Bitcoin Forum

Like seriously, a peer regulated currency?

Going great now, but there was just a Chicago tribune article and now a review by a Yale JD candidate. Eventually this will get shut down because its was to easy to send money to people our government, your government, or any government does not want receiving money.

anyone heard of the patriot act?

Are we all just deciding to operate in this bliss?

I saw a post today with some dude running a server with a mask on, really this inspires confidence?

THERE IS NO WAY THIS WILL LAST SO HAVE FUN BUT KNOW THAT THE GOVERNMENT WILL CRUSH THIS.

lets have some fun but realize that this will end, government regulation or hack will end bitcoin.



Enjoy the ride

 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D  :D :D :D :D  :o :o :o :o :o :o :o

Oh please, bitcoin doesn't have any oil, theres no way the US government will do anything other than crush it completely if it's used to fund terrorism.

listen to what Govts are up to

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gTQex6Xzsfo

pls stop bending over in this form, you can't be thar devote!!!

had to register to comment on this one...

I think its going to be tricky as anything GOV does has to factor in linden dollars, facebook, etc.

A bigger concern is what gavin, jeff et al intend to do as per:
http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7368784n&tag=contentBody;housing (http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7368784n&tag=contentBody;housing)

We are working with the government to make sure indeed the long arm of the government can reach Bitcoin[/b]
Jeff Garzik, Bitcoin Developer

Bitcoin and Agorism
http://rulingclass.wordpress.com/2011/06/09/bitcoin-and-agorism/ (http://rulingclass.wordpress.com/2011/06/09/bitcoin-and-agorism/)

alxs

Awesome links, I really enjoyed them both.

This is what has peaked my interest, very in-depth, and looking for feedback.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/55491049/Bitcoin-An-Innovative-Alternative-Digital-Currency-SSRN-id1817857

which if its untraceable, and goes beyond our borders our politicians A wont understand and B exactly what you said is what they will think.


What makes you think they WONT think its funding terrorism?

I think governments will try to wreck bitcoins, but I think they will fail.  Trying to kill bitcoins would be like trying to hold jello down by hammering it with a nail.  They can't get rid of it just by throwing the developers away and seizing their assets like they did with eGold and the liberty dollar.  Since Bitcoin's value is in the coin in your computer and not in someone's store house of commodities.  Bitcoin already exists, and the number one man has already disappeared and no one knows who he was.

Maybe he quit to go start the Silk Road to help bait the media for the purpose of propping up the value of his million bitcoins, since he knows cryptocurrency is boring geek news that won't go past Slashdot but a mail order drug website using cryptocurrency will go viral.  And maybe he runs the Silk Road on a hacked server at some telemarketing outfit or donut factory somewhere, so that if and when the authorities finally find the actual server it's running on (after spending a billion taxpayer dollars to find it), the sorry underqualified guy who's job iswas system administrator won't have a clue it was ever there or how it got there, and that fact will be corroborated by a lifestyle that is clearly inconsistent with dealing drugs or owning a million bitcoins.  And Satoshi will be getting the last laugh on a beach or a cruise somewhere with a laptop and a towel and a copy of Tor, slowly selling BTC to sail the seven seas while checking his e-mail once upon a time, and codes his next big idea, like a decentralized crypto-based stock exchange anyone can list themselves on, so he can make NASDAQ and NYSE obsolete.  The end.

There is an easy way to effectively shut down bitcoin: go after the exchanges.  Shut down MtGox and a few other popular ones, or bury them in red tape and lawyers.  Imagine if the US government required MtGox to get photo ID from all users, or they pressured other banks and organisations to not accept MtGox withdrawls.  The Euro zone would follow soon afterwards.  Just closing a few exchanges would collapse the value of bitcoins as people see the dollars they pumped into the system may not necessarily be pumped out.  

An article by the Chicago Tribune AND a review by a Yale graduate?

Shit is going down, man.

Like they crushed torrents and filesharing? Like they crushed Wikileaks?

You might just find that good ideas are a bit more resilient than you thought.

THEY WILL CRUSH BITCOIN JUST LIKE THEY CRUSHED FILE SHARING AND ANONYMITY NETWORKS!!1

I watched the same and did not like it a bit. I really hope they are just working Bitcoin as a trojan horse, giving the most kind face to the authorities so they let Bitcoin exists and it becomes big enough so they can not go down on it because there is a big mass of people using it and the political backslash would be considerable.

Hey bitcoin is NOT anonymous. It's only anonymous if you both use tor and a bitcoin mixer.

+1

Worrying though is that what if bitcoin fails this test, that it is too transparent. That means something else will replace it, something that will have the benefit of the bitcoin experiment and less flaws, that something is what will destroy our investments in bitcoin.

How will they accomplish that?  Do you believe all goverments will join to destroy the exchanges, when they did not do that for more important issues?  Even so, destroying the exchanges will accomplish nothing, P2P trading will go on.  Destroying Bittorrent and Wikileaks would be far more easy than Bitcoin.

Actually goverments will need Bitcoin, as more and more people wake up to what b***s**t fiat currency really is.  And nope, people will not choose an inflationary fork to Bitcoin.

Which one? The one that's bankrupt and only influences 6% of the Earth's population? Do you know about some places on your planet called "Europe" and "Russia"?

On the topic of Wikileaks, I believe they were kicked of Amazon on a Thursday and had attacks against their dns provider? By the Sunday night Google was returning new their IP as the top result for them and there were 208 exact copies of the sigh up and running.

If they go after Bitcoin they will create insane interest in BTC in the rest of the world. If bitcoin goes down, something better will just replace it.

"The very thing that verily vexes me to visceral unhappiness is that the vilified method of transactional verification, "bitcoin" has no v's visible in it's spelling."

A combination of governments or whatever.

As soon as their is a soapbox to standon (silkroad) the politicians will get involved. Sex trafficking, drugs, weapons. its a politicians wet dream.

One successful exchange on the planet could bring the debt based money monopoly to its knees. If only one government allows it or simply fails to contain it their fiat money will be rejected by the market. The overwhelming evidence of stability and growth will flock investment to that region and the idea will be verified. Governments will also not be able to successfully outlaw all trade with that country simply on the basis of its citizens having the freedom to transact in bitcoin.

If there is not complete co-ordination, everyone from Venezuela to North Korea to Washington to Vienna to Mauritius to the Isle of Man to Chile to Zimbabwe to Somalia there will be no way of "crushing" it with legislation.

who cares about the government. there are more severe threats to bitcoins than this.

The government really does not care about bitcoins at this point. I know people here have collectively had their heads up their butts and think that bitcoins are going to destabilize global currencies and create a new world order and therefore world governments also realize this and must be mobilizing to impede bitcoins as they see it as an imminent threat. Get real people. So far two US senators have sort of bitched about bitcoins, mostly in terms of it being related to a drug marketplace. No one is going to write a bill to forbid American's use of online currencies for years if ever and even if they did, enforcement would be difficult. Do you know how ridiculously inefficient Congress is for important stuff, let alone something trivial like bitcoins?

I know some of you are schizoid conspiracy theorists who think the moon-landing was faked, the CIA shot Kennedy, 9-11 was an inside job, Osama Bin Laden is not dead, a closely knit group of Illuminati control all major world events and economies and that you've got gold, guns and MREs buried in your bomb shelter for when the Chinese/North Koreans/Iranians/Immigrants/Canadians nuke us, but really, chill people. The FBI is not watching you or bitcoins and if you think they are, you probably think you're way more important and interesting a person than you really are.

Initially, the few resources that are used to understand bitcoins will be devoted to mostly understanding the network and tracing transactions for law enforcement, in terms of money laundering and tax evasion. I see no threat to bitcoins themself. Those expecting Mt Gox or any other exchange to be shut down by federal authorities are paranoid.

blame it on deepbit, they get blamed for everything else lol

to simplify: they destroy ANYTHING, that's they can't exploit/use/thwart/slave.
both on personal and corporate/country/worldwide level.

anything,that's breath and live don't deserve to live in politicians eyes.
and that's hardly US-specific. US just had [too much]power 4 it, which rest lack, yet.

^ this

That is such a retarded argument, because, if I recall, the world reserve currency is the US dollar, and as such, all wholesale terrorism is funded using US dollars. Untraceable bills, by the way.

I
Bitcoins are only valuable because people are willing to trade USD and a few other currencies for them. So all a government has to do is shutdown the exchanges and it won't be valuable anymore, because there would be a hard time converting BTC to USD. All the people who run around daring the government to shut bitcoins down are not thinking it through. Maybe the P2P aspect of it is resilient, but when it is worth nothing because no one is willing to trade anything for it, what then?

A US dollar is really the same thing, except it has the "backing" of the government, and by implication, of the entire US society (mainstream at least). And to start it was sbootstrapped by another fake currency: gold. But after a while gold failed (or the dollar did depending on how you look at it) and so they said the Dollar is now value because it is a Dollar, and you can no longer demand gold in exchange. That was possible because after the USD had been bootstrapped by gold for a long time, people came to trust the dollar itself. THe same thing happened in Brazil after they had super inflation.

Supermarkets had to pay people whose entire job was to go around the store all day with a price tag gun, applying the day's new, higher prices to each item. What they did was invent a new currency and demanded that all wages and prices had to be listed in the new currency, and then an exchange rate was established with the old one. People got used to seeing the new currency, and seeing the price stability of the new currency. The one day they just switched over to the new one completely, and there was no more super-inflation. Just a magic of public confidence. The US government can both shut down exchanges and also take steps to defame bitcoins. If they destroy confidence in it, then it will lose value, because that's how powerful the government and media are.

You people are ruining this forum. I hope you're proud of yourselves.

Talk about untraceable bills.


My buddy went to cash a check that I wrote him for $400 at bank of america.  They gave him 100.00 bills.. he went across the street to try and deposit those bills in his account.  one of them was counterfit and he couldn't deposit it.  He went right back across the street and told the teller what had happened.  She said there was nothing they could do since he had left the facility. 

Thats one thing that will never happen with BTC..

This currency is the governments most awesome dream.  Something impossible to counterfeit but almost 100% traceable in every way.  A currency that transcends all borders and turns the entire planet into one economic system.  If they were smart, and I think they will catch on eventually, the governments will do everything in their power to make sure bitcoin succeeds. 

Now give the government 90% of the hashing power and suddenly you can have all transactions approved only by govt servers, all parties to a transaction being only govt approved bitcoin addresses, and all transactions automatically taxed.  It's more than a government's wet dream, it's the wettest dream Big Brother ever had.

I am sure this market is on the governments radar but at this time it is so small to be any real threat. The real threat to the prosperity of this currency is not the government but institutional investors. I am a FOREX trader and am familiar with the global monetary system. At this time I do not see any of the big dogs playing this bitcoin game. They deal in hundreds of millions if not billion dollar deals on behalf of their financial institutions. Bitcoins entire economy is a couple hundred million ..small time to these people. When they start to take notice and want to dabble in this small pond they will utterly control it..just by the force of the dollars they bring to the table.

The previous poster is correct all the government would need to do is shut down the exchanges and this house of cards will tumble and be destined just to be niche market catering to the technically savvy. When it could be a global currency without borders and no central banks to screw things up. We are going counter to all the powers-that-be with this bitcoin thing. It is a game they don't control. When and if it does survive institutional intervention they will take notice and want to hold all the cards. Just remember bitcoins intrinsically have no value.. its' just digital, it gets it value from the people who perceive it has value. It is not backed by anything real at all...just like the USD. No gold, silver or futures to give it a real form. the governments are master manipulators of peoples opinions.. They don't have to actually destroy the bitcoin network to wreak havoc...just the perception of it.

They won't be able to shut it down when the exchange is decentralized: https://github.com/macourtney/Dark-Exchange

One of these days I'll have a beta out. :)

Yes, this will be awsome man. Awsome.

An online exchange is also not absolutely necessary to exchange bitcoins for cash either, going by the ads on my local craigslist there are people who will buy them in person for cash or even silver. Of course, that sort of thing might be a lot less likely if all the exchanges were shut down somehow.

Why does every american refer to "The Government"?

Which government is going to crush/shut down Bitcoin/MtGox?

My question is, how can the US govt demand photo IDs from MtGox or even try to shut it down?

For one, the govt doesn't even have control over MtGox. Second, MtGox is not even based in America.

Imagine if Korea tried to shut down Walmart. Yeah, same concept.

Government is the real religion of the USA. Americans refer to "the government" in the same way that Christians refer to "God" or Muslims refer to "Allah". There is no government but The Government, and the President is its prophet.

"Of the people, by the people, for the people..."

Don't be skeered of your own reflection :-)

US govnt hasn't been "of the people" at least since the US civil war.

We do not really need an exchange. as long as we have paypal/netteller/moneybookers/email interact...and all other ways to send people money, we will be ok...