Bitcoin Forum

hi all

i have set this thread up due to the trolling and constant garbage posted by the trolls of the official spreadcoin thread.

this not only constant garbage - while initially is amusing for the first few seconds - not only reduces the activity of REAL and genuine users / investors of spreadcoin and the project - but also increases the tardiness of the thread in general making it almost impossible to discuss things in any decent fashion ...

this thread IS a self-moderated one and trolls WILL be deleted - along with ANY OTHER posts that are deemed to be unacceptable ... this does NOT include religious views or race or colour or creed ... if the posts are ON TOPIC and spreadcoin users wish to use this thread - then there will be little if ANY issue with continuing with it ...

i too agree with gerogem regarding the freedom of speech spiel - but ONLY when it does not 'interfere' ... these trolls have become much more than a hinderance - they have become a problem ...

the real genuine users / posters are more than welcome to continue discussion here if they feel it is right to do so ... and the other posts WILL be deleted ...

simple ...

this OP will be updated ( or replaced ) if it is deemed beneficial for the spreadcoin community ...

i have been a long term miner and trader of spr - and will continue to do so ... i have my own opinion on the project - and georgem - and the tardiness of the official thread - and the slow rate of developement - and so forth ... but as i posted in the official thread - my answers will remain the same to those two questions asked before about georgem and spr ...

yes - he seems to be a capable dev ...
yes - i believe there is a future for spreadcoin ...

i hope this will be a positive step for spr - not a negative one ... as i for one - as a user of the official thread - am sick to the teeth with having to sift through all the crap before i get to the real meat of the project ...

o btw - PLEASE do not quote the trolls - as when they post - they will be deleted when i get online and blocked when they get reported to the bitcointalk mods ...

#crysx

reserved ...

reserved ...

reserved ...

Thanks crysx, It'd be nice to see some real conversations about Spreadcoin for once.

Cheers.

Do you think it will be a coin used by many people?
If you think that it will be used, for what reason do you think so?

you are welcome mate ...

im just fed up with all the trolling ... and not being able to have a decent read or conversation without sifting through pages of garbage ...

its one thing to 'feel' about religion or race or culture ...

but the mindless drivel ( well some of it WAS amusing for a moment or three ) is just too much to bear for me ...

i hope this helps - even just a little ...

#crysx

IF the plans and conceptions for the coin are realized - it can ( and more than likely will ) be used and utilized for MANY purposes ...

i personally would not be interested in this coin STILL - had it not been for the interest in the plans and development ...

if we at cwi had the people and developmental prowess that some of these fine members of the spr community on our team - we would already have an experimental system ready ...

#crysx

thanks
I want to live watching how it will become in the future

Hey chrysophylax, it's been a long time...

I'm also a long time miner and holder of SPR and if any coin's going to make it, I'm sure SPR is a good candidate.

I haven't been following the official thread for a couple of months now though.

Anyway, I'll be following this one.

it has been a long time mate ...

hope you have been very well ...

ive been the same mate - watching for a very long time - but always been a supporter in one way or another ...

#crysx

first deletion of the day - and thread ...

btw - if we DONT quote them - they will disappear very quickly when they are deleted ...

#crysx

Deleted my comment and will delete this one as well to avoid useless comments.

Though, it's nice hearing from you mate.

there is no need to delete yours mate - as it will be left as an example ...

once i know how to block from the thread - none of them will come back ... they will have to keep creating accounts and continue to post - only to get deleted again - if they can bother to ...

i will also report them to mprep - who passes it on to the higher mods ... they will have the option to ban them from the forum itself if they deem it - if they continue to do so ...

it is a good thing hearing from you also mate - it has been a long time coming for a few members that i used to chat and associate with - when i still had the chrysophylax account ...

im back to rebuilding the backend for the seednodes - a couple of coins have updated - and cwi-nodes all need a full update anyway ... one of the seednodes need a rebuild ...

#crysx

reserved

Who are you and what is this reservation for?

All of your previous posts are only 1 line long also.

from what i can see - indian translation? ... no that there is anything 'indian' anyway - there are just dialects ...

this wont be necessary here mate - there will be no bounties or anything to do with translations here if that is the case ...

delete please mate - unless you are going to post something of importance here ...

#crysx

Hi crysx.. great that you opened this thread. :) Maybe copy the original OP page too? Be nice if you did. thx.

Ps Been watch this coin for a long time. :) Allow me to post a link to the original thread for OP info. :)

Old Spread coin thread. >  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1045373.0


                       Hash algorithm:SpreadX11
                       Total supply:20 million   
                       Block time:1 minute
                       Block halving:smoothly halved every 4 years
                       Initial block reward:6.66 SPR
                       Port:41678
                       RPC-Port:41677

If you'll indulge my curiosity ... in your model, are those statements logically connected?

(Just trying to get a sense of the orientation of the thread.)

Cheers

Graham

logically connected graham? ... under the current circumstances - maybe not ... they used to be ...

accurate as individual answers to the questions posed - i do think so ...

georgem has lost his grip on the realities of being the controlling dev of spreadcoin ... this is my opinion only - but i believe its quite accurate ...

i still believe he is capable of delivering good reliable code ...
i still believe he can deliver what he says he can - though he struggles ... which is fine with any dev ...

but i also believe that he thinks that he owes nothing to no one except his 'patrons' and it seems he is now considering everyone else as cockroaches that 'he' will shed light to scatter ... come on mate ... seriously ...

georgem is completely wrong in that area IF he believes that - and from the scattered posts he has been doing - it seems so ... and so i stand by the opinion that georgem is completely wrong ...

georgem took ownership ...
georgem took control ...
georgem refuses help ...

these points ( along with many more ) - are the reasons he IS responsible ... not just to the 'patrons' - but to the entire spreadcoin community ...

its like my saying that im not responsible for the promises i make about granite ... that is complete bullshit ... if i make the promises - and i break them - then it IS my responsibility AND my 'job' as owner - controller - and controlling entity to the community to rectify these broken promises ...

this is why 'promises' dont exists with me - unless i KNOW i can keep them ...

coins101 and eightspace and you and rhino and all the others that have invested time effort and money into the project  - even if it is as little as three minutes of time to write a post - are owed some degree of responsibility from the 'governing' parties ... in this case ONE governing party ...

am i bashing georgem? ... no - not at all ... im speaking my mind - and i do stand by the things that i have said ...

georgem took control - and has a responsibility to deliver what he states he will ... regardless of whether he has personal issues - a life - 10% of time into spreadcoin - or not ... he has that responsibility to deliver - yet accepts NO help whatsoever - and allows NO ONE ELSE to involve themselves in this developmental progress or the development process ... not sharing ANY code - even though its opensource - is the biggest issue that the spreadcoin community currently has ...

granite ( our flagship coin at cwi ) WILL be such a coin that does a lot of these things discussed and have them implemented in due time - and much much more ... but do i set a date as to when this will arise? ... no ... because i dont know - so why should i pretend that granite will come through with developments that i have no idea will take shape or not? ...

georgem seems to be a good guy - and i think he is capable ... but he should not have absolute control of a project he is losing to 'fud' and crap - and more importantly - losing the faith and support of the REAL community of spreadcoin ... especially those that can help - no matter how small the help is ...

as for the sense of this thread ... really its for the discussion of the developments - communication of thoughts - discussion of future and past 'spreadstuff' - and as whole a place people can get together where we will not tolerate the garbage and crap that the fake / false profiles and imbeciles that wish to post in the official thread due to its lack of control of the thread ...

I hope all the plans an designs and developments DO come through - but at the rate at which they are happening - and judging by the rate at which promises are churned out AND broken - i cannot see this happening in any reasonable time under the helm of georgem ... at least not until he comes out with the truth of all the things that are happening and not happening - AND - accepts help in the coding and development ... thats what github is for ...

had i the resources that are not stretched to the limit as is - i would fork the current code as it stands - and start on it with 'theteam' that cwi has ... but unless help is given for coding support and backing - this cannot happen as the porjects we currently have take all our resources ... at least for the time being ...

this will free georgem of his responsibilities as a 'controller' of the project - and all he has to do is spend his 10% of time on spreadcoin if he so wishes - and 'pull request' his developments to the main git ... thats it ... we would not drive away people ... yes - qualified and non-qualified developers and people that CAN help and grow the project - from pushing updates to the code ...

if ( and hopefully when ) he does - he will have my full backing once again ... if there is a question as to 'who the hell does he think he is s- aying things like that' ... well - ill answer sinply ... i am the one that backs spreadcoin - as with ALL the other community members and investors - who are the real backers of the project ... if development is stalled to no end - then developer needs to reconcile his role to the position he thrust on himself - and be answerable to the community and investors of spreadcoin - and possibly pass on the code for further development to a developer than CAN invest more than 10% of his time for the project ...

rant over ... for now ;) ...

#crysx

tanx tbear ...

this is not about taking over the thread - its about handling the crap and false profiles taht deliver the crap to the official thread - so that 'we' can have our discussions without the headache of sifting through pages of bullshit ...

so there wont be a push for the op to be copied and installed here in this thread - unless the community itself wants it to happen ...

ideas like yours are always welcome - and so are the official discussions ...

the colour of skin - or the type of religion - or the people who post here are not the issue ... the issue is the relevance to the project and the progression of it ...

hence the op is VERY raw - and very basic ...

if you all want to change it - let me know ... especially if its overwhelmingly positive towards changing the op to the original op ...

notice the original block reward was 666? ... hehehe - that mr spread! ... where the hell did he go? ... very well planned and executed project ...

#crysx

From a maintenance perspective, It may be too late for that particular approach.

The Spreadcoin codebase is a copy of Darkcoin (https://github.com/spreadcoin-project/spreadcoin/blob/97e15a43ce721ed6dce8bbdd1ec052c6c08c3c7b/COPYING#L2), itself  a copy of Bitcoin 0.8.3 (https://github.com/dx11/darkcoin/blob/master/doc/release-notes.md).

That's mid-June 2013 by my reckoning.

The various Bitcoin release notes (https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/master/doc/release-notes/) for 0.9-13 spell out how much change has occurred since then.

Cheers

Graham

What do you mean by too late? Just it would take too long and would be not worthwhile? Clearly it is technically possible and would just be a matter of finding someone to work on it.

Unless you mean forking SPR is not worthwhile relative to other more up to date coins?

By the way, I am curious as to your thoughts in regards to the current state of the project, if you have any. If you have some time I would love to hear them.

Well I was going to set-up a new moderated thread to get rid of that ISIS twat.

Yes.


It's kind of you to invite me to opine but I don't have much to offer, I'm afraid.

My initial interest was sparked by Mr Spread's technical appreciation of the domain and his “internal market” solution (http://spreadcointalk.org/index.php?topic=37.msg214#msg214) to the logistics of overlay network membership.


And in the context of discussions about forking the codebase, perhaps it's also worth noting:


My interest in the solution persists (in the context of a contemporary codebase) but I've lost contact with whatever georgem is working on. Keeping an eye on the relevant bits of bitcointalk is tolerable but I can't afford to extend that to coin-specific external forums. I'm assuming any substantive development will be reported on the main bitcointalk thread ... eventually. Other than that, as far as the rest of the community is concerned, the Spreadcoin project would seem to be effectively suspended until the development process is complete, whenever that may be. This has had the unfortunate knock-on effect of depriving the community of a shared focus for its communication and that in turn has had a deleterious effect on the cohesion of the group.

My perspective on peer-to-peer networked cryptocurrencies has changed over the years and it now points me in an entirely different direction.

Irrespective of that, there's now a whole bunch of alts with masternodes which emphasises the need for a coherent development vision to drive any separate development strand. Strictly speaking, a fork isn't required, anyone can clone the repos, create another branch and work in that - just as georgem has done with the new-wallet branch. But it wouldn't make sense to do that unless there was some sort of “public vision” to drive  the development.

Cheers

Graham

That's along the lines I was thinking of broadcasting messages between two different blockchains to prove one is running a full Bitcoin node.  8)

Broadly, in this direction -> http://www.dodccrp.org/files/Human_Nature.pdf (HUMAN NATURE AND SOCIAL NETWORKS)

Author is: http://csreports.aspeninstitute.org/Roundtable-on-Institutional-Innovation/2013/participants/details/7/john-clippinger


Cheers

Graham

Edit: added illustrative quote

Signed mate

Nice idea ;)

Mr gjhiggins makes an excellent point (as usual).
Spreadcoins codebase is a relic of old. Building a service network on top of this antiquated code is reckless.
Bitcoin core has had several security and preference modifications since 0.8.x.
I would suggest having someone update the core codebase to as latest as possible and then attempting to launch service nodes.

I guarantee once you launch paid full nodes you will need to update core code, this is back asswords.

Chaincoin acquired masternodes in its upgrade to 0.9, the most recent Core version that doesn't necessitate a hard fork of the blockchain, c.f. the Bitcoin 0.10 release notes:

A hard fork creates a forced choice, upgrade to the new client/blockchain / stay with the old client/blockchain. A consensus will become evident but that in itself will not necessarily result in a single blockchain - both old and new chains can exist separately and simultaneously.

However, an upgrade to 0.9 falls well short of defunctec's (eminently pragmatic) criterion of “latest as possible” and also misses out on the improvements that the 10-13 versions bring. From a maintenance perspective, going to 0.9 is hardly worth the effort, given the (un-guessable, even) risk of dividing the community --- it cannot be ignored that such a move could result in georgem's miner and blockexplorer work being effectively isolated if he was minded to maintain his insular stance.

<digression>
This thread has been useful in prompting me to go back and refresh my memory of events. I bailed in late April 2015 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=715435.msg11145574#msg11145574), eventually observing “in several areas my perceptions are starting to differ sufficiently from (what I perceive to be) the consensus that it basically renders irrelevant any contribution I might make in that context, so I'm opting to keep my own counsel there.” The subtext was: “Nope, that ain't gonna work. Bugger this for a game of soldiers, I'm slinging my hook” (high and low registers, right?)

Anyway, I had to check back on coins101's apparent understanding “That's along the lines I was thinking of broadcasting messages” because my model had Mr Spread's description placed in early 2015 with late spring for coins101/georgem's development project for Bitcoin node support. So I had to check - which was useful because in the process of refreshing my memory, I was confronted with a use case discussion that I had completely forgotten about but the content of which later significantly informed my understanding - so props to thelonecrouton and Anothernode for spelling it out - details later ..
</digression>

There's a raft of 0.10 coins, just search on Github for "Bitcoin Core version 0.10.0 is now available from:" (https://github.com/search?q=%22Bitcoin+Core+version+0.10.0+is+now+available+from%3A%22&type=Code&utf8=%E2%9C%93)

There are markedly fewer 0.11 coins (https://github.com/search?q=%22Bitcoin+Core+version+0.11.0+is+now+available+from%3A%22&ref=searchresults&type=Code&utf8=%E2%9C%93) aaand (for completeness) 0.12 (https://github.com/search?q=%22Bitcoin+Core+version+0.12.0+is+now+available+from%3A%22&ref=searchresults&type=Code&utf8=%E2%9C%93) and 0.13 (https://github.com/search?q=%22Bitcoin+Core+version+0.13.0+is+now+available+from%3A%22&ref=searchresults&type=Code&utf8=%E2%9C%93)

I can't tell offhand which of the Core versions have overlay networks but there aren't many. I think bitcredits got to 0.12 and had an overlay network, that might be a sensible place in which to start looking. Upgrading that to 0.13 will still be effortful, btw.

It would have to be a long running jump and grab to 0.12/0.13 and even then Spreadcoin could end up like iXCoin, all synched up and nowhere to go.

Anyway, time to return to the Anothernode/thelonecrouton discussion. I'm not going to re-post the discussion, just the pointers:

my post: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=715435.msg10973864#msg10973864

thelonecrouton's response: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=715435.msg10975747#msg10975747

anothernode's refinement: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=715435.msg10976140#msg10976140

The key insight is thelonecrouton's “using the MN network as a consensus mechanism for choosing the locus/loci”. It's relevance didn't strike me until I found myself reading:
Threshold cryptography in P2P and MANETs: The case of access control (https://info.cis.uab.edu/saxena/docs/sty07.pdf)

and I realised that “initialize the group by choosing a group secret key” can be mapped to “a consensus mechanism for choosing the locus/loci”

Which brings us smartly to the key question: is the overlay network capable of ephemeral knowledge of a secret and thereby capable of offering trustworthy cryptography?

Using an overlay network to mediate threshold cryptography is not a done deal by any means - see Chen and Wu's review of the field: A Survey on Cryptography Applied to
Secure Mobile Ad Hoc Networks and Wireless Sensor Networks (http://www.cse.fau.edu/~jie/research/publications/Publication_files/wsn-chapter.pdf) (PDF).

I just thought I'd chuck that into the mix.

Also, coins101 put a lot of effort into detailing the other possibilities for exploiting the advantages of an overlay network, shouldn't be overlooked at this point:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=976031.msg10656234#msg10656234

Cheers

Graham

interesting reading graham ...

i havent yet had too much time to absorb it all - but i think many points ( and ideas ) can be gleaned from it ...

i am currently at thefarm - reworking some of the areas that need to be for it to mine efficiently ... development on thefarm is stalled and i guess mining granite - spreadcoin - or any other coin is at a slight standstill for the time being ...

but i will be back 'home' ( 2500kms away - and away from my partner now for a week ... yes i miss her - im human too ) and will look over - read and reread - and absorb what has been written ...

i will be looking for a dev that will be dedicated and focused on a few things in the CWI ecosystem - of which a few ideas to be implemented ... i wonder is the spreadcoin core should be part of that? ... interesting ...

eitherway - electrician about to come and quote me on  the full rewire for thefarm ... ie - destroy the bank balance again ... :P ...

i have a lot to catch up on when i get back home ... which will be friday my time :) ...

#crysx

Guys, I wish to welcome you back in the official thread.

Hope to see you there soon.

Peace!

tanx georgem ...

seems that the trolls have thinned a little out ...

ill keep this open for a while ... if not used - as i mentioned in the op - ill be happy to lock the thread ...

but it will be at the behest of the community ( as i am one also ) ...

eitherway - open discussion and communication is always a justified option for communication ... but trolling is not ... which is the bane of my life ( and many others ) when it comes to educated and open dialogue ... especially when it comes to focus on the subject matter that is important ...

#crysx

sigh. Can we tighten up the thinking just a little bit?



The phrase “official thread” is semantically vacuous, as attested by this very thread and the posts made to it.

Cheers

Graham

hehehe ...

im not gay - or even remotely bi or curious - but i could bloody well kiss you graham ...

#crysx

Whatever he chooses to do, it's unlikely to make much difference. The dissipation of the critical energy of a group results in a proportional reduction in the volatility of the perceived group consensus. Those who remain committed have been so for two years now (for an arbitrary value of “committed”).

Co-incidentally, this thread is turning into a bit of an anniversary reunion. /me waves. Don't think Palm Detroit is still around tho'

Cheers

Graham

hi all ...

ive finally got my old profile back ...

tanx to cyrus ( bct mod ) and a few others - i now have full access to my old profile ... so will be using this one as much as possible from now on ...

the 'crysx' profile will still be in use - but will be only when necessary - not as my standard ...

a lot to sort out now ...

update ...
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1563601.msg17653092#msg17653092 ...

#crysx

hi all ...

just a thought ...

mrspread IS a well known developer going by another profile here on bct ( and other portals ) ... thats one thing for sure ...

who that dev is - is anyones guess! ... but chances are - that spr was a testbed for other things to be implemented into the coin / project he is ACTUALLY working on ... its how a lot of the 'bigger coin' developers work ... which is why a lot of well coded / great idea coins have been abandoned ... not just for the monetary gain - but much more importantly - the code advancement gain WITHOUT ruining the reputation ( and codebase ) of the coins they are actually working on ...

there are much better ways ( and more honest ways ) of doing this - but nothing as as gratifying than successfully developing code that WORKS ... testing it in one coin - then improving it and integrating that code in the coin you are actually working on ...

#crysx

Crysx and gjhiggins making incisive posts as usual.  Nice to see gjhiggins acknowledging Coins101's efforts too.  His research has been tireless and I can't wait to see where his ideas end up.

I'm really sad to see georgem turning on even gjhiggins now.  Less than a year ago georgem told me that gjhiggins was one of the few devs he would be happy to collaborate with and spoke with nothing other than respectful words.  I have no idea what has changed.

From various sources I have picked up on a level of paranoia on georgem's part that previous SPR team members are attempting to undermine his project.  It has even got to the point that there is hostility towards the projects that they are now involved with.  The bottom line is that some people had enough, found themselves to be the target of hostility and insults after investing a lot of time and effort and decided they had enough and wanted to work in a more constructive environment. There is no rivalry or ill feeling.  Indeed I believe several of the people in question have large SPR holdings and are still supportive of the project.

I agree with crysx that georgem is developing his ability to deliver whatever his vision is for SPR and could well deliver something amazing but to refuse to share that vision with the community and do things in isolation, indeed insisting on monthly payments to even see a preview wallet seems like a strange approach to me.

From my own point of view, the only thing I would like to understand is why georgem has recently turned on so many people who wished him well? It makes me wonder or worry that all is not well with him.  I really hope that isn't the case.

 

Just as an afterhought:

I see no point in me posting on the other SPR thread now.  I'm only there because I'm interested to see what is happening and I don't want to continue to be name called for FUD and Trolling. Its rather tiresome when I feel I'm asking perfectly constructive questions.

I admit to being less constructive but other than that, you reflect my sentiments exactly.

My continued interest in the different stances adopted by the disparate elements of the original inclusive Spreadcoin community is based on my respect for the perspicacity of the original community members. Broadly, if they were savyy back then about Mr Spread's take on things, then they'll be just as savvy today - possibly about things that I don't yet have a good understanding of and it behooves me to pay heed.

I (like to think that I) ask questions (of myself, of the corpus of empirical work, of knowledgeable others) in an effort to deepen my understanding of the techno-socio-econo-political phenomenon that is the shared ledger. Whenever I get “pushback” from that activity (myself including), it invariably means the vulnerability is profound and reaches right down into the foundations of the effort. (Being equally harsh with own fanciful notions helps me keep my feet closer to where I think the ground might be).

I seem to have an unfortunate facility for pressing georgem’s button. It’s not the first time I’ve encountered this in my technical career, far from it (as you might reasonably suspect).  The contradiction between the position he affects and the immaturity of his communication style is significant and not one that I ignore.

As to revitalising the original Spreadcoin project as an alternative development path (to be pursued independently of - but not necessarily excluding -  whatever georgem and his funding group decides to work on/release) ...

I’m not aware of any well-founded arguments for the continued development of the 0.8.X clone versus focusing the development on one of the clones of Bitcoin Core, so I'm assuming an underpinning Bitcoin Core implementation.

But which? Each version brings its own improvements and enhancements which are just as useful to users of a cloned alt such as SPR as they are to BTC holders. To segwit or not to segwit is the question being discussed elsewhere (c.f. Blockchain mechanic, LItecoin, et al.) Can Mr Spread's 0.8.X-hosted implementation of an overlay network be readily refactored/upgraded to be integrated with 0.13.2 or does the mass of accumulated changes to the core implementation class structure present a significant barrier in terms of technical knowledge and effort? (hint: yes, it does).

Where is the “competition” and what problems are they aiming to solve (in order to be able to mount a defence against - “why bother, just switch to a more promising horse”)

An influential PIVX member and code contributor posted this as their alt's set of attributes:


What would be required and how long would it take for an independent Spreadcoin development effort to be able to match (at least) most of those statements?

Cheers

Graham

From the main thread:


The vanity generator address feature is one that, as a cognitive psychologist with extensive knowledge of and experience in UI principles, I would strongly dis-recommend for adoption in any independent development effort because, in the context of WIF-serialised addresses, it is a UI antipattern.

Vanity addresses open up an opportunity to exploit the fact that human memory is in fact a dynamically reconstructive process, not a lookup table.

An agent could offer an apparent-seeming match: ShitQUjQfAHjSHnmw9Qf3W2T3YQTjTtjBf (either maliciously or inadvertently) which would be vulnerable to known limitations of attentional resources and optimisation “features” of the perceptual process to the extent that it would effectively promote the “fooling” of a momentarily-inattentive user into not double-checking the address and potentially sending coins to a destination different to that intended.

Vanity addresses are dis-recommended from a security perspective too, as they leak information about the trading activities of the holder of the privkey.

Co-incidentally, I haven’t yet managed to come up with a plausible-seeming answer to my (self-imposed) question of: what role do vanitygen addresses have in an HD-capable wallet such as Bitcoin Core 0.13.2 that offers full BIP32 functionality?

In the same arena, would anyone be up for having a go at generating the appropriate SPR BIP32 version bytes (https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/master/src/chainparams.cpp#L132)? The version bytes are hard-coded into the protocol so the prefix is common and cannot be readily (ab)used as an exploit.

Cheers

Graham

I think the fork idea has promise.

Having said that that, some of us came to the same conclusions as you and decided that a newer core version was desirable but didn't have the stomach for the histrionics that comes with the Spreadcoin territory. We decided to take our plans to another project instead.

I have been contacted by a few people lately asking about the feasibility of a rival fork to SPR. It seems that other people have had the same thoughts.

From my perspective, I haven't got any time to be involved but I'd look on with pseudo academic interest.

I have just seen a project with a small team do a Bitcoin core update, implement some Dash features, drop in a few other features such as sha256 merge mining and speed on down the road of independent development in less than six months.

With a handful of people with the right skills and motivation, nothing would stop SPR from doing the same.

You know what a lot of these projects lack?

Vision.

Sure there are lots of features in there. But drill down into what they mean and it's a list of items that bring the project into the 'me too' category at best.

Even DASH's Evolution is based off my vision for making crypto easy to use and more like internet banking.

i agree to an extent ...

i guess most have some sort of vision for the coin / project that they have - but most devs prefer the short term btc pile up ...

we at cwi have a simple vision - that the wallets and payments are simplified so much so that any layman / laywoman can purchase pretty much anything anytime anywhere ... this simple approach means that the complexities of the systems involved need to be simplified also ...

a huge task indeed ... but is a necessary accomplishment for granite to be a good choice for payments ... as for spreadcoin - well georgem looks like he is setting his sights on the accomplishment of things that were and have been - which is not a bad thing ... i would like to see it all come to fruition also - so will see how it all comes about ...

this whole distribution to patrons only though - that will get it all undone in my opinion ... patrons / payers / customers / users alike really should have full access to the wallets - but that is up to georgem and his approach to it all i guess ...

#crysx

ISTR someone observing (correctly at the time) that Spreadcoin lacked a “public vision”.

I pondered that for a long time and eventually arrived at some conclusions:

i) a “vision” can be misleading - ANNs for pump-and-dump runs typically feature ambitious (albeit spurious) visions, presumably to draw in the punters
ii) the notion of an overall directing “vision” is untenable in the context of a peer-to-peer networked cryptocurrency
iii) a functioning Teal organisation will evolve its own vision common purpose as an emergent property of the social consensus

Visions have an unfortunate habit of vaporising when the dev loses interest (examples abound). I'd argue that they signify an elevated risk of failure, the more detailed and extensive the vision, the more damage if/when it proves vacuous.


Cheers

Graham

yup! ...

what he said ...

;) ...

#crysx

nah.

It all goes south when the dev thinks he knows everything - usually when there is a laser sharp focus on technical issues, whilst ignoring the end user.

I like this fork idea where spreadcoin exists as a separate entity for georgem's tinkering and the main branch having an updated codebase that functions with a greater emphasis on coin's vision.

It sounds sensible until one begins to pick apart the entailments:

Firstly, it would risk making an orphan of georgem's work unless the efforts were synchronised, which is not on the table because georgem needs pretty much total freedom in order to meet his responsibilities to his Patreon funders.

Secondly, as has been recently mentioned: what vision?

Cheers

Graham

Well, this one to start with

More longer-term, this one (an idea which DASH copied and is now called Evolution....you can trace the dates and see I posted this thought through idea several months before Evolution was announced as the future direction of DASH)....

https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1sKlPh19aAGPGD-DuwPH_FMIJVbqjTzEPweKkvFS0TxY/edit#slide=id.p

https://i.imgur.com/zZdGkN7.png

I would not characterise these as visions but as (perfectly valid and rational) technical development directions because they don't focus on the user but on the technology/service.

For me, a vision needs to be i) user-focused and ii) something “other”.

Cheers

Graham

I have assumed that you didn't really read the whole thing or understand the outcome (ie you didn't get it - which is a failure of communications)

https://i.imgur.com/6CVbgab.png

The whole point of all this was to create an easy on-ramp solution for the average Joe's family including grandparents, while removing central points of failure.

The thing about visions is you either see it or you don't  ;D

Semantics aside, it's a direction that starkly contrasts the current state of the the project. In its current form, spreadcoin directly serves the interest of a single individual. These concepts, regardress of where they are realized, have the potential to strengthen an entire ecosystem.

As this thread is actually called 'spreadcoin', I've created a new thread (what? another bloody spreadcoin thread?)

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1809278.msg18021096#msg18021096

please come and troll us there.

hehehe ...

and we KNOW why i called it the unofficial spreadcoin thread ...

trolling ... which is not supported here ...

would you like a namechange for the thread mate? ... :) ...

eitherway - i like the ideas - but i feel the direction is becoming more and more branched and skewed ...

if you would like to continue with your the new thread - and the rest of the community prefers to converse there also - ill lock this one and be done with it ...

would make it much easier to moderate as well ;) ...

#crysx