Bitcoin Forum

Hi, All
I was just wondering with the 1M MOQ of the new Bitfury chip
is there going to be enough interest to form a big group buy for chips to be used for assembly of miners for the small man.
As an example it can be design made by sidehack or somebody else.
Express what you think.
May be there is a window for this may be not
Thank you all for your input here

I am interested in a group buy for Bitfury chips.  I would most likely want around 25,000 chips.  This is all dependent on the price though.

All we need is 1,000 people to each put up $1,000 and we are there.

I'm not opposed to working on a board design. Frankly I was wanting to do that anyway.

If someone trusted like you was in charge of the coins then count me in.

How many chips does $1M buy? We need the answer to that question before anything else can happen.

Im also in to put some BTC in! I trust Sidehack 100%

I'm still waiting to hear if I can get datasheets or put on a list for sample chips. If I can get that, maybe we could put together an A Team for design and another one for the paperwork.

I'd be in for a few hundred bucks,I'm small time soooooooo :(

Need more mention of this in the forum,I had no idea this was even being considered until sidehack mentioned it another thread  ;)

I had kinda forgotten about it, but I tend to keep watch on this board and it was bumped earlier in the day.

Glad to see there is at least some interest.
Let us hope there can be found working solution to make this happen.
I also hope that someone trusted like sidehack will agree to organize a GB

Wait. Hang on. How many people are looking at me to head this up?

From what I see declared interest for 35000 chips so roughly 350 k
May be you should think about starting a tread for the people just to express interest in terms of quantities/USD.
The leaked chip price is 13 USD and I think it will be better with 1M order

It was 1M for a full lot of ~75k chips. That already has the discount ;) Not sure they can realistically maintain this price with current diffs and halving soon. Even if we optimistically get a working miner by April, bit fury will have already added their 16nm hash to the networking by then which is at least another 500 PH. We would be looking at a diff of about 200 billion by then, which translates to a profit per chip per month of about $2 for 3-4 months before halving.

Chip would have to be bought at under $10 per to be profitable. (of course this does not count costs for actually producing a board/miner etc).

I'd like to see more like $7-8 per chip. $13 per is gonna be hard to justify when the diff's where it is, and only going to get worse during dev time and manufacture. Ten months ago $1M would have bought about 8PH worth of BM1384 and now $1M will buy about 8PH of these, so I guess that's probably not too bad, but since then the diff's gone up 2.93 times since then, and the comparative efficiency of the two chips is about 3.4 times given the operating points mentioned. So if the diff goes up another about 18% from where it is now, these chips will be worth less now than the same dollars worth of BM1384 were ten months ago (at those given setpoints). Mind you the efficiency ratio between the given setpoint and bottom clock for the BM1384 is about 1.6 versus about 1.9 for the Bitfury chip, which means BF should have a longer viable lifetime if undervolting is possible. But you also have to consider that 10 months ago the BM1384 had been shipping for over 3 months, rather than negative two months.

so lets look at growth and when would chips get into sidehack's hands

crunch numbers yada yada yada this is a bust at 1,000,000 usd for 75,000 chips.

even if a board was made and ready to populate right now.

lets say current hash growth has been done by bitmaintech to hurt the bitfury chip.

they succeeded.

if I make a bitfury miner that can do .07 watts to .12 watts   per gh  20 chip miner

1th to 2th   70watts to 240 watts  the 20 chips will cost me 260 usd

 controller software etc I can't build a board to fit an s-3 as a drop in fit for 300 usd not with chips costing 260
the assembled  board and the shipping  will be at least 350 usd (certainly more)



So I tell an s-1 or an s-3 owner give me 500 for 1 drop in board   that maxes at 240 watts and 2 th

or mins at 70 watts and 1 th  .

I can mail it to you by the 175 diff mark which is in a few days.   so do an roi on a 500$ board  assuming you have an s-1 or an s-3 to drop it into.

roi at 20% is never
roi  at 15% is never
roi at 10% is  never

drop price to 400
power at 6 cents

roi at 20% is never
roi at 15% is never
roi at 10% is never

so a 2th 240 watt drop in board right now does not roi and I am not counting the ½ ing

even if growth drops to 5% it does not roi.

We are watching a play much like Gordian knot

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordian_Knot

Chinese mining farms at 2 cent power have decided to max hash and take as many of the coins they can before the ½ ing.

A company that builds the s-7 for 200 or 300 usd and makes 1000ph of them can just add them and keep growth rate over 10%  this unties the knot with brute force.

The 14-16 gear  will lose money at 6 cents power and 400 usd for 2th in hand right now

What's the numbers for a 48-chip refit giving you 4TH 240W wall down to 2.6TH 200W wall for, say, $600 all in? That could be possible with ASICs at about $8, which is really about the most I'd want to pay.

I will play with that set up .

If you can build 4 th  at 600 usd

that uses .07 watts  which is 280 watts  it could do roi right near the ½ ing

based on  6 cent power----------
based on 600 usd price for the miner

based on 399 usd a coin.

and based on 7% growth.

the need for gear may be not for filled   as diff is that high.




I believe s-7's built at 300-400 usd mining at 2 cents  are doing the diff jump

Except that's now looking like about a 72-chip miner, so to make it for $600 would require chips under $6 or so.

Also, there's a mistype in my previous post - 4TH 480W not 240W.

Also if I'm thinking right, something 0.3J/GH at 6c power will still turn a profit with $400 coin and 25BTC blocks up to a diff of about 460B, which we could see before the halving. Something 0.3J/GH at 2c power and $400 coin is still turning a profit up to about 700B after the halving? That sucks. I wonder how much gear will be turned off at the halving. Think the diff will drop?

Something 0.12J/GH at 6c power and $400 coin should still be turning a profit at diff about 580B after the halving. By then taking it down to 0.07J/GH keeps it in the black all the way to 1T diff?

I am going to throw this out there and see if it sinks.  I am all in because there are a lot of wheels in motion.  Block Reward Splitting, S7 nearing end of life in production, possibly no new hardware between now and April and the biggest part of it is that the price of BTC is stable at BTC

Look at this from Bitfury's standpoint.  The have a lot of BIG NAME investors looking at them.  They need to be profitable and that will not happen with the numbers above.  How many multi million dollar Immersion Data Centers that require 1.5+ megawatts are Bitfury going to sell if the price remains the same?  Not many, hence I am hedging all my efforts that the powers that be will make sure they are profitable. 

If I had the kind of money and backing that BitFury has it would not be difficult to get people excited about their stuff if the price of Bitcoin just "happens to shoot up" around the end of March.

Just want to say that I would be interested in a chip group buy if sidehack could make a miner with them.
I'm also interested in your hosting service, sidehack.

I'm talking to some guys who could be on the A Team for design, since one person really can't do everything quickly or necessarily as best as it could be. As Phil's pointed out somewhere, with the crazy diff spikes and halving approaching, even a super-efficient miner might not break even unless the chips are not super expensive. The viability of the project depends at least as much on the actual chip price as it does on the ability to raise enough money for MOQ.

Interested in this!

Count me in for a certain number.

punin was talking on some other thread that they will be allocating some chips to sidehack, which is good.

found the reference:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1150844.msg13831108#msg13831108

since price is unknown and it was a bottleneck, i wonder if something got cleared recently.
i also might be interested in chips buy/miners, but in modest numbers-would be nice to know if there will be a threshold of participation.

It's not my job to say anything officially, but someone higher up the food chain has been working and it looks like Bitfury actually likes my project idea so it's looking more possible now that it'll actually happen. Got a lot of design and prototyping to do before anything's for sure, but it looks more possible. So that's pretty exciting. Don't ask me for details on the politics of anything, because I don't know. Like I said, someone higher up the food chain's doing the talking.

Great news!  ;D Can wait to see that. Will for sure be Canadian Supplier with pleasure.  :)

Good news sidehack.

good news as always I have 2 coins set aside for you when needed.

And I would love to run a new club using bitfury gear.

I'm definitely loving this and I'll be in for whatever comes of it.

Thank you Bitfury, sign me up sidehack!

Do you need degree level electronic engineering knowledge to build your own miner?

Also, I would be interested in investing, if there is profit to be made. I've been considering investing £10,000 into a mining farm, but this might seem a better idea.

Thanks

:)
As for every kind of engineering design :civil, mechanical, tooling, electric and electronic  a degree of knowledge is needed a formal degree is just a paper.
Great deal of experience and number of finished  projects in the field is what helps most :)

hm i may have a 1000 to 1100 i can put in .

That's not surprising. Bitfury has always been fond of stickminers from the BPMC Red Fury to the Nano or Twin or Ice. Even the Hex-Fury! I just think it's weird how Bitfury just loves stickminers...

Or more specifically, at the time stickminers were popular Bitfury was selling a good chip to anyone who would pay so a lot of independents made stickminers around them.

There were great times with a lot of projects targeted to DIY and home miners :D

I would do that.. got two s1's coming just for that.  480 watt for 4TH

Hi guys,

what's the status on the boards ?

I would probably like to join, need to find some s5's though :D.

I'm almost done with an Avalon A3218-based proof of concept board layout. Kilo17 is the man with the plan as far as getting chips lined up, and a demonstration of this concept board was one step of that.

will be nice to see it.

I am just hoping that BitFury gets their chip out with enough time for it to make sense.

I would be In on group buy I got at least 2,500 USD maybe more.
I got 3 S3 Antminers laying around. Make drop in boards for old miners that would cut cost.

Im interested, and if you guys need chips produced in volume then I have some connections.
Would have to be 500,000 chips or more.

I am also interested in supporting this project and may potentially be able to pool together some of my resources to come up with some substantial money to back this if we can get some preliminary ideas of cost in place I can handle the close. I am also able to assist in any support / paperwork needed by a team as I have a full staff at my disposal

Looks like a great project, keep up the great work! when will the chips be ready?

Keep up the good work and look forward to seeing a working unit. Pricing will be critical with the ever increasing difficulty that I can't see reverting any time soon.

I'm interested too

i am in too

I have about 600 KW opening this month that I would like to fill with bitfury chips if this is still a viable option.

Did BitFury ship the chips?

I would be able to throw some financial weight behind a project like this in the coming months. $100k+ (most likely quite a bit more)

is there still interest in this project or did it just die

i would be interested to invest

Side hack has a plan for a few BF16 sticks, pods, and also a blade that can be directly mounted onto S1/3/5 frames, and nothing further has happened on this thread so I'd assume nobody else got the chips. IIRC Sidehack was one of the only guys to even get contacted by Bitfury with a realistic pricing for chips, so I think this project is dead.

I'm working, but dev time keeps getting kicked by manufacturing time. I started the 2Pac project to raise funds for BF16 dev but ended up taking over a month longer than planned to get the first batch built. Now all the kinks are worked out and I'm flat flying, but still haven't had time to get BF16 anything working. Way way behind schedule with new product development, but it's getting there. A lot of groundwork is laid, so as soon as we get chips talking the rest will fall into place pretty fast.

But that's not really this thread's project. I don't know what's up.

You can do it mate! I'm sure I have bought stuff based on your designs in the past and genuinely look forward to seeing more.

I'm also interested.

i am also interested.

There is a new BitFury chips, 16nm BF8162. I have contacted and confirmed that 1 chip is 7$ and minimum order amount is 500 000$. 1 chip has 100GH/s power and 0.1J/GH efficiency with conditional cooling.

Those are the same 16nm chips as they introduced originally.
My Hotminer X5 miner is equipped with those, see my review thread (link in my signature).

yeah I've recognised that. I was thinking it was another chip because there was posts about 10$. My information about exact costs and minimum bundle amount may be helpfull to many, so I posted that.
I am also interested in Building miners, but don't have funds yet. PMing me about efficient  and small amount orders would be appreciated.

You can build a miner by buying old Antminer S1, S3 or S5 and then Hotmine X5 or Hotmine X6 upgrade kit from Hotmine.
Hotmine: http://en.hotmine.io/x5-x6-upgrade-kit-new (http://en.hotmine.io/x5-x6-upgrade-kit-new)
With first two (S1, S3) you need to buy separately a BB board (Beaglebone Black) and build a supporting bracket for it.
S5 has BB board.
You can see my review/guide for more instructions.

Russians are going big with Bitfury and up to $100mil investment ($10mil into chip dev), want to challenge chinese and get up to 30% of all mining. 20 megawatts power at 1.3c/kwh.

Do you know what nm will they target?

they use 16nm Bitfury in Sunrise and for next gen altcoin miner (Multiclet) it's 28nm with working prototype (concept validation) at much higher nm.

Did this ever gain any traction? I would be interested in throwing down if it was still a go. I Noticed that no one has commented on this thread in awhile tho

I’d imvest 100

As would I.
Great, that only leaves only 9,998 more (@ $100ea) folks needed just to meet Bitfury's $1M Minimum Order Req. for chips...

Don't see that happening anytime soon

They ask for $2M now  :-\

God, you're killing me.  Been trying to get three sets for quite awhile.  A few folks here have been trying to get a group buy together with trusted sources.  They have a ten set minimum.  Daria does answer all emails given 10 days or so.  I don't want to keep bugging them until they roll out their cart system if that's in the cards....

If you have a source for individual sets - I'd love to hear about it!  I'm sort of surprised at the lack of companies not doing this.  The business is already there and waiting to happen.  (Isn't that the basis of the "disrupter" economy?)

I  too would like to buy up to 4 X5 boards. As you all may have seen, there price jumped from $500 to $650. I wonder why they are selling these at all at this point. Maybe a new chip nearby? Perhaps I missed it in other comments, but what is the shipping time like? I think the minimum buy is 10 boards if I understand correctly. I asked for clarification, but didn't get a reply from Vadim. What is the total demand from this forum so far? Have they answered anyone regarding weather or not they will use escrow?