Bitcoin Forum

Removed.

for miners they can take profit even below $100 per btc right now, just do the math

they run S5 in every farm already, and i can say that at least 20% or more is S7, but for the sake of putting us in the bad position we take into account s5 only

with a 0.05 in electricity(standard for every big farm) and 600w per S5, you have a mere consumption of $20 per month and a profit of 84 per month

a normal 1% farm have 3-4 tera which is 3463 S5, every single S5 is delivering a profit of around 60(84-20), so even if we fall to 100(1/3 of current price) you have still a profit of $7 per month(84/3-20), which is very bad yes but it's not negative

this with the s5, with the s7 the efficiency is greater(350(earning)-43(consumption) = 307 of net profit per month) so even with 1/3 of the value there is still $74 in profit(350/3-43) per month

The price will never go to zero (i hope).

If the price gets really low, people will start losing money (because their electricity price is higher than the profit) and shut down their mining farm.
When farms start to close, the hashrate will drop, and the difficulty will soon follow
When the difficulty drops, the people that kept on mining will find more blocks with the same hashrate
When they find more blocks, they'll have more coins to sell at the lower price

In the end, there will be an equilibrium... When the price drops significantly, i would expect the total hashrate to drop, and the amount of coins mined by the people that keep on mining will rise.
Nobody can predict the equilibrium, since it depends on: the hardware, the electricity price, the amount of people that mine for fun instead of profit,...

Not to mention many major farms are in VERY CHEAP electric places, and a lot of them run hardware not available to the home miner (Bitfury gear, KnC, SP50 Spondoolies, etc) some of which is probably more efficient than the S7.

Hmm, this is very interesting. I have always thought that $120-$150 is the limit for most of the miners but now you are saying that this is even under $100.

I guess that mining is still very, very profitable business!

Mining profitability has diferent range from home-miners than farm-miners. There is a big difference between farms price of electricity and home electricity.

Mining is still profitable for most (with low electricity rates), need to keep in mind that many do mining just for fun.

In my understanding, if some miners give up due to price drop, there'll be more market for other miners to sell their coins and also the lack of supply will produce a price raise too. It stabilizes itself somewhat.

yeah but only with the s7, and right now there is still some farm out there that need to switch asap or at least before the halving

and anyway i have not counted the initial investment, for the s7 which is bigger

If less people mine, then the difficult will be lowered and will be less expensive to mine

Of course there will be problems during the adaptation phase and the network may be more vulnerable to attacks, but there always be people to mine if there is some demand

Yes but aren't s7 considerably more expensive? This would take much longer for the farms to ROI?

yes but they need it to face the halving, i think many are still waiting with their s5 because there is still time, and they cna cut some investment by selling their s5 later

for every s7 you need to sell 4 s5 to have roughly the same hash, so half of the price of s7 is already payed with old miners

For bitcoin, these guys have to buy the special equipment to mine btcoin. For other coins, people can use GPU.

The cost of Chinese miners powered  hydro elecricity is around $150 per bitcoin. Some of them will not be profitable when the difficulty rises further.

i never think that bitcoin will have end,whatever happen to this currency,i think it not make bitcoin over.
imagine that bitcoin is same with other crypto,even the price is down up to $1,i think bitcoin will never end or lost it users.

What is your source?

I think some at least have even less costs

With the introduction of ASIC. No so many people mine for fun. Maybe 0.001 of hash power is from people for fun.

still profitable with the s7, you see above, i displayed a net profit of about 300 per month, removing 150, will give you a net of another 150

so unless we fall under 150+ it will be profitable for them to continue to mine

S7 is the most efficient miner so far. S5 is less efficient. But if your electricity is $0.05, you are still profitable with difficulty rise 20%.

S7 is the most efficient miners. Avolon A6 is just below it. Haobtc mining has ordered a lot. It will increase the hashing to 20P early next year.

And then the inevitable happens... the price rises .... and mining becomes profitable again.

That's how the cookie crumbles!!!

The difficulty will rise again to make the mine less profitable, then the price rises again. This cycle continues.

The difficulty is predicted to rise 8.5% in 5 days. There are too many new miners coming to the farms.

Price increasing good for bitcoin miners because If price increases according to their mining they get pay by blockchain. Only problem for bitcoin miners is electricity So nowadays big miners switched to Solar power system for mining. Once halving done price of the bitcoin will run like a rocket. And mining also will reduce accordingly.

Big miners will not switch to solar power system for mining, as solar panel only works in day time. I most most mining farms move to use hydro power, which is more reliable.

Every solar setup I've seen (rural industries and boats, mostly, some urban, though typically domestic) has used batteries (12/24v DC) because the owners have anticipated not just night time but cloudy days too.

With the inclusion of battery and no subsidy from government, will be solar panel still be a profitable option for mining?

It depends. Solar would be a (mostly) one-off cost - once the miner has invested in a solar system there are no further major costs. Unless the miner owns the hydro plant (which is possible - I've seen small-scale hydro power generation on farms), they'll be looking at regularly recurring costs. But wasn't this part of the discussion about reliability?