Bitcoin Forum

Good Day,

I was trying to send myself some coins to a different wallet.  Both of the transactions were from and to blockchain addresses.  I created a new address in my wallet and sent the coins from the other wallet.

Now, when I look at the wallet that I sent them to the address it had generated is not listed in my addresses and the funds have not come through.  When I look at the address I sent them to the transaction has gone through.

I am a little new to using bitcoin and I believe the new address I created in my wallet said "not synced".  I checked this on blockchain and it just said that no transactions had occured on the address so I thought it was fine to use.  I am waiting on a response from Blockchain but have not heard back.

Have I just lost my money into the ether?

Pleas help...Why would it generate an address that I was able to copy and use but now that address does not exist in my list?

Thanks,

Mito

you will have to wait till the blockchain syncs before you will be able to see the transaction. Alternatively you could probably just export the private key from your client and upload it on something like a blockchain.info ewallet. If you are in a hurry.

Try to run the client with the -reindex flag and see if the coins show up.
But only do that if the (out of sync) warning is not there. If it's still there you need to finish the syncing and catch up the block where the transaction was included before you see your coins.

Thank you for the swift reply!

So even though the address blockchain generated for me initially does not show in my wallet that was receiving the coins it is still somehow invisibly associated with that wallet?  When I look at the list of addresses in that wallet the one I used to send to is not there.  I would think it would at least still be listed even if it wasn't synced.

I still have the info for the transaction and the address I sent the coins to.  Would it be helpful to post it on here for someone more knowledgeable to check the transaction history?

The first wallet shows the transaction went through quickly and did deduct the .0005% or whatever the pecentage is to insure quick delivery.

So you're saying I shouldn't worry to much?  It was 17 coins which isn't chump change to me.

to psy:  The address it generated isn't even showing in my addresses...with or without the not synced warning.  It's like it never existed; yet, I was able to send to it from my other wallet.

Thanks!

by the way this transaction was made around 12 hrs ago. I'm not as versed with how often syncing occurs etc. but every other time I have done this the coins were recieved almost immidiately.

Something isn't adding up here.  Are you using https://blockchain.info/wallet or are you using the Bitcoin-Qt wallet installed on your computer?

I used https://blockchain.info/wallet in a browser. I logged into my wallet, went to recieve funds, had it generate a new address for me.  That address had a little "not synced" or something to that effect next to it so I clicked on the address.  A new blockchain window opened and it just gave me the details of that address and that no transactions had ever occured on it.

I figured it was ok so I copied that address and went to my other wallet and pasted into the send funds and sent the 17 coins.  If you look at the history of that wallet the coins went down the chain and seem delivered.

When I go to the wallet that generated the address the funds are not there and that address does not even show up in my list of addresses.  The address is: 1Krqph1oj3XbaGHkKtTJi9SxcC3k3qFWBk.  That is what it generated for me but is not showing in the list of addresses.  I created a couple others(after realizing that address was not in my list) just to see if it would and they were created and if I check the other new addresses I created are there but the one I sent the funds to is still not on the list.

One thing I should note is that it didn't ask for me to give the new address a "nick name" like it did for the addresses I created to test making a new address.

Thanks

I sent a support e-mail to blockchain...that is the response I am waiting on.  They have not gotten back to me.

Unfortunately, I believe that message was telling you that the address that you had just created in your browser had not yet "synced" from your browser to blockchain.info's servers.  This most likely means that they have no record of the address (and more importantly its private key) in the database for your wallet.  Therefore any bitcoins sent to that address are most likely gone forever.

You can try sending a PM to puik (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=pm;sa=send;u=17928). He's the local blockchain.info expert, but I wouldn't get my hopes up about recovering those funds.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=pm;sa=send;u=17928

The Not synced red warning label means the address has not been properly saved on our servers and will be lost after logout.

The wallet may however still be saved in your browser. On the login page click the "Download Backup" button and depending on your browser a window will popup containing some text or a file will download. Importing that into https://blockchain.info/wallet/import-wallet may restore the missing address. However if the address is not contained within that local copy then unfortunately the BTC is lost.

So, even if we know this address is bogus and I have the transaction info from my wallet that I sent it from the coins can not be recovered?  It seems like that means there will be 17 BC just sitting randomly in an address that belongs to no one.  Why can this not be recovered, especially if I know it was supposed to be my address?

I don't think my browser was saving any history. I'm guessing I will not be able to recover this downloadable "backup"?

Why would blockchain show an address when it is not synced and not let the user(especially if they are new and unfamiliar with the ins and outs of bitcoin wallets etc.) know it's a dead address?

I can't believe $500 can just be lost to the ether like this with nothing to do about it.

Thanks for the info by the way especially when it looks like I have just burnt $500!  How often does this kind of thing happen and why is there no warning or something?

Uuugh!

Unless you have the private key cached in your borwser, no it can't be recovered.


This is exactly what it means.


Because nobody has the private key for the address.


Did you try?  "guessing" that you will not be able to recover this downloadable "backup" sounds like a good way to lose the coins for sure.

It isn't a dead address at that time. It is just an address that your browser has created, but not yet stored (synced) on the blockchain.info database.

People have lost much more.  Some of them because they didn't know what they were doing. Others who knew exactly what they were doing, but then made a dumb mistake.  With bitcoin you are the only one in control of your money.  There is no bank or credit card company to replace your funds for you.  You have to take responsibility for your money and make sure you don't do something that you aren't sure about.  Making guesses or assumptions when you aren't certain is likely to lead to loss.

There was a warning.  You were told that it was not synced.  This kind of thing happens occasionally.  More often than I'd like, but not more often than I'd expect.

Ouch, that sucks mate. I've seen the did not sync message when creating new address through a blockchain.info wallet a few times, as already explained here they are lost the next time you log in. Thankfully for me I am no longer new to this, so I always log out and in again to double check new address when using a blockchain wallet.

Perhaps there should be a warning on the receive money page that warns about this, I'm not surprised that a newer user would lose coins this way.

Without the private key to the address it is impossible for anyone to recover the coins (even with all the transaction details). The coins are essentially destroyed.


The address is shown because wallets can be used in an offline mode for generating paper wallets etc. Several warnings are shown:

https://i.imgur.com/cMDa2ic.png

https://i.imgur.com/oGXPH1T.png

However I do accept the warnings could be made clearer and they will be in future.

I did see the not synced but do not recall the other message you posted(being new I didn't think the not synced was a big deal).  Why can coins not be recovered if the address is know and it's known that the address is apparently not associated with any wallet even though I know it is my coin and my address?

By the way I was able to go to blockchain and they had sent me a reply.  I thought it would have gone to my e-mail.  The info they gave me did not help at all.  I submitted a different support requests and will see how that goes.

Thanks.

Because this is how bitcoin is designed to work.  blockchain.info doesn't have your bitcoins, so they can't give them to you.  You sent your bitcoins to an address that nobody has the private key to.  Since nobody has the private key, nobody can send the bitcoins back to you.

Support will not help and I believe it was me that responded anyway. Please generate a new bitcoin address (be sure it synced properly, no warnings) and post or PM me it.

This is one of the other addresses I generated that seems to have all in order from the same wallet I was trying send my coins to: 1MHYk2rPAC5Ewm9uEUFFRLcEh6L5weJrU3

I really appreciate the swift responses you have been giving me.

Thanks again!

I can see where this is headed, and I've got to say piuk, you are one stand-up guy.  Ever since the dust-up with the guy from MemoryDealers I've been aware that your focus on customer service and going out of your way to do what is "right" even when it isn't "necessary" makes you a role model in this community.  If more businesses were run the way you choose to run your businesses, the world would be a much better place.

I have sent 5 BTC to the new address. I know this isn't the full amount but I hope it is a least some consolation.


Thanks Danny.

The arrogance of some people in these forums is unbelievable. A newbie loses $500 and he is blamed for being dumb and irresponsible. Unf*ckingbelievable.

No, he's not being blamed, just being told the truth.
Hopefully it will warn someone else not to make the same mistake(s) he did.

Ah yes, great! So the next person who loses money will be even more dumb because he should have known about this thread. Fantastic.

Wow, thank you very much.  I have to go along w/ Danny.  I really appreciate the help and it is some consolation but I'm still bummed.  At least it gives me more faith in using your system and will certainly be much more careful in my dealings with bitcoin/bitcoin wallets and their use.

So, is this some flaw in the system or just a ridiculous user error?  Every other transaction I have even done has gone across flawlessly.

Much appreciated.

Mito

I just noticed the new post Tas and didn't feel like I was being ridiculed but thank you for the support.  I realize now I should have paid more attention to the the little red "not synced" but It didn't seem to important at the time.  I just thought it meant synched with the block.  We learn from our mistakes and sometimes they are costly ones.  I believe there should be some way to recover "ether" lost funds and seems like a flaw in the system somehow but as you have stated I am a newbie.  I had never heard of any instance like this.  I guess the fact the Bitcoin are non refundable can be a good or bad thing.  In this case it sucks.  In the end aren't there only going to be a set number of coins total.  If this kind of thing happens it would reduce that total. If someone could come up with a way to find and collect these "ether bound" coins they would be rich! I'm sure this isn't the first case of this happening.

Thanks and to all Make sure your blockchain addresses are safely synced!!!!


I have not tried as I am not near the computer I was making the transactions on.  I will certainly try once back at that computer and if I am able to find a backup I will certainly return Piuk the coins he sent me.  That was a very considerate offer and I would not have expected that at all.  I thought with the info he may have been able to go into the chain and retrieve coin from dead addresses as you would think they would have some sort of back up on their system that would save any generated address.  I wouldn't have thought the browser would have been the thing to generate the address I would have thought it would be their server that would then send the address to your wallet.  That would eliminate this problem entirely. But again, I'm a nube and don't know about the workings of these systems very well.

That depends on what you mean by "this", but the fact that bitcoins can't be recovered without the private key is the intentional design of just about any viable crypto-currency.


Unfortunately we humans never have a problem until we have a problem.


I never intended to ridicule. I'm not sure why Tas sees it that way, but I was just pointing out the reality of the situation.  I apologize to anyone who found that my words were somehow offensive.  I'll try to find less offensive ways to get my point across in the future.


This reminds me a a humorous, true, but mostly unrelated story.  I was riding in a friend's car once and I noticed a yellow light on his dashboard that was lit up with the words "Check Engine".  I politely pointed it out to him, and he explained that the light had been lit for nearly a year.  When I asked why it didn't concern him, he simply explained, "I figured if it was important they would have made the light red."



This is a very common topic of discussion. Here is a link (https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/FAQ#Won.27t_loss_of_wallets_and_the_finite_amount_of_Bitcoins_create_excessive_deflation.2C_destroying_Bitcoin.3F) to read more about it if you like:
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/FAQ#Won.27t_loss_of_wallets_and_the_finite_amount_of_Bitcoins_create_excessive_deflation.2C_destroying_Bitcoin.3F


This is designed to be impossible until/unless mathematicians find a weakness in all three mathematical algorithms used by bitcoin: ECDSA with the secp256k1 curve, SHA-256, and RIPEMD-160



Definitely not (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=7253.msg1483219#msg1483219).
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=7253.msg1483219#msg1483219





There used to be some popular web hosted wallets that worked that way.  The problem is that leaves a large amount of bitcoin accessible by anyone who has access to the servers operated by the wallet hosting website.  This is a HUGE security hole.  Any hacker who can hack into the servers serving the website can instantly take everyone's bitcoin.  Furthermore any malicious employee of the wallet hosting company can decide to run off with everyone's bitcoin.  This led to some significant thefts and loss of faith in web hosted wallets that work this way.

The guys at blockchain.info came up with an ingenious solution.  The wrote a javascript web page that can generate the addresses right in your browser, then encrypt the private keys in the browser and send only the encrypted private keys up to their server to be stored in the database.  Then anytime you want to spend bitcoins, their servers can send the encrypted private key back to your browser and your browser can decrypt it locally using your password.  The web page they designed doesn't send the password up to them at all. This way nobody at blockchain.info can ever access any of your bitcoin.  They can't steal them, and a hacker can't either.  Unfortunately the drawback is that if your browser fails to synchronize the newly generated and encrypted private key with their database, then they can't supply it back to you for you to access the bitcoin later.

Thanks,

I'm feeling a bit less nubish now.  Info is always good and I should have done more research into Bitcoin/wallets etc. before delving to deep.  You guys are a valuable resource and are obviously very invested and knowledgeable. 

Thank you again and hopefully the next time I'm here to post it won't be about such a detrimental occurrence on my part.

Also, for the swift resolution even though it wasn't what I was hoping for.

Mito

By the way,I don't have my hopes up but if I am able to resolve this on my other computer I thank you again Piuk and will return the coins you so graciously offered to help ease my discomfort.

Who called him dumb?

What is he being blamed for? Not handling his coins properly... which is what happened. People are simply saying that he alone is responsible for retaining control of his Bitcoins, which is true. If you leave $500 in a park for an hour because you don't understand how cash works before using it, no one else is responsible when you lose it. Same thing when you send Bitcoins to the wrong address, or an address you don't have properly backed up, or when a scammer gets your private keys.

Bitcoins are like cash; they have no owner, you simply posses them.



Wow, that's nice of you. Hope you don't make a habit of it, though. Replacing the coins of people who mishandle them is a quick way to go broke. Nice for this poor guy, though. Kudos for helping out a guy having a bad day.

Blockchain.info kicks so much ass it's not even funny. 8)

Just to follow up on this the un-synced warning is now much clearer:

https://i.imgur.com/glXcYYs.png

PS: there's a couple of typos in that sentence.

Correct sentence should read:

Unless the private key is saved elsewhere, any coins sent to un-synced addresses will be permanently lost after logout.

Fixed now thanks.

Agree with you  :)
What if this happened to you? (any user)

Seems like a pretty clear solution to this happening in future. A separate interface for generating paper wallets - the two should not be integrated with one another.