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Other => Politics & Society => Topic started by: Chef Ramsay on May 16, 2015, 11:14:10 PM



Title: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Chef Ramsay on May 16, 2015, 11:14:10 PM
BEIRUT (AP) -- In a rare ground attack deep into Syria, U.S. Army commandos killed a man described as the Islamic State's head of oil operations, captured his wife and rescued a woman whom American officials said was enslaved.

A team of Delta Force commandos slipped across the border from Iraq under cover of darkness Saturday aboard Black Hawk helicopters and V-22 Osprey aircraft, according to a U.S. defense official knowledgeable about details of the raid. The official was not authorized to discuss the operation publicly and spoke on condition of anonymity.

The Americans intended to capture a militant identified by U.S. officials as Abu Sayyaf. When they arrived at his location, a multi-story building, they met stiff resistance, the U.S. official said, and a firefight ensued, resulting in bullet-hole damage to the U.S. aircraft.

Abu Sayyaf was killed, along with an estimated dozen IS fighters, U.S. officials said. No American was killed or wounded.

Before the sun had risen, the commandos flew back to Iraq where Abu Sayyaf's wife, Umm Sayyaf, was being questioned in U.S. custody, officials said. The goal was to gain intelligence about IS operations and any information about hostages, including American citizens, who were held by the group, according to Bernadette Meehan, spokeswoman for the U.S. National Security Council.

More...http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/M/ML_SYRIA?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2015-05-16-08-39-42 (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/M/ML_SYRIA?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2015-05-16-08-39-42)


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Balthazar on May 17, 2015, 12:47:53 AM
http://rt.com/news/line/2015-05-16/#87877

Quote
​Syrian army kills ISIS ‘oil minister’ – TV

The Syrian army has killed Abu al-Taym al-Saudi, one of the leaders of the Islamic State [IS, formerly ISIS/ISISL] who was responsible for oil-related affairs in the Omar oil field, Deir al-Zor province, eastern Syria, state media reported. Also 40 IS militants were killed in the attack. Omar oil field, north of the strategic town of Mayadin, has been under control of the extremists since July 2014.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Spendulus on May 17, 2015, 02:35:51 AM
BEIRUT (AP) -- In a rare ground attack deep into Syria, U.S. Army commandos killed a man described as the Islamic State's head of oil operations, captured his wife and rescued a woman whom American officials said was enslaved.

A team of Delta Force commandos slipped across the border from Iraq under cover of darkness Saturday aboard Black Hawk helicopters and V-22 Osprey aircraft, according to a U.S. defense official knowledgeable about details of the raid. The official was not authorized to discuss the operation publicly and spoke on condition of anonymity.

The Americans intended to capture a militant identified by U.S. officials as Abu Sayyaf. When they arrived at his location, a multi-story building, they met stiff resistance, the U.S. official said, and a firefight ensued, resulting in bullet-hole damage to the U.S. aircraft.

Abu Sayyaf was killed, along with an estimated dozen IS fighters, U.S. officials said. No American was killed or wounded.

Before the sun had risen, the commandos flew back to Iraq where Abu Sayyaf's wife, Umm Sayyaf, was being questioned in U.S. custody, officials said. The goal was to gain intelligence about IS operations and any information about hostages, including American citizens, who were held by the group, according to Bernadette Meehan, spokeswoman for the U.S. National Security Council.

More...http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/M/ML_SYRIA?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2015-05-16-08-39-42 (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/M/ML_SYRIA?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2015-05-16-08-39-42)

Personally I think those kinds of men who kill women, children and unarmed hostages are cowards thru and thru.

Behind a tough, vicious facade is very little of substance.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: koshgel on May 17, 2015, 02:44:25 AM
The most surprising part of the operation is that they didn't kill the wife. They almost never want to deal with the baggage of a combatant prisoner.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: username18333 on May 17, 2015, 02:50:20 AM
U.S. Army commandos killed a man described as the Islamic State's head of oil operations

Presumably, the global, undeclared plutocracy did not approve of the fellow's movements towards autonomy and, therefore, had its American branch, the controller of the fellow's organization, terminate him.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: BlitzandBitz on May 17, 2015, 04:13:10 AM
This must be kept pretty secret because I cant find anything.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: username18333 on May 17, 2015, 04:19:02 AM
This must be kept pretty secret because I cant find anything.

Write to your national, legislative "representative": the sheer degree whereto your trepidation is terrible will be evidence enough.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Lethn on May 17, 2015, 04:19:49 AM
The most surprising part of the operation is that they didn't kill the wife. They almost never want to deal with the baggage of a combatant prisoner.

Should bear in mind these guys are special operations so they're very well trained assuming they've been trained by anyone halfway decent and the U.S government realises the reputation it has now for operations in the middle east so they're probably trying to get some good PR on the war.

By the way, I saw this news item on the BBC, it wasn't reported as delta commandos though they were simply called "Special ops.".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-32764995


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: username18333 on May 17, 2015, 04:23:52 AM
The most surprising part of the operation is that they didn't kill the wife. They almost never want to deal with the baggage of a combatant prisoner.

Presumably, the "wife" was the global, undeclared plutocracy's "inside [wo]man."


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: koshgel on May 17, 2015, 04:25:47 AM
The most surprising part of the operation is that they didn't kill the wife. They almost never want to deal with the baggage of a combatant prisoner.

Should bear in mind these guys are special operations so they're very well trained assuming they've been trained by anyone halfway decent and the U.S government realises the reputation it has now for operations in the middle east so they're probably trying to get some good PR on the war.

By the way, I saw this news item on the BBC, it wasn't reported as delta commandos though they were simply called "Special ops.".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-32764995

Very well-trained

Quote
It said it believed at least 12 militants had been killed at the scene, that there was hand-to-hand fighting and that militants had tried to use women and children as shields.

They saved the enslaved woman and none of the American forces were injured either.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: koshgel on May 17, 2015, 04:28:07 AM
The most surprising part of the operation is that they didn't kill the wife. They almost never want to deal with the baggage of a combatant prisoner.

Presumably, the "wife" was the global, undeclared plutocracy's "inside [wo]man."

Not sure if you're serious or just conspiracy happy  ;D


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Muhammed Zakir on May 17, 2015, 04:28:19 AM
Abu Sayyaf, key ISIS figure in Syria, killed in U.S. raid

Story highlights

 • President Obama authorized the raid upon the unanimous recommendation of his national security team
 • ISIS commander Abu Sayyaf killed when he resisted capture, says U.S. defense secretary.
 • His wife, Umm Sayyaf, was captured and taken to Iraq for interrogation, sources say

U.S. Special Operations forces killed a key ISIS commander during a daring raid in eastern Syria overnight Friday to Saturday -- securing intelligence on how the terror organization operates, communicates and earns money, U.S. government officials said.

The ISIS commander, identified by his nom de guerre Abu Sayyaf, was killed in a heavy firefight after he resisted capture in the raid at al-Omar, U.S. Defense Secretary Ash Carter said in a statement.

The officials identified Sayyaf's captured wife as Umm Sayyaf, an Iraqi. She is now being held in Iraq.

The U.S. government did not release Sayyaf's real name.

The ground operation was led by the Army's Delta Force, sources familiar with the mission told CNN. There were about two dozen members of Delta Force involved, sources said.

Delta Force entered the target area on Blackhawk helicopters and V-22 aircraft, a U.S. official familiar with the operation said. ISIS fighters defended the multistory building from inside and outside positions.

Abu Sayyaf was killed as he "tried to engage" U.S. troops, the official said.

Carter said he had ordered the raid at the direction of President Barack Obama. All the U.S. troops involved returned safely.


National Security Council spokeswoman Bernadette Meehan said Obama had authorized the raid "upon the unanimous recommendation of his national security team" and as soon as the United States was confident all the pieces were in place for the operation to succeed.

"Abu Sayyaf was a senior ISIL leader who, among other things, had a senior role in overseeing ISIL's illicit oil and gas operations -- a key source of revenue that enables the terrorist organization to carry out their brutal tactics and oppress thousands of innocent civilians," she said in a statement. "He was also involved with the group's military operations."

Abu Sayyaf was a Tunisian citizen, a senior administration official said.

A U.S. official with direct knowledge of the intelligence and the ground operation said Sayyaf had expertise in oil and gas and had taken an increased role in ISIS operations, planning and communications.

"We now have reams of data on how ISIS operates, communicates and earns its money," the official told CNN, referring to some of the communications elements, such as computers, seized in the raid.

A young woman from the Yazidi religious minority was rescued.

"We suspect that Umm Sayyaf is a member of ISIL, played an important role in ISIL's terrorist activities, and may have been complicit in the enslavement of the young woman rescued last night," said Meehan. ISIL is an alternative acronym for ISIS.

Meehan said Umm Sayyaf was being debriefed about ISIS operations, including any information she may have on hostages held by the terror group.

Abu Sayyaf and his wife were suspected to be involved in or have deep knowledge of ISIS hostage operations, a U.S. official with knowledge of the operation told CNN. A team from the FBI-led High Value Interrogation Group is expected to interrogate the wife, the source said. They will seek to figure out what she may know about the capture, movement and treatment of hostages.

But Michael Weiss, author of "ISIS: Inside the Army of Terror," said Abu Sayyaf was largely unknown to close observers of the organization.

Weiss said he's skeptical the United States would risk lives to capture the head of ISIS's oil operations. ISIS hasn't made significant money from captured oil fields since U.S. bombers began striking its infrastructure, he said.

Carter: ISIS raid a 'significant blow' to terror group

A Pentagon spokesman confirmed in February that oil is no longer a main source of revenue for ISIS.

But risking American lives to capture Abu Sayyaf makes sense to Derek Harvey, a former U.S. Army colonel, intelligence officer and the director of the Global Initiative for Civil Society and Conflict at the University of South Florida.

"The most important thing about the raid is not getting Abu Sayyaf; it's getting his records," Harvey said.

Harvey asserted that Sayyaf was one of ISIS's top financiers, with likely access to the group's contacts with banks, donors, Turkish and Lebanese business interests as well as links to criminal and smuggling networks.

Harvey said Sayyaf had undeniable value as a target because ISIS is also a business.

"They're meticulous record-keepers," he said.

Meehan's statement added that Obama is "grateful to the brave U.S. personnel who carried out this complex mission as well as the Iraqi authorities for their support of the operation and for the use of their facilities, which contributed to its success."

Meehan said the U.S. did not coordinate with nor advise Syria in advance of the operation.

"We have warned the Assad regime not to interfere with our ongoing efforts against ISIL inside of Syria," she said, adding that the "brutal actions of the regime have aided and abetted the rise of ISIL and other extremists in Syria."

....

More on http://edition.cnn.com/2015/05/16/middleeast/syria-isis-us-raid/


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: username18333 on May 17, 2015, 04:28:56 AM
Very well-trained [...] They saved the enslaved woman and none of the American forces were injured either.

It seems someone never put their guard up.  ;)


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: username18333 on May 17, 2015, 04:30:08 AM
Not sure if you're serious or just conspiracy happy  ;D

Quote from: n/a
Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: BlitzandBitz on May 17, 2015, 04:31:24 AM
Looks like the wheels are starting to fall off.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: BlitzandBitz on May 17, 2015, 04:32:40 AM
The most surprising part of the operation is that they didn't kill the wife. They almost never want to deal with the baggage of a combatant prisoner.

Usually the wife fights back after all she's been living with a high ranking terrorist for a while.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: username18333 on May 17, 2015, 04:32:49 AM
The ISIS commander, identified by his nom de guerre Abu Sayyaf, was killed in a heavy firefight after he resisted capture in the raid at al-Omar, U.S. Defense Secretary Ash Carter said in a statement.

Quote from: Police State
The subject resisted arrest.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Lethn on May 17, 2015, 04:39:36 AM
Yeah, I'm not a fan of the way they phrased that either lol :P


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: BlitzandBitz on May 17, 2015, 04:45:23 AM
who wouldn't resist being captured by the enemy.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: username18333 on May 17, 2015, 05:02:26 AM
who wouldn't resist being captured by the enemy[?]

Apparently, his "wife".


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: bryant.coleman on May 17, 2015, 07:42:35 AM
Killing isolated individuals will not cause any weakness to the Islamic State. IS is not an individual-centered organization. Its strength lies in its recruits, and its ability to get new cannon fodder from various Islamic nations. IS will be able to find a replacement for Abu Sayyaf in no time. Seal the Turkish-Syrian border, if you want to really weaken the IS.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Muhammed Zakir on May 17, 2015, 07:50:03 AM
Killing isolated individuals will not cause any weakness to the Islamic State. IS is not an individual-centered organization. Its strength lies in its recruits, and its ability to get new cannon fodder from various Islamic nations. IS will be able to find a replacement for Abu Sayyaf in no time. Seal the Turkish-Syrian border, if you want to really weaken the IS.

No only Muslims but ISIS hire non-Muslims too. They must have good financial help to do all these.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: bryant.coleman on May 17, 2015, 08:09:03 AM
No only Muslims but ISIS hire non-Muslims too. They must have good financial help to do all these.

Why should any non-Muslim join ISIS, as the main aim of the organization is the extermination of non-Muslims? Some converts from other religions might have joined ISIS (especially the case with recruits from various European nations such as France and Germany). But I don't think that any religious Christian or Jew will join the IS.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Muhammed Zakir on May 17, 2015, 08:39:44 AM
No only Muslims but ISIS hire non-Muslims too. They must have good financial help to do all these.

Why should any non-Muslim join ISIS, as the main aim of the organization is the extermination of non-Muslims? Some converts from other religions might have joined ISIS (especially the case with recruits from various European nations such as France and Germany). But I don't think that any religious Christian or Jew will join the IS.

ISIS offers food, money, shelter and maybe more. Many non-Muslims join ISIS because of these. ISIS make lot of promised.

“Westerners are involved, especially in the recruitment and social media dissemination of the whole ISIS brand,” Mubin Shaikh, a former Taliban recruiter who operated from his hometown of Toronto before becoming a national security operative in Canada, told International Business Times. “Look at the videos they’re making. You think those people were trained in Syria and Iraq? Those people were trained in the West.”

“There were certain things we looked for,” Shaikh said, speaking of his time as a recruiter. “People who didn’t know the religion as much. People who were converts, because converts would probably have problems with their parents at home, so they were more likely to stay in our company."

Most Western recruits are teenagers and almost all going to Syria to fight are men. “The vast majority of Westerners joining up with ISIS are extraordinarily ignorant when it comes to religion,” said Max Abrahms, a Northeastern University professor who studies jihadist groups. Most recruits have no prior connection to Syria and “never even thought to visit.”

"People collaborating with IS can be ordinary people,” said Aymenn Jawad al-Tamimi, a Shillman-Ginsburg Fellow at the Middle East Forum. “They don’t have to be religious fanatics. They could be anyone provided you give your pledge of allegiance to ISIS.”

In countries like the U.S., Canada and Britain, potential recruits must find a jihadi mentor, which can be done online or through ISIS supporters in their local communities, according to Imam Syed Soharwardy, founder of the Islamic Supreme Council of Canada

ISIS is also likely recruiting in colleges and high schools under the cover of student groups, Soharwardy said. Recruits are seeking camaraderie, and they often know someone who has joined a militant group beforehand. For example, after U.S. citizen Douglas McCain from California went to fight with ISIS in Syria, it was later discovered that he had lived in the same building as a classmate who joined al-Shabab, the Somali militant group with ties to al-Qaeda.

Militant leaders also use Western recruits for publicity to inspire others to join the Islamic State. As with McCain, that usually only happens after he is dead.

Many recruiters use social media, such as Twitter and ask.fm, to field questions about joining the Islamic State, almost an online version of the religious seminar, the terrorism experts said. Once a Westerner has expressed interest, there is an interview process to determine how serious the potential recruit is and to hopefully weed out any spies.  The interview happens using encryption software and proxy servers, Shaikh said.

“If they can Skype you, they’ll Skype you. They want to see what you look like. You can’t be that secretive with them,” Shaikh said.  “If you know somebody, they’ll probably get in touch with someone from your place, whether you're American, Canadian or British. They’ll ask you what area you’re from, what scholars you know.”

Earlier this year, Al-Tamimi received a direct message on Twitter from a young American man eager to join ISIS. The man, who falsely believed Al-Tamimi was associated with the militants, said: “I want to go to Syria. Can you tell me how?”


http://www.ibtimes.com/isis-recruiting-westerners-how-islamic-state-goes-after-non-muslims-recent-converts-west-1680076

Two links in the above news:

http://www.ibtimes.com/isis-twitter-facebook-account-james-foley-video-highlights-disturbing-effective-1660544
http://www.ibtimes.com/after-douglas-mcauthur-mccain-us-identifies-americans-fighting-isis-syria-using-social-1673168


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Muhammed Zakir on May 17, 2015, 09:06:27 AM
Here's one article I had found about how ISIS recruits non-Muslims (so they aren't all Sunni Muslims). There was a better article I had come across that talked about how some people went to 'work' for ISIS not because of ideology but simply because they paid wages like a job, and there was no work for them otherwise, but they started abandoning ISIS because they were never paid as promised. I can't find that article now, but this one makes my point as well.

http://www.ibtimes.com/isis-recruiting-westerners-how-islamic-state-goes-after-non-muslims-recent-converts-west-1680076


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Spendulus on May 17, 2015, 06:15:49 PM
The most surprising part of the operation is that they didn't kill the wife. They almost never want to deal with the baggage of a combatant prisoner.

Usually the wife fights back after all she's been living with a high ranking terrorist for a while.

I can hear it now.

"I thought it would be so nice to try living without a burka for a while."


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Grand_Voyageur on May 17, 2015, 07:08:39 PM
The most surprising part of the operation is that they didn't kill the wife. They almost never want to deal with the baggage of a combatant prisoner.

Should bear in mind these guys are special operations so they're very well trained assuming they've been trained by anyone halfway decent and the U.S government realises the reputation it has now for operations in the middle east so they're probably trying to get some good PR on the war.

By the way, I saw this news item on the BBC, it wasn't reported as delta commandos though they were simply called "Special ops.".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-32764995

This kind of op may have been tasked both to Delta Force or its Navy counterpart, the Naval Special Warfare Development Group. Unofficial comments from media contacts may be even deliberatedly misleading to cover a classified op.  ;)
Delta don't exist (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_Force#Organization_and_structure)! Ooops...i said Delta.  ;D


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: galdur on May 17, 2015, 07:42:47 PM
Missing from the story, this was the first time that they killed this guy. Given the record of these serial liars they may very well do it again so stay tuned.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: erikalui on May 17, 2015, 08:07:00 PM
At last something positive to hear about the ISIS. It's good that they captured the wife and now the commandos can interrogate her to get more information. Other leaders might take one step behind due to this.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Spendulus on May 17, 2015, 09:04:58 PM
No only Muslims but ISIS hire non-Muslims too. They must have good financial help to do all these.

Why should any non-Muslim join ISIS, as the main aim of the organization is the extermination of non-Muslims? Some converts from other religions might have joined ISIS (especially the case with recruits from various European nations such as France and Germany). But I don't think that any religious Christian or Jew will join the IS.

ISIS offers food, money, shelter and maybe more. Many non-Muslims join ISIS because of these. ISIS make lot of promised.

“Westerners are involved, especially in the recruitment and social media dissemination of the whole ISIS brand,” Mubin Shaikh, a former Taliban recruiter who operated from his hometown of Toronto before becoming a national security operative in Canada, told International Business Times. “Look at the videos they’re making. You think those people were trained in Syria and Iraq? Those people were trained in the West.”

“There were certain things we looked for,” Shaikh said, speaking of his time as a recruiter. “People who didn’t know the religion as much. People who were converts, because converts would probably have problems with their parents at home, so they were more likely to stay in our company."

Most Western recruits are teenagers and almost all going to Syria to fight are men. “The vast majority of Westerners joining up with ISIS are extraordinarily ignorant when it comes to religion,” said Max Abrahms, a Northeastern University professor who studies jihadist groups. Most recruits have no prior connection to Syria and “never even thought to visit.”

"People collaborating with IS can be ordinary people,” said Aymenn Jawad al-Tamimi, a Shillman-Ginsburg Fellow at the Middle East Forum. “They don’t have to be religious fanatics. They could be anyone provided you give your pledge of allegiance to ISIS.”

In countries like the U.S., Canada and Britain, potential recruits must find a jihadi mentor, which can be done online or through ISIS supporters in their local communities, according to Imam Syed Soharwardy, founder of the Islamic Supreme Council of Canada

ISIS is also likely recruiting in colleges and high schools under the cover of student groups, Soharwardy said. Recruits are seeking camaraderie, and they often know someone who has joined a militant group beforehand. For example, after U.S. citizen Douglas McCain from California went to fight with ISIS in Syria, it was later discovered that he had lived in the same building as a classmate who joined al-Shabab, the Somali militant group with ties to al-Qaeda.

Militant leaders also use Western recruits for publicity to inspire others to join the Islamic State. As with McCain, that usually only happens after he is dead.

Many recruiters use social media, such as Twitter and ask.fm, to field questions about joining the Islamic State, almost an online version of the religious seminar, the terrorism experts said. Once a Westerner has expressed interest, there is an interview process to determine how serious the potential recruit is and to hopefully weed out any spies.  The interview happens using encryption software and proxy servers, Shaikh said.

“If they can Skype you, they’ll Skype you. They want to see what you look like. You can’t be that secretive with them,” Shaikh said.  “If you know somebody, they’ll probably get in touch with someone from your place, whether you're American, Canadian or British. They’ll ask you what area you’re from, what scholars you know.”

Earlier this year, Al-Tamimi received a direct message on Twitter from a young American man eager to join ISIS. The man, who falsely believed Al-Tamimi was associated with the militants, said: “I want to go to Syria. Can you tell me how?”


http://www.ibtimes.com/isis-recruiting-westerners-how-islamic-state-goes-after-non-muslims-recent-converts-west-1680076

Two links in the above news:

http://www.ibtimes.com/isis-twitter-facebook-account-james-foley-video-highlights-disturbing-effective-1660544
http://www.ibtimes.com/after-douglas-mcauthur-mccain-us-identifies-americans-fighting-isis-syria-using-social-1673168

Let's see what ELSE  Aymenn Jawad al-Tamimi has to say.

http://www.aymennjawad.org/16383/is-isis-islamic-and-other-foolish-debates

Like when he discusses is ISIS Muslim...

"Do they think we are Jewish now? lol," responded one ISIS fighter in Syria when asked for his thoughts on the current public debate about whether the Islamic State is actually Islamic. He went on to make an argument, as many of these fighters often do when interviewed, that not only is the Islamic State Islamic but it is the purest and most pristine form of Islam, the kind most in line with what God and His Prophet had intended all along. Another ISIS fighter from South Africa, when asked how he knew that the Islamic State was legitimate, remarked that "I just used my brain."

...

While statements by Abu Mus'ab al-Zarqawi, Osama bin Laden, Sayyid Qutb, and Wahhabi scholars can all be found in detail in ISIS documents and publications, there are also considerable documents citing opinion from the four schools of Islamic legal tradition. For example, in a statement distributed in the Fallujah area on offering prayers on Eid al-Adha and Eid al-Fitr, three differing categories of opinion are given on whether the prayers are obligatory, citing all four schools to illustrate the range. In other instances, the concept of ijmaa (consensus) among the Ahl al-'Ilm (theologians, jurists etc.) is stressed, such as in a Friday sermon for Ninawa province mosques on the division of the world into the abodes of Islam and disbelief.

One could go on, but it is in the realm of IS fatwas in particular – issued by its Diwan al-Eftaa wa al-Buhuth – where the impressive ability to find opinions from medieval jurists and theologians is laid bare. Many of them are unknown to most of the outside world, including contemporary Muslims. The best example is the fatwa ISIS issued to justify burning alive the Jordanian pilot, deemed an 'apostate'. Many were quick to say this practice is absolutely condemned in Islam, but ISIS cited Hanafi and Shafi'i jurist opinion to claim it is permissible, including specific citation of a 15th century Egyptian Shafi'i jurist.


So, Zakir, these learned scholars of ISIS would disagree fully with you on what Islam is and should be understood as. 



Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Muhammed Zakir on May 18, 2015, 05:51:23 AM
"Learned scholars"? I know you are an islamaphobia. They don't even follow Islamic rules and claim they are Muslims which is stupic. Many of them aren't even "extremists" like you claim and also there are non-Muslins too. They don't have enough knowledge on Islam. Keep spreading false things to spread hatred. :-\


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Spendulus on May 18, 2015, 07:50:46 AM
"Learned scholars"? I know you are an islamaphobia. They don't even follow Islamic rules and claim they are Muslims which is stupic. Many of them aren't even "extremists" like you claim and also there are non-Muslins too. They don't have enough knowledge on Islam. Keep spreading false things to spread hatred. :-\

You are the one that quoted Aymenn Jawad al-Tamimi .

All I did was bring in some other of his writings.

The point is that they defend the burning alive of the prisoner with Islamic teachings.  It's right there, spelled out.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: edward222 on May 18, 2015, 08:55:24 AM
Hope the next news report will be,

"ISIS waved the white flag, and the world will be now in peace".


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Muhammed Zakir on May 18, 2015, 08:58:05 AM
"Learned scholars"? I know you are an islamaphobia. They don't even follow Islamic rules and claim they are Muslims which is stupic. Many of them aren't even "extremists" like you claim and also there are non-Muslins too. They don't have enough knowledge on Islam. Keep spreading false things to spread hatred. :-\

You are the one that quoted Aymenn Jawad al-Tamimi .

All I did was bring in some other of his writings.

The point is that they defend the burning alive of the prisoner with Islamic teachings.  It's right there, spelled out.

Burning a living being alive is forbidden in Islam. So I don't think I should tell punishment for burning a human being. No true Muslims should do it.

Edit:

Hope the next news report will be,

"ISIS waved the white flag, and the world will be now in peace".

It is not easy because of the help they get. First, their help should somehow be blocked.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: edward222 on May 18, 2015, 09:38:32 AM

Hope the next news report will be,

"ISIS waved the white flag, and the world will be now in peace".

It is not easy because of the help they get. First, their help should somehow be blocked.

It's not easy, but its possible :)
neways, do you have any idea where do they get the help?


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Grand_Voyageur on May 18, 2015, 09:44:35 AM

Hope the next news report will be,

"ISIS waved the white flag, and the world will be now in peace".

It is not easy because of the help they get. First, their help should somehow be blocked.

It's not easy, but its possible :)
neways, do you have any idea where do they get the help?

Rich sympathetic people, mainly ones from Gulf countries.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Hamuki on May 18, 2015, 09:49:17 AM
ISIS will no be defeated easy if we dont start to do some more missions down there.
Ofc we have fighters bombing daily but there is too many psychos that keep joining them so they can keep up.

And if we succeed with getting ISIS down and killing them off..
Then it wont take long for a new group to pop up and start making damage again.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Snail2 on May 18, 2015, 12:08:35 PM
The most surprising part of the operation is that they didn't kill the wife. They almost never want to deal with the baggage of a combatant prisoner.

Probably they were tasked to capture that bloke for extracting information about his oil businesses but he died. As that information is still needed they captured the woman instead in hopes she know something about her husbands deals. I think they messed up this action and were unable to achieve their primary goal.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: bryant.coleman on May 18, 2015, 12:46:06 PM
ISIS will no be defeated easy if we dont start to do some more missions down there.
Ofc we have fighters bombing daily but there is too many psychos that keep joining them so they can keep up.

ISIS will not be defeated because the CIA don't want them eliminated. The primary aim of the CIA is to overthrow Assad. ISIS is a useful tool against Assad. But ISIS needs to be limited in Iraq, as the American oil corporations are owning most of the oil wells there. That is why the US is conducting useless air-strikes, but not conducting any ground operations.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Hamuki on May 18, 2015, 01:27:06 PM
ISIS will no be defeated easy if we dont start to do some more missions down there.
Ofc we have fighters bombing daily but there is too many psychos that keep joining them so they can keep up.

ISIS will not be defeated because the CIA don't want them eliminated. The primary aim of the CIA is to overthrow Assad. ISIS is a useful tool against Assad. But ISIS needs to be limited in Iraq, as the American oil corporations are owning most of the oil wells there. That is why the US is conducting useless air-strikes, but not conducting any ground operations.

Hmm.. Kinda want to agree but again its a little conspiracy :(

But CIA must be in on it some kind of way.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Spendulus on May 18, 2015, 02:14:05 PM
ISIS will no be defeated easy if we dont start to do some more missions down there.
Ofc we have fighters bombing daily but there is too many psychos that keep joining them so they can keep up.

ISIS will not be defeated because the CIA don't want them eliminated. The primary aim of the CIA is to overthrow Assad. ISIS is a useful tool against Assad. But ISIS needs to be limited in Iraq, as the American oil corporations are owning most of the oil wells there. That is why the US is conducting useless air-strikes, but not conducting any ground operations.

Hmm.. Kinda want to agree but again its a little conspiracy :(

But CIA must be in on it some kind of way.
Kind of ridiculous conspiracy theory, because in all real world events all secret services of all nations that have an interest might be expected to be equally involved.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: cryptocoiner on May 19, 2015, 07:37:25 AM
BEIRUT (AP) -- In a rare ground attack deep into Syria, U.S. Army commandos killed a man described as the Islamic State's head of oil operations, captured his wife and rescued a woman whom American officials said was enslaved.

A team of Delta Force commandos slipped across the border from Iraq under cover of darkness Saturday aboard Black Hawk helicopters and V-22 Osprey aircraft, according to a U.S. defense official knowledgeable about details of the raid. The official was not authorized to discuss the operation publicly and spoke on condition of anonymity.

The Americans intended to capture a militant identified by U.S. officials as Abu Sayyaf. When they arrived at his location, a multi-story building, they met stiff resistance, the U.S. official said, and a firefight ensued, resulting in bullet-hole damage to the U.S. aircraft.

Abu Sayyaf was killed, along with an estimated dozen IS fighters, U.S. officials said. No American was killed or wounded.

Before the sun had risen, the commandos flew back to Iraq where Abu Sayyaf's wife, Umm Sayyaf, was being questioned in U.S. custody, officials said. The goal was to gain intelligence about IS operations and any information about hostages, including American citizens, who were held by the group, according to Bernadette Meehan, spokeswoman for the U.S. National Security Council.

More...http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/M/ML_SYRIA?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2015-05-16-08-39-42 (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/M/ML_SYRIA?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2015-05-16-08-39-42)

That's a nice one. Can america and NATO just destroy ISIS? Coz ISIS is an obvious evil. Same way they destroyed Saddam's regime and Gaddafi's regime? Or they just don't want to?



Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: thebigtalk on May 19, 2015, 07:39:42 AM
I haven't heard this in the local news neither on the newspaper. Shouldn't this be an international news?


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: galdur on May 19, 2015, 01:07:56 PM
I haven't heard this in the local news neither on the newspaper. Shouldn't this be an international news?

I don´t think it´s very suitable for consumption outside of the U.S. due to insufficient supply of excessively gullible idiots these days. Good luck, g


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Grand_Voyageur on May 19, 2015, 06:42:00 PM
I haven't heard this in the local news neither on the newspaper. Shouldn't this be an international news?

Yes, It is. However, I cannot grasp what are you meaning. Do you mean a local news in Syria? Is Syrian Govt controlled TV & Media supposed to report on US Special Forces raiding a Terrorist/IS hideout when they're on the opposing sides of the fight there? Or do you mean IS TV reporting on their leadership receiving such a bowl from the American infidels & crusaders? I'm don't think such local media are interested in reporting such news unless their masters want to achieve a political mean with such reports.

...

I don´t think it´s very suitable for consumption outside of the U.S. due to insufficient supply of excessively gullible idiots these days. Good luck, g

What consumption you mean? It's only a short news of a military operation...you cannot wrote a long story about it, not yet at least. Only time can tell if this raid become important as the Sinjar one was. IMO writing longer story now is good only for action-fiction storytellers or writers.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: jaysabi on May 19, 2015, 06:42:58 PM
BEIRUT (AP) -- In a rare ground attack deep into Syria, U.S. Army commandos killed a man described as the Islamic State's head of oil operations, captured his wife and rescued a woman whom American officials said was enslaved.

A team of Delta Force commandos slipped across the border from Iraq under cover of darkness Saturday aboard Black Hawk helicopters and V-22 Osprey aircraft, according to a U.S. defense official knowledgeable about details of the raid. The official was not authorized to discuss the operation publicly and spoke on condition of anonymity.

The Americans intended to capture a militant identified by U.S. officials as Abu Sayyaf. When they arrived at his location, a multi-story building, they met stiff resistance, the U.S. official said, and a firefight ensued, resulting in bullet-hole damage to the U.S. aircraft.

Abu Sayyaf was killed, along with an estimated dozen IS fighters, U.S. officials said. No American was killed or wounded.

Before the sun had risen, the commandos flew back to Iraq where Abu Sayyaf's wife, Umm Sayyaf, was being questioned in U.S. custody, officials said. The goal was to gain intelligence about IS operations and any information about hostages, including American citizens, who were held by the group, according to Bernadette Meehan, spokeswoman for the U.S. National Security Council.

More...http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/M/ML_SYRIA?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2015-05-16-08-39-42 (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/M/ML_SYRIA?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2015-05-16-08-39-42)

That's a nice one. Can america and NATO just destroy ISIS? Coz ISIS is an obvious evil. Same way they destroyed Saddam's regime and Gaddafi's regime? Or they just don't want to?



Conventional military might means very little when you can't reliably identify the enemy and distinguish them from civilians. That was the US's main problem with the Viet Cong too in the Vietnam war. Guerilla warfare is effective against armies who feel the need to minimize civilian deaths. When ISIS fights out in the open, they are routinely routed by superior technology and firepower. When they can pick and choose battles and blend in with the surroundings, they're formiddable exactly because the US won't go in and level an area due to collateral damage concerns.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: thebigtalk on May 20, 2015, 12:25:23 AM
I haven't heard this in the local news neither on the newspaper. Shouldn't this be an international news?

Yes, It is. However, I cannot grasp what are you meaning. Do you mean a local news in Syria? Is Syrian Govt controlled TV & Media supposed to report on US Special Forces raiding a Terrorist/IS hideout when they're on the opposing sides of the fight there? Or do you mean IS TV reporting on their leadership receiving such a bowl from the American infidels & crusaders? I'm don't think such local media are interested in reporting such news unless their masters want to achieve a political mean with such reports.

...

I don´t think it´s very suitable for consumption outside of the U.S. due to insufficient supply of excessively gullible idiots these days. Good luck, g

What consumption you mean? It's only a short news of a military operation...you cannot wrote a long story about it, not yet at least. Only time can tell if this raid become important as the Sinjar one was. IMO writing longer story now is good only for action-fiction storytellers or writers.

No. I mean in some ways, this should be a news in all the countries in the UN. Selected countries ofcourse. People around the world would be at ease at least when news like this goes on air on their local TV.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Grand_Voyageur on May 20, 2015, 03:51:33 AM
I haven't heard this in the local news neither on the newspaper. Shouldn't this be an international news?

Yes, It is. However, I cannot grasp what are you meaning. Do you mean a local news in Syria? Is Syrian Govt controlled TV & Media supposed to report on US Special Forces raiding a Terrorist/IS hideout when they're on the opposing sides of the fight there? Or do you mean IS TV reporting on their leadership receiving such a bowl from the American infidels & crusaders? I'm don't think such local media are interested in reporting such news unless their masters want to achieve a political mean with such reports.

...

I don´t think it´s very suitable for consumption outside of the U.S. due to insufficient supply of excessively gullible idiots these days. Good luck, g

What consumption you mean? It's only a short news of a military operation...you cannot wrote a long story about it, not yet at least. Only time can tell if this raid become important as the Sinjar one was. IMO writing longer story now is good only for action-fiction storytellers or writers.

No. I mean in some ways, this should be a news in all the countries in the UN. Selected countries ofcourse. People around the world would be at ease at least when news like this goes on air on their local TV.

OK. In fact it was given also in my own country (i'm not in the USA); however, this was just a few seconds time one. As I said to galdur before it's only a short news of a military operation, you cannot wrote a long story about it. Also, how could people worldwide be at ease just because a US SF team raided a IS hideout killing a terrorist in a classified military operation (no further details available so far, obviously)? What kind of mindset is: "OMG! This is fine..the US are raiding IS; so, we will be good."?


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Falconer on May 20, 2015, 05:20:19 AM
I don't think the war between ISIS and US can end easily. Aren't you curious where ISIS get the weapons?
http://www.pri.org/stories/2014-06-17/where-are-islamic-militants-iraq-getting-their-weapons-answer-surprised-us

Code:
 Many of the weapons used by the Islamic militants known as ISIS were simply captured from its enemies in Syria and Iraq. But ISIS also has foreign backers — some of whom are "friends" of the US. 

If ISIS lose, so the "friends" lose a customer. Is there a conspiracy behind it?


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: bryant.coleman on May 20, 2015, 06:38:26 AM
I don't think the war between ISIS and US can end easily. Aren't you curious where ISIS get the weapons?
http://www.pri.org/stories/2014-06-17/where-are-islamic-militants-iraq-getting-their-weapons-answer-surprised-us

Code:
 Many of the weapons used by the Islamic militants known as ISIS were simply captured from its enemies in Syria and Iraq. But ISIS also has foreign backers — some of whom are "friends" of the US. 

If ISIS lose, so the "friends" lose a customer. Is there a conspiracy behind it?

The ISIS is being funded and armed by the NATO and its allies (either directly or indirectly). For example, a few months ago, the NATO delivered hundreds of millions of USD worth of advanced weapon systems to a rebel Free Syrian Army (FSA) unit in Syria, hoping that they will use it against the pro-Assad forces. This unit, numbering some 5,000 fighters, simply defected to the ISIS a week later, taking the entire weapons cache with them.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Grand_Voyageur on May 20, 2015, 07:33:59 AM
I don't think the war between ISIS and US can end easily. Aren't you curious where ISIS get the weapons?
http://www.pri.org/stories/2014-06-17/where-are-islamic-militants-iraq-getting-their-weapons-answer-surprised-us

Code:
 Many of the weapons used by the Islamic militants known as ISIS were simply captured from its enemies in Syria and Iraq. But ISIS also has foreign backers — some of whom are "friends" of the US. 

If ISIS lose, so the "friends" lose a customer. Is there a conspiracy behind it?

The ISIS is being funded and armed by the NATO and its allies (either directly or indirectly). For example, a few months ago, the NATO delivered hundreds of millions of USD worth of advanced weapon systems to a rebel Free Syrian Army (FSA) unit in Syria, hoping that they will use it against the pro-Assad forces. This unit, numbering some 5,000 fighters, simply defected to the ISIS a week later, taking the entire weapons cache with them.

Using your example as justification for you saying IS (ISIS is their former name) being funded & armed by NATO & other countries is a careless and absurd thing since it's equal to say the KGB & Soviet Union were NATO & United Kingdom puppets because Kim Philby (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Philby) he once worked for them before defecting to Soviet Union, after his departure from MI6.
FSA army is being funded & armed by some NATO countries (not all of them) but they are in large part funded by Saudi Arabia and its Gulf allies who "dislike" Assad regime; however, foreign countries like Russia among others are also helping the Assad's Syrian regime with funds, weapons and training too.
IS (formerly ISIS) instead is mostly funded by rich like-minded Sunni people from Saudi Arabia, the Gulf countries and overseas Sunnies. Also, Saudi Arabian Govt is known to use the export of Wahhabism both as a foreign policy tool as well as a way to steam off social discontentment by providing their subject with a way to wage a jihad abroad instead of them waging one into the Kingdom itself. Last, but not least, IS fight against Syrian & Iraqi Govts also have a Shia–Sunni strife perspective alongside being a conflict by proxies between Saudi Arabia and Iran for regional dominance.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: bryant.coleman on May 20, 2015, 11:28:48 AM
FSA army is being funded & armed by some NATO countries (not all of them) but they are in large part funded by Saudi Arabia and its Gulf allies who "dislike" Assad regime; however, foreign countries like Russia among others are also helping the Assad's Syrian regime with funds, weapons and training too.

There is a big difference between Russia arming the Assad forces and NATO arming the FSA. Assad's forces are never going to defect to the ISIS. In the past four years of Syrian civil war, not a single Syrian soldier has defected to the ISIS. But that can't be said about the FSA. FSA is a complex coktail of various factions, some of which are even more radical than the ISIS itself.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: Grand_Voyageur on May 20, 2015, 12:32:41 PM
FSA army is being funded & armed by some NATO countries (not all of them) but they are in large part funded by Saudi Arabia and its Gulf allies who "dislike" Assad regime; however, foreign countries like Russia among others are also helping the Assad's Syrian regime with funds, weapons and training too.

There is a big difference between Russia arming the Assad forces and NATO arming the FSA. Assad's forces are never going to defect to the ISIS. In the past four years of Syrian civil war, not a single Syrian soldier has defected to the ISIS. But that can't be said about the FSA. FSA is a complex coktail of various factions, some of which are even more radical than the ISIS itself.

You're still mixing FSA with IS. At least some Syrian soldiers defect to FSA (FSA was originally made of Syrian Army defectors) but not to IS. IS not belonging to FSA, nor the latter is controlling the former.


Title: Re: American Commandos Kill Senior ISIS Leader
Post by: bryant.coleman on May 20, 2015, 01:29:03 PM
You're still mixing FSA with IS. At least some Syrian soldiers defect to FSA (FSA was originally made of Syrian Army defectors) but not to IS. IS not belonging to FSA, nor the latter is controlling the former.

You need to read carefully what I had posted earlier. I was actually referring to this incident, in which the NATO-sponsored FSA soldiers defected to the ISIS:

http://www.globalresearch.ca/3000-moderate-rebels-defect-to-the-islamic-state-isis-us-preparing-5000-more/5425344

On the second part, I do agree. FSA and ISIS are different organizations.