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This will be the thread for the beta testers of sidehack-novak's adjustable  usb sticks.

I am one of 4 or 5 testers.

I will make it self mod to keep it clean.

I just got mine and I am stuck.

Not because the stick or the gear is an issue.  Basically I have not done a bat file for cg miner in a year and do not remember how to do it.

I will post a few photos .

the stick loaded as com3

I am 1 reviewer . lots of photos and info.

I am using 3.1 watts to get 9.5gh any drop on the charts was my issue not the sticks.


full size link

http://imageshack.com/a/img538/421/3yEN5R.png


http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/538/3yEN5R.png

For the next reviewers.

Locked for the next little bit.

all reviewers  shoot me a pm


all others be patient .

photos

full size


http://imageshack.com/a/img537/8740/IM9WVH.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img905/450/b5G9Vn.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img912/5105/91rjyM.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img661/6357/caamyC.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img537/3305/Xlot8L.jpg

this is cgminer 4.9.1   I need a bat file

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/537/IM9WVH.jpg

this is my start file/bat file empty due to lack of memory (58 year old minds work like this)

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/905/b5G9Vn.jpg

the test stick
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/912/91rjyM.jpg

note watts 28.4   if I unplug the usb hub i drop to 25 watts
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/caamyC.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/537/Xlot8L.jpg

one more shot of stick
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/538/wIhtvq.jpg

If it enumerated as a COM port, you need to install the WinUSB driver for hotplug support and such (Zadig (http://zadig.akeo.ie/)) which will allow cgminer to detect it natively. You'll also want to include "--au3-freq xxx" in the command line, where "xxx" is a valid operating frequency. According to the code I'm seeing (AntMiner U3 is under the Icarus driver), valid frequencies (and their associated per-chip GH/s) are:

100	5.5
125	6.88
150	8.25
175	9.63
193.75	10.66
196.88	10.83
200	11
206.25	11.34
212.5	11.69
218.75	12.03
225	12.38
237.5	13.06
243.75	13.41
250	13.75

The command line I use is "cgminer.exe -o stratum.mining.eligius.st:3334 -u 1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr -p x --au3-volt 0 --au3-freq 150"

The --au3-volt is not really necessary, since the voltage is not software-adjustable on the Compac.

thanks I will load zadig and set bat file

Since this is using the U3 stuff in cgminer, you may want to use cgminer 4.9.0.  4.9.1 does not recognize the U3, it's a known bug, so don't know if that will affect this stick.

You probably also want to add --suggest-diff 1 to your .bat file so that your stick starts at a reasonable pool diff.


Is there a way to do this without using Zadig?  I have a computer that refuses to complete the Zadig installation, so I need to find another way to do what Zadig does.

I've not used suggest-diff but that's probably a good idea. Eligius starts out at 128, which this stick should see about 7 instead.

The 4.9.1 compiled into the latest Minera build works fine, but I've been testing with 4.9.0 on Windows so I can verify it's good.

I think the drivers can be found external to Zadig and possibly installed manually. I've not tried. My Win7 desk machine has never taken kindly to Zadig installer.

could do a 'buntu run, need to give permissions to the com port though, 0224 hours here, so not up to pulling info right now, if you need it, pm me, i'll look for it about 0900

yeah this win 7 is not liking zadig.  I am going to strip this back.

I had a fear of this issue I have another pc to try on. and I am building a pc next week.

Does anybody know if bfgminer supports the U3? It's been over 9 months since I worried about USB stick mining, and haven't kept up with support in bfgminer.

I too found the Zadig/Windows interaction to be quite frustrating. I ultimately went to the Raspberry Pi realm, which I found a bit more stable.

Phil, I run the zadig driver without issue on my Win7. I have 7 S1 blades running with that driver and some CP2102.

I think the CGminer I run was modify to be able to do that. I run CGMiner 4.7.0.

I can send you my executable if you wanna try.

Here's from the thread => https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=671128.680



Hope it helps !


EDIT: Also, make sure within zadig, to install the correct winusb driver for the USB your device is connected (Go in Option => Show all Devices)

EDIT2: I guess the bmsc option won't work with the unit tho ... :(

The latest version, 5.2.0, has U3 support, although there are mixed results between users.

Its usually Windows Defender that is the stick in the mud between Win7 and Zadig. You need to check and see which program Defender is blocking or adjust the security level long enough to let Zadig install then place it in the allowed list within Defender. Don't forget, to get Zadig to work, you need to let the siliconlabs driver install first then run Zadig as Administrator.

Go back up about 8-9 posts, and you'll find a table of frequency/hashrate. That's for one chip, which is what this stick has.

Sidehack or Novak might have to weigh in here, but I think the table was derived by measurements from sidehack. The U3 connection is that it identifies to the driver/miner software as a U3, even though it obviously isn't a U3.

That's how I understand it, but I've been wrong before as my wife likes to say....  :)

Zadig has never worked on both Win7 systems I've tried to put it on in the last couple years. I have the silabs driver working fine, used it on an older cgminer for TheRealSteve's block erupter competition. But Zadig installer has never worked, and it's not because of any Windows security garbage.


The U3 uses four BM1382 (same as S3/S4); the miner he's testing has a single BM1384 (same as S5) on it. The table was frequencies cgminer understands for the U3, but the listed hashrates are what the BM1384 will do with those frequencies. It's a 55-core chip, so MHz to GH/s is times 0.055

Also, if you have a Raspberry Pi, I ran five sticks off the stock cgminer in the latest Minera (http://getminera.com/) build without any problems. If you don't want to screw with the overly scripted and weighty web UI, just ssh into the pi and do stuff from there.

The bulk of this information is already presented in the GekkoScience BM1384 Dev thread, so don't be too surprised if it gets pared out of this review thread. But for now, there it is.

Sidehack, may I ask which USB hub you're using for your Raspberry Pi ?

thanks

I got one of those $8 11-port junkers from Ebay about two years ago, stripped it down and beefed the power lines with extra wire and capacitors for running overclocked block erupters. There's pictures in the dev thread. We're thinking about building our own hub that'll take in higher than 12V and internally regulate high-current 5V to the ports, which would be good for Compac and Amita stuff but also for anyone working on a solar setup or charging a lot of devices in a car or something. So I'll probably be testing that in a month or so, but for now I have a junker hub that's been rebuilt for higher current.

Speaking of which - I couldn't get Eligius to go below 127 when I tested it, suggest-diff be damned.  Might have been user error, though.  But if not, the pool that was used for that comp goes all the way down to Diff=2, and I'm gonna guess is currently seeing one of these miners hashing away quite nicely.  Philip / other reviewers, if you'd like a user/pass, I'd be happy to set those up.  Or see that thread for some other lower diff pools.
( and yes, feel free to delete this post when the time for clean-up comes :) )

I've been using the BEUSB creds on that pool as a low-diff test for when I wanted to see what shares were actually coming out (and yes, the one on the hub on the Pi is pointed there now). One annoying thing with the U3 driver is the timeout; it's expecting about four times the hashrate it's actually getting so it resets the device occasionally if it hasn't seen a share for 2-4 seconds (depending on frequency). With a high-diff pool, you don't often see cgminer-reported shares, so sometimes your whole window is just "timeout reset" notices when you know the thing is submitting, typically, a couple shares a second (well below vardiff). The LED flashes with each returned share, so you know it's doing something.

Allright thanks, I was asking as I had no luck with the few usb hubs i tried. My Pi couldn't see more then 1 CP2102 :( (I had 8 connected)

Okay many tries on 2 different windows 7 machines and success!

I loaded zadig  8 or 9 times and it finally works .
  this stick is mining on www.mmpool.org

see screen shot


it is pulling  11gh
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/1024x768q90/537/2i5SeV.png

CONGRATULATIONS!!!

Just couldn't leave it at 150 MHz, could you?   :)

Running it at 200? What's the power like?

no it is at 150 I think mmpool was over generous I am running it at btcguild pool now and getting  lower pool side numbers.

7.79gh which is more like it.


BTW I got cgminer 4.9.0 working not 4.9.1



I hate loading zadig.

Got to make it easier for newbies 2 pc's and multiples boots stripping drivers out putting drivers in got to make this easy to help people start it.

Have you worried about "cooling" at all yet? I never ran a stick miner that didn't get pretty warm in dead air.

Good result, regardless of the hashrate.

cooling is done. there is a 5volt usb fan on the right

note this is pulling 5.9 watts but it does the usb stick the hub and the fan
I will post a cleaner photo of the fan.


http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/1024x768q90/540/t1ZiQF.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/1024x768q90/909/c4yNVi.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/1024x768q90/661/W7VmTl.jpg

full size links

http://imageshack.com/a/img540/9515/t1ZiQF.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img909/6822/c4yNVi.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img661/7720/W7VmTl.jpg

sticks are impressive. 5.9 watts which bounces on kwatt meter  5.6 to 5.9

this includes the entire hub the fan and the stick.

if I unplug the fan kwatt drops to 4.7 to 4.9 watts

so the hub is a 18 dollar junk hub with a junk wallwart 12volt 3 amp rating  I know it wastes power.   so these sticks are easy 3 watt for 7.7gh on a hub using  a platinum atx psu.

Other then zadig driving me fuckng nuts  for hours nice.



full size show more
http://imageshack.com/a/img538/7651/7MB7T8.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img905/8661/3rxbOi.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img673/3948/91XDte.jpg

cooling
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/538/7MB7T8.jpg

poolside stats
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/905/3rxbOi.jpg


cgminer 4.9 stats

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/673/91XDte.jpg

At 150MHz it should converge to 8.25GH. Good to see no HW errors. You might be able to turn the voltage down a bit and it still run smooth at slightly lower power. Startup currents tend to bounce the voltage a bit so they don't always start at as low a steady-state voltage as they'll run.

At 610mV 150MHz I ran a set for 24 hours in my ~90F shop with no air movement and zero problems. Hopefully with a decent fan and cool ambient it'll go hotter better. The makeshift heatsink on there is a bit bigger than the stock which will be on the final version.

basement is cold 70f and the fan so it will be cool ..  Going to let it run overnight then play with it on fri.

not so clear on the pot for  power adjustments.  I will photo close up tomorrow and ask questions.

so far it runs well and is actually cold to the touch. (due to ac  for the house and a fan for the stick)

The pot in the bottom corner near the USB jack allows the output voltage to adjust between about 550mV to 800mV. I believe turning clockwise increases the voltage. It should have been set to about 610mV when you got it.

4.9.2 was just released, it should work with the U3 stuff now (per the changelog, I haven't tried it yet).

very nice sofar will be following here as well as the dev posting

ran it over night .  my pc is acting a bit flakey. it is dedicated to mining so no info is at risk.  I think I picked up some kind of malware loading  down loading zadig.



So today I cranked the little pot  from 12 oclock to 2 oclock and I re set the stick to  freq 175.

the kwatt meter jumped from 5.7-5.9 to 6.6  watts so lets say    a .7 watt jump

and hashing jumped about  2 gh  to 9.81gh

full size

http://imageshack.com/a/img910/9928/ILBKHN.png


  http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/910/ILBKHN.png

so moving from freq 150 to freq 175 jumped .7 watts and added 2.02gh   that is pretty good  .


less then .35 watts a gh.  

lower right corner is adjustment pot   it was like this

+    I turned it clockwise just a bit.

full size

http://imageshack.com/a/img633/1461/h1JKa4.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img537/166/bEy7uV.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img540/938/Pflb7O.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img912/9630/Ou1Of7.jpg


good clear shot

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/912/Ou1Of7.jpg

If you have a multimeter, you can check the voltage either at the caps along the left edge below the heatsink, or on the test pads on the back of the stick. I believe from top to bottom they are SGND, Vcore, 1.8V (ASIC logic/signals), 0.9V (ASIC PLL) and PGND

I will get to it later today.

here is current  power draw at freq 175


http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/538/z8rHGz.jpg


here is cgminer 4.9.0 running at freq 175

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/673/dV6bbt.jpg


here is pool side at btcguild

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/iL89wr.png

very nice from a small unit keep up the good work sidehack and novak aswell as the reviewer

you should slowly dial back the power until it doesnt start up and see how low it will go.

one thing at a time.

when the pot was in this  position   +

it was hard to start at freq 150

in the current position  see photo  maybe a ⅛ turn  it starts pretty easy at freq 175

pot is tiny and delicate not looking to turn it much.


http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/912/Ou1Of7.jpg

this little turn i did makes startup easy for freq 150   9 of 10 starts were good wit more juice.

and good for freq 175  8 of 10 starts were good with more juice.

with new  power setting I got this to work on the pc I wanted it to work on.

This pc has a charging port  that will provide 1.5 amps  I am also not using a hub.  Once i have it fully setup i think I will use  5 or less watts with stick and fan.

I fucked my other pc up I got a bad down load of zadig and have been getting rid of a shit load of virus issues.

But I was able to get this stick to work this time.  I am pretty show the extra boost helped detection.

so it probably wont go much lower then.. thats still awesome.. i cant wait till i can get a couple.

Starts hammer on the power with the U3 driver, which affects the start voltage. The code used in the S5 ramps things up a lot more slowly, so once we have something like that in place it should start on a given frequency at a lower voltage. Right now if it starts only half the time on 610mV, it might run clean (after start) with running voltage shifted down to 590mV or so.

It isn't expected that the Pot would be something that would be adjusted while running is it? I would assume that it's more or less "static" given a given frequency, yes?

I do think you can that.  thus saving a bit more power.

I will do some testing and photos on Sun. Hoping to to exactly that.


I spent a lot of today cleaning and deleting my second windows 7 pc in which I loaded a malware filled zadig.  Waste 4 to 6 hours but I think it is fixed.

might of been easier to just reload win7 from scratch.

if you image a fresh install (macrium reflect free is good for this) it only only takes a few minutes to get back to a known good state. for miner only pcs its nice, I did exactly that a few times.

keep the image on a second partition on the same drive the OS is on, that way you dont need to worry about network or usb drivers or stuff like that, boot to reflect and go.

Where did get the infected Zadig?
I use the one in ck's cgminer git and I have no problems. At least that I know of.

I had a small amount in a bitcore wallet and wanted to rescue it. My stupidity was loading a bad version of zadig on this particular pc.

 All is well now and I made 3 usb2 drive thumbnails  with cgminer 4.9 and a good zadig.

I used to sell a lot of sticks on ebay and I would provide the buyers with this  preprogrammed:

http://www.amazon.com/SanDisk-Cruzer-Low-Profile-Drive--SDCZ33-016G-B35/dp/B005FYNSZA/ref=sr_1_5_m?


plug it into your pc  click on cgminer  and zadig and off you go.

my bad I had forgotten it was there and googled a link to zadig.

I don't have time to do photos of second setup on my node/usb stick dedicated pc

25 watts to run node
8.8 watts to add stud usb hub fan and a stick
the stick uses 3 watts to give 9.7gh

I will photo this afternoon.



As for overnight number high 9's poolside

full size link

http://imageshack.com/a/img537/7043/jHQJrw.png

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/537/jHQJrw.png

here is a slew of photos on the second pc/node/usb stick/ usb stud hub.

full size links

http://imageshack.com/a/img538/3368/sdY5cR.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img909/2530/2dHJvI.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img537/1618/OcnbXB.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img537/6246/Rc4nbj.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img661/7386/QaSiN3.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img909/8091/K4Glqz.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img633/3659/9oHXzU.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img673/4786/X9JVRF.jpg

stud hub/fan/usb stick power used = 8.8 watts

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/633/9oHXzU.jpg

stud hub/fan/ no stick power used = 5.7 watts

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/673/X9JVRF.jpg

total power for node + stud hub +  fan + usb stick

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/909/2dHJvI.jpg

cg miner 4.9.0 on  btcguild

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/537/OcnbXB.jpg

node  running

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/537/Rc4nbj.jpg


http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/538/sdY5cR.jpg

system is asrock h77m
 intel i5 2500t
samsung ssd 256 gb  a 810 SATA II ssd
antec 650 earth watts plat psu
2x 4gb sticks of kingston ram
viewsonic screen hd 1080p----------------------------I do not count the power for this as I turn it off 95% of the day

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/QaSiN3.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/909/K4Glqz.jpg

So 3.1 watts for 1 stick at 9.5gh to 9.9gh      freq 175


At worst case power is 3.1/9.5 = 0.3263 watts a gh!!




@ sidehack and novak   nice very nice work

That is very nice :)
I noticed you're using a kill-a-watt type meter for power consumption and math'ing things from there - have you considered using one of those el cheapo USB meters?  Those should give you a reasonably accurate measure of supply voltage, current drawn, and overall power consumption over time at the stick level, with a minimum level of fuss.

0.3 watt this is getting really nice! Can wait to receive mine.  ;D

 give me a link for one and I will order it.

I bought one like this http://www.amazon.com/BESTOPE®-Charger-Doctor-Current-Voltage/dp/B00GC9I61I/ref=pd_sim_60_6?ie=UTF8&refRID=06NT3Z3HJDSP20M7JWE7 (http://www.amazon.com/BESTOPE®-Charger-Doctor-Current-Voltage/dp/B00GC9I61I/ref=pd_sim_60_6?ie=UTF8&refRID=06NT3Z3HJDSP20M7JWE7) a few years back for USB Ants and Gridseeds that still works. Looking Amazon and it seems they have a bigger selection now. http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_2?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=USB+power+meter (http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_2?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=USB+power+meter)

Very good work by the way, thanks for keeping us informed.

Ooh, I might have to fetch a couple of those. The one I built a bit ago isn't working quite right.

I ordered this


http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00J3JSEG6?


this will allow for on the fly adjustments.

would be interesting to see how low it will work at freq 175

I missed the quick responses - making some delicious brownies.
I got this type for when I needed to probe at other things with the multimeter and didn't want to alligator-clip an older one to the same device: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00NHHP06C/
There's even ones that use a matrix display so it'll do some rudimentary graphing (google 'yzxstudio').  Bit overkill, price is higher, etc.  If I did want to splurge, I'd throw some money at this one and get accessible test points and full data logging: http://friedcircuits.us/tools/46
Though for instantaneous measurements, they're all fine, tbh.  It's just so much easier not to have to really hook up anything, just a pass-through USB device.

I can add my "Thumbs Up" for the BestScope device. While I don't know if the device is really accurate to .01 Amp as the display would suggest, it's certainly good enough to tell you roughly what's happening. I would think it would work fine for comparison type adjustments, rather than absolutely accurate readings.

I used it to try and figure out why my Nook HD+ tablet was finicky about what it's charging cable was plugged into. For me it demonstrated clearly that if the two data lines were NOT connected, the Nook would charge at whatever rate the charger could supply. I could clearly see distinct current differences to make this clear.

yeah and with hand built sticks like these are they will vary a bit in efficiency .

 I am impressed enough to see 3.1 watts get me 9.5 gh.

Yeah I know the hub and the fan use power but 8.8- 5.7  = 3.1 watts

The other system was close to that.   7.7 -  4.4 = 3.3 watts

The variance is hub quality the 19 port stud hub + fan has a 5.7 watt base draw  but putting the stick on it only did 3.1 watts


the shit hub had a  4.4 base watt draw bt the stick drew 3.3 watts

I get this issue is the stud hub can supply  15 sticks 60 watts no worries

The low cost 10 port hub can supply 5 sticks 20 watts maybe.

So  my low draw of 1 stick needs the usb meter  for more accurate tests.

I would not mind  having a small setup mining a few sticks maybe 1 board and running the node.

right now my setup is 36 watts. add 3 sticks at 9 watts and my 45 watt setup does a node and 36gh.

maybe toss in a board and run that.

I used this pc to mine about 13 gridseed blades so it can do  a lot of sticks or boards.

Just started playing with with my test unit today.  It's running great off of my MINIX Intel Atom based Ubuntu machine. I've had some issues getting it to run on an Rpi, but I haven't given up there yet. I'll also be testing on a cubieboard. Here's some pics:

https://i.imgur.com/XA0t4ycl.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/PGf0UmEl.jpg


 

Nice Would you consider getting this item from amazon:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00J3JSEG6?

same meter I ordered.  

 helps to see variations in power use for the sticks.  If we all measure with the same meter. While not ideal still helps to see  if the sticks get 0.30 to 0.33 watts per gh.

your stick seems to be doing a little better then mine.  I settled in at  7.70-7.79 gh at freq 150   but  I ran at  btcguild and mmpool.  I am also running a node which may or may not slow the stick's result a bit.



as a complete aside

How much juice does your cubie pull?

And do you think a cubie could run a node and mine a few sticks?

Trying to create a package setup.   

2-5 sticks a hub and a rasp pi.

2-5 sticks a hub and a cubie

2-5 sticks a hub and a usb stick with cgminer+ zadig to plug into a windows 7,8,10  pc

I don't think you guys are going to get an accurate GH/W using killawatt or similar at the wall meters for such a small load. There are just too many other sources of error other than the USB stick that the readings won't mean much. Now if you were measuring 10x sticks on a hub for example, then you'd get closer to a true reading.

That's pretty cool, I just ordered one. Cubie draws around 2-3 watts I believe. You can run a full node off of an rpi or cubie as long as you allocate enough swap space, but it will run dog slow. I think you would need at least 2gb of RAM to run a full node smoothly but I don't believe there aren't any SOC boards with that much RAM yet. On Windows, ZADIG is a bit of a hassle, especially if you already have other drivers associated with the device. I plan to make a WinUSB driver package to simplify things.

the amazon meter is a 1 stick usb meter should be sensitive enough.


http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00J3JSEG6?


I suspect my kwatt meter could be off on my pull the usb stick out of the hub test.

I just placed an order for a couple of those meters as well. Definitely will come in handy.

There are SoC boards with 2GB RAM, including the cubietruck (cubieboard 3).  It is not often terribly cheap to get a 2+GB RAM board, however.  I would vote against using much swap space on an SD card, it is slow at best.

I haven't personally played with it too much but I think it's likely that the required memory could be reduced, there are some flags for bitcoind which ought to help.  If 1GB is enough then a banana pi or raspberry pi 2 would work (both pretty cheap).  I have some experience putting together low-memory linux environments so it's possible we could get something to work.

Something to consider if you want to run a full node is how much hard disk space you'd need.  You might wish you had a spinning drive- which would make swap easy (and probably less slow).  However, you obviously add cost- and power.

--
novak

I had a lot of parts from gpu mining. so I put the current pc together for 0 cost.

I was interested in  running a lower power unit but this is 25 watts running just the node.

Then the sticks get added to it   and the pc end for the sticks is free so to speak.

Since the pc is already in use 24/7/365.

I know rasp pi and cubie are lower power and cheaper to buy. Since  the sticks need some type of controller/pc I am trying to figure what is best for the average user of them.

Not everyone has  1 or 2 pc's for mining only. So I was  tossing out some ways to combine  things on a lower cost controller like  the pi or the cubie.

once you add a 128gb sdcard or even a 256 gb sdcard the little guys are not that cheap.



BTW

Still running at the 9.5-9.8 gh nice easy stable.

Once I get the meter on monday I will try turning the pot ⅛ and setting the freq to 200

the 19 port stud hub puts out .9 amps a stick (4.5 amps)  and I  have bridges which will allow for 1.8 amps which is 9 watts.

I do not think I will try pulling 9 watts.  


 I may use the bridge and try 5 watts and 15gh,  but that is about a week into the future.

you guys that are testing might also want to check out what a electronics you tuber i watch called mjlorton uses to test usb power

link to a video using the device
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYQz88ZclRA

link to the item
http://www.ebay.com/itm/USB-3-0-Power-Monitor-YZXstudio-Voltage-Current-Meter-OLED-Charger-Doctor-/171657443908

seems like its a fast update

not sure though figured i would leave it to you professionals here

Unfortunately, yes.  1.5 will do it, too, but not for much longer.  On the up side, they're working hard on lowering the requirements of a full node in both storage, ram and bandwidth.  Putting one together yourself is at least still the cheaper option - the pre-made full node boxes are relatively expensive ($160+)

Yeah, that's the type I mentioned in the dev thread.  One thing to note is that it's still under active development, and reflashing it with updated firmware is a bit annoying.  I'm waiting for that to settle down before replacing mine :)

looks nice but at 32 usd costs more then this one:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00J3JSEG6?
my 19 port hub is a usb2 device


full size links
http://imageshack.com/a/img537/9928/aTvwMW.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img661/2609/XM5wVL.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img633/3659/9oHXzU.jpg


here are the 2x 19 port hubs I have and the bridge devices >  I am hoping the $9.75 meter model I got  gives me  +-  5%
once I try a more solid overclock  on freq 200 and higher  checking the  power  becomes more important.

 no stick 5.7 watts
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/537/aTvwMW.jpg

 one stick  at freq 175 = 8.8 watts
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/633/9oHXzU.jpg


second 19 port hub and  bridge devices

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/XM5wVL.jpg

very neat i was not aware you could bridge usb ports to get more power out of them... where do you get those hubs ?

https://learn.adafruit.com/external-drive-as-raspberry-pi-root?view=all (https://learn.adafruit.com/external-drive-as-raspberry-pi-root?view=all)

This might help get the Pi running on a hard drive.

I think klintay sells them here, let me find a link or two.


https://www.facebook.com/eyeboot


https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=528371.0


here is direct link but may be sold out

http://www.eyeboot.com/19-port-dipo-electronic-USB-Hub


you can ask klintay here is  his profile

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=122882

i would imagine running a hard drive off usb would be slower then running off a uhs class usb flash drive..
like this
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226378
plus the drive with all those adapters would use more power.

While I find the discussion of running a "full node" fascinating, can I ask what the motivation is? My simplistic view is that it's kinda like running Seti@Home in terms of "value", however you define value.

I don't want to hijack this thread from it's intended purpose, but thought I would ask. Feel free to delete this post if you wish.

well I knew I had enough parts to rebuild 2 pc's both with low watt intel t cpu's

so if you are building a 'free' pc that idles at 23 watts and runs a node at 25 watts


vs a rasp pi the uses 10 watts.

 cost me 0 either way


  you have to ask yourself  for 15 watts  or 11 kwatts a month extra or 2 bucks a month 24 a year .

what is better to run sidehack's gear.

I would be willing to say the pc build will allow me 20-25 sticks using the 2 stud hubs I own.

I would be willing to say the pc build will allow me 8 to 10  18 chip boards.

 I think the rasp pi won't do that.   So the node  is really a  2-3 watt gift to bitcoin on my part.


I am not sure how many sticks and or boards will come to me  as a user and as a kit seller.

We need to see how it unfolds.

But picture a  small pc built to run cgminer / bitcoin node doing 25 sticks + 10 boards.

vs a rasp pi bogging down at 10 sticks and  or 4 boards .

Remember this is All conjecture since no one has run  more then 5 sticks on  1 hub.

So no one knows if that is an issue for rasp pi's or cubies or beagle bones or is that bugle bones.

So my 'free' pc build  may drop the node  if I determine the node lowers my sticks and or boards hashing.

This is the fun part of the gear testing limits figuring what's a good setup etc.

Time will tell.

Probably but why run a drive over USB when you have a SATA port (as in, how about using any of those SoCs besides the pi?)? 

Besides, using flash as swap space is kind of a no-no.  Not that it's likely you'll burn one out in less than several years, but you're using something in a way it wasn't really meant to be used.

--
novak

amazon meter arrived. some photos

full size links
http://imageshack.com/a/img901/5221/hytHGL.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img908/5674/pLpZKh.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img540/3377/HdwIvD.jpg

meter looks nice and it flips stick so tweaking stick is easy
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/901/hytHGL.jpg


close up
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/908/pLpZKh.jpg

and we are pullin 9.5 gh or so

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/540/HdwIvD.jpg

now I had a good  meter for 1 stick  so I dialed back power  the pot is  now  in this position  


+   in stead of ⅛ clock wise     the readings dropped from .66 amp to .6 amp

 so .66 amp x 4.91 v =  3.24 watts  and 9.5 gh


now .6 amp x 4.91 volt = 2.94 watts and 9.5gh hash

or 3.24/9.5 = .341 watts a gh

2.94/9.5 = .309 watts a gh


.309 watts a gh at freq 175 is really good and most likely accurate within 5%

so was the invalid ones due to power being to low in that btw very neat seeing these numbers from a usb drive .... next question how is the heat on the heatsink ?

Should be able to get slightly better performance still if the timeouts can be eradicated.  Theoretical at 175MHz is 9.625Gh/s, which you're already pretty close to in the average measure :)

If it's not reporting HW errors during the delay, the "no valid hashes detected" timeout is still based on U3 timings, which the duration is frequency dependent. The U3 would have four times the hashrate at a given frequency (as it has four chips) so cgminer says "well heck, I haven't seen a share in this long it must be hung and needs a hard reset" but that's not really valid for the stick because it's a single-chip device. The "we have a problem" timeout should be four times longer. That'll be taken care of when we have our own driver.

Looking good, Phil. I won't get to play with my meters until probably Thursday. Thanks for getting some good numbers up.

with the fan blowing on it no worries.  I think I will turn the fan off for an hour. I don't have an infrared gun but I have a temp for food which if placed on the heatsink should give a good number.

27c with fan turned on

40c with fan turned off

full size
http://imageshack.com/a/img538/6752/j5BF12.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img537/6362/4cO2FR.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img537/415/R8jtxt.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img633/1166/35lmqw.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img540/2181/czebCV.jpg


went from 27 to 32 c with fan turned off
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/538/j5BF12.jpg

moved up to 38c

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/537/4cO2FR.jpg

it is hard to read but 39.6c and I played with lowest amp setting here at 0.57 amps = constant hw's

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/537/R8jtxt.jpg

fan drops it down fast to 28c this is in a 25c room temp   notice amps at 0.61 this is much better for HW's
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/633/35lmqw.jpg

lastly look at HW they are at 698
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/540/czebCV.jpg

Maybe after the USB meter, the next thing to get is a thermal camera module? ;)  ( FLIR reacted to the SEEK by dropping their prices a fair bit.. lower resolution but generally higher quality. )

yeah but the oven temp meter is pretty good. cost = $0



I have also decided to  bump amps to 0.61-0.62   vs 0.6


reason is at 0.6 HW is 2%  at 0.61-0.62 HW is under 1%

so my stick seems very happy at freq 175 and 0.61-0.62 amps  still is that nice 0.31 watt per gh number.

A very reasonable argument ;)  If it piques your interest anyway, let me know :)

of course it does and I want one. but so many parts with so much gear in house  and a very patient wife .

I don't want to add any straws at the moment.

Today the usb meter came an intel cpu came. some fan grills are due. some more parts tomorrow.

I have to build a pc in the next 2 days.

z97 asrock itx mobo
i5 4570t cpu
2 8gb sticks of ram
1 250gb msata
fsp plat 450watt psu
a silent zalman cpu cooler

s much as I would like the meter no more gear for a week or two. (or not and I will say fuck it and ask you for a link to buy the meter)

What is the power draw when you figure in the host PC?

read the thread all answers are here.  Does not that seem fair to write.

here is break down

  total of   36 watts for   the  entire setup  I don't count the monitor as it is turned off 23 of 24 hours

----------------------------watts

1)pc --------------------23-25
2)usb hub -------------  4-5
3)fan -------------------   1
4)usb meter -----------   1

5)1  stick --------------  3

The pc runs a full node and uses 23 watts idle 25 watts on a node

A rasp pi would do 10 watts idle and no node. So since I choose a real pc my penalty is 13-15 watts over a rasp pi, cubie, bugle bone etc

I am just waiting for a chance to pop in more sticks to see practical limits for sticks  + boards.

and lastly the .61 amp setting does give hw  errors but not to many.

 i may tweak it to .62 or .63 amps looking for a little less on hw's

I am now starting  freq 200 setting .


My meter reads 4.89 volts x .75 amps = 3.6675 watts  

 I seem to be running  11gh  this is 0.3334 watts per gh

Hw are low

I added the bridge  to give me lots of amps pictures coming


power used is good +  < ⅛ clockwise from the blue plus

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/911/4MUcpv.jpg



good numbers 10.93 with 13 errors and 6688 good

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/540/iSj7ie.jpg

hmm so if you can hit freq 200 with .33w/gh with the s5 chip on a special single chip board, wonder if someone can modify/undervolt the s5 to do it?

I'm just sitting here shaking my head in amazement.  The next round of miners ought to be crazy efficient.  Keep up the reporting.  This is good stuff.

I just wish I had this now I could do some summer mining even with my 18 cents a kwatt

You do, just not as many as you would like.....  :)

Maybe the stick miner should be the U4 in homage to the U1 and U2 series? Or maybe the U2+ ?

While I am sure my recollections are off a bit, other than packaging, is this just about what the original BFL ASIC  miner was supposed to be? USB powered, and 6-8GH? This is better than a Jalapeno in terms of speed, and maybe 1/10 the power draw?

yeah I have
1.6th at btcguild
 140 gh at solo pool
 this 11gh at mmpool

but summer prices in NJ are just too high to mine.

Probably should be thinking about your 1.6TH when BTCguild closes later this month (i.e. June 30th). Maybe you already know about this, but thought I'd mention it anyway.

Sad to see it go.

Great pictures and reporting so far, Phil.  I have one request/suggestion: for the cgminer screen caps hit d then i for widescreen reporting and it will show accepted/rejected/hw errors at the top to the right of WU.

Keep it up, great project to be following!

I did that. I also bumped up current from .75 to .78 amps

I had 6600   good 13 bad at .75 amp x 4.89 volts
I had 12800  good 26 bad at .75 amp x 4.89 volts

I now have 65000 good 29 bad at .78 amp x 4.88 volts

so the little bit higher power has resulted in  much better hw   gh is 10.91

3.8064 watts/ 10.91 gh  this is 0.3488 watts a gh

full size links

http://imageshack.com/a/img661/6564/wV1m5o.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img537/1056/HPPAwX.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img910/295/YxLwqa.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img540/7320/88S5fC.jpg

http://imageshack.com/a/img903/6558/fvr6rY.jpg

my shirt
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/537/HPPAwX.jpg

Hw are 30 or 29  but we have done only 3 or 4 errors with current amp setting in about 20 hours


http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/910/YxLwqa.jpg
amps are .78 volts are 4.87-4.88  freq = 200 gh is about 10.93
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/540/88S5fC.jpg


 second hw shot
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/903/fvr6rY.jpg

tomorrow I am going to try a higher freq

errors are 30/224000 = 0.0001339


they were 26/12600 = 0.0020634

so when I bumped amps from .75 to .78

we did 4/211400 = 0.00001892


so I am pretty happy with this setting  on the pot.

.79 x 4.87 = 3.8473 watts

3.8473/10.95 = 0.35135 watts a gh  with next to  a 4/211400 hw rate

the setting with  .75 amps did   

.75 x 4.89 = 3.6675 watts/10.95 =  0.33493 watts a gh with a 26/12600 hw rate

both  settings    are really good.


looking forward to a higher freq test.

Nice!  ;D

 1) Note all HW are way under 0.5%
 2) Note to set new freq a full restart of my windows 7 pc is needed.



tested are in bold

   100           5.5  
   125           6.88  
   150           8.25    .                   .31             Hw under 0.5%
   175           9.63                        .31 to .32    Hw under 0.5%

   193.75         10.66  
   196.88         10.83
  
   200         11.00                         .33 to .35  Hw under 0.5%


   206.25      11.34                          .36  still testing    4.85 volts.  .84 amps    11.34 gh    0 HW    with 34820 good.
                                                        .35  started  test  4.87 volts   .81 amps    11.34 gh  
                                            
   212.50         11.69      
   218.75          12.03

  
   225.00         12.38  
   237.5         13.06  
   243.75      13.41  
   250           13.75  


make note that amps of .81 or .84  start to push  usb hubs

As soon as I exceed 0.40 watts per gh I will stop testing

freq 206.25 needs testing at lower amps.  it ran for  more then 4 hours and did about 34800 good shares with 0 Hw at the .84 amp level


these sticks need cooling at freq 175 and up

freq 150 seemed okay with no fan

I will test lower numbers last as  running them with no fan at freq 100 at .25 watts a gh would be really cool (pun intended )

https://i.imgur.com/CqRTplR.png

My Shirt is on its own vacation!

 1) Note all HW are way under 0.5%
 2) Note to set new freq a full restart of my windows 7 pc is needed.



tested are in bold

   100           5.5  
   125           6.88  
   150           8.25    .                   .31             Hw under 0.5%
   175           9.63                        .31 to .32    Hw under 0.5%

   193.75         10.66  
   196.88         10.83
  
   200         11.00                         .33 to .35  Hw under 0.5%


   206.25      11.34                          .36      4.85 volts.  .84 amps    11.34 gh    0 HW    with 34820 good.
                                                        .35    4.87 volts   .81 amps    11.38 gh   0 Hw with  85,000+ good
                                                        .34    4.87 volts   .79 amps----11.37 gh   1 Hw  for 9,000+ good shares


                                            
   212.50         11.69                   just started

 
   218.75          12.03

  
   225.00         12.38  
   237.5         13.06  
   243.75      13.41  
   250           13.75  


make note that amps of .81 or .84  start to push  usb hubs

As soon as I exceed 0.40 watts per gh I will stop testing

freq 206.25 needs testing at lower amps.  it ran for  more then 4 hours and did about 34800 good shares with 0 Hw at the .84 amp level


these sticks need cooling at freq 175 and up

freq 150 seemed okay with no fan

I will test lower numbers last as  running them with no fan at freq 100 at .25 watts a gh would be really cool (pun intended )


I ran 206.25 at lower amps. of .81 and still had 0 HW after 80000 plus shares. see photos below
0.81 amps gave me 0 Hw
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/538/qbZXex.jpg

I also did 11.38gh which is better then sidehacks' prediction of 11.34gh!


http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/901/sgQJfg.jpg

so I dropped current and I am  running one more set of tests. it is nice to see the stick doing a little better then I hoped for.


http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/537/S5FD6o.jpg

will be nice to see if it will do .34 watts a gh at freq 206.25  with low errors.   and after 9000 shares or about an hour  it had only 1 hw



 if this could project to an 18 chip board  we would have  about 205gh at about 70 watts. pretty good if cooling is easy.

this stick is a nice piece of work.

now testing freq 212.50

Cant wait to see the board!  ;D This is really nice 0.34 watt

I am impressed by this gear. so far the 212.50  test is doing well.

And this show us that bitmain just dont care to make a good miner. They want to make profit. Sidehack take time to work with the chip and the result is awesome!  ;D

well  this stick is really nice ,but it needs care.  remember I am using:

 1) an intel i5 quad core pc with an ssd and 8gb ram it is all mining /btc nothing else
 2) a high quality usb hub
 3) and I am a long term miner with a lot of experience playing with gear testing gear etc.


If bitmain sold this as a u3 stick to the masses it would have had issues from people that don't know how to mine.

I think a lot of rookies would do below:

No cooling
underpowered hub
People unable to run cgminer

I love this gear from sidehack  my geek viewpoint like it a like. 
Also as an ebay seller I can sell these sticks in a kit.

I am looking forward to the 18 chip boards.   I think they will do under 75 watts and around 200gh

freq 212 results Hw 69  30912 shares  hash rate 11.73  power .81 amps 4.85 volts notice in photo I went to a single port since most of us can not bridge  our usb ports.

amazing that these are a bit high on Hw  but on power used this is 0.335 watts per gh!  


this is my setting where I get  0.335 watts per gh

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/911/ZxM4wF.jpg


errors good   since I am looking for best gh per watt

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/537/sZS1VK.jpg

starting  freq 218.75


http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/540/tTjCwZ.jpg


notice power draw of .84 amps and volts of 4.84 that is 4.0656 watts and close to max  on many hubs


http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/540/8cwESi.jpg

Well hey, nifty. I'm pretty sure the new revision Compac PCBs and the barebones 18-boards have shipped, so I might be playing with those next week.

I wonder when the other three guys are gonna start reporting opinions?

One random thought on this. You might want to consider performing the lower frequency (i.e. lower power) tests before you push onto the higher speed and higher power tests. I say this because I think there is zero risk to the hardware  at the low end, but the higher up the scale you go, somewhere along the line something could go POOF. Once it goes POOF, then you may not be able to test the low end. I am not saying don't ever push the high end, just that with the extremely limited number of these devices, it might make more sense to get the "low end" end data first, and then "go for the MAX".

I completely understand the urge to push the envelope, but it might make sense to adjust the sequence of tests.

I think as long as the heatsink is staying cool (which implies the chip is staying cool), there shouldn't be much problem. The buck on this guy is built for an upper limit of 800mV and about 20A which is a heck of a lot more power than any stickminer should ever use. The USB jack is rated for 1.5A.

Also if the new PCBs work he'll probably be getting a proper final design stick end of next week that can be babied.

But yeah, it'd be kinda lousy to see it catch on fire.

yeah but if the test one does go up in smoke you can see what went wrong and fix it before its too late.

Do these have thermal paste or tape between/to the heatsink? It looks very close in size to the U2+ heatsink but the fins are thinner, sorta like something I've seen before.

so at 218.75 which is the s3 stock freq... you should get like 234ghs at less then 100 watts?

i would love a few of those 18 chip boards.. maybe ill get 4 or 6 to replace my s3s..

you really are putting bitmains techs to shame..

you can see they went for speed, instead of efficiency.

It's approximately 1"x1.75".  AntMiner U2 is ~1"x1.57", so a bit shorter - and also flatter.

Keep in mind, though, these are not the final heat sinks;

maybe  the 18 chip is a little worse then the stick .  but if it does 12.0gh a chip at freq 218.75 that is   216gh  at 80-90 watts.

I just finished my 218.75 test   I got .84 amps x 4.84 volts and 11.97gh  with 99.5%  good share rate.

this 4.0656 watts and divided by 11.97 = 0.3396 watts per gh  errors were higher at 0.5% but a little tweak on the pot would have dropped the error rate and bumped the power a little bit.
 so at 0.341 watts errors would be 0.1%

I am now doing freq 225 I will stop here as I needed to push amps to .900 with volts at 4.82 watts = 4.338

most hubs at maxxed at this point .  so I will stop at this point. I will post numbers but errors are decent with the small turn of the pot errors are well under 0.5%

Yup, the 18-chip boards look very promising for what they may produce, can't wait to see those come along.  I've got an S1 and S3 that I would use as donor to upgrade to this design.

I would look to replace my 2GH/s nanofury sticks with these stick as well, 4x the hash is alway welcomed.

the freq 225 test went pretty well   0.3498 watts a gh  Hw 7/12000  that is 99.941% good   I hashed at about 12.40gh.

I will post photos and clean thread up a bit.

So from freq 150 to freq 225  I ran 0.31 to 0.35 watts a gh and was able to always be better then 99.5%

Once I get all photos posted I will do the lower freq's of 100 , 125

I will see if 0.28 watts a gh with no fan can work on 100 and or 125 freq

 1) Note all HW are way under 0.5%
 2) Note to set new freq a full restart of my windows 7 pc is needed.



tested are in bold

   100           5.5  
   125           6.88  
   150           8.25    .                   .31             Hw under 0.5% Hash rate 7.97gh-----biggest difference will retest it.
   175           9.63                        .31 to .32    Hw under 0.5% Hash rate 9.64gh

   193.75         10.66  
   196.88         10.83
  
   200         11.00                         .33 to .35  Hw under 0.5% Hash rate 10.97gh


   206.25      11.34                          0.34, 0.34, 0.36 Hw under 0.5%  Hash rate 11.37gh
 
I look at this set of three tests at freq 206.25  and  realize I did not go low enough on the pots's setting


                                            
   212.50         11.69                     0.335 watts per gh  Hw under 0.5%  hash rate 11.73gh  

  
   218.75          12.03                         0.3396 watts per gh Hw under 0.5% hash rate 11/97gh

  
   225.00      12.38                           0.3498 watts per gh HW under 0.5%   hash rate 12.40gh


I believe my hub will do all of these real easy  with my  2 port bridge.  Most hubs will not be able to do these below.  They will be tested last.
   237.5         13.06  
   243.75      13.41  
   250           13.75  

so far there has been CrazyGuy and philipma1957, you pinged the other guys?

on that note, CrazyGuy, hows yours been going?

One item of note: The numbers that Phillip comes up with I assume are measured "at the USB connector"  as I understand it. The actual final "at the wall" efficiency won't look as good, since there has to be power supply, and hub losses. These numbers also, except for some early ones, don't include the PC that's running the mining software.

When compared to an S5 for example, where it's all pretty much bundled together,  you only really get to measure the "at the wall" figure. That's I think where the .52W/GH comes from .

Don't get me wrong, this is all really good work. It's just not quite as good as it seems is all.

A lot depends on how you set a stick up.

my pc is really efficient . it runs a node at 25 watts and if I choose to run 1 stick at freq 125 .  I won't need a hub or a fan.

if sidehack makes a usb hub that allows a psu to power it the hub would be very efficient .

the s-5 is 1150gh and at .52 per gh  you get  598 watts.

the controller and the 2 fans are close to 20 watts of waste so 578/1150 = 0.502 watts a gh.


 your argument is valid  if the pc/rasp pi/cubie/bugle bone  were never going to run.  that means all power used by the controller/fans/hubs counts against the watts per gh.

my 1 stick 1 hub 1 fan is pulling more then 8 watts to do 11 gh.  i do not count the 25 watts for the pc since i was using the same 25 watts to run

the node.

 now if I add 2 more sticks and go to 16 watts to do 33gh I am at 16/33 = .4848 watts per gh not counting the pc's 25 watts.

buts a guy with a rasp pi will use 16 + 10 = 26 watts for 3 sticks a fan a hub a rasp pi   this is 26/33 or 0.7878 watts a gh


many people don't want big home mining.  26 watts vs  600 watts almost no noise vs lots of noise.

for sticks to really beat an s-5

 10 at 11 gh = 110gh  watts per gh at .33 = 36.3 watts + 10 watts for rasp pi = 46.3 watts add 3.7 watts for fan and hub waste you are doing

50 watts to get 110gh that is 0.4545 watts a gh and beats the s-5 in power use and sound use.  so the sticks show under clocked chips work well.

carry forward to an 18 chip board and maybe we have a special piece of gear.

210 gh at 75 watts using a hub and a rasp pi will bitch slap the s-5's  .52 watts a gh.

So I had a really long and thoroughly quantitative post written up addressing points of discussion from the previous 10 or so posts but the forum ate it and I don't really feel like going back over all those numbers again. Call it a lack of motivation if you want. Novak and I got back to the shop this morning after a 37-hour marathon drive (1630 miles) for supplies to find the power had gone out, all the UPS were depleted so the servers were powered down, the internet wasn't working and the hosting router had eaten its own hard drive, and also I haven't really had anything to eat except Twizzlers and sunflower seeds in about 23 hours. All in all it was a pretty fun couple of days.

Anyway. The point was, the S5 was designed at a time when the hardware scene was pretty different than it is now. It's fairly optimal when you consider the size constraints of the S[odd] miners, prioritizing hashrate first and efficiency second (since top clock on the BM1384 is still more efficient than bottom clock on just about every other chip brought to market). With higher chip density they could do better, but at increased cost (17x3 like in the S4+ could get you 1.4TH at 500W with 70% more chips, whooptee doo).

The 18-chip board will be more efficient than 18 sticks, because you have 1x support hardware instead of 18x support hardware and the regulator should run closer to 95% than the 87-90% on the stick.

I will probably also not release an 18-chip board with the BM1384. I'm assuming, with the dev timeframe we have, that Bitmain's next gen chip will be out and if I can design around that for the larger stuff I certainly will. Maybe if the BM1384 chip prices go way down it'd still be viable, but it'd be starting off at a disadvantage when the next chip will probably see 0.3W/GH around top clock instead of bottom.

18 chipboard with 0.18W/GH TO 0.30W/GH

Would really be nice.

New chips yeah.

Mine's still running great at stock speeds with no fan.

My opinion so far is that it's a great miner for beginners. It took all of 30 seconds to get it up and running. Efficiency is great, but you're going to have to string up a few of them in a hub to average out the draw from your controller.

I'll have some free time this weekend to get it hooked up to a cubian and rpi and start taking some more measurements.

im not sure about new chips.. right now its pure speculation.. not even an official announcement.

if the s5 chips can do much better then they are doing, why spend the resources to make newer chips?
it would be more cost effective to just redesign the boards and use the stock they have?


we have until 65 billion difficulty for s3s at 10c a kwh. can maybe get some more out of them if they are undervolted.

the s5 has until around 115 billion before we have to start worrying about that.

i was going to pick up a 2nd s5, but i found these threads and i think if the 18 chip boards can be made soon it would be better to get them.. even if they are made on the s5 chips they will be better then anything on the market.

There is actually someting coming from july from Bitmain. A lot of good source have confirmed it .

Should be the S7. If we follow the pattern, it will be a new chip. S1 - S1  new chip S3 - S4 new chip S5 - Nothing new chip S7.

Hope so!  ;D

guess it all depends how much they value it..

About the best Bitmain could feasibly do with an S[odd] size miner with the BM1384 is probably a 17x3 string, getting 1.4TH at 500W and 70% higher chip cost. That's pretty dense. A new chip with 30-40% better top clock would do the job better and probably at lower cost. I'll be surprised if they roll out another S[odd] miner with the BM1384 instead of a new chip.

They could do another S[even] miner with it, and some 18s unregulated strings could get around 3.4TH off a 1KW PSU in a rack box which would be pretty darn sexy.

Even if we build with BM1384, 18-chip boards won't be available for months. If I had a design right now, I'd have to raise the money for a chip batch and then wait for them from the factory. If I had a design right now, S7 would probably be selling before I had the money all together. And since it'll be probably a month before I have the design ready...

But all that is discussion for the project discussion thread. Let's try and keep this one to stick facts instead of non-stick speculations.

this thread makes me really curious about undervolting the S5. I've searched but cant find any posts about it. i'm running the nicehash firmware which allows the ability to change the voltage. but i havent seen anyone post about it. im afraid to mess with it because i dont the the correct syntax(or parameters) to put in. dont want to fry my miner on the first try....

you cant change the volt on the s5 with the firmware :(

it also seems to not work they way they intended it to by reducing the input volts from the psu.

s-5 is not able to go under 10.8 volts  and needs to be dialed down to that after startup.

power savings is only 10%. and a plat psu at 12 volts will drop to a gold at 10.8 volt setting

so the 10% power savings may only be  5-6%

something in the string design.  A bit above my paygrade. as to the why of it.


Back to this stick.

I found an issue it does not like to go lower then freq 125.

My freq 100 setting was not very stable and a bit power hungry.

So I would say think :


freq 125 no fan and 0.305 watts per gh as the minimum.


freq 225 with fan and 0.35 watts per gh as the maximum.


   100                   5.00>>>>>>>>>>>>>not very stable

  
  125                   6.88
   150                   8.25  
   175                   9.63  
   193.75         10.66  
   196.88         10.83  
   200                 11.00  
   206.25         11.34  
   212.5                 11.69  
   218.75         12.03  
  225                 12.38

  
   237.5                 13.06  
   243.75         13.41  
   250                 13.75  

s-5 is not able to go under 10.8 volts  and needs to be dialed down to that after startup.

power savings is only 10%. and a plat psu at 12 volts will drop to a gold at 10.8 volt setting

so the 10% power savings may only be  5-6%

something in the string design.  A bit above my paygrade. as to the why of it.


Back to this stick.

I found an issue it does not like to go lower then freq 125.

My freq 100 setting was not very stable and a bit power hungry.

So I would say think :


  freq 125 no fan and 0.305 watts per gh as the minimum.


 freq 225 with fan and 0.35 watts per gh as the maximum.


   100                   5.00>>>>>>>>>>>>>not very stable

  
   125                   6.88  stable no fan needed 0.305W/gh
   150                   8.25  
   175                   9.63  
   193.75            10.66  
   196.88            10.83  
   200                 11.00  
   206.25            11.34  
   212.50            11.69  
   218.75            12.03  
  225                 12.38 stable fan needed 0.34 or 0.35 W/gh

  
  
all below are not tested for 2 reasons stick was getting warm at freq 225 and most people do not have a usb hub that will give 1 amp at 5 volts for multiple ports 24/7/365

 237.50            13.06  
   243.75            13.41  
   250                  13.75  






I can get the freq 237.50 and  above to work, but I think I will not try them so quickly.

right now I am doing freq 218.75  working very nicely.

I don't have much else to test on it.

pools used

btcguild.com >>>>>>> RIP
mmpool.org
solo.ckpool.org

Playing around some more with the test unit today. At a frequency of 150, efficiency at the usb port is a little under .32 watts per gh with a board temp of 44.6c.  I was also able to mine directly off of the usb port of a cubie, but you'll need a power adapter that can handle at least .9 amps at 5v to do the same.

https://i.imgur.com/X01wO4sl.jpg (http://imgur.com/X01wO4s)

https://i.imgur.com/43LsILZl.jpg (http://imgur.com/43LsILZ)

https://i.imgur.com/CrWxRY1l.jpg (http://imgur.com/CrWxRY1)

https://i.imgur.com/sZV5Zpdl.png (http://imgur.com/sZV5Zpd)

https://i.imgur.com/h2cw3Jyl.jpg (http://imgur.com/h2cw3Jy)


                 "Look Ma, no burns!"

https://i.imgur.com/MVN5DzCl.jpg (http://imgur.com/MVN5DzC)

yeah I got 40-42c  with the meat temp probe at freq 150

@CrazyGuy: I assume that you have not tinkered with the pot on you sample stick? You are using it the way it came "out of the box"?

Great work, and good pictures!

bump for pot shot

The second stick came. 

After 3 or 4 zadig  installs the second stick took install.

I have the two sticks running at this pool:

http://solo.ckpool.org/users/1JdC6Xg3ajT3rge3FgPNSYYFpmf53Vbtje

I also run a U2 at it I will post photos in a bit.

zadig truly sucks.

But I shut down everything on the pc except zadig I ran it as an admin and after  two reboots it installed the new driver. 

I then ran cgminer 4.9.2  and hot plugged the sticks. they both work.

I also ordered a second usb2 meter which arrives on sat.

some photos are coming

I didn't reset the voltage on those sticks before I sent them out, so it'll probably run hotter than the first. It should be stable to 225MHz at the current setting (at which speed it draws approximately 1A)

I noticed it is a tad hotter then my 218.75 stick setting.  my stick is .87 amps your stick is .93 amps. I ordered a second meter. it come tomorrow.

full size links:

http://imageshack.com/a/img913/2474/sunRvR.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img673/4046/FvBWpS.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img905/8003/MwaQss.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img911/8074/bCNRDt.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img661/104/ROcmPC.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img661/5120/90yKn4.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img909/5678/5BN8QP.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img908/2899/gajzuQ.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img908/3797/7DSv14.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img661/2765/N73SAG.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img673/930/XJvLCs.jpg


new stick with gold heatsink
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/913/sunRvR.jpg

both sticks running at 218.75
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/673/FvBWpS.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/905/MwaQss.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/911/bCNRDt.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/ROcmPC.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/90yKn4.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/909/5BN8QP.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/908/gajzuQ.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/908/7DSv14.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/N73SAG.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/673/XJvLCs.jpg

I ended up getting zadig loaded
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/905/MwaQss.jpg

I needed to turn off every app to get the failed install to really work
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/911/bCNRDt.jpg


once every thing was off and zadig run as admin it did install
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/ROcmPC.jpg

the hardest thing with the sticks is the zadig install
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/90yKn4.jpg

I then opened my cgminer 4.9.2
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/909/5BN8QP.jpg


I have many start files for each freq tested I picked ckpool freq 218
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/908/gajzuQ.jpg


http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/908/7DSv14.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/N73SAG.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/673/XJvLCs.jpg

finally running well

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/908/7DSv14.jpg

the hub and 2 sticks use 13 watts.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/673/XJvLCs.jpg


my stud hub powered on with nothing pulls about 5 watts

so these two sticks are doing about 8 watts

Just got it out of the mail.  Will be a few day's till I have a more in-depth review/test of it.  I will say first impression is very nice.  I was surprised looking at it was expecting a prototype looking miner, but this looks like its ready to ship.   And love the color heat sink it is a nice looking gold.

Initial test plugged it in, loaded driver, and it ran first off.   So once again a very nice start to a review right there.


Looking forward to playing with it :).  Again a few day's and I will have more in-depth.  

They're going for green ones in their production batch :)

I would highly recommend you adjust the voltage down (which on that guy will mean turning the pot clockwise a little bit) if you're running it off a laptop port.

I made a few very small changes to the PCB between this and what will be the production batch - mostly cosmetic, no circuitry changes. The heatsink is anodized a different color but otherwise identical to the final product heatsink. Also we'll probably be using a pick-and-place instead of a guy with a homemade air pencil so stuff like the inductor and input caps will be a little more squared-away.

It was for quick initial test.   Didn't set up the hub/fan yet.  You are very right on turning voltage down with laptop port it was good for a quick test but did heat up.   It in no way was optimized as far as my first testing setup. 

yeah these sticks work without a fan at  about .7 amps  once you pass the .7amp draw which is freq 187.5 you need a fan. 

I am doing .87amp on both sticks and doing freq 218.75  and I need a fan

Sometime soon I figure on pushing one up to 300MHz or better and see how it handles, see what the input current looks like. We did some rough comparisons today on heatsinks from some other miners and figure with moderate airflow the thing should be good up to about 6.5W chip heat, which would happen around 1.5A input current, which I should touch 300MHz before hitting that point. I think.

Unless one of y'all want to test that first. The only thing I know for sure is the buck's good for it. That's only about eight and a half amps output, pretty small potatoes for that circuit.

I may give a high power test tomorrow.  I have not passed .92 amps and freq 225.

the sticks got a bit warm.

I have some very good fans and maybe I will try really blowing  them out on friday.

I will use the usb bridge. that can go close to 1.8 amps at 4.8volts which is  over 7 watts

Just started higher overclock tests.

fullsize links

http://imageshack.com/a/img537/1732/b0a3Um.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img537/4849/w8BWvF.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img661/2889/CaCuoh.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img540/2382/b1LPCZ.jpg


only doing 1 stick. Since I have 2 if I do something wrong I will have one more left.
note my hub can do .9 amps per usb port. so I have a bridge  thus I can give a stick 1.8amps.  most hubs will not do this for you. note cooling fan

this is the original model I am doing freq 250.  it is doing 1.07 amps to get to 250 freq

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/537/b0a3Um.jpg

the hub and the stick pull 8-9 watts on the kwatt

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/537/w8BWvF.jpg

here is the bat file and the early cgminer numbers
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/CaCuoh.jpg

note temp is 75c humidity is 62%

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/540/b1LPCZ.jpg

after some 1 stick testing at freq I moved to 2 stick testing,

full size images

http://imageshack.com/a/img673/3618/YXxKFG.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img905/876/feIAPf.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img633/9744/6Ef7U7.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img673/6385/HuAc8k.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img673/2489/tuh3vI.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img661/3984/LY7aLz.jpg

they use the  usb bridge and they use 1.11amps and 4.81 volts each the gold is the new one the black is a tiny bit taller and is the older one

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/673/YXxKFG.jpg

the hub and 2 sticks use 14 watts

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/905/feIAPf.jpg

early cgminer numbers are  here
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/633/6Ef7U7.jpg

temp was 77f but shot is fuzzy
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/673/HuAc8k.jpg
better temp photo
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/673/tuh3vI.jpg

cgminer after an hour or so . 14 watts used to do 27 gh counting the 4 or 5 watts of the hub.

so 9 or 10 watts  to do 27gh at the sticks


http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/LY7aLz.jpg

I have hit a dead end on testing.  I got freq 250 to load after that cgminer crashes.
I suspect I need to get into a file and add freq beyond 250, but my skill set with code is that of cut and paste.
I need to see a screen shot to copy what to do.

Sticks work well up to freq 250 I needed to get a better fan but in an 80f room temp in the garage I can hold the sticks with my hand and while warm they will not burn me. I found a fan that moves more air and I could  keep the sticks cooler by turning the fan up.
The black heatsink older stick likes 1.07 amps   4.81 volts
The gold heatsink newer stick like   1.12 amps  4.81 volts

the black one  has less errors and has just over 14gh
the gold one has more errors and just under 13.8gh

so 10.534 watts for 27.8 = 0.378 watts a gh.

not surprising the watts per gh drifted up a bit due to the 250 freq.
the variation in these two sticks is about 5%  but that is at top speed.
could be the newer gold one can go lower maybe a stable 100 freq my black heatsink stick was not stable at freq 100. it works as low as freq125

Still 2 sticks and close to 28gh.

Yeah, I had forgotten the U3 code only has up to 250MHz in it. The actual code shouldn't be too hard to modify to add additional frequencies, it'd be dropped into the Icarus driver.

The black-heatsink stick was made with one of our new-from-Bitmain sample chips, the gold one actually has a pulled chip. The power dissipation also increases with heat, so the smaller heatsink on the gold stick probably adds to that slightly.

still 250 is pretty good.  someone that  knows how to mod the Icarus will need to give me a few screen shots on that.

I am pretty sure that with a quality high speed fan these will do more then freq 250  and 13.8 or 13.9 gh.

I will run them overnight at freq 250 then back down to 218.75

I think you'd need to adjust driver-icarus.c:
Change to 450

Extend that with:
( values from datasheet - there's a formula if you want to try other values*  If bfgminer works feed it hex values directly )

The function anu3_find_freqhex basically does a look-up of the frequency given on the command line in the table without exceeding it.  So supplying it with '166' will make it use the '150' freq.
The function set_anu_freq sends the frequency on over and then it's wait and see if things freak out or not :)

* No idea if making it use anu_find_freqhex instead wouldn't work.  Can't spot a reason for using a LUT for the U3 in the cgminer commits.

The code I wrote to help with S1 undervolting (http://gekkoscience.com/misc/set_freq.cpp) should print out valid hex for the nearest possible setpoint to any arbitrary frequency, if you want more granularity than 25MHz steps just add whatever lines you want to it.

Okay so lets say I want to get my working version of cgminer 4.9.2 to add  for the sake of argument

freq 256.25
freq  262.50
freq   268.75
freq  275.00
freq  281.25
freq  287.50
freq  293.75
freq 300.00

which I THINK MY SETUP AND THE USB STICKS CAN DO.

I do not understand how to splice it into the  cgminer 4.9.2 I have.

give me a few minutes to show a screen shot or two. 

here is a screenshot of my 4.9.2

fullsize link


http://imageshack.com/a/img540/3146/eN85t7.png



My coding skills are poor I can do a  start bat file and not much else.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/1024x768q90/540/eN85t7.png

Borrowed from an S1 thread, clock and hex:

256.25  1405
262.50  0a01
268.75  1505
275.00  0a81
281.25  1605
287.50  0b01
293.75  1705
300.00  0580

You're going to want to find driver-icarus.c. Change the ANT_U3_MAXFREQ to 300 and add these to the u3freqtable around line 400 then recompile. Doing that on Windows is going to be less than fun.

I've got my sticks on a Pi at the shop but I can ssh into it. I'll see if I can do it there.

may be over my head.  but I will keep trying a few ideas.

So I added a bunch of frequencies to driver-icarus. You also have to modify a function in a few places in cgminer.c to take the accepted max up from 250 to 300.

I added that into the current git code (4.9.2) Recompiled and all that, cgminer starts and recognizes --au3-freq above 250 but doesn't see sticks. Of course I didn't test compile the stock code to see if it worked before I made my changes. Whoops.

Hey, at least you got that far ;)  I haven't compiled cgminer on windows in a very long time; the instructions are outdated, several things have changed in various locations, and just when I thought it was getting somewhere... I'm hitting make complaining about the size of struct timespec being unknown :)
( cross-compiling on a linux install is much more fun )

Actually, I'm on an XP laptop in my living room, SSH'd into a Debian server at the shop, re-SSH'd into a Pi with Minera on a shelf in the office, and building it on that.

Which cgminer 4.9.2 built straight from git isn't picking up my sticks either. But now the stock cgminer isn't picking them up either? Dunno what's up.

Must. Go. Deeper.

In the mean time, I got mine to build.  This took well over 100 steps (admittedly, this includes clicking trivial buttons and such - was documenting it in screenshots just in case) and a whole bunch of googling and crossing fingers.. and the particular error I was facing semi-last (there were two more after that) is actually a MinGW issue that should be fixed soon.

For reasons I haven't explored yet, I also ended up needing 'libgcc_s_dw2-1.dll', but then it started right up and fired off on a Block Erupter USB without issue (so far - not a fan of the zadiggery and tend to run older cgminer).

@sidehack: what are the functions that need tweaking in addition to the define and LUT?

Edit: I suspect it's the set_float_100_to_250 cap on input parameters?

Yeah, that's the one.

I won't have any more progress until tomorrow when I get into the shop. Not sure if something in the compile scripts hosed USB or if the hub's smoked out or what but I got no sticks even on the cgminer already built into minera, which actually was still working after the first unsuccessful rebuild from git (in a different location).

I'll talk to Novak tomorrow and see what he thinks, since linux and programming are both more his thing. It's funny, I'm the one with a CS degree to his Aero but he's the far better programmer.

TheRealSteve sent me a cgminer build. 

Will test it in the morning.

Thanks steve.

BTW these sticks float along at freq 250

30 plus hours  one has 2 or 3 hw's the 5 or 6.

Stats are

4.73v 1.12amps

 4.73v  1.07amps

I got a second meter. I will post a photo in a few mins.

 

Hopefully no magic smoke was released in an untimely coincidence.  I'll see about documenting the cgminer build (mis-)steps somewhere (not this thread, way too o/t).  If anybody wants to play with my binary, shoot me a PM - or just wait for sidehack/novak's build :)

Not trying the build yet but photos of my gear at freq 250.  I am impressed with these little sticks.

say 2.2 amps x 4.75 volts =  9.9 watts giving 27.46gh  this is 0.36 watts per gh at a high overclock.


http://imageshack.com/a/img907/1672/EqSGyN.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img908/3190/27EUgh.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img673/7530/VDJCEv.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img673/766/zfie6A.jpg


so in an 82 f garage  and a 140 mm pair of fans these sticks are merely warm
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/907/EqSGyN.jpg
my pc running  cgminer and bitcoin and the hub running the 2 sticks use 46-47 watts
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/908/27EUgh.jpg

the 2 sticks and the hub use 16 watts

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/673/VDJCEv.jpg

the cgminer has run more then a ½ day at this setting  8HW FOR ONE AND 2HW FOR THE OTHER!!
pretty good.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/673/zfie6A.jpg

That's pretty cool !

Great job guys :)

I certainly wouldn't mind getting ahold of that cgminer build. Novak's gonna be busy all week catching up on his own projects and I need to be manufacturing PSU gear so I doubt either of us are gonna have much time for cgminer coding.

Also, by now there should be at least six of the new final-prototype sticks delivered to US testers (three more went to people overseas). Hopefully this week enough of them will post info that we can get a consensus whether or not they're sellable. Might open an order queue as early as Friday.

PM sent - forum's having some glitches, postponing cgminer build thread until tomorrow/day after depending on hours.

Running my stock 4.9.0 at 250MHz I'm seeing 13.7GH; running your custom build at 250MHz I got up to 11.5GH with a lot of resets. The power draw was what I expected for 250MHz but the hashrate and WU came in low. Not sure what's up.

Unfortunately I can't even provide a proper comparison build; all the cgminer code outside of the frequency options is the same, so any differences would come from not having the exact same libraries used in the official builds, kludge workarounds for compile errors, etc.  Might find out later if there's some egregious difference - if I get around to posting that windows build thread, get some feedback, etc.

Might want to compare against 4.9.2, since that's the codebase used - but I'd be surprised if there's a performance difference between official 4.9.0 and official 4.9.2

you should look into being a hand model :)

The only comparison I have to 4.9.2 is the stock compile on the Pi that didn't enumerate the sticks at all. I'll see about digging up a stock Windows 4.9.2 after I'm done messing with 4.9.0 code on Linux.

Actually I have wonderful fingernails.  Many women have told me that would pay to have them. ;D

You might not want to repeat that too often to your Wife.....  :)

4.9.2 upgraded the USB reset for the U3's, (-U3 will USB reset on no shares for 2 seconds instead of 1.), which might be why it's not enumerating the sticks ??.

I get that on my 4.9.2 build.  I really struggled getting zadig to load drivers after that I am good on the two sticks up to freq 250

Also you need a really good hub to drive sticks at freq 250 … my sticks do 1.07 amps and 1.13 amps and pull .36 watts 

So 250 is not bad as a safe top end.

So, we got some cgminer 4.9.0 edited to take up to 300MHz in 6.25MHz increments. I haven't started tuning the stick for min stable voltage, but I got it to light up at 300MHz off 730mV core, pulling 5.03V 1.47A off the line which gives us a stick-level power of 7.39W for 16.5GH at 0.448W/GH, putting its device-level efficiency prett much on par with an S5. With the fan I had on it, the heatsink was leave-your-fingers-on-it-indefinitely hot.

I'm okay with that.

[EDIT] For a pair of sticks tuned a bit better, I'm seeing 1.38A and 1.42A for an average draw of 1.40A, so 7W or 0.425W/GH

Very nice :)  Is that already a cross-compile for Windows (for phil et al)?  I wonder what the issue might be with 4.9.2 - no problems here (stock or custom), but that's not on a U3 / Compac.

I have not yet tried to do your linked software. I  got  too busy. with some other stuff.

Now that sidehack is doing 300mhz and getting   .44 watts   use a fan and just a bit to hot to touch  5.03volts at 1.47 amps = 7.39 watts


 and I did 250mhz getting .36 watts  use a fan and you can hold them just warm  1.1 amps x 4.73 volts = 5.203 watts


I am thinking 275 may be a good compromise.  along with  6 watts or 6.3 watts per stick


To all please remember these 250, 275, 300 settings will need a very good hub and a fan



In the long run I may do a 5-10 stick fun miner and run at  freq 218.75  they will not need a bridge for power and should cool well with my fans.

If by "just a bit too hot to touch" you mean "leave your fingers on it indefinitely", then sure. Because they were definitely not too hot to touch.

that is exactly what I mean.

I can take the sticks set on freq 250 and hold them with 2 fingers  for 5 or more minutes (allowing the fan to still hit and cool the stick)

I was guessing the 300 freq would be too hot to do this for 1 or 2 minutes

with one stick at 5.2 watts

the other at 7.39  that extra 2 watts is too much for long term holding of the sticks.

is this what you dropped linked to me?
a lot of work you did man!

Novak and I noticed some discrepancies with the hex values I was using and the hex values from S5 code, which probably caused most of the issues. The sticks, when given an invalid hex, jumped up to freakish current draw without being detected.

I'll link an archive with the modified files for cgminer 4.9.0 that we have working here in a bit. I haven't tested every frequency step but I know 287.5MHz and 300MHz work.



[EDIT] http://gekkoscience.com/misc/compac/compac-cgminer.zip (http://gekkoscience.com/misc/compac/compac-cgminer.zip)  contains modified cgminer.c and driver-icarus.c which should compile into a cgminer 4.9.0 which gives 6.25MHz granularity from 100MHz to 300MHz for the U3, and consequently for our Compacs

philipma, what are you doing with 1-2-3 blocks?  ;)

work wonders for cooling.  look like swiss cheese bro.

I've received the second test unit and I'm happy to say it ran all weekend at the same hashrate as the first. I did notice it was running a bit hotter than the first rev and was surprised to see it was running at almost twice the temp when I pulled out the IR gun. I had let it run at sidehack's voltage settings, which I readjusted today, so I'm not sure if the unit was damaged over the weekend.

https://i.imgur.com/cetstZjl.jpg (http://imgur.com/cetstZj)

Cgminer 4.9.2 appears to be resetting both units every few minutes but it hasn't really affected the hashrate. Probably need to adjust the timeout
https://i.imgur.com/kGig85Ml.png (http://imgur.com/kGig85M)

U2 Size comparison
https://i.imgur.com/sLDlj7Rl.jpg (http://imgur.com/sLDlj7R)

Can't touch this...
https://i.imgur.com/sGJu2bFl.jpg (http://imgur.com/sGJu2bF)

Yep. I had 'em running hot for a few days to see if they'd do it, but I didn't have time to reset everything so I pulled and packed them as-is which meant you were probably running it about half a volt higher than it actually needed.

Oh by the way...

http://gekkoscience.com/misc/compac/two_sticks_300MHz.JPG

Got word mine arrived and hurried on over to have a play with it :)

So far most reviews have focused on performance - and I'll be messing about with that later - but thought I'd focus a bit on other bits and pieces.  For those who are relatively new to this thread, please note that this is for basically an engineering sample and is not necessarily the final product.

Updates for 2015/07/08 with feedback from designers (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1086011.msg11817467#msg11817467)

---

https://i.imgur.com/Zddzbkb.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/Zddzbkb.jpg)
Beauty shots as typically used in my StickMiners thread.

Documentation
There is none - well, this and the development thread.  Hopefully something will be set up at http://gekkoscience.com/ in due time :)
On the other hand: if you've ever used a different small Bitcoin miner, then documentation is practically unnecessary.

Plugging it in
As a USB device, the Compac can plug straight into a USB port, but due to its width and power requirements, a suitable USB hub is recommended.
https://i.imgur.com/qgWw3yj.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/qgWw3yj.jpg)

Software
Using cgminer, the Compac is recognized as an Antminer U3 after the default drivers - Silicon Labs CP2102 drivers - are replaced using Zadig.  Only a single device configuation parameter is needed:
The frequencies accepted via cgminer by default are 100 through 250 in these steps:
Further frequency support can be compiled in, and is being worked on by GekkoScience.  Higher frequencies do tend require a higher voltage, which is set using a piece of hardware on the board; the cgminer --au3-volt parameter is effectively ignored.  Higher frequencies also draw more power.

Using bfgminer - well, unfortunately I got no further than a single blip of the board's LED and bfgminer throwing an error, no matter the combination of scan settings and drivers:

bfgminer support can probably be added in the future, but cgminer+zadig works quite well.

Tweaking
The Compac's performance is effectively regulated by three things: its operating frequency, the core voltage, and its temperature.
A higher frequency demands a higher core voltage, uses more power, which makes the chip hotter which may cause increased hardware errors (or worse).
A lower frequency can do with a lower core coltage, uses less power, which lets the chip run cooler.
However, too low a core voltage and the miner will not initialize or cause increased hardware errors.
See the Core voltage adjustment section for a bit more detail.

Dimensions
How big is the Compac?  Overall dimensions are approximately 93mm x 25mm x 14.5mm, and it weighs about 25g.
https://i.imgur.com/XEY1cyR.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/XEY1cyR.jpg)

How does that compare to some other miners?  Bigger than a Block Erupter USB, AntMiner U1/U2 and similar, thinner but longer than a NanoFury 6, but much smaller than a Twin Chip Fury.
https://i.imgur.com/JXfVPhY.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/JXfVPhY.jpg)
( The black bit sticking out the side of the GekkoScience Compac is a female header I soldered on. )

Thickness-wise, it is only marginally thicker than an Antminer U2.
Weight-wise, it is about as heavy as an Antminer U2, a bit less than double that of a Block Erupter USB (14.5g), and a bit less than half that of a Twin Chip Fury (59g).

Heat sink and thermals
The heat sink is essentially the same size as that of the Antminer U2 heat sink, but has 8 fins instead of 7.

The heat sink is bolted down with 3 screws which are pretty easy to remove.  The heat sink sits on top of the Bitmain Technologies BM1384 chip as it's a flip chip design, meaning most of the heat is best evacuated out the top.  The heat sink does overlap the board, something necessitated due to the tall components elsewhere on the board.  An extensive redesign might alleviate that, but from the development thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=995675.0), earlier layouts had issues of their own.  In the end, this is primarily an aesthetic aspect.

The heat sink also sits a bit off the board as it has to connect to the BM1384 chip.  A few surrounding components (capacitors) are actually a tiny bit taller than the chip, so the heat sink has a small metal spacer to make sure that the heat sink has good thermal contact, instead of sitting on top of those capacitors and 1. not contacting the chip and, worse, 2. potentially shorting out those capacitors.

The heat sink is not the final color: it is planned to be green, at least from GekkoScience themselves, so it might look a little more like this:
https://i.imgur.com/eZeNXeJ.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/eZeNXeJ.jpg)
GekkoSciencce: I think the actual green for the heatsinks will be more "evergreen"

Third party sellers - e.g. the German licensor - may opt for a different color, and the sides of the heat sink provide ample branding space, be it a simple Dymo labelmaker sticker, silkscreen printing or (laser) engraving.

Although the BM1384 is a flip chip, the bottom does get warm as well.  Here's a video of a failed initialization: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWeMsrdrR-8
Note that the thermal tape used here has a range of about 25°C - 35°C, so by no means should this be interpreted as it actually getting hot.  Nevertheless, for those wishing to clock higher, an additional heat sink or heat spreader on the bottom may not be a terrible idea, as long no short circuits are created.

The top of the board also stays fairly cool, although the CP2102 USB serial chip and one of the voltage regulators do get relatively warm even without any load.  When under load, the other components warm up a bit as well, but nowhere near as much as was apparent for the Block Erupter USB test.
https://i.imgur.com/PeIkhv9.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/PeIkhv9.jpg)https://i.imgur.com/mCcOSY8.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/mCcOSY8.jpg)

LEDs
When plugged in, the Compac will light the LED bright green.  This LED also stays on when the board is hashing away - unlike the Block Erupter USB and a few other miners.  I have to admit that it is sufficiently bright that I put thermal tape on the LED as well to make it a bit less so.  I would recommend a larger resistor value for the green LED to make it a bit more dim and save (a small) amount on current used.  Of course end-users can also take a sharpie to the LED or cover it up.
https://i.imgur.com/0uNzPmC.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/0uNzPmC.jpg)

When the board is hashing away and finds a share, the LED will appear to blink in a bluish white, courtesy of what at first glance may look like a purple color.
https://i.imgur.com/9KgFX5a.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/9KgFX5a.jpg)

This is actually a combination of both blue and orange/amber (not quite red) LED chips within the package.
https://i.imgur.com/6ADIxU9.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/6ADIxU9.jpg)

The blue and orange/amber channels appear to be soldered together, so if you were wondering if there were further statuses - this does not appear to be the case.  

Core voltage adjustment
The core voltage can be adjusted using the trim potentiometer - in the corner of the board opposite that of the GekkoScience logo - using a small screwdriver.
https://i.imgur.com/aofods2.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/aofods2.jpg)
Clockwise = a lower resistance = lower core voltage.
GekkoScience:  [A] thing changed on the V0.5 is the pot rotation direction; it'll be back to clockwise increases voltage instead of counterclockwise

If the core voltage is too low, the board will fail to initialize - after it has initialized, however, the core voltage can be brought down.  This makes testing a bit more difficult than set-and-forget if trying to eke out the lowest power use for a given hash rate.
So far I've found that a 2 o'clock position always facilitates initialization, while 3 o'clock is a bit more prone to failure.  This is likely to vary as trim potentiometers tend to have a fair bit of tolerance and thus differences between components out of the factory.

One thing to note is that the trimpot of choice does not have detents.  What this means is that when you turn it clockwise too far, you can enter a 'dead zone' on the resistance track, in effect bringing the resistance up to the maximum and with it the core voltage.  If you are not using a USB meter or test equipment to monitor the power draw or core voltage directly, you may thus be led to believe you're lowering the core voltage when in reality it just shot up.  Not an issue for tinkerers, but still something to keep in mind.
https://i.imgur.com/Na9PQjt.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/Na9PQjt.jpg)

Core voltage / testing
The core voltage can be monitored directly using the exposed pads on the bottom of the board - although I would recommend soldering a header, preferably female, to those ports to make it easier to hook up some test leads.  Using the core voltage is, arguably, a better measure for exact testing than trim potentiometer angles or power drawn, as the angles are not quite exact and power draw may fluctuate.
There are 5 pads in total , although I have to admit I haven't quite deciphered one of them as of yet; it seems to short to ground.
https://i.imgur.com/1AfURVu.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/1AfURVu.jpg)
GekkoScience:  The question-mark pad is indeed GND [...] The final version for production has a single GND pad and RESET is broken out on the fifth pad in case someone needs it.

These pads are, as mentioned, exposed and sit close to any surface the Compac is rested on.  If you were to use multiple Compacs in a fairly dense USB hub, you may wish to enure that the heat sink of one can never short out the pads of another, or put some isolating material between them.  For the production version, I would suggest not exposing these pads by default, leaving off any ENIG/gold plating and keeping solder mask on top of them.  This does mean tinkerers will have to expose the pads specifically if they want to, but makes it a bit less prone to accidental shorts.

Engineering / build quality
I'm going to re-stress that this is effectively an engineering sample, so some of the feedback here is likely to not even apply to the production version.  I'm also going to be semi-harsh, because why not.

The heat sink is reasonable quality.  The screw taps go through the entire thickness which is a bit overkill, and burrs are left around the taps.  This shouldn't pose any practical problems as long as very loose burrs are brushed away to prevent any of them falling out and accidentally shorting things.
GekkoScience: They were samples sent from the factory, drilled from stock they already had run out.
The components are all good quality.  No cracked inductors here.
Component and trace layout is decent.  I can't really comment on this as I know GekkoScience faced issues earlier on and some of the layout decisions may have stemmed from alleviating those issues.  There's a few 90° angles that could probably be avoided, but with modern fabrication and them not being part of any high frequency signalling paths, not really an issue.
The PCB itself is of pretty good quality.  It's a 4-layer 1.6mm board, with good alignment of solder mask, copper and drills.
Soldering is decent, given that it was done outside of a professional setup.  There are quite a few solder balls around, but none of them posing an acute problem.  GekkoScience have already mentioned that they're getting a nice SMD soldering station, so this should not be an issue going into production.
GekkoScience:  We have inbound [...] a pick-and-place and an IR oven so placement and soldering should be a fair bit more precise on the end product.
The silkscreen printing is minimalistic - i.e. there's no component indicators let alone values.  I understand that future versions have the pads on the bottom labeled, at least.
GekkoScience: On the final version, the pads on the back are labeled.

Not really applicable to the Compac itself, but: packaging for shipment was also quite good. Antistatic bag, bubble wrap, wedged diagonally in a sturdy box so it wasn't going to shift around despite typical postal treatment.

Sub-verdict for this post
The GekkoScience Compac is a solid StickMiner, certainly has raised a few eyebrows in regard to the performance, and in terms of tinkering allows a fair bit of control for a trade-off of speed, power usage, and acceptable HW error rates.  A few niggles aside - that may or may not be addressed in production version(s) - this is a miner that most users should be able to use almost entirely out of the box.

One might even say that the GekkoScience Compac is the miner that the Antminer U3 should have been.
With the Antminer U3 instead being the Antminer P1, and preferably tested better

Great review, and I agree with your closing statement.  In fact, I posted something almost identical yesterday in the dev thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=995675.msg11810210#msg11810210).

 Steve a Nice review.  you did bring out a shorting issue which is good.

I really would suggest a usb meter  as the " I have fat fingers and bad eyes" method  for pot adjusting. Also I have the older black and the new gold and sidehack flipped the pots on my so I really needed two meters to be sure.

 You are correct that the lead pads may be more accurate, but you need to watch for shorting

.https://i.imgur.com/cetstZjl.jpg (http://imgur.com/cetstZj)


fullsize links

http://imageshack.com/a/img912/9373/dU82Bt.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img911/2746/L5sfbE.jpg

note the fans have a nylon grill to prevent a short sticks are at freq 250 with the fans they are only warm
no sticks made before these did the temps as well as these
newer gold is 85 f
but my probe was a bit too wide for the gold fins I suspect both heatsinks are 90-93 f

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/912/dU82Bt.jpg


older black is 91 f
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/911/L5sfbE.jpg

The black heatsink on Phil's old test (which is a modified V0.3 stick) is actually cut from an AM Cube heatsink with dimensions eyeballed. The gold heatsink on the new test (which is a V0.4 stick) is colored differently but otherwise identical to the final version. They were samples sent from the factory, drilled from stock they already had run out.

On the final version, the pads on the back are labeled. The question-mark pad is indeed GND; I had separate planes for PGND and SGND which were joined elsewhere to avoid ground loop issues from the VCore currents but that actually made things worse. This was fixed on the V0.4. The V0.5 (final version for production) has a single GND pad and RESET is broken out on the fifth pad in case someone needs it.

Another thing changed on the V0.5 is the pot rotation direction; it'll be back to clockwise increases voltage instead of counterclockwise.

Regarding the soldering commentary, I did have a paste stencil for V0.3 which was still accurate for about 90% of the V0.4 board but all the components were hand-placed with a crappy homemade vacuum pencil and heated with a reflow air gun. We have inbound (and held up in customs, grumble grumble) a pick-and-place and an IR oven so placement and soldering should be a fair bit more precise on the end product.

Thanks for that thorough review, TheRealSteve. I think the actual green for the heatsinks will be more "evergreen" and less "whoa that's sexy" than in your sample image, unfortunately. So what do you think? Worth selling?

where can I place an order for some of these?

You can't, yet. I'm waiting for more of the testers to post opinions before opening a sales queue, in case there's something wrong that I hadn't noticed yet but merits tweaking the design.

No problem!  I'll incorporate your comments into my post and provide some references :)  I'm glad the trimpot's direction will be reversed, makes much more sense - at least to me (volume knob analogy and all that).

Evergreen is slightly more bluish and a bit less saturated, I think?  Take your pick: https://i.imgur.com/IMUFYMc.png
( hot pink (https://i.imgur.com/8yFqPNw.png) also looks quite sexy - bit of an attack on the ol' eyeballs though )

I do think it's worth selling.  You already have the chips - as does the other guy - so selling something is a given.  I think it's more a question of proportions.  How many single chip Compacs would sell vs the - relatively - marginal increased cost for an Amita?  How many of those would sell vs a fair bit larger cost for a pod miner?  How many of those would sell vs the type zero you're planning?  Those are questions some of the other guys are probably better equipped to answer as they've been on the sales end - and I'm terribly biased :)  All I know is I have a few potentials (pending final cost and - due to shipping - European licensor terms) lined up, some of which could be changed to Amita depending on how those pan out.

Given that the bi•fury, NF2 and Avalon Nano are still selling (not at a high rate, but selling nevertheless) out of official stores - some at prices quite a bit higher than what you're aiming for - I don't really doubt that they will sell over time, regardless.

steve i really liked looking at your review i am not a technical person when it comes to miners and what not and you made it where a noob would understand them

Just testing notes so far:


0) General information + Hardware Needed
1) The Miner
2) Install
3) Conclusion


0) General Information + Hardware Needed to buy
The GekkoScience Compac is likely the first BM1384 chip project we see from Sidehack and Novak.   But for sure will not be the last.  It is likely a series we will see. The miner it's self has a huge offering of adjustable speed, and with being able to easily push 14-15GH/s out of the miner makes it relevant to today's mining.

• Computer or Raspberry Pi to run the stick miner
• Most likely a powered usb hub to keep heat away
• Active cooling such as a fan to cool down the miner

1) The Miner
The Compac was made with a taller heatsink and profile.  This will work well with most powered hubs.



2) Install
The optimal install will be on a small electricity usage device.  I foresee these being a good miner for raspberry Pi's.  A lot of the testing/reviews have been done on windows boxes.  But chances are once these hit sales low powered linux boxes will take over.

Right now most are using windows machines with Zadig driver - http://zadig.akeo.ie/  With using cgminer - http://zadig.akeo.ie/

I personally suggest putting together a batch file to make it easy to run if you are going to run in windows.  Will feel very familiar to anyone who has used miners with Zadig before. Below is the command with approximate speed each frequency will get you. 

The command line I use is "cgminer.exe -o stratum.mining.eligius.st:3334 -u 1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr -p x --au3-volt 0 --au3-freq 150"

100	5.5
125	6.88
150	8.25
175	9.63
193.75	10.66
196.88	10.83
200	11
206.25	11.34
212.5	11.69
218.75	12.03
225	12.38
237.5	13.06
243.75	13.41
250	13.75

Running at 100 freq I tested on a laptop without USB hub.   At this level its cool to touch.   You have a LOT of adjustment possible.  Once you go up you do need to adjust and use a hub with fan pushing air.


3) Conclusion
This no doubt will take over the single usb miner market.  We will see how far it goes from there, there is a lot of possibility.   We have seen Sidehack and Novak can take a product from a thought to a product ready to sell, this say's a lot. 

One thing that we have not seen in someone really use the Raspberry Pi in combination with this miner.  With the Raspberry Pi's low market point, I just think this will make a lot of sense and eventually will see it vs the windows installs (even the low powered windows installs).

When I can buy one, I'll try it on a Raspberry Pi. I have a very low tolerance for zadig difficulties.

I expect it should be pretty straightforward. Prior to my SP20, I was running a single Pi with 3 of the older R-boxes (the little 4" cubes), and some U2's. I am comfortable enough with Linux, that I expect I can do it.

Zadig was actually pretty easy in my case I used a fresh install of Windows.  And it installed first time without any issues.

But Raspberry Pi is where I see these moving to.   Even with low power windows options, the price point just makes sense to use multiple raspberry pi's if needed vs some of the windows options.

The photo I posted a week and a half ago with nine sticks running 225MHz on my test hub were all running off a Pi (running Minera) powered from the same hub, zero problems.

Cool reviews guys!  TheRealSteve I dig the Pink!

*shudder* :)

---

Didn't get to play much with the Compac today, spent some off time on a train whipping up a preliminary packaging design for the ones I'll gift, though.
https://i.imgur.com/rGAm5iU.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/rGAm5iU.jpg)
Box is a cheap PP box, small foam inlay currently only cut out for the heat sink - might flip that around yet.  The box is intended for playing cards, so I ran with that for a small insert's design.  Needs a few small tweaks.

The insert is, at the same time, a bit of documentation on getting started - also very much in progress.  There's a small table for either individual test results or nominal ones, given they should all perform pretty similar.
https://i.imgur.com/x1e1i1P.png (https://i.imgur.com/x1e1i1P.png)

I've only just done some testing, had to collect my test gear over here, calibrate bits and decide on a set up.
https://i.imgur.com/6dTZucc.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/6dTZucc.jpg)
Probably won't be using the IR gun very much, the probes give nice continuous feedback anyway.

https://i.imgur.com/9AwasEm.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/9AwasEm.jpg)
Multimeter will be used to check the core voltage, the USB meter will do its thing measuring both USB voltage, A, and mAh, while cgminer (though I almost got somewhere with bfgminer - nope.) will be used to track speed and HW errors.  Will probably mine over on BTCDig, as long as they don't get DDoS'd again.

The case is really nice.
I look forward to see more from you in this thread.

Those types of boxes are very common in the rock & mineral community for displaying rock slices and such.  They can be found in large quantity at wholesale prices around the web, but here's an ebay link (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Meteorite-collectors-box-for-presentation-protection-/230667504148?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35b4daca14) for an example.

Bravo! I like that look a lot, I want one even more now for keep sake.

I really like it aswell nicely done.  Maybe on back put history and a little about the miner on the white spot.   

But very well done.   I like it shows the color of the heat sink off.

i cant wait to get a couple of these.. as well as a whole handful of the typezero boards to replace my s3s. (which will stop making money for me around 65 billion difficulty)

So it looks like we've gotten some sort of approval from four of the eight testers. Still waiting to hear anything from MrTeal, CanaryInTheMine, vs3 and ManeBjorn. I'd like to have approval from at least two of them before opening a sales queue. I've gotten word from vs3 and ManeBjorn that sticks have been received, so hopefully something pops up in the next few days. I'm tentatively looking to open sales next Wednesday with at least 600 sticks (more if I hear back from Bitmain about a potential second chip buy). As I've done before on limited-batch opening sales, I'll announce several days beforehand the time (and time zone) and orders will be queued on a first-come first-serve basis.

I'll be focusing on North America, I reckon. I'm supposed to send European customers to the German guy, who has received manufacturing data and tells me he'll be running out a tiny batch to test before doing a full run. Anyone in Europe specifically wanting a GekkoScience-made stick for posterity (like, you know, TheRealSteve) I can probably send a couple, but so's I don't cut in on his turf I'd just as soon stick to the Western Hemisphere.

I'll be watching like a hawk to get a few in the first come first serve basis!

Fun times, will there be a max. order quantity?

"I'll take 600, please..."  ;D

I'll probably put up some simple flat shipping rates and make you pay at the time the order is placed. So if you paid for 600 and were the first money in, I guess technically you'd get 'em all. But know there is no bulk discount so you'd be looking at about 56BTC forked over.

I am going for 20 or so.  I will play with them for quite the while.  Since .31 watts is nice.

most likely run them at freq 200 or 225.  I want the amps under .9 ..

 freq  250 does  need 1.07 to 1.13 amps

my hubs will do .9 amps with no issues.  So freq 200 or 225 is the more practical limit.

Heh, what a dick move that would be to buy all of them.  There's a lot of people that want to play with these!

Mine will go here, and these 4 will go play somewhere else.

http://s29.postimg.org/xug3tti6v/20150709_202938.jpg

While it's obviously your business to do with as you see fit, it would seem that perhaps for the first two weeks after you open your order queue, you put a limit on of say 50 sticks. I expect that are many dozens of folks, myself included that will want to purchase a couple. At some level it would make more sense for you to sell out as a dozen large orders, it would be kinda unfortunate.

Another option would be kinda the opposite of a bulk discount, a bulk premium price. The 1st 20 are at whatever X prices is. The next 20 are at 1.5X, and the next 50 are at 1.75X (or something).

Just some thoughts from a really small time miner that would like not to miss out on a couple.

I like his flat rate pricing.  If someone buy's one it is one price, makes it very easy.  

If he does discounts then people will buy to get the good price point.  And then sell excess miners.  They might sell here or ebay who knows.  But in a way he would be selling against those who bought at a discount, if they try to sell their extras soon after receiving them.  

what about australian based users? we're kinda of helf way between europe and the states.

There's a few problems with most of those boxes, unfortunately.
1. They tend to be the wrong size; see my earlier post for dimensions.  These (EU, I should note - different card size) playing card boxes are just about the right size for presentation, inclusion of a bit of documentation, and optional SD card with all that's needed to be up and running quickly.
2. They tend to be hard plastics, which tends to crack.  PP is a much more forgiving material.  Ideally I would have gone for the Antminer U1/U2 / Mycelium Entropy type box (http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Transparent-gift-box-PP-packaging-Size-9-5-4-5-2-2CM-Rectangular-USB-box/1381001011.html), but it won't fit in those - and an AX seller with the same style, but larger, boxes (http://www.aliexpress.com/item/New-Rectangular-USB-Packaging-PP-packaging-Transparent-gift-box-Size-10-7-2-2CM/1280628871.html) (where it would fit) has not yet responded :)

Similar styles that are longer and less wide are typically advertised as being for pens and watches, so that can also be a good place to start if anybody wanted to box their bunch.

Thanks, both :)  Once finished (things need to be changed for the production version, there isn't any actual information at gekkoscience.com as of yet, etc.), I'd be happy to share the files (Inkscape SVG).

---

Yep, I would humbly request (that is to say, get in queue) for at most two.  I know the German guy can deliver and am happy to send patronage his way :)

---

If only we knew what happened to Barntech  :-\  Though any assembler in AU would still need chips as well anyway.  For finished product, maybe you get your pick between US and Germany? :)

I had a contact in AU reselling PSU hardware for a while, but he got burned pretty badly on a big Garden purchase or something and kinda dropped out of the game. I'l get ahold of him and see if he wants to do something for his continent. Otherwise, per-unit shipping would suck from either US or EU but I got no problem with someone buying from either. I don't care who buys from German Guy, but my limitation is I told him I'd forward EU customers to him (for the most part, it's for their own good) so that's what I'll do. The customer doesn't have to buy from him, but I'll recommend it.

TheRealSteve, that box was pretty sexy.

Slight update on this bit - looks like it may have been due to an issue with pthreads.  Replaced the pthreadGC2.dll with an older version, and getting much better behavior now.  For reference, see the cgminer cross-compile build notes (https://github.com/ckolivas/cgminer/blob/master/windows-build.txt#L302).

---

Thanks! :)

A playing card is ~ 89x60mm, the case I linked is 85x60mm.  Since they are meant for mineral samples they tend to be very resilient.  I have many many and never had one crack.

Thus my mention of EU card size differences; 89mm is not long enough to house the Compac, let alone 85, unless you'd put it in diagonal (certainly an option).

I've had a different experience, but that probably comes down to the exact material.

Ultimately though, both are available for pretty cheap. Maybe if somebody wanted to make a large run the exact numbers begin to matter :)

I've been off the forum for a couple weeks, but just wanted to pop in and say I've received my stick miner as of yesterday and I'll try to catch up on the posts here and give it some testing this weekend.

I missed your posting.  I look forward to your thoughts on it.

Hopefully MrTeal and at least one other can post some news of the sticks. Last I heard from vs3, he was having software trouble I think and hadn't gotten any sticks to light up yet. Once we have at least six favorable reviews, if no serious issues have been found that need to be addressed with a redesign and retest, I'll give a three-day warning on opening sales.

I think what I'll do is limit to 10 sticks per person, except for people who have already gotten ahold of me about bulk purchases. If you haven't done so by the time sales open, you missed your shot because I posted last week that folks wanting more than a few needed to get ahold of me directly.

hack are you going to post in here when you open up sales queue and link over to it ?

Sounds good I am looking forward to my batch.

Nice, glad you put a limit on purchases so we can all get a few!  Really looking forward to playing with these bad boys

I think I posted my note to the other thread, so just to repeat it here too -

Regarding feedback - I've shared my observations and feedback with sidehack already (in PMs, I'll leave it up to him if he wants to repost them here - that's fine by me). Aside from that this thread already covers 99% of the rest, so I'm not sure if there is any benefit of repeating that.

In a nutshell - a very nice design, the kind of solid plug-and-play stuff that you would expect for a USB miner, and of course if anyone wants to overclock it (I guess that includes everyone :) ) - don't forget to use a powered USB hub and cooling.

The only other thing worth mentioning again is cgminer. Version 4.9.0 was the only one that worked consistently for me (on Windows - both 7 and 8 and x86 and x64). For some reason the officially published 4.9.1 and 4.9.2 did not recognize the devices.

As for EU - if that's the same German guy (selling NF2s on bitshopper.de) I would highly vouch for him!

I think --suggest-diff is unique to ckpool.

Well, that's five of eight reported in favorably. Thanks, guys.

I got windows  7 to work  with 4.9.0 and 4.9.2 

  zadig is tricky  right click run in admin and  have every app/program turned off except zadig. 

do a restart of windows 7 and it then lets zadig do the driver swap.   I have to do  each stick (I have 2) with the other unplugged from the hub.

Then start 4.9.2  making sure the amps are boosted a bit too high. Then the gear gets found easy.

Basically I really needed the usb meter to do set up.

When I get my larger order I will post how hard or easy to do 5 sticks and 10 sticks. 

With the exception of running a nine-stick test on Minera with 4.9.1 built in, all the testing and re-coding I've done on them was done with 4.9.0

I should probably check out TheRealSteve's modified Windows build with additional frequency support sometime. Anyone else used that one?

I have had trouble getting the time to sit down and full do the higher freq build in 4.9.0 or 4.9.2

I get busy in the summer and can't get 4 or 5 hours of me time. To do the build.

I can get my two sticks to work on 3 different windows 7 pc's in 4.9 or 4.9.2

and I can get them to work on my mac mini with windows 7 in a vm

Each pc has it own quirks with zadig but they all will do the job.

As a complete aside I ordered a 2tb samsung ssd and I am going to do a new pc build soon using windows 10.

I will set a lot of  time aside for the build including getting a good cgminer for these sticks letting me go to freq 300. 

I can tell freq 300 should be easy peasy with a few fans.

Be sure to read the update if you do (replace a DLL), but it's been as stable as stock cgminer 4.9.2 here (Win8).

So I think I'll give until tomorrow afternoon to let any of the remaining three reviewers lodge complaints. I know all three are busy guys.

If nobody's opposed to the plan given the information so far presented by the five reviewers who have weighed in to some extent, and if none of the remaining three testers deliver any merited criticisms by tomorrow afternoon, I'll probably go ahead and start planning for taking in orders.

Right now for regional resellers I have:
MacEntyre (of bitshopper.de) manufacturing and distributing in Europe

valkir covering sales in Canada
chiguireitor covering sales in Venezuela
AJRGale covering sales in Australia



I'm not sure how the regional guys are going to want to do sales. I figure probably post a fresh thread in Group Buys but it'll be up to them. I'll have instructions on my end ironed out when I post the when-sales-officially-open date, which I'll make sure has at least a three-day lead after the announcement so people can get their various waterfowl aligned.

Looking forward to the announcement!  Hopefully it won't happen this weekend as I will be out of town, and I have a feeling these are going to go quick.

Good luck!

Valkir has the Canada group going on.

I will order one for sure :D

Mikestang just get into a group buy from your country!  ;)

Yep HerbPean You are on the list!  ;D

Why would you need a group buy?  There's no discount on quantity, which is what group buys are used for.

I live in the USA where these are being made, and afaik the sticks will come direct from GekkoScience.

Canada is costly to ship to.  A group buy may save money on shipping.

In US we should not need a group buy.  If there was a discount for quantity then yes we would have one opened up.

But I consider us lucky to be able to deal direct with GekkoScience.  I hope they keep rights to use and don't use a distributor as far as us.

Other countries if they can save on shipping or customs I'm all for group buy's.  It's nice of Sidehack to allow them to keep costs down for other countries.  Shows he cares about customers.

Even with international shipping, unless someone is picking it up directly from the international distributor then they'll be paying for shipping twice: once to get the bulk buy to the distributor (this cost will likely be added to the distributors resale price), and again to have it shipped from the distributor to them.

But if it is cheaper to do it that way then yes, I too am glad sidehack is allowing that distribution model for the folk abroad.

I don't ship overseas like I use to, but I have shipped to valkir 3 times   NJ to Montreal and it is not cheap.

So I think 1 package to him from sidehack then valkir ships inside Canada saves money.

I am going to mine mine for a while maybe until October/November.





English is funny mine mine is correct I think?

I''m curious if you don't mind telling how big are you going with these miners? :)

For a quick reference, I can send 3 stick miners to Canada for $20. Or I can send 25 stick miners to Canada for $45. Or I can probably send 50 to Canada for $60. If it takes $8 to ship an individual's order within Canada, the end customer pays about $10 for the shipping from me to Valkir to himself instead of $20 from me to himself. Which if you're only buying one to three sticks, that's a fair portion of savings. And it also saves me having to fill out a freaking jillion customs forms, which I'm wholeheartedly in favor of.

Some folks (like CrazyGuy, who have well-known outlets already) will probably be reselling within the US, but as long as I still have stock and you know where to find me, anyone can buy straight from the source.

10-12 to run with the node pc no more  just fun mining.  point them at ck's solopool .

Oh yeah, if any of y'all get a PM from a sidehack asking for money for sticks, and the pay address is not the 1BURGERAX address posted all over my threads, it's probably a fake sidehack so kick him in his tiny digital balls. I know at least one fake account exists (specifically this buttface (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=487776)) but who knows who else is out there, just waiting to steal your money.

yeah I have a copycat


https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=443374


annoying to say the least.

Trolls control a decent amount of this board.   They seem to go after things to mess with someone or some product.

What I have tried to do is just not get caught up in battles with  trolls.    I figure if it takes them more time to make a post then I spend on it I win.

But a copycat is taking it to next level, and really annoying for sure.

Nudging things slightly back on topic with some testing.

Here's a GekkoScience Compac hashing away at 16.5Gh/s (300MHz clock):
https://i.imgur.com/jDGyXys.png (https://i.imgur.com/jDGyXys.png)https://i.imgur.com/yjr6VPi.png (https://i.imgur.com/yjr6VPi.png)https://i.imgur.com/WbxMgP6.png (http://youtu.be/m3dyiCjGPXA)[youtube.com]

I made a few adjustments to cgminer to show a bit more detail, give an estimate of Work efficiency, time elapsed since last reset/zero, etc.

That info was then used across several frequencies, measuring all the things, and doing further calculations (getting the effective hash rate and effect J/Gh, for example.)  The test setup has pretty much been unchanged throughout other than adding a power supply later on.  The fan is positioned 10cm above the Compac, so keep that in mind when looking at the temperature deltas; I wouldn't want to leave it passively cooled at the higher frequencies :)
https://i.imgur.com/x7xYagd.png (https://i.imgur.com/x7xYagd.png)https://i.imgur.com/g7VnD6o.png (https://i.imgur.com/g7VnD6o.png)
Note: There's a knee in Vcore in the graph until I test those 'tween frequencies

I did run into a few occasions where the comms chip wasn't doing anything - power draw was pretty much near-zero* - and had to unplug/replug (switch on hub port makes this nice and easy).
* The green LED appears to be using ~3mA.  The blue/orange ones together add another ~6mA.  This affects efficiency quite minimally, but I'm still glad I taped that LED over a bit.

If all went well, and it would initialize and hash normally, potatoscope showed pretty much this (Iusb (dimensionless because what's a current probe? Can derive from graphs above though) at Vcore=~550mV):
https://i.imgur.com/m7mK8d8.png (https://i.imgur.com/m7mK8d8.png)

If instead it failed to initialize, typically due to too low a Vcore, it would show this (Vcore=~550mV - yes, every once in a while it would be okay):
https://i.imgur.com/iSjCg4j.png (https://i.imgur.com/iSjCg4j.png)
In that unclean state, more often than not, I had to power cycle the board to get it up and running again.

The other failure mode is in the upper regions of the clock frequency.  As more current gets drawn, cheap power supplies drop voltage quite a bit, and the power driver on the board would freak out a bit, producing a nice singing inductor coil:
https://i.imgur.com/2kcIskU.png (https://i.imgur.com/2kcIskU.png)https://i.imgur.com/BIB87KJ.png (https://i.imgur.com/BIB87KJ.png)https://i.imgur.com/9QSbTKA.png (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zxcYBbIvZEg)[youtube.com]
Something to add to my little booklet's FAQ when I get around to updating it for the production versions (would love to know what changes are made there other than pot direction).  Solution is to use a better power supply or at least an adjustable one so you can bring Vusb back up.  In fact, on several tests, I had to bring Vusb up above 5V to prevent the singing.

As the clock frequency increases, the range in which Vcore will work and Vusb becomes finnicky narrows quite a bit; that's why the little graphs also become more narrow :)

Suffice to say that I haven't pushed it beyond 0.38J/Gh@16.5Gh/s at this time, and haven't yet tweaked things subtly enough (a multi-turn pot would be nice) to get below the 0.339J/Gh@6.85Gh/s I've gotten, those are pretty impressive stats for a StickMiner :)

Good times.

I think sometime soon I'm going to set up my pair of sticks on ambient cooling here in the office (no fans) and push frequencies higher until one of them explodes, just to see what happens. If these things will ride 300MHz with no airflow in a 75F room would be pretty good to know.

Also, it'll take some software tweaking but I should have a way to drop that current burst on chip init, which especially at higher frequencies can be pretty bad. Unfortunately since there's no good way for cgminer to distinguish between the Compac and U3, we might have to make a Compac-specific cgminer with mods to the base U3 code that could make it not work with the U3 if we want the best performance from our Compac. As it is it works pretty good so I'm not too worried about it, but it's stuff we need to test anyway.

Maybe I've been using too good power supplies, or I overbuilt my rebuilt hub too well (it's got star-connected power leads per port, each with a local 470uF cap), because even with nine sticks initializing at 225MHz (which just the running current dropped my Vin to about 4.7, not sure what init current dropped it to) I had zero chatter on the buck. My pair of 300MHz sticks are running off what's apparently a pretty strong ATX, where the no-load 5V read in as 5.2
The input UVLO on the buck is internally set to 4.4V typical, so if your supply lines drop below that it power-cycles the buck. That could be the problem. If your supply lines drop below 4.4V it's fairly likely that at least one part of your setup sucks - either the hub's power or the hub itself. Or maybe the USB jack terminals are crusty and making a high-impedance connection.

Re: drop/singing - never had it go below 4.4.  Long before that things would drop out, bumping it back up, drop out again, etc.  It's likely a combination of factors (the various meters and boards in between, the generic power brick, etc.) or even this particular Compac :)
Will have to test at some point with a more direct setup, but at some point it's less of a stick miner and more of a PSU+HUB that also happens to mine :)  I'm quite happy with the performance you can still get off of a USB2.0 / 3.0 port, actually.  Hm, and I just noticed I didn't upload the right picture for that - fixed now (just showing 500mA and 900mA cut-off lines).

Yeah, depending on inline meters and such there could be a high-impedance (if only for AC) connection keeping burst current from getting through and dropping the voltage below a usable threshold momentarily. I didn't mean to insult your setup. I also tend to forget that regular people don't always have nice things, or know how to turn crappy things into nice things, so expecting a typical customer to have a USB hub actually capable of maintaining 5V under a 1.5A draw, while seemingly reasonable to tech people, doesn't take into account the reality that most people buy the cheapest crappiest black box capable of meeting immediate needs and don't know how to make it work any better. Which is, in a way, another reason to hold off on building Amitas.

Also, thanks for testing so extensively.


Additionally also, I just rechecked the datasheet. 4.4V is the minimum turn-on, and it's got a lot of hysteresis - the turn-off drop voltage is 3.9 typical.

Ah, not insulted at all - it's just a test setup and in part finding these edge cases is what it was about.  Means if somebody does come back to me with a gifted Compac saying it's making beeping sounds, doesn't seem to do anything, etc., I know what to tell them :)

Thank you for allowing my StickMiners thread to not die just yet - and thanks again to Bitmain for supplying the chips they had.

So, this just happened.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1126705.0


Yep. I put up an official sales thread with instructions and timelines and stuff.

Eeeeeexcellent :)  Looks like you were typing that up while I bumped my thread - added the link.

https://i.imgur.com/HluEGmDt.png (https://i.imgur.com/HluEGmD.png)

If there's anybody else who would like to set up a group buy for their region, feel absolutely free to use any of the pictures from my reviews, and/or this one with the heat sink closer to what it should be (with any luck).

Good stuff right there TheRealSteve. I feel like with all the info the reviewers have provided, and constant updates from sidehack I already have my compac!  :P

Honestly he did a good job.  I really want them to succeed and I think they will.  They built a sold product my review is still running.

I really hope they keep making gear and have a series.  I would LOVE to see a large hashing unit some point in future when chips are able to be secured easier.

So would I. Designing the thing is no problem, but being able to mass-produce is a whole different matter (mostly of financing materials, since we'd have all the tools required).

Well maybe some new 1386 s-7 chips turn up  and you get to make a good 18 chip board this fall.

I'm hoping so. Bitmain said they'd let me know when they have more chips, and I'm really hoping they'll leak some info on new stuff but honestly I don't expect to know anything until after whatever official announcement they might have planned. But be sure we'll have cash in hand for sample chips the day we're able to buy some. It's been over a year since I had a project as fun as the stickminer, and the full-scale stuff could become some real business if it works as well as I hope.

Or even SFards.  I would LOVE to see something from GekkoScience that does not cost the rumored 1200 dollars.   

The great news is GekkoScience has gained a following, and rightfully so.  So i'm hoping this will make companies more willing to let them use chips.  Bitmain letting them get some then being quiet is curious.  I hope bitmain provides them some more chips whether it be S5 or what ever is next.  We have seen Sidehack can do a heck of a lot already with current gen chips.

Sfards gear according to their website  runs best at all LTC or all BTC  not to sure it is efficient enough to bother with.

It's also a 50W BGA chip built mostly for scrypt and I've stated numerous times that I don't want to work with either, and especially not both.

yeah  they are hard to mount j4bbrwocky   has been having troubles with it.

I think they could be a decent 1 chip LTC/scrypt miner since the scrypt side pulls less power.

I also think people may not like that the usb stick only mines scrypt and the btc/sha-256 was disabled.

https://i.imgur.com/5N0tGLa.png
Still hashing away very stable after 1 day, 10 hours (123456 seconds because why not).  Tamb=24.5°C, Tdev=39.0°C.  I still think the USB resets ('X' figure in that screenshot) are software-avoidable, related to it expecting a U3, but I'm not touching that code any time soon :)

Very nice. I couldn't even get my U3 to hash for that long!  Okay, sometimes it would but i'd rather have this bad boy running.

Well, cgminer (my build - shouldn't matter, but just putting that out there) eventually hit a bump (apparently about an hour ago).  Pool sent a new block notification and cgminer exited with "Failed to create restart thread".  Number of USB resets was just under 50 - and none were on the screen before the error - so one potential culprint -ck mentions in a thread doesn't seem like it should apply (though I only count USB resets due to no valid hashes, and not restart_threads() counts, so who knows)

Regardless, not a problem with the stick itself - I've set it to hum along comfortably at 200MHz = 11Gh/s so I can do some other testing at some point :)
Edit: I should point my Block Erupter USBleep (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1011866.msg11608419#msg11608419) at it so next time I'll know it stopped because things stopped beeping..incessantly..and annoyingly.

I had this happen on a ck build of cg 4.9.2 running 1 u2 on solo.ckpool.org

so it is not your build and it is not the sidehack stick.

since I was using a u2  and ck's stock build from his download of 4.9.2

but it is an antminer product to the fault may be with antminer chip.  note the u2 is the 1382 chip

and the sidehack stick is the 1384 chip. 

I am running the sidehacks on mmpool has not hit a block in 2 months

I am running the u2 on solo.ckpool has not hit a block in a few days.

if either pool hits a block and this happens I will post back.

My two sticks running on a customized linux build of 4.9.0 (the only real changes were to U3 frequencies available in the Icarus driver) at 300MHz ran for about eleven days without any known hiccups - until, it looks like internet dropped out at the shop this afternoon so now I gotta go fix it. Grumble grumble.

Luke-Jr has requested a stick, so we'll probably see BFGMiner support. That's good news for y'all what use BFGMiner.

Can anyone please tell me for 5 or 10 of the units would a powered usb hub be ok to power them and what specs would it need to be?

Also any recommendations on a make/model would be greatly appreciated :).

copy/paste it is;

I'll raise you my copy/paste to your copy paste (this could get silly) :)

Thanks very much :).

Yeahhh let's not ;)

Let's instead see if MrTeal and CanaryInTheMine can post with their feedback? :)

I have not been on much with the new baby coming a couple weeks ago but I am getting back into things now.
I am setting up the stick so I can give my feedback as well.

Zadig is a pain in the butt on the Win 7 setup with these that is for sure.  I will let you know how it goes. cgminer is not finding it right yet but I will fiddle with it and get it going.

Nice work Sidehack and Novak. I am glad to see the sales thread as well.

congrats on the baby!

as for zadig  I was able to run it as admin with a right click.  I then had all other programs turned off. this got it to load the correct driver.

I then ran cgminer 4.9   I also got cgminer 4.9.2 to work.

as for getting stick recognized try turning the little pot .

   +       <   the pot has the phillips screw  so do a ¼ turn   If you have the gold model heatsink turn it counter clockwise  

also use freq 150 to start  if it starts and tosses hardly any HW errors turn the pot ⅛ clockwise while running then see if lot of HW's occur.

Thank you.

Very cool on the pot by the way. I am going to have fun with this. 
I think the drivers are being a pain with Zadig. I used admin mode as a matter of course. I will take it all down and make sure nothing is in the background running. Should help.

Thanks again I will post my results once I get this going.

congrats on baby!

I got zadig to run no problems (except one that was my fault; see below) on vista 32 ultimate, win7 starter, win764Pro, and XP (use a special XP version of zadig). its wasnt sidehack stuff it was other USB controlled miners with the same controller chip as sidehacks.

protip: dont replace your HID keyboard driver with zadig :)

aside to above I do full image backups on dedicated miner computers (well all my boxen actually) once everything is confirmed to be working. then anything at all goes into the weeds just restore form latest backup. saved me from myself a few times, as I regularly forget how stupid I can be heh.

see bolding

Yeah I am so guilty of this. ;D

heh.  I chalk it up to alltimers - er Alzheimer's. yeah yeah thats the ticket.. anything to excuse my errors ya know :D

Throwing this back on-topic a bit - have been playing with pushing the Compac a little harder.

Here's a video of it hashing away at ~20.39Gh/s @ 375MHz.  Might want to mute audio, unless you're OZR from our good friends over at the main Russian Bitcoin forum - he seemed to enjoy the fan noise last time, throwing in a little extra in this one :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjA-m1DbRf8

Quick grab of those stats before I hit post (edit 2: updated again, ~20.59Gh/s as early errors have less influence.  Shutting it down at this point to go add some test points to my power injection board):
temp ambient: 26.2°C
temp heatsink: 44.3°C
temp delta: 18.1°C
( Fan center ~9cm above Compac - got bumped a bit trying to get the Block Erupter USBleep to pick up the blue flashes  )

Wow.. I thought the flashy lights were annoying. ;D
But you aren't running a fan for cooling?

Nice. I was just talking to someone about BM1384 performance on the S5, and mentioned that Novak and I had talked about freezing a Compac (maybe oil immersion or something) and seeing how far the chip would go before it crapped itself. I don't know about init bursts (which a better driver will fix, and is on our to-do list in progress) but the buck should be good for steady-state currents well in excess of 400MHz. The inductor is rated for about 17A, which a BM1384 should draw less than 13A at 400MHz/0.8V

Right? :D  I still think they're way too bright, stock, too.. bit of tape & marker I reckon.

Sure I am, check out 17 seconds in :)  One of those arctic breeze USB type things (somewhat quiet, pushing a fair amount of air, easily positioned) from the BEUSB era.

I'm trying to *not* break it - maybe a (bitshopper) production one :)

The limiting factor in that setup, by the way?  The USB cable (+ connectors) that's going between the power insertion board and the little USB test point board used by the meters.
Vusb@start: 5.66V | Vusb@end: 4.76V | Iusb: 2.37A
(5.66 - 4.76) * 2.37 = 2.133W being dissipated in that assembly.  The USB cable gets very slightly warm (5.5°C above ambient)

I should have a shorter, beefier (cheaper shielding, thicker wires) one somewhere, but I'll probably just stick some test points on the power board instead and plug the Compac in direct when I start pushing it further.  Have to re-mount the flipside heat sink first.

---

Edit: Doing just fine at 400MHz:
Starting to get a little warmer though: 50.2°C (27.7°C ambient)

---

Edit: And at 431.25MHz:
Though this did take several start-up attempts.  I had it notched up one higher (437.5 / 24Gh/s), but no luck getting that a second time so far.  Maybe with whatever code changes sidehack mentioned to make it a bit less demanding at init.  Leaving it running as is for a while :)

I received my 5 sets of y cables from this ebay seller

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1Ft-USB-2-0-A-Female-to-2-x-male-Y-Splitter-Extension-Extender-Lead-Cable-Power/221661361513?

I left him this feedback

http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=2012-boutique&ftab=AllFeedback&myworld=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2050430.m2531.l4585

they are working okay see gui for cgminer 4.9.2

https://i.imgur.com/wOTBaRq.jpg


here they are in action freq 250 with a fan
https://i.imgur.com/1zYQ21Z.jpg

I need some better shots of the cables

https://i.imgur.com/AS0CGqF.jpg


this is the best shot of the cable so far

https://i.imgur.com/2cf6Km1.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/akvILaV.jpg

Novak reported to have made some headway with the driver last night, which is good news. We haven't gotten to ramp-up init yet but it shouldn't be too difficult. He's already got a cgminer compiled that takes in Compac-specific flags and reports the hardware as a Compac using a driver-gekko.c include, and I'm okay with that.

Tested the y-cables better  pull the red marked one you still hash but amps jump and volts drop so the red injects power.


https://i.imgur.com/YLcfZYk.jpg


https://i.imgur.com/6da4sLn.jpg
pull the black and you go zombie.

https://i.imgur.com/2dSIVQL.jpg


https://i.imgur.com/52XQU8T.jpg

here it is plugged into the hub

red power booster on the left side

https://i.imgur.com/DxiLvRo.jpg

the packing bag is resealable.

https://i.imgur.com/ncCTlPo.jpg

I got the same hub as you. I need the splitter too?

THere is not enough power with this hub ?

I think it all depends on how hard you want to push an individual stick in terms of frequency. Phil can correct me if I am wrong, but if you want to run at 250 MHz, I think you can do that all day long, probably with multiple sticks and no Y-cables. If you want to push above that, then I think the stick will draw more than a single port can supply safely and reliably. The original USB spec (prior to USB 3.0) was .5A for a single port.

You might want to review the earlier postings and see where it starts to draw more than 1A, for a single stick, as I recall. It's not the total for the hub, but rather the current for the port it's plugged into.

this hub is rated at .9 amps per port.  which for a usb2 hub is good.   this hub will run a lot of sticks at freq 225. at freq 250  not as much.

I never was able to  get a good cgminer  4.9.2 build   with freq at 275 or higher.  I played wtih it but my windows soft ware  skill is so so.

Since the sticks get less efficient at 275 or more I did not bother to really try to load the freq settings  like

256.25
262.50
268.75
275.00

and higher

I think the 19 port hub will do freq 225 or lower

maybe 250

any higher you need a y-hub

I really like the setup you have going there.  With active cooling that is getting some nice speed I'm sure.Very nice setup though thanks for sharing.   

I have a decent amount of old powered hubs (cheap sold all the ankers back when stick mining was new).   But I've been thinking of maybe trying to add more power to one of them.   Have not got to it yet have a list full of projects kinda juggling to decide which one's I do at the moment.

Compac production assembly begins in the morning. Just letting y'all know.

That is great news.  Congratz on your own miner.  It is really neat to see the process you documented.

You have made it further then a lot of companies that post on here with actually coming through with a product in the end.  I personally hope it's a long line to come.

It looks really cool, will you be posting a few pictures here and there of the assembly? ;)

he posted a shot of all the new pcb boards a few days ago.

I've been working on a driver-gekko for cgminer, thus far it's still not a lot different than icarus, though I'm trying to fix it up.  The one thing I do have working is a ramp-up initialization that starts frequency at 100 and steps it up a notch every time it pushes work.  Using that, I've already made one start up at 450 MHz, although it was pulling 2.5A from USB and seemed to be having trouble and resetting every few minutes.  I could maybe make it run better if I played with voltage.

--
novak

With you working on the driver, I have a question. 
Since these chips are usually ran in a chain, and you are talking about icarus options, can you specify commands where, say you have 4 sticks, it will work on a portion of the hash/block/calculation, instead of the whole block? 
You know, like the antminers do currently using commands via cgminer. Example: --bitmain-options 115200:32:8:15

Thoughts?  Would that add to the efficiency?

Currently?  No.  The reason being, the icarus driver is too stupid to drive multiple chips and it needs a setup to divide work out to more than a single (that's one of the things I get to add). 

I don't think it really ups your efficiency either- just having multiple sticks gives you a better chance of getting in a share above the required diff. cgminer already does not send the same work to each miner, that's just how you divide out work from stratum.

--
novak

Slight bump to this thread, given that I've now had two of the production units in hand to play with.  Much of my original review stands, so I'm mostly going to go into some differences and updates with regard to v0.5 production version.

Astute observers have probably noticed I updated the picture in my StickMiners thread.  Those who have been using the picture of the engineering sample with the faked-out green heat sink in their marketing material (asicpuppy/bitcoinware/holybitcoin/others), feel free to replace with clean PNG versions of the actual production unit below (thumbnails have forced black background, full images have proper alpha):

	top	middle	bottom
	https://i.imgur.com/rW8HHVYt.png (https://i.imgur.com/rW8HHVY.png)	https://i.imgur.com/k1eTJlFt.png (https://i.imgur.com/k1eTJlF.png)	https://i.imgur.com/861TYPpt.png (https://i.imgur.com/861TYPp.png)

These ended up actually being a combination of both production units I have, and I'll go into the why later.

First, a nice top view to show some of the changes with annotation:
https://i.imgur.com/8nIHhnw.png (https://i.imgur.com/8nIHhnw.png)
The annotated bits are straight from sidehack, who did a pretty good job of pointing out what was new in v0.5 - and yes, one of the major changes is the pot direction which now, thankfully, increases voltage when turned clockwise.

From left to right: pads on back (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1086011.msg11817467#msg11817467), reset cap out from under heat sink, aligning the TX resistors (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1126705.msg12309955#msg12309955), pot direction change (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1086011.msg11817467#msg11817467) and pot PCB trace snafu (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1126705.msg12309803#msg12309803).

Other than those changes noted by sidehack, there isn't really any difference in terms of the hardware layout.
It appears a different board house or production line was used for the PCB.  The new color is slightly different, it has a much more metallic sheen (more transparent solder mask), the silk screen uses a different process (there was also a silk screen package outline added for the LED, or that simply got lost in the other process), and the via drill is very slightly larger - which, thankfully, didn't cause any issues with things like traces getting mangled.

	silkscreen detail	vias detail
	https://i.imgur.com/wq8MB9f.png	https://i.imgur.com/Vgergv3.png

The back side of the board does indeed have the silkscreen for the test pads which takes away some on-the-spot guesswork, and also adds the GekkoScience logo as silkscreen.  The test pads are still exposed, so if you wanted to add a heat sink on the back*, make sure you're not shorting things out on them.

In terms of assembly, I was happy to see that there wasn't a spray of solder balls on the board, but hopefully things have improved down the line as far as the pick-and-place and need for manual rework goes.  I ordered mine way early in sales ("first!") and my units were probably among the first to be produced as well, so with any luck this is already the case.  The only reason I bother to mention this is because of things like this:
https://i.imgur.com/Zi4wHPp.png
The capacitor on the right does not actually make contact with that pad, the one in the middle apparently does - but I'm not convinced that's due to an actual solder connection, or it just happens to rest on that pad making contact.  This is alongside some general crustiness of flux and a few gnarly joints from apparent rework.  This is why I ended up combining the best of both units for the StickMiners thread picture.

The heat sink is the new green color which does look quite nice even though I had gotten used to the nice golden one.  They're still tapped all the way through, but that's okay.  The screws used were changed as well, from pan to countersunk, shaving off about 0.5mm in overall height; more could be gained if the board had actually been drilled countersunk as well, though there's a via (and potential inner layer traces) that would probably nix that unless moved.

In terms of QA, that board with the iffy capacitor soldering does hash away just fine, but d1 shares found refuse to blink the blue+orange LED; the orange LED at least does work when testing it with a DMM, but I haven't yet poked at it further to find out where the issue with the lack of blinkenlights might be.  On the up side, I did mention in my original review that the LEDs are rather bright, which still holds for the production units; with a nonfunctional blink part that's less of a concern and saves a fraction of energy ;)

In terms of software, the production units now have a nice identifier which can be used by GekkoScience's version of cgminer (until pull request submitted and accepted, you will have to use that version), and is used by bfgminer as well; Luke-jr added support for the Compac and helped with the identifier bits.  I had no problems getting the Compac working with either of those popular pieces of mining software, which means a host of third party software (e.g. GUIs) that uses them as a back-end should work with the Compac as well.

With things up and running, I also ran a few more tests with regard to *putting a heat sink on the back (see note above).
https://i.imgur.com/1esZT2y.png (https://i.imgur.com/1esZT2y.png)
On the engineering sample I put a small heat sink that was pulled from a motherboard - with the help of reddit (https://www.reddit.com/r/Whatisthis/comments/3ly77m/logo_found_on_a_heat_sink_pulled_off_an_old/), I was informed this was off a Chaintech (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaintech) board.  You can still get these (http://www.aliexpress.com/item/30-Pieces-lot-37mm-x-37mm-x-6mm-Green-Cooling-Cooler-Heatsinks-Heat-Sink-Aluminum-Heatsink/32449597376.html?spm=2114.01020208.3.46.elcnIN&ws_ab_test=201556_6,201527_2_71_72_73_74_75,0_0), though the little ones for smaller chips are a lot more common (http://www.ebay.com/itm/LOT-OF-40-PCS-Aluminum-VGA-Card-Xbox360-DDR-RAM-Cooler-self-adhesive-Heatsink-/141264980186), so I ran a test with one of those on one of the production units, and without one on the other.

While not terribly exciting, the temperature difference in stagnant air for an upright orientation at 5.5Gh/s@0.60V was 3.7°C, while moving air (small fan ~10cm from the miners) difference was about 1.4°C.  The larger heat sink fares better but as that's on the engineering sample, can't fairly compare the two.
Similarly boring was checking the ideal orientation and fan position - in the good tradition of "I could've told you that much!"-research: laying flat on their back with the fan blowing parallel to the fins gave the lowest temperature increase from ambient, with upside down and the fan blowing face-on to the heat sink being the worst.  I know, shocker.

Both the engineering sample and one of the production units have been running pretty much non-stop since September 21st at the Compac solo mining club (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1177508) and Nexious (if you have a minute, throw him some thoughts) (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1195039) respectively without a single hardware error.

So my original conclusion also stands and I hope to see more from GekkoScience in the future, which I undoubtedly will as long as they can get chips :)

Nothing leaves my bench without the LED flashing properly on shares. I'd suggest checking on the connection state of the small diode inbetween the SOT23 transistors to the left of the LED. That circuit basically acts as a timed pulse generator triggered by the RX to kick on the flash, and if the diode for some reason lost contact you'll get green only.

That diode is one of the hardest parts for the machine to place correctly because it's such a friggin' small package, smaller even than the 0603. It's the littles thing on the board.

The bulk of rework-requirement issues is, I'm fairly certain, due to the solderpaste we used. It got lost in shipping and arrived a few days late, in August, which meant the ice pack it was shipped with to keep the binder from evaporating was mostly a wasted effort and it's pretty dry. Doesn't spread evenly, has no tack, and by the time parts are placed it's basically cakey dust which means adhesion sucks.

The pick-and-place had a bit of a learning curve and took some calibration and such to get going. It was about four days before I had it figured out enough to place a whole panel of 30 sticks, and about two weeks after that before I had things straightened out enough that it could place a whole panel without requiring manual intervention for some things. I'll be optimizing placement speed on the next batch, and with better solder paste and a bit more calibration things should stay pretty nice.

Issues like the shifted capacitors are actually a result of a bit of rework I have to do on the big FETs, partly because the solder paste doesn't stick to the pins without help. I started watching specifically for that, and on the last four hundred or so sticks have been making sure to manually align the caps and add solder when necessary.

We did use a different board house for the full batch. The V0.4 were from a quick-turn prototype outfit, but the production V0.5 were ordered from the same US fab place we get 750W PSU boards from. I wasn't expecting the vias to be so huge, and that actually adds to some of the soldering problems, especially on the big FETs - some of the pads have vias adjacent or internal which wick away melted solder and can leave the pad fairly dry. I'll have to take this into account on future designs.

well I am 20 for 20 with the green so i am not complaining tomorrow I get new psu in for my stud hubs.  direct replacement and eff goes from 78% to 85%

Gentlemen, meet Max.

http://gekkoscience.com/misc/compac/max_1.JPG

http://gekkoscience.com/misc/compac/max_2.JPG

Max here is a bit of an experiment. We beefed the main buck input caps from 66uF to 300uF, beefed the output from 770uF to 1240uF, the buck controller bypass from 2.2uF to 10uF and extended the voltage range to about 950mV top-end. Everything else is stock - FETs, inductor, primary heatsink and such.

Then we ran it at 500MHz. It didn't do quite as well as hoped, but honestly I think it's the hub's limitations. Output voltage was sagging, and considering the output currents involved the input cap upgrade wasn't really enough to overcome input impedance of the power leads on the hub (which I'd already beefed previously). Average draw was not measured but probably exceeded 4A; instantaneous burst draws could have been in excess of 20A. I don't think the hub was quite up to the challenge. Reported errors were around 6% and work units were in the 330 range.

It did, however, work just fine at 488MHz.

http://s21.postimg.org/ontsg8mlj/cgminer_487.png

28 errors in 17 minutes, average hashrate 26.55GH out of 26.8GH expected. Pretty badass.

If your willing to experiment an play a little more with these. Think you could build that USB connector without the Positive terminal, but instead, hang a molex pigtail from the pad and power it straight off an ATX???

Better still build a molex connector straight onto the PCB then plug in a standard floppy drive cable.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/dpjtcouau6ah0kj/2013-11-02%2012.41.13.jpg?dl=0

Super badass!  Max has pushed the limits of what's possible with a stick miner, who would have thought a few months ago that we'd be seeing almost 30GH from a single stick.

First I want to see how far it'll go with the USB jack in place. I'll build a better USB like TheRealSteve uses for tests. Maybe if I can't push it far enough to melt the ASIC off that I'll do hardwired power.

The inductor will probably start failing before the ASIC does. But I've got a replacement I could scab on rated for at least twice the current.

Thats cool man.    A year and a half ago the chilli was 36 to38 Gh(8chips and a power station)

Yeah, two years ago I paid $400 for a Blade and pushed it to almost 15GH at about 150W. Now I can get that hashrate from a $25 USB stick and 7W power, or almost twice that hashrate from a somewhat-modified $25 stick and about 20W of power. Next time we get bored we'll rig something up to hit and exceed 500MHz but it'll take some rigging both in hardware and software.

By the way, the voltage can be pencil-modded to increase the upperbound by reducing the resistance of the blank resistor above left of the pot.

Nice result with Max, what core Voltage were you running? As an aside if an S5 could be run at 488MHz that would be 2.41TH  :)

Rich

If an S5 could be run at 488MHz it'd be 1.6TH but it'd also draw about 1KW and require about 13.5V PSU

I didn't scope the voltage, but it was nominally set to 890mV when we fired it up. Multimeter reading was more like 850, which I attribute to ripple probably due to input current limitations. I won't know for sure without scoping. When the voltage was turned up higher the performance actually got worse, which is a clue to me that it's an input current limitation because a higher voltage means a higher current draw. Increasing the inductance would decrease ripple current which would decrease the peak current bursts which might make it a bit better, and increasing input capacitance would help average the input current peaks, but decreasing input impedance will help quite a bit as well by allowing the hub to source more current without voltage dropping out.

the 2 hubs were doing 105 watts they dropped to 90 watts. any sticks left maybe i can get some more and fill the hubs up

Ooops on the S5 @ 488MHZ. I had quickly typed the Frequency into my spreadsheet that had an S5 with 3 Hash Boards connected...

Yes a lot of power, but a lot easier to turn Server PSU's up to 13.5V than down to 9.5V  :)


Rich

But it's a lot harder to take 500W out of an S1 heatsink without your boards bursting into flames. I can only estimate on the efficiency but it's about S3 level, so it'd be safer to just run some S3. Not nearly as fun though.

Guys, can you tell me what this wire going around the pot is going to do for me, or is doing it already?

Just curious as I didn't see it on the others.

(*warning* fuzzy pic ahead)

https://i.imgur.com/9tzXRVA.jpg

Ah, so you got that stick.

It was mentioned in a sales thread that there was a slight error in the PCB. There's a tiny hair trace which was hidden under the silkscreen layer so I didn't notice it when checking over the final revisions (seriously, it's ten thousandths of an inch square and underneath the silkscreen) that actually shorts the pot to ground. What this does is tie the regulator output to minimum (550mV) instead of giving you full-range control.

You might notice that every stick has a small nick in the board near the center terminal of the pot. This is me cutting that tiny trace. On about two percent of the sticks, my knife slipped and I nicked both the offending trace and the necessary one to which it was attached. That there is the first stick this happened to, and being early in the batch and the first stick with that issue I was in a bit of a rush to fix it and just routed directly around the cut trace with a wire. Some dozen or so other sticks out of the next few hundred also have nick issues, but I fixed them with a bit more finesse - which is to say, a smaller and much less intrusive wire.

Basically, if you bust that wire off your stick will stop working.

What this does is tie the regulator output to minimum (550mV) instead of giving you full-range control.

 if you bust that wire off your stick will stop working.

I am definitely not going to take the wire off heh. Unless you told me it did something like allow me to overclock that stick higher, etc, but saying it is a no no is good enough for me.

I vaguely remember something along the lines of what you mentioned about "instead of giving you full range control". Could you help me understand a bit more there on why I wouldn't want full range control, if it is the voltage the pot controls?

I will go read back through the Sales thread, just being curious.

You do want full-range control. You very much do want it. At the minimum voltage you'd be lucky if it lit up at 100MHz. They come from us at 610-630mV where they work at 150-200MHz. You can take it up to 800mV where it'll probably work at 425MHz.

Yeah, I figure the placement&soldering will have improved and continue to improve over time :)
I'll try poking at the components here and there when I get around to it to see if I can get the LED blinking away.

---

Review by 'Ken' at one of the reseller shops:

Finally got around to poking at things - that was indeed it, saves some hunting :)

https://i.imgur.com/wmzzQLF.png (https://i.imgur.com/wmzzQLF.png)
Was going for an angle view ( https://i.imgur.com/abKI0X4.png ) but I think the top-down one shows the problem pretty well; the pin wasn't wetted by the solder, probably for the reason you've pointed out before.. paste drying out.

Should be a simple fix with a touch of flux and a heat gun :)

Indeed - That text at the top is the tiny "GekkoScience" silkscreen. The smallest I personally ever work with is 0402, which is plenty tiny and uncomfortable enough, and yet far from the smallest passives found in modern mobile devices.

If I were doing it again I'd buy a larger diode. Actually I might do that anyway since I need to re-buy for the second half of the batch. I haven't tested the new paste yet but honestly it can't be worse than the first batch's stuff.

I am glad that was the problem. By the time 400 sticks passed my bench, there really weren't many issues I couldn't identify on the first try. A lot of signal and power problems with the ASIC I could identify just by how much current it was pulling when I plugged in the stick.

Thanks for the picture.

I have one that just start acting up, it just started hashing slower and slower until it stopped and with the pic I found the same leg had come up just enough. Just to check it, I pushed that leg down and it started hashing again.

Got the stick pulled out right now and going to touch it with the iron just enough to flow the solder (after work, if the tip is small enough to get in there).

Just bought 6 more sticks :D :D, rawr!

The second batch will use a different diode and better paste.

Also, that diode doesn't affect in any way how fast the stick hashes. It's only integral to the operation of the flashing LED and whether it's present and functional or not does not change how well the ASIC communicates or operates. So if that actually fixes a hashing problem I will be confused.

Just plugged it back in and it's hashing away, so I'll leave it alone, "don't fix it if it ain't broke"..

Guess I could have flexed the board or something when plugging and unplugging to check with the usb meter and got something to make contact again or usb port just lost contact or?