.com/hLDpXFW.png

See the reference.

What is happening when you avoid him questions: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991993#msg10991993

If you have checked the time, you can easily know I was sleeping at that time. I checked your thread now and if you unlock it, I can reply. Thank you!

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I will find here: Skype: tanya.kuthiala.3 and E-Mail: tanya.kuthiala.3@gmail.com and I'll figure out something like this

https://www.facebook.com/tanya.kuthiala.3 or https://www.facebook.com/tanya.kuthiala (This is Indians, in the state of Kerala)

A fair warning: You maybe going for similar names. I can assure you, I don't know here but I know you won't believe it. If you think it is her's, it's okay but probably, it may belong to someone else and you might be breaking their privacy. Anyway, it's always your choice.

PS: Here's a bitch in Indians...That is why Muhammad Zakir trying to justify the actions of this scam

Muhammad Zakir - https://i.imgur.com/Rmv7Hju.png (This is Indians, in the state of Kerala)[/size]

Yes, I am an Indian. I still don't know why should I protect a person(if he/she is bad) even if the person is living in my country.

This is going a little offtopic. If you think my actions are bad or irrelevant, feel free to start a scam accusation and we can discuss it there.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Muhammed Zakir on April 06, 2015, 08:49:17 AM
Thanks mate. Whose next or am I the last? :)

https://i.imgur.com/N1IzfHz.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/N1IzfHz.jpg)


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: redsn0w on April 06, 2015, 08:52:20 AM
Thanks mate. Whose next or am I the last? :)

https://i.imgur.com/N1IzfHz.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/N1IzfHz.jpg)

Who cares? Negative trusts from brand new/newbie users. I hope no one will trust  their judgments  ::). will the trust system be (in the new forum software) the same as now?


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: BadBear on April 06, 2015, 01:13:37 PM
...

95 accounts for trust bombing? Really?


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Quickseller on April 06, 2015, 01:20:36 PM
Thanks mate. Whose next or am I the last? :)

https://i.imgur.com/N1IzfHz.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/N1IzfHz.jpg)
this is obvious spam. I think this probably qualifies to have them removed, however either way it is not going to affect you.

IMO anyone that attacks someone based on their race is deducted credibility points in my book and are generally not going to be listened to.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: siameze on April 06, 2015, 01:37:11 PM
IMO anyone that attacks someone based on their race is deducted credibility points in my book and are generally not going to be listened to.

Usually racially charged comments follow from a person that has not legitimate ground to stand on in their accusations. Muhammed Zakir was one of the first people I remembered seeing on here regularly, and although I don't know him well seems like a genuinely nice guy. There are certainly bad actors amongst all races and peoples, so trying to justify this simply because he is an Indian is rather laughable.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Muhammed Zakir on April 06, 2015, 01:42:58 PM
...

95 accounts for trust bombing? Really?

:o Why don't we ban as he/she is clearly spamming. I mean there is ban for post_spam and PM_spam, so why not a ban for "trust_spam"? This will increase if no action is taken and of course, never want a trust moderation. The trust feedback can stay there.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Grand_Voyageur on April 06, 2015, 01:56:14 PM
IMO anyone that attacks someone based on their race is deducted credibility points in my book and are generally not going to be listened to.

Usually racially charged comments follow from a person that has not legitimate ground to stand on in their accusations. Muhammed Zakir was one of the first people I remembered seeing on here regularly, and although I don't know him well seems like a genuinely nice guy. There are certainly bad actors amongst all races and peoples, so trying to justify this simply because he is an Indian is rather laughable.

+1. Symantec (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=382389) seems to have the habit to resort to retaliation trust feedback abuse; recently, at the beginning of the MSDN Key trade affair he sent me a PM saying he left me -ve trust feedback - over the following neutral feedback: Selling Keys from MSDN is not allowed as per Microsoft own TOS (see http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_7-windows_install/selling-product-key-from-msdntechnet-and-or/cf40c328-67ce-49b6-bbb6-c28cda92c06e) and may also be a misdemeanor or felony in your jurisdiction accordingly to IP protection law and/or other laws. This can apply also to Keys from other software houses. Always do your own due diligence before engaging in a trade! - then backtracking. After this I reminded him - PMs #msg3525723, #msg3526241, #msg3526263 - about how trust feedback was supposed to operate; so now, I think he has no excuse for his abusive behaviour.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: tspacepilot on April 06, 2015, 01:59:02 PM
...

95 accounts for trust bombing? Really?

:o Why don't we ban as he/she is clearly spamming. I mean there is ban for post_spam and PM_spam, so why not a ban for "trust_spam"? This will increase if no action is taken and of course, never want a trust moderation. The trust feedback can stay there.

This seems like a reasonable approach, I think.  Salty?


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Muhammed Zakir on April 06, 2015, 02:10:37 PM
L+1. Symantec (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=382389) seems to have the habit to resort to retaliation trust feedback abuse;

If I were him, I will stop this. Won't it be boring to login to 95 accounts and leave feedback to different accounts? -x_x-

recently, at the beginning of the MSDN Key trade affair he sent me a PM saying he left me -ve trust feedback - over the following neutral feedback: Selling Keys from MSDN is not allowed as per Microsoft own TOS (see http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_7-windows_install/selling-product-key-from-msdntechnet-and-or/cf40c328-67ce-49b6-bbb6-c28cda92c06e) and may also be a misdemeanor or felony in your jurisdiction accordingly to IP protection law and/or other laws. This can apply also to Keys from other software houses.

It was discussed earlier but there wasn't much use. As it isn't illegal because at most, it is punishable under Civil law.

Always do your own due diligence before engaging in a trade![/i] - then backtracking.

What Vod did was to get this to attention but it went in a different way as there was "illegal" and "stolen". One the contrary, Vod has a soft corner for Microsoft and that is one of the reason for leaving negative feedback and also one of the reason for anti-vod statements.

After this I reminded him - PMs #msg3525723, #msg3526241, #msg3526263 - about how trust feedback was supposed to operate; so now, I think he has no excuse for his abusive behaviour.

For me, he has: "I am an Indian". :-\

Edit: He has came up with FB profiles which claims she is living in my state. Pretty soon, he will tell she is my neighbour. Hope he atleast won't tell "she is living in my home/house". ::)


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: symantec on April 06, 2015, 02:15:19 PM
95 accounts for trust bombing? Really?

Sorry! Admin. I don't remember much

But my purpose is to attack give the bastard is abusing trust here to apply to everyone

We are pulling more members to go to war with me

The people Indian and China are the same: Because I call this the dog


:o Why don't we ban as he/she is clearly spamming. I mean there is ban for post_spam and PM_spam, so why not a ban for "trust_spam"? This will increase if no action is taken and of course, never want a trust moderation. The trust feedback can stay there.

Better go suck travel mouth bitch Indian
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10986221#msg10986221
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10987699#msg10987699
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10987962#msg10987962
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10990204#msg10990204
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991113#msg10991113
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991220#msg10991220
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991683#msg10991683

Important Messages: https://i.imgur.com/OChMSjX.png and https://i.imgur.com/hLDpXFW.png

What is happening when you avoid him questions: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991993#msg10991993


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: BadBear on April 06, 2015, 02:21:54 PM
95 accounts for trust bombing? Really?

Sorry! Admin. I don't remember much

But my purpose is to attack give the bastard is abusing trust here to apply to everyone

We are pulling more members to go to war with me



I don't care what your purpose is, it's still spam, and it accomplishes nothing. Use your time away from the forum to chill out.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: siameze on April 06, 2015, 02:22:20 PM
Such poppycock. If you don't want Vod or anyone else to leave you negative trust then either 1) Don't sell stolen goods and products which also violate the company's TOU, or 2) Do business on another forum that doesn't rate members or provide such protections.

Just last week in another thread, a user by the name of SellMaster3000 or something was doing the same thing, and seemed shocked that people would leave him negative feedback. Vod is simply making a note of facts which is valuable if you want to make an informed decision. If you like cutting corners you will overlook the trust comments and contine buying from such vendors I am sure. If integrity matters to you, then you will look elsewhere.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Muhammed Zakir on April 06, 2015, 02:24:01 PM
[ size=12pt]Sorry! Admin. I don't remember much

This. It clearly states you have created lots of account just for trust spam.

But my purpose is to attack give the bastard is abusing trust here to apply to everyone

This is were you are wrong. If I am abusing trust system, you shouldn't do the same to me, you should post in Meta and we can discuss.

We are pulling more members to go to war with me

Another misunderstanding of yours. I am not a magnet. You can't:

• Clearly post a scam accusation.
• Avoid trust spam.
• Avoid abusive language.
• Clear your doubts.

[ color=green]The people Indian and China are the same: Because I call this the dog[/color][/size]

As you call us Dogs, we are same. Interesting theory.

[ size=12pt]Better go suck travel mouth bitch Indian
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10986221#msg10986221
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10987699#msg10987699
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10987962#msg10987962
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10990204#msg10990204
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991113#msg10991113
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991220#msg10991220
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991683#msg10991683

Important Messages: https://i.imgur.com/OChMSjX.png and https://i.imgur.com/hLDpXFW.png

What is happening when you avoid him questions: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.msg10991993#msg10991993[/size]

These are explained above. Have you took the time to read before copy-pasting? Besides, could you teach me how to "suck" these if that solve your problem? Whenever I tried, my mouth is either vaccum or is filled with air. Thank you!


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Grand_Voyageur on April 06, 2015, 03:48:57 PM
L+1. Symantec (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=382389) seems to have the habit to resort to retaliation trust feedback abuse;

If I were him, I will stop this. Won't it be boring to login to 95 accounts and leave feedback to different accounts? -x_x-

LOL

recently, at the beginning of the MSDN Key trade affair he sent me a PM saying he left me -ve trust feedback - over the following neutral feedback: Selling Keys from MSDN is not allowed as per Microsoft own TOS (see http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_7-windows_install/selling-product-key-from-msdntechnet-and-or/cf40c328-67ce-49b6-bbb6-c28cda92c06e) and may also be a misdemeanor or felony in your jurisdiction accordingly to IP protection law and/or other laws. This can apply also to Keys from other software houses.

It was discussed earlier but there wasn't much use. As it isn't illegal because at most, it is punishable under Civil law.

Sadly, this wasn't the case in every jurisdiction. As an example, in Italy to IP protection laws qualify users of such Keys as felons due to them being punishable even when you do it not-for-profit, in order to make a "profit" which can also be seen in the simple expense savings due to the fact that you have had paid less money than for the purchase of the original key/software. Since Symantec self-admitted to being using an exploit to illegally obtaining MS Keys an Italian user could also held accountable to article 648 -a felony - of the Italian penal code (if the same user was unaware of the illicit origin of the Keys and simply failed to verify their lecit origin - doubtful - he could hope the be held accountable to article 712 - a misdemeanor - of the same penal code. Civil law punishments can always be applied even if court charges are brought.
However, if I remove a software from a system and resell the same key to another usere this would be OK both to IP, penal laws & to MS (or other software house). Obviously, multi-user key licenses have to be sold in bulk and cannot be sold individually.

Always do your own due diligence before engaging in a trade![/i] - then backtracking.

What Vod did was to get this to attention but it went in a different way as there was "illegal" and "stolen". One the contrary, Vod has a soft corner for Microsoft and that is one of the reason for leaving negative feedback and also one of the reason for anti-vod statements.

As I said above out there are many court jurisdictions. Vod called out MS since he was knowledgeable over it; but sw came from many software house and I am concerned of having to fight in a court not about a developer balance sheet.


Title: Re: Trust spam happens
Post by: Grand_Voyageur on April 07, 2015, 10:40:48 AM
95 accounts for trust bombing? Really?

Sorry! Admin. I don't remember much

But my purpose is to attack give the bastard is abusing trust here to apply to everyone

We are pulling more members to go to war with me



I don't care what your purpose is, it's still spam, and it accomplishes nothing. Use your time away from the forum to chill out.

He (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=382389) came back with an alt-account kinglong (uid:490032) (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=490032) to evade ban opening an almost identical thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1016057.0) to repeat same accusation against MZ after users asked him to provide verifiable evidence (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1012548.0;all) over the FuckIdolPlus scam case he was involved in. Also he still engaged in giving out fake trust feedbacks.

http://gyazo.com/f820c68abd0a5764a0b6ce5a575a3cc9 (http://gyazo.com/f820c68abd0a5764a0b6ce5a575a3cc9)