Bitcoin Forum

I have noticed that many started trusting services that doesn't provide it's users with the private keys, the only online service you can trust is blockchain.info wallet, for the fact they provide private keys but even that is still not enough, I hardly use it for small transactions only.

Services such as Xapo is constantly banning users and keeping their bitcoins me included, you can't sue them for that because you agreed to their terms of service which states the following, they also support some countries and not others.

Read the damn https://xapo.com/terms/ and tell me of one thing protecting us and not their asses, you should only agree to that damn thing if they didn't keep private keys, if private keys are stored on your side instead, or they keep it but encrypted so them selves can't see it without your unlock key.

If you choose to use an online wallet for any particular feature such as credit card, please make sure to not use it as a storage for your life savings or big amounts.

Be decentralized, and online wallets should be more transparent about the shit they do in the background, it breaks all the things bitcion was invented for.

About time till bitcoin becomes just another FIAT system of numbers on screen that transfers between people and inside their (accounts).

You have been warned, you can troll, flame and do whatever you want, but at the end of the day you are the one losing their bitcoins.

Be safe.

Well i used coinbase for my online wallet and
i dont use offline wallet as i dont know how to use it.
:P well thanks for the advice though...
but i think using online wallet is just fine as long as
its not so big amounts on it. :P

I use Blockchain and Coinbase and I never had a problem ever since I started using those 2. I downloaded Armory a month ago but I cant get it running so I give up on it and continue using Blockchain and Coinbase. You just need to know how to protect your coins like using 2fa and don't just rely on what the site offers as protection.

That ok for small amount but still, coinbase is the same as paypal, they ban and everything, if you really really need an online wallet use blockchain.info, they don't keep your keys, the version they keep is encrypted and they can't use it, it decrypt on client side for signing with salt from server which makes it impossible for browser extensions to sniff it, it does also have google F2A.

Cons of blockchain.info that you can't restore your password if you forgot it, so make sure to write the 12 words of your seed on a paper and you will be good to go, they can be found on "import/export" tab.

I dont like using blockchain as it has a high transaction fees.
and it takes so long... and also blockchain is always down. thats what i dont like
with it. and yeah.. even in coinbase i can use 2fa and even cp verification in every transaction.
so i think its still safe. but thanks for the information.

If you don't own the keys, you don't own the Bitcoins. That's the truth and it has been told many times but people don't bother about it until and unless they get into a problem where they can't access their funds.

Blockchain.info wallet is OK for small amounts but only if you keep back up of your keys, so if some day the site is off-line for some reason, you'll be able to get hold of your funds by importing your keys in another wallet. Coinbase, Xapo, etc. are not wallets, they're service providers and should be used for buying/selling services and not as wallets.

Also, if you have a Desktop and/or an Android device then you don't need to use on-line wallets period, there are wallets which provide much better protection and are much convenient to use. For ex. Electrum, Mycelium.

You are contradicting yourself OP, your thread title says "Never trust an online wallet..." but you recommend Blockchain.info which is an online wallet, but I agree with you, I would go with Blockchain.info than using Coinbase as I've read in some threads here that their account's was closed by Coinbase.

i use blockchain wallet already since a long time and never had a problem with this wallet and i'm still comfortable using it till now because i never have huge amount of bitcoin so i think it's not necessary to use offline wallet

I am using ledger H.W 1 Hardware Wallet to store my bitcoins securely. Never had a single issue using it. I feel, it is the most safe and secure offline wallet,  I ever use to store my bitcoins.

Blockchain.info has a regular network fees of 0.0001BTC/KB which is rather small and standard, even 0.00002BTC/KB can work. Coinbase pays the TX fees for you and you must follow their terms no matter what.

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Blockchain.info is not 100% secure either. They are a central validation wallet which means that the users need to rely on them to get correct information about the wallet. They have been quite unreliable and accepted transactions which have invalid signatures[1]. This is a huge risk for merchants who regularly accept Bitcoins through their API. Blockchain.info automatically sends the change back to the original address which could risk the privacy of the users. They have been rather incompetent on their security for the past few years[2][3] and I have migrated from their wallet to Multibit. By keeping your wallet backup on their server, you need to trust them to manage it securely and have a strong encryption.

I would recommend going with greenaddress.it. When using 2 of 2 multisig with them, they send a nlocktime script to users which allow the users to redeem them if they are down. With 2 of 3 multi sig, users keep two of the keys and they can't compromise it in any way. No keys are stored on their server, encrypted or not. With them, you can select the Electrum servers/your own node to verify against and there is no risk of sybil attacks.

For the online wallet, greenaddress.it is one of the best. They can still make unauthorized changes though, like every online wallets go for desktop wallet if you don't want this risk.

[1] https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3frn1d/satoshis_coins_have_not_moved_blockchaininfo_is
[2] https://blog.blockchain.com/2014/12/08/blockchain-info-security-disclosure/
[3] http://arstechnica.com/security/2015/05/crypto-flaws-in-blockchain-android-app-sent-bitcoins-to-the-wrong-address/

Never use an address from an exchange, Blockchain.info is enough for everyone to use and it's safe.

I use Bitgo and have never had a single issue. They even offer insurance option for larger amounts. Highly recommended.

No no, I was like if you really are dying to use an online wallet, at least blockchain.info gives you the private keys.
as a personal choice I use multibit for windows and mycelium for android, I would pretty much get ledger and get rid of the hotwallet but for now I will just save in paper wallet.

For usability you need an online wallet. Bringing your pc to every meeting is just wrong. Sure I try to have a lower balance with my blockchain account, but I need it.
Rather then blockchain.info I would not trust an exchange with it.

P.S. If you look at  the security measures blockchain.info takes and some users take, storing it online in most cases is safer then offline.

Totally agree with you, online wallets can be exploited much easier that offline ones. But in some cases, you're forced to hold your funds in online wallets, depending how often you spend. Not talking about enormous amounts although.

I own a Trezor, so I'm pretty "safe" (I want to believe)

Although I agree the are safety issues with online wallets, exchanges, credit cards and Paypal, I've never had a problem and if they really ban you then there must be something bad with your behaviour. These companies are serious and they don't go around robbing people, it would be an scandal.

Well, I once had a problem with a blockchain.info wallet.  I was even using 2FA.  I lost ALL BTC (briefly).  It took some back & forth with them, but I did get my BTC back.  Never explained what happened...

Now I use blockchain.info for small amounts, and for short-term storage for using their SharedCoin service.

blockchain.info's MOBILE wallet has always worked well for me (some 12 transactions).

Eh? Take some time to read the thread?

You don't need a online wallet for portability. You can easily use a HD wallet and use a wallet which have the same BIP32 deviation path as your desktop wallet. Since all the addresses generated are deterministic, you won't lose any coins.

If you look at the security flaws that Blockchain.info made, I rather store it with an exchange than with them Some exchanges actually have a cold storage and some wallet providers even provide insurance for coins.

@Ranochigo, you sounded like one of the competitor's of blockchain (greenaddress.it)!

I am using Multibit since my blockchain wallet was hacked even with 2FA enabled, so I guess they are not very secure with private keys. I am using Multibit since almost 6 months, without any problem ,small and big amount.

How could that happen? I have my blockchain wallet for over 1.5 year and never had any problems. Their security system is very solid, 2FA wallet identifier etc.
In that perspective it is safer then most exchanges?

2FA wont be important, for example if you have a copy of the wallet private keys in your pc or email, they can import it directly without the knowledge of wither u use blockchain or something else, 2FA and password and identifier is a false security feeling.

The real thing is the safest, hard cold paper wallet for big amounts, full core node or at least multibit for pc/mac/linux "small hot wallet", and mycelium on the go, and in all cases keep the 12 words on a paper far away in case your pc or phone burn.

What do you mean by high fees?
GO to the custom tab and you can pick a custom fee. (Even 0 btc)

Also, xapo is basically paypal.
Same concept except with bitcoin.

Coinbase and Xapo being the new Paypal is a scary idea but it seems to match the experiences of some people. Those people probably didn't read the terms and conditions, but even so. It's very easy to trust attractive looking services but I'll stick to controlling my own keys.

They are good for cryto community because they make it easier for new people to crypto, their positive side only, but if the new guy get ripped off by bad support that's also a bad thing to the community.

I hope people learn how to manage their own coins in short time after using xapo, getting used to xapo and other services will make the community dump, they wont care about blockchain, they wont care how it works or what is private keys, they will only care about imaginary numbers going from wallet to wallet.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/30/55/cc/3055ccd19f88271c613bc2f8b424aa22.jpg

I only use online wallet since I don't know how to use offline wallet. Downloaded bitcoin core but I don't have much time to learn how to use it. Well anyways, I don't have much bitcoin to store for now. If I decided to buy some serious amount of bitcoin then I guess it will be the time for me to learn using offline wallet.

I use online wallets for my every day transaction and storing coins because I don't have much knowledge on desktop wallets. In case PC got some issue than don't know how to recover my coins so I depends on online wallets like XAPO, Blockchain and coinbase. I keep my coins in all these three online wallets.

Download multibit, write the 12 words on paper, in the future you can restore it on any pc from that real paper.
and when you decide to learn more about private keys, it's easy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lx9zgZCMqXE

also

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9jOJk30eQs

Just remember you don't have to make it complicated, a private key is important you can have it on a paper, whenever you lose your wallet you can sweep it on any wallet.

It can be imported in QT client, multibit, mycelium, blockchain, a private key can be imported anywhere that key is like your password, the password that xapo is keeping away from you, and thats why they own your bitcoins and you have nothing to do about it if they ban your email.

Private key should be owned by you and not shared with anyone!

I hope you learn to use it, take your time and ask around!

Google Multibit and install it.. send your coins.
Then copy your Wallet.dat to a USB drive etc or copy out your keys etc.

I did not use xapo before.
I used coinbase with small amounts and I did not face any problem with it . I know that I do not have any access to my private keys and I can't import private keys either. But they pay the transaction fees and Their exchange is one of the highest volume.

Blockchain allows users to export their private key and that enables them to load the private key into other desktop clients. At least that is for blockchain wallet. Not sure about the other web wallets.

I only keep some funds in hot wallet because it is hard to insert private key on mobile. Except that i put all of my coin in multiple cold wallet address with printed copy of them in my cupboard.  8)

Basically people are storing the money to others and they will only release the bitcoin to you if you meet their rules, so becoming ourself the bank then we can decided when and where to spend, i heard also in the past about xapo's "issue" if i can call it.

it is always better for you to hold your coins and have complete control over them, so you need to avoid Webwallets. In the event of having to use one pick up the most trusted like tblockchain.info, and don't hold many coins there.

I have a savings cold wallet, and a wallet with coinbase that I never have more than a bitcoin in at all times. I know online wallets are hackable, that's why I use a big company like coinbase, so in the event of a large scale hack, it will be usually their fault. And I believe they'll pay me back.


All the rest of my bitcoin though, do into a cold wallet. This is to keep them safe from hackers and most of all, me. I like to Gamble ;3

Yes, it is good to have our own system to control our money but most of the people now coming to bitcoins may not be having so much technical knowledge on how to use off line wallets and in case of some issues may not be able recover their coins so they prefer to use online wallets. Any online wallet may not be 100% secured but for small amounts should be fine until one familiar with off line wallets.

And it is our job as Bitcoin user to led our newbie friends to the right path ;)
Using Desktop wallet is really easy and i find it more convenient compared to online ones ::)
Heck, why don't we tell them to use hardware or paper one instead, it is more secure than desktop and online ones
Also, in case of a problem we can recover our coins, wallets like electrum has a seed system so in case you destroyed your wallet.dat you can always recover them easily :D

I wonder if online wallet allows user to export their private key, will it still be a concern?

I don't trust xapos wallet because it doesn't allow you to export your private key.

Online wallets that allow you to get your private key is better than having XAPO because at least if the website go down you can sweep your key on any wallet such as MyCelium, Multibit classic, or any decentralized real wallet.

Just remember that even if they allow you to export they might still have copy of your key, always keep it for small amounts, try to get used to wallets where you own the private key, if you print and save it on paper you will be safe, being online doesn't mean always you will be forever.

None of these online wallets are a 100% secure. The best wallet to have is an offline wallet that's not connected to anything.
These online wallets are kinda like a bank, they hold your bitcoins for you. Instead of you holding it in on a offline wallet. I myself use blockchain as well. I've never had a problem with my wallet. I use this for transactions and such.

That's true, best thing to do. Online wallets are never a 100% secure so I wouldn't put everything that I own on there.
You never know what will happen to the site or what could happen.

The whistle blower ? thanx anyways for the info

All those words when really only a few are needed.

If you don't own your private keys you don't own your bitcoins.

Security wise, no. Even if online wallets allow users to have access to their private keys, the online wallets do still have access to the private key. Online services can still potentially steal your Bitcoins. For it to be truly secure, privates keys must never be exposed to the internet, encrypted or not.

Thanks for the warning Chief but still I will use online wallet because I don't want a hassle type of sending and receiving funds. Plus Im using my coins in trading so if I will just let it in a cold storage it will be a hassle one.

I know the risk of having an online wallet that's why all my coins are scattered just to prevent and minimize the possible loss if ever those online wallet you are talking about got wrecked which is highly at low chance for now.

Thanks for the alert. Then we should also be wary of those vanity bitcoin address generating service too since they also have a copy of the private key.

As far as I know, blockchain provides private keys, you could look into them. I've been using blockchain for awhile next to me offline wallet.
I never had an issue with them but there are enough people here on this forum who think other wise.

I believe your reason is reasonable, but in my opinion even the strongest security has a flaw,

but because of that little flaw then its being called not secured is also not right,

but for once again its just my opinion, but then if we don’t store it at online wallet where is the safest place to store ?

But one suggestion that I agree is don’t store too many bitcoin in your account because if its lost nobody can track and return the bitcoin to you

Yeah, you got that right, and that's one of the reasons why I don't use that anymore.  I use the moon faucets pretty frequently and so I have a Xapo wallet, but I transfer the btc as soon as it reaches a few cents worth.  I trust them as far as I can throw them. 

Mycelium is the only wallet I really use and it's been good so far.  I don't claim to be an expert on btc, but you have the private keys with them, right?

Xapo, Coinbase etc are great for fauceting since they pay the TX fees and won't result in a large part of your earnings taken away. However, I would still recommend people to move the BTC out as soon as there is a significant amount.

Mycelium does not have your private keys or does it get transferred out from your phone. They use central validation though.

since my activity on bitcoin transaction not that high i think spending worth of 5cents isn't a problem,but which aspect make it too expensive for you?

Why do you say the transaction fees are too high? You could set the fees manually and get the tx confirmed in the blockchain. If you not rush to send the transaction, you could include lower or zero fees.

You could use bitcoin core,  electrum,  or multibit wallets, which are safer than using online wallets.  The safest place to store bitcion is cold paper wallet, or hardware wallet Trezor.

I think the only time online wallets can be trusted is if they give you the private keys. I've been using blockchain for this exact reason.
Even though I don't hold much in my online wallets, it's still handy to use when I want to make a quick transaction.

Blockchain online wallet does hold your private keys too even they gave you that. Online wallet is good for faster transaction. No harm trusting them. Just don't let all of your coins stored to that kind of wallet. And some wallet facing legal terms like Coinbase.

I do not use online wallet. I only use the core client. It is difficult for the to trust the online wallet providers.

I believe that nothing is secure 100℅ when it comse to technology at all. So if online wallets can not be trusted so desktop wallets are the same as it can be baked with viruses or defected apps

Virus or apps? Maybe true to Windows, not much for Unix/Linux.

This is why I only use online wallets for small transactions and if I want to buy something online. I don't have much on them either.
I prefer to use blockchain, they do give out your private keys to your wallet, even with those private keys, I am still very careful with that wallet and making sure not to hold much bitcoin on them.

anonymousx, i would like to know in which bitcoin wallet have you moved, people are having issue also with another online wallet - coinbase.

Hardware wallets are the solutions if you hold a large number of bitcoin.

blockchain.info most probably. people tend to trust the site since it seem like there is no issues to them since the start.

I kept using blockchain as well as i just have small amount of bitcoin as i kept buying and cashing out for my needs. those that I send to my armoury wallet are the ones I just save but even that I still have less than 0.5 btc to that offline wallet.

I do not use online wallets as that is against the principle of bitcoin, which is decentralization. For others maybe a small amount in online wallet is fine.

This is why you shouldn't place every bitcoin you own in one wallet. Let alone an online wallet.
I'm a bit skeptical when it comes to online wallets, because they are in some good use in some cases. I hold the majority offline though.

Blockchain.info holds your encrypted wallet, and your password decrypts it. Blockchain.info truly is the safest online wallet, because they don't have access to your coins, like coinbase.

I personally user coinbase though, because I gold large sums of bitcoin in either investments or on my cold wallet.

They aren't safe. You are still downloading the scripts for creating addresses and sending transactions. They can easily add a flawed RNG and your private key can be obtained easily(happened before). At the log in page, they can add a malicious script to capture your passwords.

Coinbase controls your private keys which means that they have full access to your coins.

Off course offline wallets are very safe but when it comes to quick transaction of small amounts then it sucks because it is not quick like a online wallet so what I do is I divide and keep my bitcoins in different wallets. I use both online and offline wallets. Online wallets also I have few off them so if one got some issue also I may not lose all my bitcoins. Online wallets are some thing like your keeping your money in your trusted member house so there is always higher risk of losing your coins.

Cold storage is not meant for daily use... You use it for more secure long term storage, so there is not reason to compare the two based on usability on a daily basis. If you want

daily usability, buy a hardware wallet like a Trezor. The same goes for online wallets... you never store large amounts of coins on them... just enough for daily or weekly use.

The moment when you do not have exclusive access to your private key, you relinquish power to someone else... in most cases, someone you do not know.  ???

Online wallets are not for storage, everyone knows that.  They are a temporary place to use to collect and move funds for different reasons.  If you go to bed at night with more than a single BTC in an online wallet, then you are leaving it on the sidewalk for the next passerby.

But not everyone know or even care about it, especially beginner who try to use bitcoin, they want an instant method to have a wallet without research first about the security.

And that's the main problem.
I think over time as bitcoin grows an emphasis on not using online wallets will be more predominant then it is now.

Yes but holding some small amount for daily usage is quite safe. Remember not everybody has a wallet which can travel everywhere.
I for one need acces to my bitcoin when i visit a friend for example.

Online wallets will always be needed for access of your bitcoins on the go. I don't see why online wallets are being downplayed as not being safe. I have used some on my app list for my mobile device and have not had a security issue. Just as long as they the creators of the wallet puts out updates then that should patch any issues from a security stand point.

That's the mean and only reason to use an online wallet. Having your bitcoin accessible anytime, anywhere.
But not all, just a safe amount which enables you to buy the things you need regulary.

I hold my BTC on an offline wallet but I've got a small amount on a Coinbase account which I find more convenient for day-to-day transactions.
Still, I read those stories of people having issues with Coinbase and I start wondering about switching to another online provider.

Coinbase is very good as a hot wallet and for small amounts.
And as long as you do not make transactions with gambling sites, your account will not be locked .
So I recommend you to continue using it specially they are paying the transactions fees which is going higher in the next days

Got it, I'm not really into gambling so I should not be worried about getting my account lock someday for no reason.
Thanks for pointing this.

"Never trust an online wallet" that's like saying never trust a bank which is fine as long as you're okay with keeping all your money under your bed. Personally, I don't have a local wallet, I only use Coinbase for big or small amounts (I've never owned more than 10 BTC but it wouldn't make a difference if I did). It's just that for me the advantages far outweigh the risks. Also, trusted online wallets make zero confirmation systems possible. If you're paying from a local wallet, a zero wait transaction would mean the other party has to trust you, the online wallet on the other hand will be able to immediately confirm that you have the funds and that it's on it's way as soon as you click send.

I trust Coinbase... Why not? There's not a problem with trusting them.

Many have complained about having their coinbase accounts locked. But usually it comes down to them using it for online gambling sites which is not allowed in the united states where coinbase main site is located. That can get there whole company in trouble if the feds know they are enabling their clients to fund accounts for the use of gambling online.

better to save money on the online wallet more secure, but its shortcomings are less flexible, we could only open the wallet in our computer course, different from the online wallet

I personally think that you can use Blockchain.info and that it is perfectly safe. I'm using it for 2 years now and never had an issue.

blockchain is good almost everybody uses this wallet, but I think a third party is not good enough
I prefer to offline wallet

I agree with your warning - it's important for everyone to know what the benefits and risks are with any business they engage in. I don't agree with your heavy skepticism.

Answer a question for me, do you use a bank for your fiat transactions or savings?

If yes, you subscribe to the fiat version of an online wallet. Fiat banks don't but Anonymousx's money into a little envelope (little, because I assume you have higher balances in bitcoin, haha) waiting for you to use it. They put your money with everyone else's and just keep record of what they owe you.

What bitcoin doesn't have is an insurance system to protect people from fraud or a run on the online wallet banks, think of the shit that led to the 1929 crash of the US stock markets.

But I don't think the existence of online wallets goes against all that bitcoin stands for. It's important for multiple options be available for different types of users and different types of uses. Online wallets are great for business transactions. They're also great for those that don't think they can keep the private keys for offline wallets safe, with confidence, forever.

Variety of options, freedom of choice, free markets, all of those uphold the fundamental values of Bitcoin.

The user can transfer the funds from the coinbase wallet to his own local wallet and then transfer to gambling site.

Yeah online wallet you can't trust it that is true.
But for people who is starting you need to trust it.
That is why you need to have more than one wallet like one online en one offline.

I use my online wallet just or my backup if something bad happen.

I do agree that we should not put our money in online wallet. It was too risky, too many accident happen back then.

My main reason is i can't completely control my money if i don't have the keys.

I have a virtual machine where I run multibitHD and electrum (both lite wallets) where I keep the bulk of my coins in my "savings accounts".  It's handy to have both of them because I can just send back and forth between them when I want to upgrade one of them without any risk.  Plus the whole VM can be backed up for safety reasons.  I don't use the VM for any other purpose at all and unless I am doing something with the wallets I leave it off.  Blockchain.info is my "checking account" where I can access coins for easy spending.  Even so if I spend a lot, like to buy a new miner from bitmain or someone, I spend from the VM wallets because my blockchain wallet doesn't hold that much.

Even if you have the keys someone else can control your money if he has too because of any malware or infected apps, there is always a risk.

Yeah online wallet is never to trust it, because your bitcoin is in there system.
Just beter to have in your desktop. But I think some online wallet like BlockChain and Coinbase is to trust.
I don't believe they will just scam there is to much people that use it.

Correct, so it's best to store your coins offline and encrypt your wallet.
I for one make sure to store my key on 2 locations
1 cointains half of the key and on other location i got the other half.

Great, i am saving some money to buy a trezor hardware wallet which i think it's the best one and reasonable price.

Here's my strategies on how I deal with everyday transactions as well as remain safe at the end of the day.

• Never sign up on any online wallet(s), including Blockchain.info. But if you are already using Blockchain.info, then you must download (https://blockchain.info/wallet/chrome-extension) their chrome extension to enhance your security measures.

• Buy any hardware wallet(s) (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=899253.0) with 2FA enabled by default, alongwith a backup seed for recovery.

• If you can't afford to buy hardware wallet(s), create (https://github.com/pointbiz/bitaddress.org/archive/v3.1.0.zip) numerous paper wallets instead and import them on your Core wallet or Blockchain.info's chrome extension app to broadcast each transaction as per the requirement. But this process would be too tedious and you'll probably end up losing track on your funds.

• Always create multi-sig addresses for securing each trades. (Here's a tutorial (https://ledger.groovehq.com/knowledge_base/topics/how-to-create-a-2-of-2-multisignature-account-with-two-ledger-nano-and-coinkite) regarding it if you are having Ledger HW.1 as your preferable hardware wallet.)

I always prefer the second strategy for ultimate security.

I also using both coinbase and xapo, and there is no problem since first time i use it untill now everything is going okay..the main problem i prefer using online wallet is that i have problem to download full blockchain if i use desktop wallet

For me trusted one is blockchain info and also coinbase i never experience bad essue yet using coinbase
And also electrum i use too as my cold storage..
I tried xapo before but in the first time i use it its hard to sign in with sms verification 1 hour before you receive the verification code to login..

I do not use online wallets. I only use the bitcoin local wallet. When I open the wallet software, I am helping the network.

I st ill kept using blockchain wallet just to  keep few coins there. I just recently installed multibithd wallet to my windows laptop when i tried trading on secondstrade for it works trading on them. From then on I tried saving my coins to this multibit wallet jsut to save coins before i lose it to some dice and betting sites.

there is big difference between blockchain.info 's wallet and XAPO 's wallet

if you read OP he is talking about the rules that these sites (like xapo) have that allows them to block you account and money while you don't have access to your private keys to withdraw your bitcoin.

but bc.i wallet (although not safe) it gives you your private keys and is safer than xapo IMO.

Xapo is a service aimed to make Bitcoin more accesible for the casual bitcoiner (especially the very beginners using faucets for example). I agree that there should be an option somewhere to access your private keys but for common persons using another type of wallet is too complicated, that's why Bitcoin adoption rates are horrible and it's facing a very hard time right now.

i totally agree with this. i have never claimed that services like XAPO are useless. surely they are offering much needed services. especially for new people who are not familiar with how things work with bitcoin transactions.
i am simply trying to compare it to other online wallets while pointing out topics aim.

When the time that bitcoin.org remove blockchain.info in their web wallet list recommendations, I seldom use my blockchain.info and start liking XAPO and Coinbase.

There is a reason why they remove it. bitcoin.org is a big major site so if they removed it there's is really a security problem to that wallet.

I do not like xapo and will always do,they work like paypal had control on your bitcoin much better if you have a desktop wallet and online one but not a third party like xapo,it is good only for beginners but if you have learn a lot about bitcoin and wallets you should go for a more secured one

We are talking about online wallet here, of course desktop wallet is the best compare to online wallets.

I just stated that XAPO is better than Blockchain online wallet.

I regularly use online wallet and I used many of them since I do regular transaction almost everyday. I don't like a hassle one. Im not storing any large amount in a certain wallet as a safe move.

I think anyone with a decent head on their shoulders should know this already. Especially if you're into bitcoin for years already.
I personally use an online wallet only for small transactions, for storing an amount I use a desktop wallet.

Agree, desktop or hardware wallet is still the best for ensuring the safety of our coins ;)
But still, i like Xapo for their free fee ::)
Would be pretty useful when you ran out of coins to pay the fee
I know that you can set your Desktop wallet to 0 but that would take lot of time to be confirmed :(

I'm using xapo for almost a year now and they never ban users for no reason. There are many people who keep blaming websites for banning them but if users break their TOS, they have to ban them. I haven't had such issues with any online wallets nor payment processors and most who have had were at the wrong most of the times. There is no guarantee of any online/offline wallet or even banks and at the end it's one's own choice.

There have been many times when users have reported of wallets like multibit crashing and requiring users to download the updates and in such cases transactions and payments get delayed even more. Can't even talk about the fee which is high. For me online wallets have always been safe and the best else all wallets are the same at the end of the day.

What is the point of using Coinbase as a wallet then? It is much better to use your desktop wallet as the only wallet rather than storing them on coinbase. There is no advantage anyway. There is a risk of them closing your account due to your coins being linked to a gambling site.
Online wallets has never and would never be safer than a desktop wallet. SPV clients takes little to no time to download and install and would hence be a good choice. Online wallets can be down for large amount of times due to several factors.

If the wallet crashed then it's probably the fault of the user, wallet won't crash in a random manners and something must causing it ::)
I've been using electrum for months after migrating from Xapo and i can't be more happy than before and it doesn't crash at all
maybe it's because im not doing stupid stuff on it :P

Iam use xapo more than 1year without any problem ::)

I dont prefer offline wallets as they crash very often. I had an app based wallet earlier but that as well used to delay my transactions after which I am using only blockchain. Don't get what issues you had with Xapo but their support has always been the best.

I also had issues with Xapo and hence I shifted to Blockchain which again gave me issues. I couldn't login for 5 days and hence now I am using blocktrail that's much better. I am now using Multibit which works good.

Both xapo and blockchain.info are reliable companies for me.
Yet I chose to have as minimal coins in their wallet. The history has proven that exchanges and online wallet services can't be trusted.

I use Core wallet quite a lot. The 0.11 version. It does not crash. It is very reliable. Much better than previous ones.

Core is a nightmare IMO. Hundreds of gygabytes to download and days of synchronization with the network... if you run a server or smth like that it's OK but for ordinary people it's something unbelieaveable. Imagine if you'll have to wait few days to download transactions history when you had't use your Paypal or bank account for a while...

I already tried xapo wallet before but i never experience to ban. but my problem in xapo i need top wait for a hour before i receive the verifying code to login.. I experience this issue every time i login in xapo that's why i'm stop using it. All my balance transfered to electrum.. And also i use coinbase for online base wallet.. Coinbase is the alternate option if you don't want the service of xapo.. and blockchain is the best option.

you did the best thing moving to a wallet that you control private keys and nobody can ban you and block your funds.
but if you ever experience any trouble receiving message it might be because of your network, you should contact your phone company or the service that is sending you and ask for help. it is easily fixable.

I'm using xapo.com as my online wallet so this thread made me doubt from that site since it has a delay on transferring btc. I'm from Philippines and we can also use coins.ph as our online wallet and it is trusted here. But I would also want to try blockchain.info as I read all of your reviews about it then I can say it is a trusted site for online wallet.

All the post sounded like store only what you can afford to lose,if ever this online wallet close without returning all their coins to their owners they will face a huge global suit,because they work globally

The blockchain is not "Hundreds of gigabytes" and it definitely does not take days to verify fully even on a 5 year old computer. With v0.12 coming very soon, CPU validation speed would be less of an issue with libsecp256k1 being introduced, increasing the efficiency. With pruning and all of these improvements, it would be easier for an average Joe to use Bitcoin Core and not online wallets (at least for desktop).

Although it maybe a good time to buy new laptop, I have ultrabook with SSD and all this GBtes of data is not something I need. And even 12 hours of downloading the blockchain is not something normal user should do.. All MS Office apps set will be downloaded much faster. And more and more people prefer to use mobile apps to send the funds.

IMO this Core soft is kind of like the first online bank software, 10 years ago or more many banks requred you to download special programs - some I remember even asked for floppy disk drive)))

Look at ebanking now, who in hell will ask the user to download some software? It's kind of last century stuff...

Well if that's the case i should transfer all my bitcoin into blockchain from coinbase. yeah maybe some online wallet will be gone or done in the future. But not all my bitcoins stay in one wallet.. So that if it will happen i don't lost all my bitcoin.

because I think blockchain is the most reliable wallet. they will not turn out to be scam

People have lost bitcoins from their blockchain wallet in the past, either due to their own negligence or the company's, so even if they don't scam, the risk of losing coins there are much higher but do what you should do with your money.

i trust ither wallets (e.g. blockchain, coinbase, blocktrail) but i can't trust other wallets except i mention earlier :)

to be honest I have never encountered a problem as long as I use the wallet blockchain. they are a great company, they call that blockchain will grow by microsoft. I think they will not cheat

Only blockchain.info is my online wallet but use coinbase too because it dont have fees.

SPV clients like Electrum serve the same security as long as you have a trusted backing node which you get the information from. SPV clients are much better than online wallets in general. Bitcoin Core 0.12 offers functions with faster validation and a better pruning.

Sure web banking do not require programs. However, the web content can be changed at any time. If a rogue employee have the power, they can potentially capture the login passwords. In contrast, Bitcoin clients can be verified with reviewing and building of the source code. No changes can be made without the user's acknowledgement.

I have coinbase and i have that ever since. I didn't have anything else other than coinbase. So i dont know with you guys..

Thanks, I will check out Electrum and likes, seems to be a good alternative to Blockchain's wallet!

Thanks for your information. What is your suggestion if the online wallet is not so safe? Thanks.

Is not that they are not safe. For most part they are ok. But you have to realize that money deposited and kept in online vaults, wallets and services are no longer under your direct control.
That service can be hacked, your coins robbed. And usually you don't have access to your private key while using these services - I think only (blockchain.info gives you that).

I do not use online wallet. I do not want others to control my money. It is much safer to handle the money myself.

I agree with you OP. But I keep my bitcoins at e-coin.io and have not any private keys  :'( All what I have it is their plastic debit card.

The online wallets are very secure and safe. I know you heard from some people that they are hacked or something. But that is not a problem.
It is very safe. And Bitcoin is also very safe to use it, so that is good. We must make Bitcoin more popular in the future

for me online wallet is secure if you can secure your acc, like IP restriction, 2fa, strong password, blocked TOR IP etc.

you're right it all depends each of us, if we keep secure our wallet i think wouldn't be a problem for our money.
some majority people mistake on online wallet is they give private key to another people , or download something that contains keylogger or the other viruses and the worst thing that happened was if the site get attacked by hacker

But those security measures are useless if ever that website will shut down and decide to run away ;D I will still prefer software or hardware wallets that let you fully control your bitcoins.

Lol, online wallets are very safe and secure. Why are people so negative these days ? is that because the value is not high.
Of course you can be hacked but that happens not often so it is very safe and secure. And Bitcoin must also be more used.

Well I think there are a couple online wallets that are pretty trusted in my eyes, the blockchain is pretty safe if you ask me.
There are also some other wallets but you can also use a paper wallet because that is really secure if you ask me.

I think most of wallett online are still legit as of now but maybe in the future they will close or down.. So its better to use offline wallet if you just holding it for a long time but if you just for temporary its better to use web wallet because there's no fee for every transaction..

Well I think you can trust online wallets but the fact is just do not use them for large(big) amounts of bitcoins because you will get targeted by hackers for sure.
If you got a high number of bitcoins just do them in a cold storage or paper wallet I think that is the safest you can do.
Also do not go talk about that you have a lot of bitcoins big time...

Using online wallet giving me such fast and instant transaction when I needed it.

It's not bad to trust an online wallet if you know to yourself to cover up some risk associated by using it.

it's right, Im use online wallet too.
the easily in acces of wallet make me use it, we can open it everywhere. with any device.

When the online wallet service is insured and it will not be hacked, if it is hacked, and you can get your money back, then I will use it.

I don't have any problems with blockchain.info and coinbase so far.