Bitcoin Forum

Every electronic ticket machine in Switzerland sells XBT, and accepts CHF and EUR cash as payment. Apparently people have been using it for remittance purposes instead of Western Union, and WU decided to try to do something about it:

https://ibin.co/3AhU24PVukXz.jpg

A perfect reason to walk over to the machine and buy Bitcoin  ;D

https://ibin.co/3AhUJF4eXNQZ.jpg

What did they decide to do about it? people should realize something about bitcoin, it's like IPv4 and IPv6 while banks and traditional banking system is more like IPv4 while bitcoin is like IPv6. if you know about internet protocols you'd know what I'm talking about.

bitcoin has IPv6 utility, but.
but then we have blockstream trying to act as ISP's only offering users ipv4 and sidetrack them with bad compression and other features, while the ISP(blockstream) is utilising real IPv6 concepts for commercial banking networks. until they are ready to unveil the new ipv6 currency known as hyperledger

Just a question: Are you from Switzerland? As far as i know you need a Swiss mobile number for buying BTC. Or is there any way around this (idiotic rule)?

Am I the only one who don't like buying bitcoin in public places or in these places where are lots of camera which does not give privacy to the amount (I mean only for privacy) but if I don't care for privacy then it's ok, a good place to purchase bitcoin and from the picture provided seems the fees are not high as I thought.

I am pretty sure every ATM machine has a camera pointed directly at you so even if there is no one around your receipt could still be seen. Not that this is the end of the world but this doesn't matter at all because your government could see your bank statements and your last online Bitcon purchase at will. Are you scared of random people staring at your Bitcoin receipt lol?

I heard that Switzerland is gearing towards crypto acceptance, Bitcoin is Vat-free in Switzerland, in Zug area you can pay taxes with BTC, Swiss railway accepts BTC, banks forcing bitcoin friendly legislation,
but I have no idea that you can buy BTC from every electronic device, I thought is is only couple ATMs.
When bitcoin will fully unfold its wings, Western Union will become a MySpace of money remittance solutions and they know that perfectly well, no wonder they are starting to panic.

Privacy isn't related to cameras only, if you buy on an exchange they know who you are too. The biggest problem that i see normaly in this vending machines (or on ATM's) is the big fees compared to exchanges.

No, I don't have that "issue", and I think most of people here too because as long as we don't make anything illegal then it's ok, I also don't spend bitcoins somewhere I don't like, but for the privacy of people who buy in these places are 0% but anyway it is better than nothing and I'm happy to see such places because it encourage more people to join the cryptocurrency.

So no fees in WU until the end of March? Tough competition ;) Good to see these services stepping up! Their general acceptance was what made Bitcoin happen, so them stepping up means that Bitcoin will one up them soon.

Define privacy please? There is no privacy when you are buying online or offline as long as you are using funds that can be traced back to you. Do you think your privacy is 99% when you are hidden behind your monitor at home and 0% when you are at the mall ATM? Lol. If you want 100% privacy you have to put on a fake beard and glasses and meet up a Localbitcoins seller. Have you bought any that way?

You can buy coins from any SBB ticket machine now so pretty much any station around the country.

Which is great, as for the phone number requirement I haven't tested myself yet, but you could get a burner for a few bucks from any shop, although with ID. If privacy is your concern, buying coins that way is obviously the wrong choice, but it's perfect for legitimate use.

I can't see the date of the receipt provided in the OP but to calculate the fees seems that it is around 6% because 12.04 CHG of 200 CHF is 6% so I think it is pretty high but when we compare this to person to person fees this is not bad even though the transactions are mostly instant

Yes, but other private BTMs don't have the same requirements. The national rail company operates all of these machines.

On this subject, I thought that a huge company such as Western Union really got destroyed by Bitcoin. But the way I see it, Western Union is just doing some positive steps to utilize Bitcoin to keep up with the latest trends in industry.

Bitcoin doesn't need to destroy WU.

Before the money transfer industry, WU was all about mail, telegrams and moving people. They could very well move coins in the future, everyone would be happy.

I've seen this happen to most countries in Asia well. After how well the gains have been, the outcome to prosperity in second / third world countries is amazing.

There are people living off BTC by holding faucet money. Don't doubt the importance of it's future either. Just like Satoshi expected, each and every country on this planet is opened up to the future of worldwide transactions while making surprising returns.

So the fee is around 6%, but what exchange rate is it and what about the maximum limit one can get? Is there some KYC stuff or can i just go there and pay in cash and get some coins?

Ummm..

The issue is not changing your CHF into bitcoin. It is the person on the other side having to change their bitcoin into their local currency.

Are there bitcoin ATMs in South Africa, Philippenes or Brazil? If there are not, it doesn't work for remittances.

I'm not surprised hear that news due I was tell to anyone one days, people will left western union due they can use bitcoin that give low fee transaction and if this news are true hopefully this is open people eyes from other country that most using westren union for send and received money.

What is people living off faucet money have to do with western union getting destroyed in Switzerland. How come one live off by claiming faucets and let me ask you how much time you will be wasting to get some real money.It is a option if you can automate things up other than that it is a complete waste.
Switzerland is following the technological changes and accepting it and Western Union have to come up with some crazy ideas or they can incorporate bitcoin into their business model.

That is marvelous that they sell Bitcoin for cash ! The inverse transaction would be even more useful in my case. Do you know something about it ? About Western Union since I do not even know what kind of services they offer, I can not say whether they will survive or not to Bitcoin.

Here's the thing feared by financial institutions such as banks, presence of bitcoin will certainly make financial services, and of course there will be a rejection of many of the parties that will keep campaigning to reject the bitcoin. For us as users of the bitcoin, surely this can we expect.

i think western union make new innovation with bitcoin and they don't have to be destroyed, as long as western union can give their best service to their members and make integrate with bitcoin, then people will know how to buy bitcoin with western union and of course this is a good news for bitcoin users itself. i am sure that in future, other payment gateway like paypal, perfect money, payza and others will do the same like western union and they can see the advantage of bitcoin.

Switzerland is getting popularity as one among the financial centre for digital currency development. Bitcoin has gained popularity long back and now with the introduction of Swisscoin it has got more acceptance within the country for reduced fee and avoiding dependence on banks and financial service providers like western union.

Contrary to popular belief, Swiss banks are not against bitcoin at all, they want to embrace it and offer bitcoin banking services, whatever that mean.
Local banks shouldn't be worried, but global companies offering only remittance services like Western Union, MoneyGram and Ria are right to be afraid of BTC.

 

You might not need ATMs for the receiving person to get their money. I believe we have 2 here in the Philippines but I don't even now where they are but we're doing just fine. It would really depend on what options are available in that country. One local bank here allows cashing-out in their traditional atms. You can also cash out in almost any bank here too, as well as pawnshops.


True, banks will always be useful even if everyone start doing most of their transactions in bitcoin. There are still need for loans and traditional banking will still be in business.

Yes, someone has even gone to the trouble of listing them in English on coinatmradar.com The Philippines has an especially strong ecosystem, it includes rebit.ph and coins.ph

But in most cases people do not visit a machines to receive remittance, they redeem the note/XBT with another person in the village/town.

Well, we cannot really expect privacy in a public space, as you have said there are cameras and other people, but unless you can earn your crypto online, there are not many options to get bitcoin privatelly and for no else but you to know about the transaction.

Western union is dead it just does not know it yet, its walking dead......  ;)

That news is very bad one for the Western Union for sure they are going to do anything just to attract their customers and win them back. But we can't blame bitcoin for it as we know that it is more convenient than using WU's service that needs a beautiful teller. Unlike with bitcoin you can just simply send it with your own with cheaper fees or else WU will just simply adopt BTC.

I always thought that a business like Western Union could use Bitcoin as a way to send money even if the customer didn't know they were using it behind the scenes. It's a good way to use the technology without people having to buy Bitcoins.

Remittance can only work, when people can send money from one destination to another at the same fee. The Swizz WU branch might have zero fees, but what about the person on the other side? How much is he paying on the other end, to receive that money?

WU/MoneyGram still have the advantage that they have on-ramp and off-ramp services globally for Fiat conversion, and this advantage is gradually eroded by the ease of use and user-friendly apps that are being developed to transfer Bitcoin globally. ^smile^

It definitely ought to have started with Switzerland because of their banking and secret prowess and I have no doubt the financial institutions are shivering to the spine by this news. Western union ought to be innovative enough and be more flexible else they will be destroyed.

WU uses their own accounting system to manage back office tasks, they don't have any use for Bitcoin per se.

WU's strength, like most businesses, is the scope and "stickiness" of its customer network. It's expensive to acquire a customer in terms of both time and money. So when another network comes along that acts as a substitute, that's really something they should be concerned about.

The real question I think is: "how close is WU getting to operating costs?" They still have about $1 Billion of buffer (https://corporate.westernunion.com/annual-report/pdf/annual-report.pdf), but it's decreasing each year....

Swiss banks can use bitcoin to be honest. It would be such a brilliant idea, get peoples Money and store them in bitcoin. When needed just cash it out like this. I believe this is a great example of how to use bitcoin.
I never thought about it this way. What if they do not even needed? What if people can store their own bitcoin!!! :D I mean Switzerland is the last country that would want bitcoin to succeed.

https://news.bitcoin.com/bitcoin-companies-legally-operate-switzerland/ :-* :-* :-*

Yeah bitcoin is growing for good in switzerland. This will be impacting a lot for the other's country.

Agreed, unless their business model starts to evolve now they will probably be out of business in 5 years. Their only advantage right now is their customers' general lack of education.

Speaking of privacy, your post now resides in the following complex in a special file with your REAL name on it:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-8-BqDI96WGI/U69fniwOwOI/AAAAAAAALlQ/WR4_ZuTaFoI/s1600/689px-Utah_Data_Center_of_the_NSA_in_Bluffdale_Utah_vectorized.svg.png

oh, what happened if you buy bitcoin in area where are cameras and situation is like in bank? What happened if you are using for legal things? Nothing..
Maybe it will destroy western union in switzerland but not huge damage for them. It has positive side, maybe they will try to add bitcoin worldwide transfer and that won't be bad news.

The Swiss mafia is everywhere and I bet they will gradually collapse western union because if they adopt Bitcoin fully and based on their banking history they might be able to hold up the secret and help people store up Bitcoin in Switzerland and help make it stronger than fiat and subsequently make Bitcoin transfers attractive than western union.

I don't think the issue is the legality of the use you are going to give to bitcoin but simply about your privacy rights, unfortunately this is a problem with everything and not only bitcoin, if you buy groceries with a credit card then the super market where you buy your stuff know exactly what you bought and when.

Had you bought groceries with silver bucks from your local store a few centuries ago, it would have been just the same. It not the information that is new in the game, it is the automated storage of that information, the communication (information in motion) and the computers to dig into it and deep learn from it that is new.

Side note:
 The Seattle city council has voted to divest it's holdings in western union. This yanks $3billion from them. They are standing with the standing rock Sioux tribe against the pipeline.

Great,Switzerland is now very friendly for bitcoin,services like WU or Money Gramm are going away,chinise have bought money gramm i ve been reading something thay will try use digital currencys
Maybe news that SNB is accepting bitoinare around corner and it is reason of price spike

Cool, but this was Wells Fargo, not Western Union (http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/environment/protesters-call-for-seattles-billions-to-be-pulled-from-wells-fargo-over-dakota-access-pipeline/)  ;D

Bitcoin starts spreads to remittance business, the transaction of bitcoin is fast than traditional transaction,
that are some beneficial bitcoin be compared with western union.
The people will choose bitcoin for sending the money than choose western union that has expensive fees
some time western union will be getting destroyed by bitcoin for all of countries.

With the stupid fees and limitations which WU has, this is really not a surprise. If this would spread out, I would be the first one who would transfer from WU to bitcoin, especially because it's easier to transfer un-taxed money via bitcoin then via WU.

I've seen such a post before with photos or some guy buying bitcoins in Switzerland this way but is WU really going away because of this? Can the opposite thing be done, can you buy euro for btc? If not then WU still has its advantage that you can actually get cash and buy something for it. Although I hear the taxation is very high there.

No, the taxation is not high, the fees are.

The transfer money is available to the second party in almost minutes, but for 1000 eur you pay almost 60 eur in WU fees, and the fee goes higher if you want to send more, on 2000 eur it's around 120 eur in fees etc. And the problem is that it's limited to 1500 eur per transfer/wu number (at least that was my experience), in case I'm sending 5000 eur to you, I pay 300 eur in fees, but you get around three MTCN numbers and you have to fill out three papers with the same data but different MTC to pick it up. If it's a small post office, you have to tell them that 24h before that you will come and pick it up.

Via BTC it's much easier, but you don't get the cash instantly...

Western Union should adopt to the changes of the times. Instead of getting crushed by bitcoin they must integrate bitcoin and use bitcoin in their remittance system or they will convert their system into an escrow system and enjoy the benefits from service fees. If western Union will not adopt bitcoin then sooner or later they will go bankrupt.

OMG your right.  :-[ Oops, sorry. I was remembering incorrectly an article I read earlier in the day. 

Nice to see Switzerland taking that bold stand for Bitcoin and hope other countries will stop sitting on the fence and embrace Bitcoin because it is actually here to stay. As for WU, MG and many companies out there that are too blind not to see change, even while standing right before them, "early bird eats the worm."

Whoa, that is really nice to have a bitcoin stand in our place too. Hope they have consider bitcoin as a currency that some other people used too here in our country. And I think there really will be a lot of stand like that if bitcoin is introduced to other countries like us. Though other bank s are accepting some, really money is still used to convert it.

Well I am not kind of shocked hearing this news because it was already happening all over the globe , bitcoin was really fast compare to traditional remittance center , you can get your cash instanly wtihin a day unlike other remittance center that requires lot of verification and fees and you need to wait for days ! I love bitcoin but I am not buying bitcoin in public because I want to stay anonimous .

Exchanger services like as Western Union, MoneyGram and many other have already take advantage of charging higher rates of commission for exchange fiat currency globally, but now time is changed people are also get aware about anonymous and decentralized digital currency. Which is more comfortable for user.

So In future third party exchange services will be shut down due to higher charges and time taken for transaction.

Bitcoin and few other decentralized platforms are already give a best option to user. Stellar and Ripple are one of them which supports cross border payment system.

Not unexpectedly, this feared by the bank after the presence of bitcoin. Everything looks messed up so that they will urge the State to prohibit bitcoin because could threaten the existence of the bank.

Most ATM machine had installed camera in all different places in then whole world. maybe for now your not interested in bitcoin, but in the long run you'll do gonna like too, because in your place sooner or later in some other places Bitcoin is accepted in different merchants over there.

This event will be followed in other countries, I'm sure when everyone knows the bitcoin then they never use Western Union services again. I think sending money by Western Union is troublesome and depending with hours of work when taking submissions.

yeah it looks like the government already knew about it, the potential for bitcoin is very large. its can make currency or bank becomes useless and disappeared as western union

You are lucky to live in such a great country. Thst is so sweet !! You csn just draw money like that with such ease. The fee is s bit high bit its ok I guess. So what else can you pay for with bitcoin there ?

And I am really being envious to the bitcoin users there, that is really efficient in that case i can draw money everytime whenever i needed without any delays.

If there will be one machine like that here in our country that will be very very helpful.

Western Union is getting destroyed in Switzerland is a simple thing as most were digitalized and knows how to handle it. In the rest of the world the Machine usage is decreased and exchange services were getting priority, because Machines levy high fee. I think in a city in Korea where 20 Machines in use has got reduced to the 3 or 5.

With bitcoins ability to be transferred to almost any part of the world with just small fees Western Union will sooner or later lost their market and get bankrupt. The only way for western union to overcome this losses they should convert their business into an escrow or an exchange. Their new business should be to exchange local currency to bitcoins and vice versa and of course they will add service fee to every transactions.

This doesn't really look to show any sort of domination by Bitcoin on Western Union in the least, it seems like more of a one time instance then full proof of domination by bitcoin.


As much as I'd love for bitcoin to become accepted worldwide and to gain traction mainstream, I personally doubt that it will ever fully happen. I believe that some developing / developed nations will use it and it will gain traction their but it won't gain world wide usage instead of FIAT. I'll without a doubt agree with you on WU sucking but people are still able to use FIAT without an issue so theirs that.

People don't like change, it bothers them.