Title: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: mercistheman on February 19, 2016, 12:28:18 AM Interesting... I added my name to the class action suit.
http://www.pcworld.com/article/3034977/butterfly-labs-cant-afford-the-39m-fine-to-settle-charges-it-duped-bitcoin-hopefuls.html Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: tobacco123 on February 19, 2016, 01:43:47 AM I almost placed an order for a miners from BFL but the "pre-order" put me off...
Maybe they can pay back in bitcoins? Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: -XXIII- on February 19, 2016, 01:53:52 AM Quote Butterfly Labs over-promised on what it could deliver. On Thursday, U.S. regulators said Butterfly Labs and two employees have settled charges accusing them of deceiving thousands of people by keeping payments for bitcoin mining systems that were never delivered. The deal includes a judgment of $38.6 million against Butterfly Labs and its part-owner and vice president of product development, Sonny Vleisides, and a judgment of $136,000 against general manager Darla Drake. The judgments are suspended, however, because of the defendants' "inability to pay," the FTC said. Drake's judgment will be suspended when she turns over the cash value of the bitcoins generated using the company machines. Sorry guys, doesn't look like you're getting anything back... at least for a while. It's almost like, if you're a corporation, the more you steal the more you're able to get away with. Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: nichu on February 19, 2016, 02:18:40 AM this is greed fine i guess ;D , i dont think they are planning to settle the amount ,but made a good rep with this case :)
Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: Velkro on February 19, 2016, 02:39:21 AM Sadly, they won't pay it.
What was lost by people is lost forever :/. Hope u didn't invest there. Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: Gleb Gamow on February 19, 2016, 03:47:15 AM Interesting... I added my name to the class action suit. http://www.pcworld.com/article/3034977/butterfly-labs-cant-afford-the-39m-fine-to-settle-charges-it-duped-bitcoin-hopefuls.html Quote Butterfly was swamped with orders and fielded a ton of complaints from people waiting to receive their hardware, but it continued taking new orders. In late 2013, it took a single downpayment of $1 million for machines. Hashtrade send BFL the $1M via BTC downpayment to a newly created bitcoin wallet address. The funds were then moved to another address. Then moved again to the infamous 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs bitcoin wallet address eventually taken over by the FTC, later to be returned to BFL. It was that address that BitPay, HashTrade and BFL showed the world proof that the transaction was legit, alluding to the address belonging to HashTrade. BitPay remitted $1M USD to BFL's bank account. The other problem with that $1M worth of BTC is that what was processed was not even HashTrades bitcoins, but of those earlier mined by BFL, with BitPay acting as an exchange and not as a third-party payment processor, the latter of which they're only licensed to do. You, I nor anybody else can send $10 USD worth of bitcoins to BitPay and have them send you said amount to your bank account. Yet, BFL did such to the tune of over $10M USD over the course of over a year, stopping the practice hours before the FTC locked the place down. Saying that the FTC fucked up is an understatement. Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: Chef Ramsay on February 19, 2016, 05:09:39 AM I almost placed an order for a miners from BFL but the "pre-order" put me off... I learned my lesson w/ these guys back in the 2013 summer and this pre-order BS. Don't do it, just save your coins - I mean it with all sincerity. I wasted 13 coins at that time on this garbage; want to be me? Profit: .3 in today's dollars. All newcomers should not look to mining to gather more coinage, just spent more of said coinage for naught. The difficulty goes sky-high during pre-orders (and normally during any period) and beyond so your miner that may come in the next few-to-6months will get you nothing. Buying and holding is precious and not part of some BS talk, can't stress it enough. You're saving BTC and money by checking out what I'm saying, not trying to cut you out of easy BTC. Don't do it and fall for it, I wish I had back my 13 and another 20ish that I spent on mining contracts from back then. Saving/holding is way undervalued in this BTC world - never let them go to anyone or you're gonna fail. Maybe they can pay back in bitcoins? Prices are getting too high at this point to be able to play the trial and error in the mining game and be able to recover ever and have a decent BTC stash as prices keep going up in this next bull market. Hold and do not play around; this is your final advice as there are no ez fixes to getting more money here. If I placed my address below like others, I'd expect many coins in general from onlookers but I want none of them, just due diligence for newer types to do what's right for them in this crucial period. Mainstreet won't be able to keep up after this next rally upwards, so now is your chance and do not squander this opportunity. You can thank me later, just buy and hold (don't invest or mess around w/ your BTC as you go forward). Any Q?, ask (PM) before you screw yourself on a fast faulty mess-up that just profits the traders and the like. Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: Kakmakr on February 19, 2016, 05:24:28 AM These people made big promises and could not deliver, well I think they knew they would not be able to deliver, but they still took the orders. I also nearly fell for this, but a friend pointed me to a friend that had problems with them and I decided to hold out.
It would have been a huge mistake and could have drained all my funds at the time. Strange how greed clouds your judgement. Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: DimensionZ on February 19, 2016, 06:10:03 AM These scammers fully deserve what is coming for them. You can't just expect to trick so many people and think nothing will happen to you.
Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: tvbcof on February 19, 2016, 06:17:46 AM The one thing all of these main-ish-stream media stories seem to have in common is that they don't have a word about Zerlan (or whatever his name was.) Ten bucks says that that scroungy little weasel sung like a cannery. Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: Gleb Gamow on February 19, 2016, 06:25:41 AM The one thing all of these main-ish-stream media stories seem to have in common is that they don't have a word about Zerlan (or whatever his name was.) Ten bucks says that that scroungy little weasel sung like a cannery. https://sli.mg/qzHe18.png It is pathetic that he is still listing Butterfly Labs as his employer, in addition to his new gig. Hey, I wonder if there's any reviews of Josh Zerlan at iFLY. Hey, I found one: http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserReviews-g38969-d9801022-r345615920-IFLY_Kansas_City-Overland_Park_Kansas.html Quote “iFly is a must for the entire family!” 5 of 5 starsReviewed 1 week ago via mobile iFly is a very welcome addition to Kansas City's list of 'things to do'! We have already made several trips to fly in the tunnel and we are addicted!! It is an awesome activity for our kids. The thing that makes this place even better than most is the enthusiasm of the staff. From the moment you walk in it is obvious that everyone there sincerely loves their job. Josh Z is coaching the kids and is fabulous with them. He makes it really fun and encourages them the whole way through. A truly positive experience. Highly recommend both iFly and Josh Z! Visited February 2016 https://i.imgur.com/cGZhND8.jpg I'd say that somebody better tell Aime B about Josh's rainbow poodles. I mean, she entrusting a strange (pun intended) man to touch her kids and all, so she best have done a background check on him. In case you didn't figure it out, Aime is closely related to Josh Zerlan. How close, you ask? They share the same master bathroom. I would show it to you, but that may get me in trouble since I have a restraining order to not come near his rainbow poodles. Raise your hand if you still believe the story of how Josh Zerlan looked out his office window and realized that BFL's original office was across the street in a Section 8 housing project. With that same hand, used its fingers and poke your fuckin' eyes out. Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: SFR10 on February 19, 2016, 07:08:17 AM Shocking news as I only got interested with their newly made efficient chip and was looking for a group buy to join in and order some but after seeing what just happened and also their history (only found out now), I won't be doing so. The sad part is, their inability to pay back and their reputation won't be fixed too unless they repay first (wrong move by them).
Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: robelneo on February 19, 2016, 07:18:21 AM I almost placed an order for a miners from BFL but the "pre-order" put me off... I learned my lesson w/ these guys back in the 2013 summer and this pre-order BS. Don't do it, just save your coins - I mean it with all sincerity. I wasted 13 coins at that time on this garbage; want to be me? Profit: .3 in today's dollars. All newcomers should not look to mining to gather more coinage, just spent more of said coinage for naught. The difficulty goes sky-high during pre-orders (and normally during any period) and beyond so your miner that may come in the next few-to-6months will get you nothing. Buying and holding is precious and not part of some BS talk, can't stress it enough. You're saving BTC and money by checking out what I'm saying, not trying to cut you out of easy BTC. Don't do it and fall for it, I wish I had back my 13 and another 20ish that I spent on mining contracts from back then. Saving/holding is way undervalued in this BTC world - never let them go to anyone or you're gonna fail. Maybe they can pay back in bitcoins? Prices are getting too high at this point to be able to play the trial and error in the mining game and be able to recover ever and have a decent BTC stash as prices keep going up in this next bull market. Hold and do not play around; this is your final advice as there are no ez fixes to getting more money here. If I placed my address below like others, I'd expect many coins in general from onlookers but I want none of them, just due diligence for newer types to do what's right for them in this crucial period. Mainstreet won't be able to keep up after this next rally upwards, so now is your chance and do not squander this opportunity. You can thank me later, just buy and hold (don't invest or mess around w/ your BTC as you go forward). Any Q?, ask (PM) before you screw yourself on a fast faulty mess-up that just profits the traders and the like. Thanks for sharing your experience and advice I am almost tempted to invest all this cloud mining sites the key here is to really hold your bitcoin ,because holding it alone is an investment itself,but of course bitcoin is a currency that should move around.. Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: Gleb Gamow on February 19, 2016, 08:03:33 AM Shocking news as I only got interested with their newly made efficient chip and was looking for a group buy to join in and order some but after seeing what just happened and also their history (only found out now), I won't be doing so. The sad part is, their inability to pay back and their reputation won't be fixed too unless they repay first (wrong move by them). Thanks to my Google-fu back in the day, a lot of the history you speak up stemmed from my research. Sadly, Leroy Fodor's MENSA son wasn't yet old enough to conduct the research himself, but is making up for lost time helping his pretend dad, Leroy, investigate the Cryptsy matter... at the age of three. HAHAHA Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: classicsucks on February 19, 2016, 08:21:09 AM In case you didn't figure it out, Aime is closely related to Josh Zerlan. How close, you ask? They share the same master bathroom. I would show it to you, but that may get me in trouble since I have a restraining order to not come near his rainbow poodles. Raise your hand if you still believe the story of how Josh Zerlan looked out his office window and realized that BFL's original office was across the street in a Section 8 housing project. With that same hand, used its fingers and poke your fuckin' eyes out. LOOOLZ, that is excellent detective work! But I guess poor Aime just puts the poodles up Zerlan's ass in that master bedroom? Old "Box of Fans Laboratory" finally has to shut down... Amen. Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: Leeroy Jenkins on February 20, 2016, 01:20:17 AM I'm guessing we can expect them to have had "flew the coop" a year or two from now. To wit (a few days before the raid):
Does this thread need less cow(bell) and more chicken, as in Chickenfly Labs? Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: Gleb Gamow on February 20, 2016, 03:56:35 AM In case you didn't figure it out, Aime is closely related to Josh Zerlan. How close, you ask? They share the same master bathroom. I would show it to you, but that may get me in trouble since I have a restraining order to not come near his rainbow poodles. Raise your hand if you still believe the story of how Josh Zerlan looked out his office window and realized that BFL's original office was across the street in a Section 8 housing project. With that same hand, used its fingers and poke your fuckin' eyes out. LOOOLZ, that is excellent detective work! But I guess poor Aime just puts the poodles up Zerlan's ass in that master bedroom? Old "Box of Fans Laboratory" finally has to shut down... Amen. I would let you slap me on my ass for this great find, but I have a boil. :o Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: log2exp on February 20, 2016, 04:30:17 AM Since Josh is working as a trainer at iFly, if an old BFL pre-order dude show up just to see if Josh still have a straight face would be great, hahaha!
Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: classicsucks on February 21, 2016, 08:37:06 PM Since Josh is working as a trainer at iFly, if an old BFL pre-order dude show up just to see if Josh still have a straight face would be great, hahaha! "Oh hai Josh, does iFly accept bitcoin payments IN ADVANCE"? Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: SISAR on February 21, 2016, 08:42:09 PM Such arrogance, much fail, wow! ;D
Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: unamis76 on February 21, 2016, 09:53:07 PM Can't afford to pay with all those Bitcoins allegedly mined on customers machines? Wow...
Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: mercistheman on February 24, 2016, 12:23:57 AM So they settled for a whopping $15, 000... son of a bitches got away with it.
http://www.kansascity.com/news/business/article62022452.html Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: QuestionAuthority on February 24, 2016, 12:55:07 AM So they settled for a whopping $15, 000... son of a bitches got away with it. http://www.kansascity.com/news/business/article62022452.html They were always going to get away with it - because FTC. It's not like a real agency was investigating BFL. I wonder how many coins were mined at various pools with customer equipment. It would be so easy to spread the hash rate around and hide thousands of bitcoins. Chances are they got away rich. They just need to fake poverty for a few years and then retire to a little island somewhere. Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: nickenburg on February 24, 2016, 01:14:17 AM Wow like 6 months ago I still had a pre order open there,
It took really long so I asked for my bitcoins back. They did send them to me so I guess i'm lucky then? Unfortunate but i remember visiting there site and i was like wow these guys are the best I guess they where really good in promising things and not delivering it's a shame Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: Gleb Gamow on February 24, 2016, 04:17:54 AM http://www.kansascity.com/news/business/article62022452.html
Quote The federal government has gained a $38.6 million judgment against Butterfly Labs, a Leawood-based seller of bitcoin machines, but agreed to collect only $15,000. Butterfly Labs consented to the judgment under terms that essentially excuse it from any additional payments because of its limited financial resources. The agreement is based on financial information the company presented in U.S District Court. “We’re paying $15,000 to settle this case,” said Michael Foster, an attorney at the Polsinelli law firm representing Butterfly Labs. Officially, the judgment is suspended but could be reinstated if the company is found to have misrepresented its financial condition, or “if we lied about our financials,” Foster said. Bitcoin is a digital currency that has gained traction among some consumers, businesses and governments. Bitcoins exist only digitally and are “mined” by using sophisticated computer equipment to verify increasingly difficult calculations that verify bitcoin transactions. The Federal Trade Commission agreed to the settlement a year and a half after persuading a federal judge to shut down Butterfly Labs as a bogus business. It said the company had taken 20,000 consumers for up to $50 million. What are the odds that BFL lied about its financials? http://www.quickmeme.com/img/60/60653c4d9cbf62ec01ab9bde21ef414ed371ca2b47fed9bba1e50b962b2ee8ce.jpg Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: Gleb Gamow on February 24, 2016, 04:52:55 AM http://www.kansascity.com/news/business/article62022452.html
Quote The federal government has gained a $38.6 million judgment against Butterfly Labs, a Leawood-based seller of bitcoin machines, but agreed to collect only $15,000. Butterfly Labs consented to the judgment under terms that essentially excuse it from any additional payments because of its limited financial resources. The agreement is based on financial information the company presented in U.S District Court. “We’re paying $15,000 to settle this case,” said Michael Foster, an attorney at the Polsinelli law firm representing Butterfly Labs. Officially, the judgment is suspended but could be reinstated if the company is found to have misrepresented its financial condition, or “if we lied about our financials,” Foster said. Bitcoin is a digital currency that has gained traction among some consumers, businesses and governments. Bitcoins exist only digitally and are “mined” by using sophisticated computer equipment to verify increasingly difficult calculations that verify bitcoin transactions. The Federal Trade Commission agreed to the settlement a year and a half after persuading a federal judge to shut down Butterfly Labs as a bogus business. It said the company had taken 20,000 consumers for up to $50 million. Sonny Vleisides: Hello, BitPay. Hey, I know like everybody knows that you're only a third-party payment processor and NOT an exchange, but I need you to process a million dollars worth of bitcoins we received the other day for the sale of Monarchs from an industrial client of ours that we've bumped to the front of the queue ahead of singular monumental assholes orders. Can you do it? BitPay: What's in it for us? Sonny: Glad you asked. We've already moved the bitcoins once, then moved them again to the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://www.walletexplorer.com/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) bitcoin wallet address. We'll send you the coins and you get to pen a press release declaring that you're the first to process a million dollars worth of BTC to fiat (I'll later let you know what bank account to send the money). We'll all pretend that 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs belongs to HashTrade but it's really ours. You game? BitPay: Sounds like a plan, but make sure word doesn't get out that this is a ruse, mmmkay? Sonny: Mums the word. We even have Josh Zerlan in on it via a 10 BTC illegal bet with the ONLY dude who's wise to us at the moment, thus shutting his ass up till January of next year. Here's the funny part. A year from now, we here are BFL are going to send him a 1099 for services rendered, thus deducting Josh's bet from our bottom line. We may even send him a foam pitchfork for shits and giggles. BitPay: Okay, it's done, but I don't feel too comfortable about doing this. Sonny: Hey, you may not feel too comfortable now, wait till you we extort your ass in doing this exchange thingy on an ongoing basis over the next year or so to the tune of over nine million dollars more. BitPay: Where are these bitcoins coming from? Sonny: We mine them with ... wait for it ... miners that are customers already paid for and are waiting for them to be shipped, but we have them on hold believing that the machines aren't finished yet and that we're still testing them, with each test HAHAHA failing, but we're working hard to resolve the issues. BitPay: Where the fuck do you have these miners? Sonny: Some here at the office in plain site, some at my house, some at my family's homes, some in a cave, and even some in chicken coop. BitPay: You guys are so bad! HAHAHA Sonny: Yeah, we know. The other bitcoins came from the ones you already sent us for purchases which we've been sitting on till the price rises which has and continues to do so. We're simply returning them back to you in exchange for fiat (again, I'll be providing bank accounts info shortly). QUESTION: How the fuck was I, Bruno Kucinskas, able to figure it all out and provide proof via ONLY Google et al., but the FTC couldn't do such with its unlimited resources, arriving at a tens of millions dollar fine, but reduced it to umpteen thousand dollars to the same dude fined ONLY $100 USD for ripping off tens of millions from the elderly with his lottery scheme, not counting never changed with stealing tens of millions via his LFC and online gambling (with Jeff Ownby) schemes? Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: elvizzzzzzz on February 24, 2016, 08:13:14 AM Y'know what really, really, really P**&*&*s me off about the BFL scam?
Don't get me wrong, BFL _owes_ me, but I would have been in profit except for the greed and stupidity of people who bought from BFL well past the day it became clear that it was too late to invest in mining equipment. Even today, it's the same lemmings, different cliff. Never underestimate the stupidity of people in large numbers. And thanks to all who have added to this thread, and made the world a shade better. FU_BFL! Title: Re: Butterfly Labs loses Lawsuit... 39 million Post by: DimensionZ on February 24, 2016, 09:49:25 AM The prospect of getting 'free' money by buying heavily overpriced mining equipment could skew the judgement even of very prudent people haha. I mean when the greed kicks in you don't think rationally ;)
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