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11 minutes and you start panicking? Dude seriously?
I'd like to know the name of the bank that can transfer money through accounts faster than that.

Weak troll is weak.

Does it use the blockchain technology? How can it be that fast?

Still doesn't change anything to the fact that 11 minutes is fast and that bitcoin can be even faster if you pay the recommended fees. Litecoin is fast too, but still isn't worth much money. Speed doesn't do all. Bitcoin is decentralised and doesn't need you to trust someone else, which is something that banks will never be able to provide.

The time taken to find a block (and hence transaction verification time) is not deterministic. If you include sufficient fees, your transaction will be included in the next block.
The average time to find a block is 10 minutes.

Indeed it is now often occurs in every transaction confirmation question Lags, it is because the network is experiencing a slowdown, Bitcoin and causes the slowdown because of the large number of transactions carried out every second and the network you use.

Average block time is 10 minutes.11 minutes isn't that rare. I've seen a 2 hour gap before. Remember, this is cryptography. There's a chance, but it's not certain. Be mindful that the block time isn't set, kiddo.

FUD and no.

Of course! International bank transfers take 10 minutes. ::)

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You need to take a look at these graphs:
https://i.imgur.com/uP5iuxc.png
https://i.imgur.com/O5Fy8ZX.png

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Source: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Confirmation#Confirmation_Times
I don't see this as problematic (as a lot of services accept TX's with zero confirmations). If your include the proper fee, your TX is almost guaranteed to be confirmed in the next block.

This statement is completely false. There is no such thing as "lag" or a "slowdown due to large amounts of TX" in this particular problem. The chance of finding a block is the same for every second. Read:

My last transaction was need 1 hour and usually 10-15 minutes only  :'(

better call Mike Hearn

The banks can take days to do a SEPA bank transfer outside Euro countries, and occasionally they lose your money in their complex system. If that happens you have to pay them to start an investigation, and if you are lucky they might get your money back in a month or so.

SEPA transfers between Euro countries can take half a day, and that's lightening fast for banks. They can't compete with an hour for a Bitcoin transaction.

here is lauda trying and failing at pretending there is no issue.. lets atleast stick with reality and try translating lauda's crap into something atleast more realistist.

1. If you include ABOVE the proper fee, your TX has a higher chance to be confirmed in the next block. but with average blocks holding 2500tx.. if there are 3000tx with above the proper fee.. then there is obviously still no guarantee.

2.  though blocks will still be produced in the similar timescales, who's transactions are inside the blocks can change. leaving some people feeling a lag because they are left waiting. transactions (not blocks) can lag if there are more transactions in a 10 minute average then usually would fit into a block. no matter how much 5000tx pay in fee's they all wont fit into a block that holds an average 2500tx. some transactions even with the high fee's will have to wait. and thus feel a lag.

3. with transaction fee's being more of a wild guess. because if everyone is paying X then you have to outbid them. so your wasting time researching current fee and working out a premium ontop to hopefully get first in line. then with blocks not being a stable and predictable 10 minutes. you wont know if you have to wait 2 minutes or 1hour.. not only based on capacity but randomness of block timing..

then you will see that bitcoin is not 100% noob proof..
guessing fee's to outbid others for first in line. then guessing the time of when that confirm will actually hit. is not something noobs like to see in something that is suppose to be hightech..

but with all that said.. its a hell of alot better then the banking system which doesnt always operate over weekends or not always sorted the same day

Yes, this is serious BTC network problem. For example, if you paying with card, no one shop will be agree to wait let say three hours untill transaction is complete and BTC payment is received.  ;)

Wrong. It is not a serious problem at all and your analogy is wrong. The time that it takes to process those CC transactions is quite long (I'm not exactly sure when they settle, so someone else might know more). You obviously don't understand how the underlying system works. What happens at the 'counter' when you use your CC can be compared to when you send a BTC TX == near instant. Confirmations are something else.

Correction: They can't compete with 10 minutes on average.

its lame things like this numbskulls words that makes noobs wonder about bitcoin issues..

he cant say with one sentance that bitcoin is instant..
when he knows that merchants dont AND SHOULD NOT accept zero confirms.
malleability is NOT fixed. and even when it is fixed.. RBF is another reason to not trust zero confirms.. even without RBF, orphans is a third reason not to trust zero confirmations.

so it doesnt matter about "settlement times" of cash or credit cards or bitcoins.. its about the time the recipient is happy to assume that they have got paid.


EG it takes 0.1 second for a cashier to grab a bank note from a customers hand.. but untill the cashier has checked the note is not a fake. typed in the value into the cashiers till and gave the customer their change.. can take 30 seconds.. then in no way is paying for something 0.1 seconds.

EG its takes 15 seconds to slot in a card and type in your pin number. and takes 2-5 days for the funds to settle in the bank accounts.... but due to contracts between card processors and banks. if that 15 second action of authorization is passed successfully. then the merchant can deem it as being paid in 15 seconds not 2-5 days..., due to the contract from card processors that hold responsibility for payment settlement

as for bitcoin. it may take les then seconds to hop between nodes to reach a node/mempool/explorer that the merchant can monitor and see the transaction is being sent.. but for many reasons its not best to blindly trust that tx will settle.. and knowing that its a random number between 2 minutes to 1 hour to get one confirm (averaging 10 minutes but never exact) and knowing that more then average transaction can mean the one they are waiting for may not even be in the very next one (even with a fee paid due to everyone else also paying fees).. then the wait to be considered accepted can be an unknown amount of time. that can only be estimated as under an hour in most cases.

so sticking to reality.. will everyone please do one thing when talking to noobs about bitcoin
STOP SAYING "instant and virtually free"

we are no longer in the pre-blockstream days where that statement was true.. lauda knows this but refuses to admit it because it goes against his blockstream faith of perfection..

but please be realistic and tell noobs the truth.. its not instant. but is better than most international banking services.

it is very normal.no need to fear. once it took 2 days for me to get 1confirmation. just pay very high fee if you want it to be confirmed much faster.

I think people will always panic. No matter how fast confirmation times would be, unless it will lightning fast with literally seconds of delay.
It is just in human nature to complain about everything. I recognize that bitcoin 10 minutes standard confirmation time is ok'ish for now but not ideal.
But claiming that it is the reason for bitcoin infrastructure collapsing is pure FUD and BS.

Really? do this bank make international transfers in minutes? I'm sure not!

Anyway, time of transaction depends on the commission - pay more, it will be faster. I'm curious how much for transaction faster than 10 minutes takes your bank .. For sure not $0.05 like it is with Bitcoin.

Did you ever hear about zero confirmation accept? Now a lot of services start doing this (BTC casinos - betcoin.tm, exchanges - Coinbase). Nobody have to wait, believe me it is no problem.

continous hacking whether by maleability or otherwise leaves the hacker exposed to being caught,

once the prison industries catch on zero conrfimations to a certain value will be safe

As you that blockchain was attacked by hackers a couple of months ago by spamming the transactions hopefully they are still on it so use 0.00015+ BTC tx fee to get high priority transaction.

Sometimes it can take long while I've seen some of my transactions getting 6 confirmations in just 23 minutes with a fee of $0.15 (0.0003 BTC). Sometimes if there are too many dust transactions, it can take even longer.

Banks too take a lot of time and unless you are using IMPS, transactions can take 1-2 days or even a week so nowhere I can see a fair comparison.

i think at this moment normal transaction need arround 20.000 satoshi for each transaction (per kb), to get normal time in confirmation (10-11 minute),
i recomended you use xapo wallet for "free fee" and faster transaction in confirmation

each transaction depends about how much  your fee, and how much your transaction.

You simply don't understand bitcoin then.

First comf in 11 min, completely normal.
Second comf ALWAYS comes in the following block.
You were slightly unlucky the second comf took longer than 10 min.
You could have been lucky and the second comf could have taken 2 min, but it didn't.

The infrastructure is running at full (core restricted) capacity and does have delays, but that did not cause your problem.
You just described exactly how bitcoin is meant to work.
There is no problem here.

11 min first comf?
You don't understand bitcoin.

How much fee did you pay for that transaction? Maybe you just need a higher fee for that transaction to speed up. If you want to compare it with bank, the fee would be more expensive in bank.

You don;t understand how bitcoin works either.

The tx in question was included in the FIRST BLOCK that was mined, after the tx was sent.
The next comf was 20 min later. the very next block after the first block.

You could have paid 10 btc in fees, it would have made NO difference.
This tx COULD NOT have been processed any faster.
(luck of block propagation time aside)

*****************

2nd comf 412859 (Main Chain) 2016-05-22 09:33:43 BW.COM 0000000000000000020e5e6ab86cea2e0a98275ab72e1e67054af125162a0dc8998.09
1st comf 412858 (Main Chain)   2016-05-22 09:13:20   F2Pool 00000000000000000202b69f405cc49dc0ac7e6a912ade7a119fb43dd07dd00  999.98

previous block,
412857 (Main Chain)   2016-05-22 08:46:34   BW.COM 0000000000000000025974e82b0d888c464d530476ec80a4fd34191d1f477dd0 998.12
At least 15 min before the tx was sent.

It takes time. for me usually 10-15 mins with the recommended fees, the most tike taken to confirm my transaction was maybe 3-4hrs when the fee was Less

The thing is, the majority of the banks cannot beat that confirmation time, even if they wanted to. I send money from my bank to someone else's account at another bank and it took 2 days. This was

not even in another country. I think people expect impossible and unrealistic confirmation times... or they have never used remittance services. The expectations should be lowered with proper

information from these exchanges and third party service providers.  ;)

10 minute is the average block finding rate.
It can easily take up to 1 hour sometimes.

That's not true. In several occasions I paid at merchants and they accepted the tx with zero confirmations.

This could happen sometime but not usually. Usual time for 1 confirmation for bitcoin transaction is 10 minute that seems to fluctuate these days. Don't know the actual reason for this. However to maintain 25 bitcoins per 10 minute average time to get 1 confirmation always get maintained as 10 minute.

You are confusing comf time with block prop time.
"Usual time for 1 confirmation for bitcoin transaction is 10 minute"
Usual time for next block is 10 minute.
Your comf time however depends on a range of factors.

"seems to fluctuate these days. Don't know the actual reason for this"
Clearly not.

"However to maintain 25 bitcoins per 10 minute average time to get 1 confirmation always get maintained as 10 minute."
Your confusing block prop time with comf time again!

that is the exception.. and not the safe rule.

please do not tell any noobs to expect instant payments with merchants. or they will be disappointed. be realistic with safe stats on bitcoin. do not try overselling bitcoin by using the exceptions that sometimes occur.

even ignoring the naive comments of trying to suggest instant tx's should be told to noobs.. dont even try overstating confirmations either

EG, yes some blocks are solved in 2 minutes.. some blocks are formed with only a couple hundred transactions waiting in mempool, meaning that all should/could get included no matter the fee or lack of.. and some merchants accept just 1 confirmation... but
DO NOT say to expect every merchant to accept payment within 2 minutes because of the 'sometimes' exception

"AND SHOULD NOT accept zero confirms" ...as absooute proof of payment, which defines bitcoin.

Obviously, merchants can except zero comf if they want to take you on trust.
(were these "merchants" local to you kik? were they online? Were you buying big or small?)

As Franky said, it is not the safe rule.
Either merchants have taken a risk because they know you, or because your payment was so small, or because despatch could be cancelled if comfirm failed.
Or other reasons.

But zero comf is not a done deal.

People just lack patience and if their transaction doesn't get confirmed in time, they began complaining and sending out support tickets. They need to understand that it depends on the network and sometimes delays can be longer. It
happens with every currency/payment method.

I have made litecoin transactions nearly instantly with zero confirmations, no reason why Bitcoin cant be,

the merchant was logging my IP and obviously new how to deal with people  who tried fraud

I dont think tor or anything else can protect u from gigantic corporations if they wanted to track

u down,

Unfortunately, I disagree with you and it seems like everyone who has decent knowledge will too. There's nothing wrong here and you just completely misunderstood how the system works. I mean 11 minutes off and you already panicked? I pay really low tx fees so my priority is low. It takes around 15 minutes for my tx to have a confirmation. Just relax fella.

I disagree with you, and have to agree with franky1 (despite his constant ad hominem). The problem with zero confirmation TX is that they can be cheated, quite easily IMO. Just send a TX with near-zero/zero fees, and it will most likely never confirm even though the merchant accepted your TX as valid. If you know what you're doing, then it isn't hard to attempt a double spend or use RBF to replace it. However, in a lot of cases the merchant will know who you are (e.g. if you're using Steam) and can apply appropriate measures. Additionally, practically nobody is going to attempt this for trivial amounts and those amounts would be negligible losses as well. The general rule is that the more value the TX has, the more you should wait before finalizing the transactions (e.g. buying a $100k car).

Knowing the IP is pointless in most cases as IP != person. Additionally, those 'gigantic corporations' can't track you down easily either, unless they know how to bypass encryption (e.g. used by VPN).

There are hackers who try every now and then but when a transaction takes over 24 hours, it gets irritating. I've had a transaction that took almost 36 hours and it was frustrating when the fee was over 0.001 BTC.
Even 0.001-0.00015 BTC fee doesn't help transactions to get confirmed soon.

Such arbitrary fee amounts are useless and won't guarantee anything. It seems that only a few people actually know that it comes down to the included satoshi/byte ratio[1]. In other words, a fee of 0.0001 (arbitrary) might be sufficient for transaction A of size X, but might be too low for transaction B of size Y.

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[1] - https://bitcoinfees.21.co/

About accepting zero confirmations (this seems to be a big part of this debate):

I know accepting zero confirmations will allow a tech-savvy person to, for example, create a double spend (not hard to do)...  The thing is: this is basically shoplifting, it's illegal, and when somebody doing this gets caught, he/she can face jailtime.

To be honest, i don't see much difference between somebody stealing a t-shirt or somebody "paying" for a t-shirt using a low fee, and creating a double spend once he exited the shop.
To avoid shoplifting, i guess the only thing you can do is either open a webshop (so you're the only one handling your stock), or work with a counter (so your shoppers can't physically touch your goods untill you hand them over).
I understand why some shopkeepers would be willing to risk some RBF or double spend cheaters, as long as they have a security camera and log tx times, so they can hand over security images to the cops, i don't think it's that big of a deal (for small sums ofcourse)... Shopkeepers already deal with shoplifters since ages, this is just a different kind of shoplifting. This is just my own opinion tough...

Sure beats an ACH transfer. Or even a wire transfer ($30!).