Bitcoin Forum

[Update:]Currently there is only one spot for order with value about 15 000 GBP. Please note that cost estimates have been changed to 900£ initial and 120£ monthly recurring.

  My name is Vladimir and I've been in bitcoin mining business since late 2010.  I have qualifications, experience and passion suitable for this business and I do it on full-time basis since January 2011. It seems that this is now the right time for expansion and therefore I offer for your consideration this call for investors to participate in an exciting bitcoin mining project.

  I have recently secured a site for new data centre, let's call it DC3. DC3 has a benefit of secure environment for bitcoin mining rigs with plentiful electricity supply at relatively good prices with potential to negotiate an even better deal once the operation starts consuming lots of electricity. My DC design (tested and proved on previous DC's) is expected to have better than 1.06 PUE. For example, Facebook, recently boasted that they have a new state of the art DC with PUE (power use efficiency) of 1.07. As an another example a typical commercial DC with refrigeration(aircon) based CRAC's has PUE above 2.1 This is also known as the second watt problem.

  DC3 site has potential to accommodate up to 400 Ghps worth of GPU based equipment.

  Since January 2011 I've sold and fulfilled a significant number of mining contracts and also have more than one investor on board with terms substantially similar to what is proposed here.

  The proposed scheme is simple. Investor funds deployment and operation of the hardware and all reasonable and relevant out of pocket expenses, I do all the leg work. The results of calculations are split 65/35 for investments above 15k£ and 70/30 for investment above 60k£. For example, in case of 70/30 split, 70% of bitcoins mined by hardware goes to the investor and 30% to the operator.

  Moreover, property rights on hardware (mining rigs) built and operated under this agreement are split in the same proportion.

  It is estimated that it will cost, on per Ghps basis, 900£ to build and deploy the hardware followed by 120£ per month to run it.

  There are many options on what to do with hashing capacity for investors. They could point it to a pool, get zero-variance delivery from me, they could resell it in place, offer their own bitcoin mining contracts to the public, sell bitcoin option or futures contracts backed by mining capacity etc...

  Should you be interested in this opportunity please contact me for more details.

F.A.Q.

Q1. I want to invest 20 BTC. Where do I send?
A1. Minimal investment is 15 000 GBP. Should you wish to invest BTC or USD or SLL or Mongolian Tugrics or carrots you would need to convert it to GBP. Fiat currencies can be converted fairly efficiently to GBP using companies such as xe.com and transferwise.com. Bank details for wire transfers are provided when contract is signed.

Q2. Would you have have any problems if somebody took you up on your offer and divided that action up on GLBSE?
A2. No problems.  Moreover, it is certain that I will not list on GLBSE myself, because my legal counsel wont let me. Therefore, whoever uses GLBSE for this will not face competition from me directly.

Q4. Do you hand out guarantees/contracts/SLAs that include also commitments/penalty payments from your side if a rig goes down?
A4. Indeed I do offer a SLA in form of zero-variance computational results delivery. When a customer elects zero-variance option he will receive on daily basis as many bitcoins as statistically expected for given Ghps hashing capacity. This will happen regardless of rig's uptime. For comparison, some pools charge as much as 10% for "reduced variance" which is not even as good as my zero-variance delivery.

Q3. What type of hardware are investors investing in?
A3. GPU based high end mining systems. Only high quality components with mix of 6990's and 5970's. As they say... a picture is better than 1000 words and I have two pictures for you. This is shelf 1 in DC1, fairly typical unit, DC3 will be quite similar.

http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/7834/dc1shelf1outside.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/694/dc1shelf1outside.jpg/)

http://img534.imageshack.us/img534/4029/dc1shelf1inside.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/534/dc1shelf1inside.jpg/)

I highly doubt you are going to find venture capitalists of that caliber here.

I have no such doubts. There are already people onboard with this and more people are in DD stage.

On second thought, you're right. If I had that kind of income, I would probably drop that kind of money on this, given a sound business plan.

Bitcoin geeks know it is a sound concept. This is a low-risk, high-reward start-up. Are you willing to link to a plan here or is that under NDA?

The business plan is essentially in my original post above. I make no representations with regard to future valuation of BTC, bitcoin difficulty, prices of electricity etc. I however give an estimation of costs involved into deploying and operating 1 Ghps. You do not expect me to provide cashflow projections here, do you?

Also I am not soliciting investments into my company. I am offering investors to outsource bitcoin mining to me on partnership basis.

However, I am prepared to discuss my offer in details privately.

Would you have have any problems if somebody (probably not me) took you up on your offer and divided that action up on GLBSE? (Of course they'd take a small management fee)

It is none of my business what my clients do with their mining capacity, as long as I am not burdened with significant administrative overhead.

Funding it via GLBSE and than distributing 'results of calculations' as dividend might be a great idea for someone. Moreover, it is certain that I will not list on GLBSE myself, because my legal counsel wont let me. Therefore, whoever uses GLBSE for this will not face competition from me directly.

I love it!

Shouldn't the operator be taking on the running cost (of what u wsay is 100 per machine?) for their 35% of otherwise no investment?

Dear filharvey, thank you very much for your interest and for your proposed business model. It is very interesting. I think I will pass on this one at this time, though.

Feel free to run a similar service yourself on the terms you have suggested.

Your electricity costs are ~0,14 GBP (0,16 EUR/0,23USD) per hour per rig. Assuming a 1MH/W efficiency (which is quite low as you claim to have an overhead of just 6% for cooling and many AMD GPUs have more like 1,5MH/W or better) this is still higher than the electricity prices where I live, which are already quite high compared to other places.

Also I don't really get the point of paying you to set up hardware, paying for (overpriced?) electricity and THEN paying you 35% or 30% on top of that. This translates to over 100 GH/s (if the full datacenter can be filled) just for your own pocket with 0 expenses. Even if 1 rig fails per day, you still would make profit (currently 100GH/s would be worth nearly 2000 USD per DAY), plus you own 1/3 or that rig too! Do you hand out guarantees/contracts/SLAs that include also commitments/penalty payments from your side if a rig goes down? What are your exact services that are worth ~1/3 of investor's incomes?
I'm also not that happy about the fact that investors pay 100% of the hardware but you own 30/35% of that hardware afterwards just for plugging it together.

What I value though, is that you are at least upfront and tell in advance what to expect, maybe there really are people that see this as an interesting business model/investment?!

When at first I read this post...
I thought it was a pretty funny joke...
A play on SkepsiDyne and all the mining companies...
Now I realize it's just a very bad investment...

I know that maths can be pretty hard...
But when you look to invest 20k+++...
You should take the time to run the numbers...
I'll hold your hand and even do it for you...

Assumption 1: Average difficulty over next year: 1 000 000. (super optimistic)
Assumption 2: Value of mining equipment after one year 50% of new price. (super optimistic)

Alternative A) Invest in this:
Investment in equipment: 1000GBP
Monthly cost: 12*100 = 1200 GBP
Total: 2200GBP

BTC generated at 1Ghps after one year at 1M difficulty: 365
Of these you get to keep 65%: 237
At end of one year your hardware has a value of: 500GBP of which you get to keep 65%: 325

So for a total outlay of GBP: 2200-325= 1875 you get 237 Bitcoins.

Alternative B) Buy bitcoins for GBP 1875 today at USD price 8.5:
You get 361 bitcoins and get to keep all of them...

Even with these very optimistic assumptions...
This investment here is very very bad...
Maybe you hope to find someone...
With 20k+++ and no math skills...

But as I have said before...
Unless the investment is pure genius...
It will always be better to just hold coins...
A mining company is not pure genius...
In any form or way...

Surkim, where did you get "Your electricity costs are ~0,14 GBP (0,16 EUR/0,23USD) per hour per rig."?  This seems to be a statement of fact in writing, which is false, which is also damaging my business. Do you know what legal definition of this would be? What a bunch of noncence. Are we starting to suck arguments out of our thumbs here. What do you think it does to your credibility?

Sukrim, Bitsinmyhead: You are new here, obviously you lack backgraund info. Therefore I'll try to address your rhetoric.

First of all, please stop comparing this to ScpesiDyne... That is just an anonymous kid (based on his voice) copying me. In fact, ALL known mining contractors to some degree are copying me (thank you),  because I was the first one to offer this kind of service commercially.

Second of all, please stop comparing this to direct purchasing of coins. These two investmetns have completely different risks, rewards and tax liability profiles, etc.., etc.., etc...

Third of all, please stop counting some of my costs and my "outrageous" profits. Your approach is simplistic, and naive to the extreme. I've been pestered by kids like you about how badly I compare to their gaming rigs under the bed for long time now.  You think you are that good, please go and start competing business.  Please do house you rigs in open field by an electrcity pole.


"just plugging in"? O boy... where do I start....

Have any of you ever in your life managed 10 servers for a year? How old are you? What are your business credentials?  Why would anyone take anything you say seriously? Do you realise that running hundreds of servers consuming megawatts of electricity is a completely different ballgame as compared to running 1-2 servers in your mom's basement?

I've been delivering mining contract commercially for a while now. My multiply clients are who's who of this board, and they made boatloads of money on my contracts, most of them renewed expired contracts, many renewed more than one time and increased volumes.

Now I offer service at long term cost far below any competitor on the market plus offer hardware 'hedge' and skiddies are still not happy. Now they tell me I shall work for free, place hundreds of rigs by an electricity pole in the open field, provide zero-variance for free, etc.. etc.. etc... I am, frankly a little tired of this and wish there was a moderated business board where likes of you could not get to.

However, "Do you hand out guarantees/contracts/SLAs that include also commitments/penalty payments from your side if a rig goes down?" is a good question, and yes I do hand out such grantees and contracts and moreover I have significant proved track record of delivering on my promises. I will address this in F.A.Q further.

"What are your exact services that are worth ~1/3 of investor's incomes?" This is another good question and I will address it in F.A.Q. I do think however that for anyone with some money to invest the answer is pretty obvious already.

Sukrim, Bitsinmyhead: I would appreciate if you and your kind stop posting noncence in this thread. Please do not reply to this post in this thread. I really do not want another 10 page discussion comparing my business with a kid ruining mining rig in his mom's basement. I also invite you to consider deleting your not so well thought out posts. However, should you wish to ask further specific questions like the two I mentioned above, you are welcome to do so.

Your statement in the OP: 1000 GBP initially per GH/s (approx.), 100 GBP per 1 GH/s per month for upkeep (approx.)
100 GBP/30 days/24 hours = ~0,14 GBP per hour "to run it" as you put it. I thought this would be most likely your electricity costs - if not, I'm sorry.

Honestly I'm not in the mood to argue around with your business model, whatever you want to achieve with it. Also asking for no answers/followups but on the other hand using mildly insulting/suggestive questions and words like:
might not be the smartest strategy for a respected businessman. Just saying... ;)

If it is not ok for you that people voice their opinion (and yes, my opinion is still, that your own share is too high for my taste - your's obviously is different and it's up for other potential investors to decide for themselves) please consider advertising on a website/forum you control and that you can edit/restrict/censor as you wish.

Further questions:
If they are not 100% electricity costs, what other costs are covered with the ~100 GBP/month an investor should pay?
Until when are you looking for investments? If for example someone would start a collection on GLBSE, this might take one month or more - and by that time you even might be already "booked out".
What type of hardware are investors investing in? With that amount of money you want to raise, FPGAs/ASICs wouldn't be that much out of reach any more... but these have different 2nd hand value to be considered.
Which country will this data center be in? Still in GB or somewhere else?
What types of services are investors allowed to host on "their" machines? Only Bitcoin related stuff (what about hosting a pool server?) or also different services, like webservers, torrent boxes...

So you are some kind of legend on this forum...
David Hasselhoff is a legend in Germany...
Doesn't mean I want to invest in his brand....

Why let numbers ruin such a nice investment idea...
You just hide behind the...
Different risks, rewards and tax liability profiles...

Tax liabilities are very unclear...
At least where I live...
Thats what my accountant says...
Doubt it is much different in the rest of world...

And for the risk/reward...
I want to challange you...
To come up with a set of assumptions....
Where your risk/reward profile...
Is better than just buying coins...

You do that and I leave this thread alone...
But right now this just looks like an easy way...
Of getting rich of someones dreams...
Nothing sells like printing your own free money...

Surkim, you are correct I do get worked up by people assuming that my only cost is mining hardware and electricity, you would be not the first one. Perhaps I should keep my cool better. But trust me you are not the first one pestering me with this by far and my not quite board room style response is provoked by the level of critique.


Let's see.. Rent, property taxes, water, electricity, shared hardware depreciation (floors, CCTV cameras, alarms, shelving/racks, security contracts (including police response), management and monitoring servers, networking equipment and Inet connectivity, cooling system, ventilation ducts, shipping, insurance, electrics ... the list goes on) Also the quoted numbers are estimate. It might get higher in reality, definitely it should not be surprise if thing go 5-10% or even a bit more over budget. Should you try to get something like this in a 'proper DC' expect costs 3-6 times higher, though. This is rather different from just electricity, is it not?


There are no set time limit. DC3 is expected be scalable up to 400 Ghps which is a lot. Further expansion is possible. It might make sense to let me know about large GLBSE listing being prepared so that I amend my plans accordingly and prepare for scaling up further if needed. Also I do not need any specific number of investors to come in order to start the project. DC3 will come online with existing funds and arrangements which are either already in place or being finalized.


GPU based machines, 6990's mostly at the moment, not the cheapest ones either where it comes to mb/PSU/case.



Derbyshire, UK.


None. Investors will not get any access to raw machines. The delivery of the results of calculations would be done either via weekly zero-variance method or by pointing miners to investors RPC end point. Note that costs are quoted per Ghps not by GPU's or boxes.

Here you go...

tomorrow exchange rate of bitcoin goes to 0 and stays there forever. You've just lost 100% of your bitcoin investments while me and my investors will have some computer hardware and a working supercomputer which coluld be sold or may be used to mine namecoins or bitcoin 2.0 or towncoins or googlecoins or visacoins or ciacoins or even fedcoins or carotcoins to be rented out to GCHQ or something else.

Goodbye.

Gpu's are good because they can be used to do computational work on other problems to bitcoin...

The real question is why don't we make a co-op and build bitcoin asic's?  Then sell them for profit... this means that we get GBP or other asset, while still helping the bitcoin community.

Yep.


This is a great idea. I'd be happy to be a customer. But someone else would need to do it. I simply do not have expertise required for this.

You didn't think it would be that easy...
It's time to look at the number once again...
Thats where the answers will be found...
Not in peoples lofty dreams...

So Im going to assume that if bitcoins fall to 0 overnight, the value of the equipment will probably fall to something like 50%. So your investors are risking:
1000 investment + 100 monthly payment - 500*65% value of investment after BTC becomes worthless = 775GBP

Now what I am going to do is buy coins today for 775GBP.
That would equal about 150 coins.

Now every month I will spend the 100GBP buying coins. With average difficulty level of 1M, I should be able to pick up at least on average 10 coins per month. After a year I have 260 coins this way and risked exactly the same as you.

You might argue, but what if price goes up a lot... Well then difficulty will do the same, so it will be worse for you because I get most of my coins in the beginning... Even giving you the very favorable assumption of average 1M difficulty over the next year, which I think most would agree is kinda unrealistic...

The end of the story is:
Your clients risk: 775GBP to gain 237 Bitcoins.
Buying bitcoins risk: 775GBP to gain 260 Bitcoins.

And that my friend is why its called a risk/reward profile and why you just don't look at the risk or reward in isolation.

Investing in bitcoin mining today is questionable...
Investing in bitcoin mining today keeping only 65% is outright terrible...
If its a bad investment...
There is no way you can play around with numbers to make it good...
Its the beauty of the game...

no comments

Wise move, GLBSE is not suited for everyone. We'll have it up in about 8 hours, and the payment function will be working at that time.

I think on buying vs. mining, Bitsinmyhead made enough points already [pun intended! :P].

I did a few calculations on your 2 products and it seem like that after quite exactly 180 days the "Hashes solved per unit of money invested" ratio of investing into this business model starts to beat the 400 GBP/month mining contract (meaning the lower costs per day start to pay off compared to the high initial price)

HOWEVER:

What any investor needs to keep in mind is that the total hashing output is 35% lower, so unless the whole BTC system stays more or less stable on a certain difficulty level (doesn't really matter which) it might still be wiser to consider a high initial burst.
In which (mining) product to invest depends on if you believe that the difficulty will rise (Yes: Get as much capacity as possible NOW!, No: Get as much efficient capacity as possible, maybe even look into the OpenFPGA project [though that only pays off in a few years at it's current hashrate + initial price...] or similar stuff) and also how long you want to invest in it (everything below 180 days makes only sense to be invested in a mining contract).

I also did a more thorough spreadsheet on this, but I guess that's not in the general interest and can be calculated by anyone else.

I would be prepared to make a significant investment into ASIC mining, but not into GPU mining anymore.

This would only pay off, if difficulty stabilizes "soon (tm)" or if you intend to run the same hardware for a few years.

Otherwise high initial bursts with GPUs would pay off far more BTC for your investment, have a much higher resale value (BTC ASICs are nearly worthless except for BTC mining) and can be sold + upgraded if a more efficient model comes out.

It might both have it's pros and cons, but ASIC/FPGA mining is not the solution to everything (much like quantum computing).

[Edit: The above is again only valid for MINING investments, not for BITCOIN investments! As Vladimir already said: Investing in mining is something different from investing in BTC itself, as for example you have some "fiat value" through hardware components in there, some additional benefit for the network itself though hashing power and more flexibility what you use the computing power for. This comes (probably, as Bitsinmyhead calculated) at a price against buying BTC directly but is a different investment model!]

Was talking about ASIC with someone not too long ago, we came to the conclusion that we would probably need something along the lines of USD$1Million. We also came to the conclusion that the bitcoin economy couldn't handle a venture that size at the moment as it would essentailly be a 1million withdrawl from the bitcoin economy.

Right now I don't think the price of bitcoin is high enough to justify something like this.

This is exactly results of my research done half year ago. Investing into ASIC's makes not much sense before 1 BTC hits 100$. Though, if someone proves me wrong, I will not be surprised.

I have some significant money lying around... But not enough to invest directly...

So, can someone open something on GLBSE? Please? :D

Don't forget Casascius coins!  :P

No.

Edit: Seriously, read the thread!

Q3. What type of hardware are investors investing in?
A3. GPU based high end mining systems. Only high quality components with mix of 6990's and 5970's. As they say... a picture is better than 1000 words and I have two pictures for you. This is shelf 1 in DC1, fairly typical unit, DC3 will be quite similar.

http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/7834/dc1shelf1outside.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/694/dc1shelf1outside.jpg/)

http://img534.imageshack.us/img534/4029/dc1shelf1inside.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/534/dc1shelf1inside.jpg/)

You miss the point. He doesn't lose "everything" even if the value of bitcoins crashes to a cent and the currency becomes outlawed on all 5 continents under the penalty of death. He can just suspend the electricity, internet access etc.. Until it becomes profitable again (either for himself or his clients).

Even if it doesn't, he has physical hardware that can either

1. be easily sold for around 60-80% of it's original value depending on how soon this hypothetical massive crash and outlawing would occur (yes you can argue this is a loss, but depreciation of 20% is better than 99.999% depreciation through direct purchase of BTC)

2. used for any other number crunching/cryptographic scheme that requires mass computational power.

Mining bitcoins is a much more economically sound strategy than large direct, speculative purchases.

F.A.Q Updated

Q4. Do you hand out guarantees/contracts/SLAs that include also commitments/penalty payments from your side if a rig goes down?
A4. Indeed I do offer a SLA in form of zero-variance computational results delivery. When a customer elects zero-variance option he will receive on daily basis as many bitcoins as statistically expected for given Ghps hashing capacity. For comparison, some pools charge as much as 10% for "reduced variance" which is even not as good as my zero-variance delivery.

one more picture :-)

http://img863.imageshack.us/img863/9295/cardbox.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/863/cardbox.jpg/)

ooh thats sexy. i had a box about 3/4 that size with 5850s  just a day ago. To bad i didnt have more money or i would really think about giving this a shot. im keeping my eye on this thread i want to see how this turns out and how to see you succeed with this.

Hi.

Is there already glbse posted for this project?

I've contemplated setting such DC myself, seeing that my mining halted to a grind, but would be definitely interested to invest in such opportunity.

As far I know no GBLSE project posted yet related to this. I am definitely not going to do it myself. But will do my best to help whoever does it.

Sorry, if I was slow to respond to queries related to this thread in last two days. Lot's of things are going on right now here. I have finished all the formalities and got the keys from DC3 site yesterday. Move in works are in progress right now. Lots to do.

Below is a picture of a bunch of 5870's waiting deployment in DC3:

http://img542.imageshack.us/img542/3774/cardsperppedfordeployme.jpg

Where you found those?

DISHWARA is trying to buy 8*3 of those and found only two. :/

In Europe there are still a lot of 58xx cards on sale...  8)

How much hash does 22K get one? And we would own it foreve?

Currently this offer is temporarily "on hold" due to already received funding and brisk sales of regular mining contracts.

Once DC3 is fully on-line and further expansion plans are drawn with better certainty for next few month I will activate this offer again.

Meanwhile, do not hesitate to contact me if you have any questions.

The reason you are wrong if the following.

The end of the story is:
Your clients risk: 775GBP to gain 237 Bitcoins with no computational experience or hassle of having multiple servers in their homes + a server farm that can do other tasks, if the worst comes to the worst, you could sell the ATI cards and buy hard drives and bandwidth and just use all of the 'rigs's as dedicated website/storage/game servers.

Buying bitcoins risk: 775GBP to gain 260 Bitcoins.

And this is why his service makes so much sense. 23 bitcoins is negligent considering the advantages.

Are you at Node4's DC3 ? If so I can vouch for Node4, quality service :)

No it is not at Node4, whatever node4 is. If node4 is some kind of DC or colo provider than the chances are that my recurrent prices would be 300-500% and initial prices 80% higher if I was there.

DC0 is in my garage, DC1 is another location, DC2 project is on hold with lease signed by site owner but not yet signed by me, DC3 is another site which is about to go online (any day now), lease for DC4 site is being worked on.

I generally have to go for another DC everytime I suck out all the juice (electricity) available in vicinity of the site  :D.

Ordering own electricity substation so far is rather cost prohibitive and what's more important takes rather long time.

I have now exactly one spot for an order valued at 15 000£ on terms described in OP. First come, first served.

Looks interesting, i'll keep an eye on this

How much hash would that get?

Hypothetically if bitcoins crashed forever the purchaser would still own 65% of the equipment. Would they be able to decided what to do with the equipment? Offer it up as servers/sell it/give you 35% of the depreciated value go owe 100% of the equipment/ other.

15k£ will get you ownership of 6.5 Ghps worth of 6990 based equipment plus about 5 month of running it. This is after my share is taken. Only recurring (operating) expenses thereafter.


In event of 'liquidation' chose one or more of:
- sell it to me (If I make a good enough offer. I will try to offer, on best effort basis, i.e. no guarantees, at least reasonable price for heavy case and some other components which are more difficult to resell/ship)
- flog components on ebay (or elsewhere) yourself, I'd drop-ship at cost. Moreover, I store the packaging and all the stuff coming with components to maximize resale value.
- get me to flog components on ebay (my costs are to be covered)
- collect it in UK (Derbyshire)
- have it shipped to owner, at cost (shipping cases probably will be cost prohibitive, but with the rest of components there should be no problem).

Basically, this is hardware which would be your property, temporarily in my custody. I am prepared to do what's reasonable here.

Hosting it as servers for someone for free or even if compensated, is not reasonable. I do not operate a generic DC. This also means that no remote access will be given to the servers. They will be managed only by me while in my custody.

That seems pretty steep for me. 22grand i could get 15Ghash/s+ . I was thinking about getting an investor or two but ill have to pass. It seems like its more for someone who cant set up there own rigs if an investor like that is in it for the long haul im sure they do alright.

K, this works out in my numbers at about 10 machines running. If people are interested I'm willing to set up a stock on glbse to handle this. I will also throw in my machine which is currently doing only about 1.3gh/s but is earning and hence money incoming.

I think with the current price fluctuations we need to sell 3000 shares at an average of $10. That would leave plenty spare where by which other machines can be built or purchased to provide extra income. I would take a 15% service fee for organising this (before people go 15% wtf, with putting in 1.3 on a possible 7.8 network I'm losing. I only make money back at over a network of 9, and once that is met I will be willing to reduce my %). Dividends would be paid daily after receiving payments from the pools.

Valdimir, question for u is how long could this option be open for. It could take 2 weeks to organise money from the different exchanges?

Don't shoot me down, just an idea. I will be investing myself both in money and in Mh/s. And I will not be owning 51% of the company as per other glbse companies. All hardware will be owned by the people who purchased it, ie my hardware is owned by me, the hardware purchase by Vladimir owned ia the company.

On me being taken off running he company, my hardware earnings will direct back to me and not the company.

Phil

filharvey, talk to me privately. This could be done, the contract can be tailored for your needs.

if someone were to buy up 51% of the company you would need to be sure to pass ownership of the parts over. Id be willing to invest to what extent i do not know yet.

All this effort to solve hash problems through "guess and test?" When 21 million is hit, it'll be nice to see effort going into actually producing real wealth for a change.

When I say other machines can be purchased or built, what I mean is that they can be purchased from Valdimir. The whole idea here is to have a management company, so that everyone can invest in Valdimir's DC3 or other centers when they come on line.

I do not see any physical hardware (execpt the ms/h I'm putting in) to be housed. When I said hardware owned it is the ownsership of the hardware at Valdimir's DC3.

Also as the price has stabilized a bit, probably only 1500 shares would need to purchased.

Phil

Nice idea, however be aware that GLBSE is using Bitcoins _only_ but you pay this contract in GBP (which is far from USD parity btw). It might become impossible for you (and shareholders) to track whether my 1 BTC share should be worth 1 share (because I bought it at a price of 20 USD/BTC) or 2 BTC (bechause I bought it at a price of 40 USD/BTC) or 0.5 BTC (because in the meantime, a BTC is only worth 10 USD). You might burn or overrate initial investors, depending on the Bitcoin rate.

What you could do, would be to NOT hand out any shares, until there are enough buy offers to fill the contract. Then on day X release all shares, which are immediately sold, cash out and everyone's happy, because everyone has paid the same value in USD per share.

Just make sure there is no confusion what this is - it seems to me rather like a fund than a company, meaning even though 85% of the money generated is paid out to 100% of the share holders, it is still you who has ultimate decision power as the manager, I guess.

I guess in case the Vladimir contract goes south, you could just get as much money for this as possible, convert it into BTC and pay it off as final dividend - currently there's no way I know of for a shareholder to really identify himself/herself to you in a secure way, so hardware could be sent via mail or so.

I say release 3000 or 1500 shares assuming BTC/USD is $20. It doesnt matter if the price of exchange goes up. we arent investing in BTC, we get paid in BTC its all fair.

Where will you sell shares on GLBSE? Will you?

Where will you sell shares on GLBSE? Will you?

Yes, have taken the consideration of GBP to USD to BTC. For USD it is about $24k which is needed (at 1.6). That is why I said 3000 @ $10 and 1500 @ $20. That is over what is needed, but would cover costs if less, and I'm sure that the extra could be used for renting of other machines from valdimir.


That would be nice, but offers are sometimes never paid up. I guess, there could be something in the contract that, if not enough shares were sold, all money would be returned via a dividend payout.


Actually yes a Fund is a better word for it.


Yes, that would be the main option. All hardware would be sold, and company(fund) liquidated back to the investors.

Phil

a photo from DC3, taken a few minutes ago.

There are funs and there are FUNS!

http://img815.imageshack.us/img815/1125/funsw.jpg

5870 is for size reference here


Launch on Monday.

You're not building a data center at all, your justtrying to make one of those jetpack things you saw on youtube  :P

:(

30% is a pretty big cut Vlad

Sure it is. I do pretty good job for it though.

Perhaps it is more suitable for those who seeks risk and worry free mining experience. Those who prefer to pay twice perhaps can find something less expensive.

DC3 was officially launched this week. Lots of capacity can be made available rather quickly now i.e. lead time is expected to be less than a week.

A little photo to tease you, just two power cables coming in ATM, but 10 more can be added very quickly and easily when needed:

http://img810.imageshack.us/img810/8907/powercables1.jpg

Nahh.. those things weight 35 kg each. I could not even lift them to the mounting point myself (they damn big too). Had to call in some help.