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Title: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: newrad on July 20, 2015, 02:09:00 PM The cryptocurrensy community seems to ignore the inevitable threat of a 51% attack. Once the government and major banks see that Bitcoin is impeding on their infrastructure they will come together and execute a 51% attack. IT WILL HAPPEN, and the amount of money it takes for them to execute the attack is peanuts.
My question is, what cryptocurrensy has the necessary code to make it insusceptible to the 51% attack? LTC? NXTCOIN? Let's Discus.. This is important. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: oblivi on July 20, 2015, 02:13:10 PM The cryptocurrensy community seems to ignore the inevitable threat of a 51% attack. Once the government and major banks see that Bitcoin is impeding on their infrastructure they will come together and execute a 51% attack. IT WILL HAPPEN, and the amount of money it takes for them to execute the attack is peanuts. My question is, what cryptocurrensy has the necessary code to make it insusceptible to the 51% attack? LTC? NXTCOIN? Let's Discus.. This is important. "51% attack is the end of the world" Wrong. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0mykANOMGQ Watch and learn. Also pretty poor FUD attempt. No one is interested in your alternative shitcoins. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: foodstamps on July 20, 2015, 02:16:06 PM You signed up just to make this thread?
Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: newrad on July 20, 2015, 02:19:33 PM The cryptocurrensy community seems to ignore the inevitable threat of a 51% attack. Once the government and major banks see that Bitcoin is impeding on their infrastructure they will come together and execute a 51% attack. IT WILL HAPPEN, and the amount of money it takes for them to execute the attack is peanuts. My question is, what cryptocurrensy has the necessary code to make it insusceptible to the 51% attack? LTC? NXTCOIN? Let's Discus.. This is important. "51% attack is the end of the world" Wrong. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0mykANOMGQ Watch and learn. Also pretty poor FUD attempt. No one is interested in your alternative shitcoins. I'm not promoting any particular coin. I'm asking what alt-coin out there isn't vulnerable to the inevitable 51% attack. I'm a full supporter of bitcoin, but I will not ignore the fact there is a hole in the Bitcoin system which makes it imperfect. The attack WILL happen. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: StonerStanley on July 20, 2015, 02:21:33 PM probably digibyte.
bitcoin (core and devs) is nothing compared to coins like dash, digibyte, and most other resistant altcoin. Bitcoin still here because of media and profit by p&d. I think digibyte because the devs seems resistant and they work a lot. Design is also good, the core, ect, ect. Dash is anonymous so not welcome for the public and the government won't let dash win. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: Amph on July 20, 2015, 02:25:02 PM again this crap, the money needed to set up a mining operation that could overwhelm 51% of the network at this stage would be best used with that same equipment to secure the network instead, and earn the normal reward from the mining activity
would be more feasible for chinese to do this, because they are already at roi stage Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: oblivi on July 20, 2015, 02:25:58 PM The cryptocurrensy community seems to ignore the inevitable threat of a 51% attack. Once the government and major banks see that Bitcoin is impeding on their infrastructure they will come together and execute a 51% attack. IT WILL HAPPEN, and the amount of money it takes for them to execute the attack is peanuts. My question is, what cryptocurrensy has the necessary code to make it insusceptible to the 51% attack? LTC? NXTCOIN? Let's Discus.. This is important. "51% attack is the end of the world" Wrong. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0mykANOMGQ Watch and learn. Also pretty poor FUD attempt. No one is interested in your alternative shitcoins. I'm not promoting any particular coin. I'm asking what alt-coin out there isn't vulnerable to the inevitable 51% attack. I'm a full supporter of bitcoin, but I will not ignore the fact there is a hole in the Bitcoin system which makes it imperfect. The attack WILL happen. Dude, watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncPyMUfNyVM You don't understand how Bitcoin and the blockchain works. The amount of computational power you would need to severely disrupt the network at this point is just ridiculous, and they would lose tons of money trying to do so. They would gain way much more money by being good actors. Learn how the consensus algorithm works before you drop your next FUD thread. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: StonerStanley on July 20, 2015, 02:33:49 PM Dude, watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncPyMUfNyVM You don't understand how Bitcoin and the blockchain works. The amount of computational power you would need to severely disrupt the network at this point is just ridiculous, and they would lose tons of money trying to do so. They would gain way much more money by being good actors. Learn how the consensus algorithm works before you drop your next FUD thread. Attack or not, bitcoin will be replaced. Lack of development. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: achow101 on July 20, 2015, 02:39:16 PM I'm not promoting any particular coin. I'm asking what alt-coin out there isn't vulnerable to the inevitable 51% attack. First of all, EVERY COIN is vulnerable to a 51% attack, just like your password and cryptogrpahy are vulnerable to a brute force attack. There is nothing that can prevent one. However, the costs of performing a 51% attack are extremely high and it is difficult to pull off. The community will react and come up with a solution, which might just be get more people to mine thus reducing the attackers percent of the hash rate. Also, a 51% attack is not the end of Bitcoin. All the attacker can do is double spend his own coins, attempt to prevent people from spending, and attempt to prevent miners from mining. I'm a full supporter of bitcoin, but I will not ignore the fact there is a hole in the Bitcoin system which makes it imperfect. The attack WILL happen. Even with 51% of the network, that doesn't mean the attacker suddenly has absolute power and full control. That just means that he has a higher probablility of finidng more blocks and could potentially create a longer valid fork of the block chain. The other 49% of the miners would still be finding about half of the blocks. In order to actually gain control of mining and adversely affect Bitcoin, the attacker would probably need somewhere upwards of 80 - 90% of the hash rate, which is much more expensive than just 51%. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: achow101 on July 20, 2015, 02:41:02 PM Dude, watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncPyMUfNyVM You don't understand how Bitcoin and the blockchain works. The amount of computational power you would need to severely disrupt the network at this point is just ridiculous, and they would lose tons of money trying to do so. They would gain way much more money by being good actors. Learn how the consensus algorithm works before you drop your next FUD thread. Attack or not, bitcoin will be replaced. Lack of development. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: newrad on July 20, 2015, 02:44:59 PM again this crap, the money needed to set up a mining operation that could overwhelm 51% of the network at this stage would be best used with that same equipment to secure the network instead, and earn the normal reward from the mining activity would be more feasible for chinese to do this, because they are already at roi stage You don't understand, the 51% attack is to destroy the infrastructure of bitcoin in order to save the established banking system in the U.S. and worldwide. The cryptocurrensy community seems to ignore the inevitable threat of a 51% attack. Once the government and major banks see that Bitcoin is impeding on their infrastructure they will come together and execute a 51% attack. IT WILL HAPPEN, and the amount of money it takes for them to execute the attack is peanuts. My question is, what cryptocurrensy has the necessary code to make it insusceptible to the 51% attack? LTC? NXTCOIN? Let's Discus.. This is important. "51% attack is the end of the world" Wrong. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0mykANOMGQ Watch and learn. Also pretty poor FUD attempt. No one is interested in your alternative shitcoins. I'm not promoting any particular coin. I'm asking what alt-coin out there isn't vulnerable to the inevitable 51% attack. I'm a full supporter of bitcoin, but I will not ignore the fact there is a hole in the Bitcoin system which makes it imperfect. The attack WILL happen. Dude, watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncPyMUfNyVM You don't understand how Bitcoin and the blockchain works. The amount of computational power you would need to severely disrupt the network at this point is just ridiculous, and they would lose tons of money trying to do so. They would gain way much more money by being good actors. Learn how the consensus algorithm works before you drop your next FUD thread. I understand fully about how Bitcoin and the Blockchain works. My sister knows a guy who's ex-girlfriend's uncle was a friend of Sataoshi Nakomoto's brother. What you are saying is absolutely ridiculous. It doesn't matter how much money will be lost, the point of conducting the 51% attack is to save the banking system the U.S. has developed over the past century. They have no interest in becoming a "good player" and collecting peanuts from bitcoin. The major bankers view bitcoin as a silly computer game, and an annoyance that needs to be destroyed. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: ausbit on July 20, 2015, 02:46:32 PM Dude, watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncPyMUfNyVM You don't understand how Bitcoin and the blockchain works. The amount of computational power you would need to severely disrupt the network at this point is just ridiculous, and they would lose tons of money trying to do so. They would gain way much more money by being good actors. Learn how the consensus algorithm works before you drop your next FUD thread. Attack or not, bitcoin will be replaced. Lack of development. As for what other coins could avoid this attack, I'm not positive but I think all alt coins would be if they are being mined and/or just having transactions pushed though by miners. Edit: My sister knows a guy who's ex-girlfriend's uncle was a friend of Sataoshi Nakomoto's Hahaha, thats funny shit man, what are you smoking? Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: micheline on July 20, 2015, 02:47:05 PM My question is, what cryptocurrensy has the necessary code to make it insusceptible to the 51% attack? LTC? NXTCOIN? Let's Discus.. This is important. Important for whom? Only for those who want to create some altcoin pump. You're free to choose from hundreds of altcoins that - of course - are all somehow better than Bitcoin. Make your choice and enjoy the results... Since I'm not that wise and a little bit lazy, I will just keep my Bitcoin and loose everything. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: Amph on July 20, 2015, 02:52:01 PM again this crap, the money needed to set up a mining operation that could overwhelm 51% of the network at this stage would be best used with that same equipment to secure the network instead, and earn the normal reward from the mining activity would be more feasible for chinese to do this, because they are already at roi stage You don't understand, the 51% attack is to destroy the infrastructure of bitcoin in order to save the established banking system in the U.S. and worldwide. they care more about profit than anything else, and also i doubt that any single governments have the fuds necessare to develop an attack when bitcoin will be full adopted right now you already need something like half billion to do such thing imagines when bitcoin will be reach mainstream status Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: achow101 on July 20, 2015, 02:52:13 PM again this crap, the money needed to set up a mining operation that could overwhelm 51% of the network at this stage would be best used with that same equipment to secure the network instead, and earn the normal reward from the mining activity would be more feasible for chinese to do this, because they are already at roi stage You don't understand, the 51% attack is to destroy the infrastructure of bitcoin in order to save the established banking system in the U.S. and worldwide. Even if the attack was to destroy the infrastructure, as soon as it stops, the network will rebound. Those that have faith in Bitcoin will find a solution. Probably something like a block or small code change that drops the difficulty back to a usable level by the rest of the miners. After a few months, Bitcoin will be back on track. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: newrad on July 20, 2015, 02:54:22 PM I'm not promoting any particular coin. I'm asking what alt-coin out there isn't vulnerable to the inevitable 51% attack. First of all, EVERY COIN is vulnerable to a 51% attack, just like your password and cryptogrpahy are vulnerable to a brute force attack. There is nothing that can prevent one. However, the costs of performing a 51% attack are extremely high and it is difficult to pull off. The community will react and come up with a solution, which might just be get more people to mine thus reducing the attackers percent of the hash rate. Also, a 51% attack is not the end of Bitcoin. All the attacker can do is double spend his own coins, attempt to prevent people from spending, and attempt to prevent miners from mining. I'm a full supporter of bitcoin, but I will not ignore the fact there is a hole in the Bitcoin system which makes it imperfect. The attack WILL happen. Even with 51% of the network, that doesn't mean the attacker suddenly has absolute power and full control. That just means that he has a higher probablility of finidng more blocks and could potentially create a longer valid fork of the block chain. The other 49% of the miners would still be finding about half of the blocks. In order to actually gain control of mining and adversely affect Bitcoin, the attacker would probably need somewhere upwards of 80 - 90% of the hash rate, which is much more expensive than just 51%. Whatever amount that is, it's peanuts. If all the major banks came together (Citigroup, JP Morgan Chase & Co, BoA, HSBC, Wells Fargo), they could have the attack done in a matter of 2 weeks. They could put together enough money to take full control over the blockchain with ease. I wouldn't be surprised if they already have the facilities built and just waiting for the perfect moment to shut Bitcoin down. The U.S. government..... I don't even have to explain. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: achow101 on July 20, 2015, 02:59:34 PM I'm not promoting any particular coin. I'm asking what alt-coin out there isn't vulnerable to the inevitable 51% attack. First of all, EVERY COIN is vulnerable to a 51% attack, just like your password and cryptogrpahy are vulnerable to a brute force attack. There is nothing that can prevent one. However, the costs of performing a 51% attack are extremely high and it is difficult to pull off. The community will react and come up with a solution, which might just be get more people to mine thus reducing the attackers percent of the hash rate. Also, a 51% attack is not the end of Bitcoin. All the attacker can do is double spend his own coins, attempt to prevent people from spending, and attempt to prevent miners from mining. I'm a full supporter of bitcoin, but I will not ignore the fact there is a hole in the Bitcoin system which makes it imperfect. The attack WILL happen. Even with 51% of the network, that doesn't mean the attacker suddenly has absolute power and full control. That just means that he has a higher probablility of finidng more blocks and could potentially create a longer valid fork of the block chain. The other 49% of the miners would still be finding about half of the blocks. In order to actually gain control of mining and adversely affect Bitcoin, the attacker would probably need somewhere upwards of 80 - 90% of the hash rate, which is much more expensive than just 51%. Whatever amount that is, it's peanuts. If all the major banks came together (Citigroup, JP Morgan Chase & Co, BoA, HSBC, Wells Fargo), they could have the attack done in a matter of 2 weeks. They could put together enough money to take full control over the blockchain with ease. I wouldn't be surprised if they already have the facilities built and just waiting for the perfect moment to shut Bitcoin down. The U.S. government..... I don't even have to explain. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: ausbit on July 20, 2015, 03:01:57 PM I'm not promoting any particular coin. I'm asking what alt-coin out there isn't vulnerable to the inevitable 51% attack. First of all, EVERY COIN is vulnerable to a 51% attack, just like your password and cryptogrpahy are vulnerable to a brute force attack. There is nothing that can prevent one. However, the costs of performing a 51% attack are extremely high and it is difficult to pull off. The community will react and come up with a solution, which might just be get more people to mine thus reducing the attackers percent of the hash rate. Also, a 51% attack is not the end of Bitcoin. All the attacker can do is double spend his own coins, attempt to prevent people from spending, and attempt to prevent miners from mining. I'm a full supporter of bitcoin, but I will not ignore the fact there is a hole in the Bitcoin system which makes it imperfect. The attack WILL happen. Even with 51% of the network, that doesn't mean the attacker suddenly has absolute power and full control. That just means that he has a higher probablility of finidng more blocks and could potentially create a longer valid fork of the block chain. The other 49% of the miners would still be finding about half of the blocks. In order to actually gain control of mining and adversely affect Bitcoin, the attacker would probably need somewhere upwards of 80 - 90% of the hash rate, which is much more expensive than just 51%. Whatever amount that is, it's peanuts. If all the major banks came together (Citigroup, JP Morgan Chase & Co, BoA, HSBC, Wells Fargo), they could have the attack done in a matter of 2 weeks. They could put together enough money to take full control over the blockchain with ease. I wouldn't be surprised if they already have the facilities built and just waiting for the perfect moment to shut Bitcoin down. The U.S. government..... I don't even have to explain. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: Velkro on July 20, 2015, 03:04:33 PM Let's Discus.. This is important. You are wrong, 51% is only very short disruption of Bitcoin. Next there are bans to disruptive bitcoin miners and there is no more problem.Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: tsoPANos on July 20, 2015, 03:06:19 PM Although you are trying to spread FUD, it is true that bitcoin has major scalability problems.
The 51% attack is not a big deal compared to blocksize and blockchain size issues though. I think you should stop now spreading FUD and make people turn to crapcoins. If bitcoin dies, crapcoins will follow. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: LiteCoinGuy on July 20, 2015, 03:41:53 PM The cryptocurrensy community seems to ignore the inevitable threat of a 51% attack. Once the government and major banks see that Bitcoin is impeding on their infrastructure they will come together and execute a 51% attack. IT WILL HAPPEN, and the amount of money it takes for them to execute the attack is peanuts. My question is, what cryptocurrensy has the necessary code to make it insusceptible to the 51% attack? LTC? NXTCOIN? Let's Discus.. This is important. Litecoin of course :P but in any case, take a look: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncPyMUfNyVM Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: Andretti83 on July 20, 2015, 04:21:19 PM Digibyte currently better protected from 51% attack.
And in the next hardfork someone will have to control 90% of one mining algorithm and 51% of four other algos to execute "51%" attack. I'm not aware if any other crypto have similar protection (probably is), but digibyte is the first thing that came in to my mind. https://i.imgur.com/BePch65.png Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: Derek492 on July 20, 2015, 06:22:28 PM Mintcoin.
Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: kazuki49 on July 20, 2015, 06:38:36 PM 51% danger is real but the problem with Bitcoin is that its anti-personal mining will make it very hard for the single individual fight against an overwelming attack force unless you buy ASIC.
Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: bit1 on July 20, 2015, 08:05:44 PM A true danger is that banks take ownership cheap BTC.
Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: andyatcrux on July 20, 2015, 08:18:53 PM I understand fully about how Bitcoin and the Blockchain works. My sister knows a guy who's ex-girlfriend's uncle was a friend of Sataoshi Nakomoto's brother. What you are saying is absolutely ridiculous. It doesn't matter how much money will be lost, the point of conducting the 51% attack is to save the banking system the U.S. has developed over the past century. They have no interest in becoming a "good player" and collecting peanuts from bitcoin. The major bankers view bitcoin as a silly computer game, and an annoyance that needs to be destroyed. https://i.imgur.com/Hc9Ypov.gif Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: bit1 on July 20, 2015, 09:32:54 PM I understand fully about how Bitcoin and the Blockchain works. My sister knows a guy who's ex-girlfriend's uncle was a friend of Sataoshi Nakomoto's brother.[/b][/size] What you are saying is absolutely ridiculous. It doesn't matter how much money will be lost, the point of conducting the 51% attack is to save the banking system the U.S. has developed over the past century. They have no interest in becoming a "good player" and collecting peanuts from bitcoin. The major bankers view bitcoin as a silly computer game, and an annoyance that needs to be destroyed. About: I understand fully about how Bitcoin and the Blockchain works. My sister knows a guy who's ex-girlfriend's uncle was a friend of Sataoshi Nakomoto's brother. Sorry, I cant believe that, Many peoples could are interested on to known who is Satoshi Nakamoto, I think not even the family knew his identity. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: Hollingsworth on July 20, 2015, 09:42:51 PM The cryptocurrensy community seems to ignore the inevitable threat of a 51% attack. Once the government and major banks see that Bitcoin is impeding on their infrastructure they will come together and execute a 51% attack. IT WILL HAPPEN, and the amount of money it takes for them to execute the attack is peanuts. My question is, what cryptocurrensy has the necessary code to make it insusceptible to the 51% attack? LTC? NXTCOIN? Let's Discus.. This is important. Litecoin of course :P but in any case, take a look: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncPyMUfNyVM Bitcoin is still robust after its introduction 6 years ago, but has had some recent technical hiccups with Galvin fork and tx/spam issues. Highly improbable that bitcoin would be replaced, but if it were, the standby, on-deck crypto is Litecoin. Coblee, the litecoin dev, has addressed some of bitcoin's shortcomings. I think most folks underestimate the speculative value that this brings to LTC. It could literally jump to hundreds of dollars in value overnight. But it's a longshot to be sure. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: UserVVIP on July 20, 2015, 09:47:01 PM Nobody knows the answer to this question. If and when Bitcoin "dies", it will be due to a well respected and widely adopted alternative. For all we know, this alternative could be right under our noses, but it could also not yet exist.
Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: dreey on July 20, 2015, 09:55:37 PM That Will never gonna hapend !!
Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: Za1n on July 21, 2015, 02:49:52 AM Actually an anti-bitcoin entity could perform a 51% attack without buying too much equipment. If I were a government or other such entity and looking to perform a 51% attack I would look into opening up a bitcoin mining pool. They could just payout higher than average and miners would slowly begin moving over to that pool. If you are making y bitcoin per xxx hashrate and I start a pool offering y+20% bitcoin per xxx hashrate, there is no doubt people would start moving over.
With all the cloud-hashing schemes and other scams out there, most people wouldn't even question how is possible for such high payments. Others would suspect something, but most would not care as long as the payments kept flowing in. So at roughly 144 blocks per day * 25 BTC reward * $300 = $1.08 million per day currently mined. So they offer extra 20% would only cost them ~$200,000 a day. Actually it would be quite a bit less since it would take time to build up a loyal following of miners and they would only need 51%. So only toward the end of the operation would they be paying out in excess of $100,000 a day, They could probably start the operation with just a few thousand a day as people first started to move over. So the question would become how long until they could convince enough people to move over. If only 30-45 days, I think they could pull it off for around $2-3 million. Heck this is low enough amount where even a large company or high net-worth individual might try it on their own... Thoughts? Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: achow101 on July 21, 2015, 03:06:58 AM Actually an anti-bitcoin entity could perform a 51% attack without buying too much equipment. If I were a government or other such entity and looking to perform a 51% attack I would look into opening up a bitcoin mining pool. They could just payout higher than average and miners would slowly begin moving over to that pool. If you are making y bitcoin per xxx hashrate and I start a pool offering y+20% bitcoin per xxx hashrate, there is no doubt people would start moving over. As people begin to migrate over, the community will see that this pool is gaining almost 51% of the hash rate. Then a shitstorm will ensue and that pool will lose those miners. Just look at what happened when Ghash.io almost had 50% of the mining power. They lost a lot of miners and the miners went to other pools to keep any one pool from getting 51%. The anti-bitcoin entity would have to get its own miners and mine by itself to get 51%. Also, if such an attack succeeded and discredited Bitcoin, then all of those Bitcoin they mined are worthless and tons of money was just wasted.With all the cloud-hashing schemes and other scams out there, most people wouldn't even question how is possible for such high payments. Others would suspect something, but most would not care as long as the payments kept flowing in. So at roughly 144 blocks per day * 25 BTC reward * $300 = $1.08 million per day currently mined. So they offer extra 20% would only cost them ~$200,000 a day. Actually it would be quite a bit less since it would take time to build up a loyal following of miners and they would only need 51%. So only toward the end of the operation would they be paying out in excess of $100,000 a day, They could probably start the operation with just a few thousand a day as people first started to move over. So the question would become how long until they could convince enough people to move over. If only 30-45 days, I think they could pull it off for around $2-3 million. Heck this is low enough amount where even a large company or high net-worth individual might try it on their own... Thoughts? It is likely that they wouldn't succeed so hey, the government or whoever just made a lot of money that they can now use and maybe instead of attacking Bitcoin, they can adopt it and use it. 51% is not some magical number that as soon as someone gets 51% of the hash rate, they suddenly have full control over the blockchain. It doesn't work like that. What 51% means is that the miner has a majority of the hash rate, which means they have a higher probability of finding over half of the blocks. In reality, the entity would need 80, 90% or higher in order to successfully pull off such an attack. In the network's current state, that would be prohibitively expensive. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: -Lux- on July 21, 2015, 03:09:34 AM The cryptocurrensy community seems to ignore the inevitable threat of a 51% attack. Once the government and major banks see that Bitcoin is impeding on their infrastructure they will come together and execute a 51% attack. IT WILL HAPPEN, and the amount of money it takes for them to execute the attack is peanuts. ShadowCash check it out! https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=745352.9180My question is, what cryptocurrensy has the necessary code to make it insusceptible to the 51% attack? LTC? NXTCOIN? Let's Discus.. This is important. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: username18333 on July 21, 2015, 03:43:01 AM In reality, the entity would need 80, 90% or higher in order to successfully pull off such an attack. In the network's current state, that would be prohibitively expensive. A flash jump in a fiat currency could enable the (more than less) trivial purchase of a substantial quantity of coins. These coins, alongside others acquired via (perhaps, "illegal") seizure and other, governmental mechanisms, could enable a governmental body to maintain instability in the exchange rate of the coin relative to the given fiat currency. This volatility could motivate a wider userbase of the given fiat currency to forsake any break therewith that said coin might, otherwise, facilitate. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: achow101 on July 21, 2015, 04:42:37 AM In reality, the entity would need 80, 90% or higher in order to successfully pull off such an attack. In the network's current state, that would be prohibitively expensive. A flash jump in a fiat currency could enable the (more than less) trivial purchase of a substantial quantity of coins. These coins, alongside others acquired via (perhaps, "illegal") seizure and other, governmental mechanisms, could enable a governmental body to maintain instability in the exchange rate of the coin relative to the given fiat currency. This volatility could motivate a wider userbase of the given fiat currency to forsake any break therewith that said coin might, otherwise, facilitate. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: sextian on July 21, 2015, 06:52:44 AM Bitcoin is dying because the general public has just lost interest in it.
It is not just the price that has collapsed it is the excitement in the idea of cryptocurrencies. There are a few graphs from google trends here: https://veggiecoin.wordpress.com/why-voin-is-a-better-investment-than-bitcoin. The future of cryptocurrencies (if they have a future) may lie in niche coins: cannabis coins, solar coins and so forth. The bitcoin protocol is not suited to a single monolithic coin. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: g3rszpi on July 21, 2015, 07:20:10 AM Bitcoin is dying because the general public has just lost interest in it. Bitcoin is a $4bn business + cryptos. Also this number is increasing every day. I can ensure you that bitcoin will not die.It is not just the price that has collapsed it is the excitement in the idea of cryptocurrencies. There are a few graphs from google trends here: https://veggiecoin.wordpress.com/why-voin-is-a-better-investment-than-bitcoin. The future of cryptocurrencies (if they have a future) may lie in niche coins: cannabis coins, solar coins and so forth. The bitcoin protocol is not suited to a single monolithic coin. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: HCLivess on July 21, 2015, 12:50:17 PM citicoin?
Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: HeroCat on July 21, 2015, 01:55:11 PM Bitcoin is most popular crypto in the world. No any other crypto can be so popular in nearest time - let say 5 - 10 years ;D
Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: Abiky on July 21, 2015, 02:02:58 PM Bitcoin is most popular crypto in the world. No any other crypto can be so popular in nearest time - let say 5 - 10 years ;D I totally agree with you. Bitcoin is here to stay for long term and hopefully achieve mainstream adoption in the near future. However, I do think that most alt coins would die with the exception of Litecoin and Monero, because of lack of development (just my opinion) :) Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: Nxtblg on July 21, 2015, 02:20:04 PM The hashrate of bitcoin is 360,540,831.57 GH/s s othey would need 180ph/s that is a LOT of hashrate. The longer it takes someone to get the gear for that the higher it will be and governments are slow when it comes to gathering money and okaying for use, especially on something like bitcoin and who would build all the machines? Good point! Props to you for discerning that a 51% attack by a nefarious new-entrant would be a lot harder to pull off than the hash numbers suggest. The key question is, how would this bad-actor get ahold of the ASICs? People do like to gossip...imagine the buzz that would circulate if an ASIC manufacturer went into manufacturing overdrive to produce a whole new slew of ASICs without any improvement in their hash rate. Lots of people in the Bitcoin-miner world would wonder - in digital writing, and in public - what was up. The wonderings would turn into something else if said manufacturer turned away all buyers of 'em with a message, "they're all spoken for." At the very minimum, the pools would make serious inquiries. Could the ASICs be manufactured secretly? An interesting question... Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: talkbitcoin on July 21, 2015, 03:07:26 PM The cryptocurrensy community seems to ignore the inevitable threat of a 51% attack. Once the government and major banks see that Bitcoin is impeding on their infrastructure they will come together and execute a 51% attack. IT WILL HAPPEN, and the amount of money it takes for them to execute the attack is peanuts. My question is, what cryptocurrensy has the necessary code to make it insusceptible to the 51% attack? LTC? NXTCOIN? Let's Discus.. This is important. which altcoin are you suggesting ( promoting ) ? i don't see any altcoin that has the possibility of replacing bitcoin so far... Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: Orangina on July 21, 2015, 03:26:27 PM Biggest value ? It's Bitcoin , most used by people on the world , Bitcoin ! most used by websites that sells goods ,services etc.. that's Bitcoin too . Alternative coins are called alternative because they are copies of Bitcoin and not because you can use them instead of BTC . shitcoins won't repalce bitcoin anytime
Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: BTC2You4Free on July 21, 2015, 04:02:04 PM I don't think that Bitcoin will die anytime soon, but in the (very unlikely) event that it loses adoption and does die, I think that LTC would be a good contender to become the biggest cryptocurrency - it has risen pretty well over the last year or two, to only have a small(ish) drop recently. Another contender would be DOGE - it is holding its value pretty well at the moment (even though each coin isn't worth much), and there is no limit to the amount of coins produced, which could help it do well (not sure why, just a weird theory).
Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: Za1n on July 21, 2015, 08:23:26 PM Actually an anti-bitcoin entity could perform a 51% attack without buying too much equipment. If I were a government or other such entity and looking to perform a 51% attack I would look into opening up a bitcoin mining pool. They could just payout higher than average and miners would slowly begin moving over to that pool. If you are making y bitcoin per xxx hashrate and I start a pool offering y+20% bitcoin per xxx hashrate, there is no doubt people would start moving over. As people begin to migrate over, the community will see that this pool is gaining almost 51% of the hash rate. Then a shitstorm will ensue and that pool will lose those miners. Just look at what happened when Ghash.io almost had 50% of the mining power. They lost a lot of miners and the miners went to other pools to keep any one pool from getting 51%. The anti-bitcoin entity would have to get its own miners and mine by itself to get 51%. Also, if such an attack succeeded and discredited Bitcoin, then all of those Bitcoin they mined are worthless and tons of money was just wasted.With all the cloud-hashing schemes and other scams out there, most people wouldn't even question how is possible for such high payments. Others would suspect something, but most would not care as long as the payments kept flowing in. So at roughly 144 blocks per day * 25 BTC reward * $300 = $1.08 million per day currently mined. So they offer extra 20% would only cost them ~$200,000 a day. Actually it would be quite a bit less since it would take time to build up a loyal following of miners and they would only need 51%. So only toward the end of the operation would they be paying out in excess of $100,000 a day, They could probably start the operation with just a few thousand a day as people first started to move over. So the question would become how long until they could convince enough people to move over. If only 30-45 days, I think they could pull it off for around $2-3 million. Heck this is low enough amount where even a large company or high net-worth individual might try it on their own... Thoughts? It is likely that they wouldn't succeed so hey, the government or whoever just made a lot of money that they can now use and maybe instead of attacking Bitcoin, they can adopt it and use it. 51% is not some magical number that as soon as someone gets 51% of the hash rate, they suddenly have full control over the blockchain. It doesn't work like that. What 51% means is that the miner has a majority of the hash rate, which means they have a higher probability of finding over half of the blocks. In reality, the entity would need 80, 90% or higher in order to successfully pull off such an attack. In the network's current state, that would be prohibitively expensive. Yes, as I pointed out people would catch on of course. Did Ghash.io offer a 20% premium over other pools at that time? My question was, would the 20% premium over other pools cause most people to not care and keep mining at the higher paying pool? If not 20% how about 25%, 50%. At some point I think greed would outweigh the concern for the network. As far as the 51%, they could just as well get the 60% or 80% whatever would need. My main argument was to counter everyone thinking you would need to purchase a bunch of hardware and operate it to pull this off. I was simply suggesting an alternative where a few million dollars could be used against the community by bribing the miners over to a rogue pool. Edit: I see after researching Ghash.io did indeed offer a premium at first. But they later removed it. So the questions still stands: Did the miners leave because of concern for the network or due to the removal of the promotional bonus? I am sure they lost some of each group, but I think the majority was due to the loss of the premium. Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: kevindurant on July 21, 2015, 08:30:53 PM Yay. Another thread that killed (will kill) Bitcoin 3290483rd time.
Dudes just relax it's quite immune to 51% attacks (Unless you're too smart to find a way to do %51 attack more efficient). Title: Re: Bitcoin WILL die. What is the best alternative? Post by: bitcoin revo on July 21, 2015, 09:39:13 PM http://gavintech.blogspot.com.br/2012/05/neutralizing-51-attack.html
The bitcoin network can defeat an attack that would cost the government millions with potentially a few dozen hours of coding, either patching the existing system or starting a new one. |
