Bitcoin Forum

Hello all,

Assuming an unlimited budget and 1000 watts from the wall of free electricity available 24/7, what do you recommend for a miner. It can be Bitcoin or any other cryptocoin, I don't care as I will eventually be converting it to USD. I also want to miner to be as quiet as possible.

for bitcoin with a mere 1kw you cna not even use one s7 which is the recommended asic, you're very limited with that amount of watta, unless you missed a k? and you were talking about kw?

for altcoin ethereum is the most profitable, but there is the correct section for that, see the altsection

You could go with an Antminer S5 in which you could purchase 2nd hand of those in this forums computer and hardware section. It requires 590 watts from the wall. The sad thing is, your not going to make much but if you start right away, you could get back your investment just before the halving (assuming you got it for a good price) and anything after that would be profit.

What he could also do would be to buy bitcoins with his local currency, then buy the miner with the bitcoins. This way what the miner would have cost him in fiat money is stable, and he will be able to profit from the price increase that has 99% of chances to happen after or just before the halving.

It would cost fiat though .... "local currency" if fiat money (in almost all cases) and he buys coins with it.  That just means buying BTC with fiat instead of miner with fiat.  But really it does not make that big of difference as either way he is spending fiat to get a miner in this case.

Also having there is not guarantee of increase. We hope and speculate it's there.  But it's no 99 percent sure thing, investors know about it now so it's not like it will sneak up on them.

That's a good idea. Buy the miner with bitcoins while the price isn't as high as it will be after the halving
But question is how will the halving influence the price. If you expect it to go higher then wait a bit.

I would go initially with an underclocked S7 to get the Power down to 1000W. Then as soon as there is something better available like a Bitfury BF8162C16 based system sell the S7 and go for the new system. Basically maximise what you can mine with the 1000W


Rich

Only problem I see is S7 prices are dropping... fast.  Bitmain has dropped them with difficulty drops.  So with a new source that get's cheaper and cheaper it's hard to compete as a used seller unless you use a play like ebay..... they you mess with all kinds of things.

I sold all my last gen gear (S5's, S5+, SP20's, Avalon 4.1's).  My electricity was just to high to make sense anymore to keep mining I made far more selling.  I ended up buying coins.  My plan was to buy current gen, but until I invest more into current gen I want to understand difficulty changes. Also my ROI math... needs to look better a few things could do it.... don't know if any will happen though.

I have been thinking about holding the coins from last gen sales and just buying next gen whenever it does come out (depending on price ofcourse).  Did not expect to hold.... but it was more attractive to me personally right now then throwing even more into investment into of current gen gear.

I would wait to see what shows up in the 14/16nm generation.

 With free electric, you're not worried about efficiency from a cost standpoint.

 With only 1 KW electric available, though, you NEED to maximise efficiency to maximise your TH.


 Don't waste time on an S7. They're dropping price FAST of late, you'll probably not mine enough to make up for what you lose on trying to sell the thing used, and the next-gen gear SHOULD be showing up fairly close to when you'd RECEIVE the thing if you buy it from Bitmain.

 DO go ahead and get a good Gold-efficiency or better power supply - preferably Platinum with your power limit.
 A couple percent better efficiency can make a difference in your situation.

You may be right on the S7, however the price will bottom out at some point and become a good buy. My feeling it would be good to get mining, rather than just wait for something that is not here. So agreed on getting a good PSU, then perhaps see if you can pick up a very cheap S5 to get your feet wet.

Perhaps more important than all of the above is to crunch some numbers with the various options and decide that way which is the best way to go.


Rich

When I studied Economy, one of the first thing we learnt was that if the supply get reduced and the demand stay the same or drop a little, the price increase. The price of a Bitcoin is the price of how much it costs to produce. If you get two time less coins, price should get doubled, but you have to think that some mining farms will close. To don't have a price increase, you need that at least half of the mining farms close their doors after the halving. It may even be more but I won't do complex calculations here.

I can pretty much promise your Econ101 did not cover crypto currency.  Bitcoin there are more coins every day when blocks are found.  Yes there is a supply and a demand.

BUT btc is determined by the free market of investors on what its worth.  So having in coins does not mean you get double price for btc coins.  Look at difficulty we almost haved since January as far as difficulty going up.   Did coin price follow and go up with it.... no not to that extent.

Check out http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/ to estimate your ROI, but beware that even their calculator has a tendency to overestimate ROI.

The reason why is because the network difficulty is in reality adjusted more or less weekly.

For the uninitiated, the "network difficulty" is how hard it is for miners to solve the cryptographic problems necessary to solve a block, and thus earn bitcoins)

Plus the supply of bitcoins will not "halve"; the rate of increase will halve. All the bitcoins in existence today will still be there. It is not like a consumable item (food or electricity for example) where a halving of the supply would have a demonstrable impact. I'd be happy to be proved wrong but I really doubt if there will be a significant price increase at the halving.

I'm not sure it was not part troll after re-reading it.  Almost has a bit trolling or someone is just not as seasoned as they thought.

If you look since January we have almost haved in due to difficulty.... did we get a jump of 2x .... no.   It just is not that simple on btc value it is very hard to speculate.   But all investors know about having so again nothing is going to sneak up on us.

I speculate we see some increase before, but I don't see double due to "supply".

I said that Bitcoin's price could potentially double for the halving, not that it will. I personally plan that the price will be around 600$, but mainly due to hype than the reduction of the supply. However, you are right, that it isn't a consummed product, and as simple as it is, I did not take this in account.

What you said was:


You did not say it could.... but that it should double.  And said you learned Economy class.... again it would be more of a investment class that would make sense to cover it.   A advanced one dealing with currency trading would be far better then econ101 class that might have a page on crypto (and most don't have that).

It is a free market on bitcoin so there are no guarantees of doubling, and we can't say "it should double" as it is not that simple.  Also it is a currency it is not a simple good like products normally focused on econ basics. Look since january it almost haved on difficulty.... and did price did not double.

There are just so many varibles it's far from simple to speculate.  And with having being known... it will not sneak up on us.  Investors could be considering it with current prices already.  Fact is we don't know months in crypto time is just to long to give good speculation.

While I expect that the original claim of "unlimited budget" isn't true, perhaps you should skip the miner altogether and just buy BTC. Yes, you are then reliant on any BTC price increase to make a profit. While you would have a risk of of a BTC price decrease, you are exposed in a similar way if you decide to buy a miner and run it.

The limit of 1000W is really the limiting factor in terms of how much you can expect to earn/profit if you go the route of actually running mining hardware.

As always, don't spend/invest more in BTC than you are prepared to lose.

If you had a unlimited budget.

You would just be direct partners with the main service provider which would be bitmain.

Or setup shop as a competitor, but intially you are partners behind the scenes like most monoploies are done.

I don't know that this is true.  A lot of the big data centers I have a feeling have NDA's and are talking to Bitfury... their next gen if hit specs is a game changer.  And if you have a big backing you could become a customer of theirs.

Bitmain is the most popular for home/hobby for sure.  But next gen could be interesting.

That's true that my courses didn't had a crypto-currency chapter. When I said it should, I meant : in a theorical common market, dominated by supply and demand, the price would normally double. I know that it isn't true at all in Bitcoin, and I was not very clear about this point.

There is no need to continue this a Econ101 class topic.    There is a reason they did not cover it in your class.  BTC is not a product...... it is a form of currency.  A class on currency trading would be a much better fit then a standard econ class. So throw all those supply curve and other stuff your talking about out the window that were made for products.  Currency is much harder and speculation is not as easy.  

We could hit having and not see doubling.  We have haved due to difficulty since January did we see doubling in price? Your assumptions are wrong.