Bitcoin Forum

And please, understand that i don't mean that the price will immediately pump to $10,000+, im just saying that if the SEC approves ETF (and it will, if not on 11th, then the next time, it will happen eventually) we will see new, never seen before, streams of money coming into bitcoin.

I don't know if you understand what ETF really means. This is huge for the non-geek investor to hold bitcoin. It will be possible for anyone to go into their local banks, and tell the employee to but you some COIN shares, anyone can do this. Once people get gains with that, it will spread, everyone can get in with no technical knowledge about bitcoin in a safe, regulated way. So all those old millionaires, or your regular person that just wants to hold BTC but isn't really sure how to do it, will be able to get in thanks to the COIN shares. Of course I personally recommend people to learn how to buy and hold actual BTC, but we can expect everyone to do that and COIN will be 'it', the missing link to get the average investor that is not into cryptography/computer stuff. This means potentially billions of increase on the marketcap. With some time price going x10 is perfectly plausible. How long it will take? I don't know, but it opens the door for that possibility to happen.

I agree with you that we will see an significant rise when its aproved. But it will not happen in march. So we we will see an significant dump in march. And i am fully prepared :) But when it is aproved we will see 10k easily within a year.

It's like buying "paper gold": if you can't hold the gold in your hand, you don't own it! The same with Bitcoin: if you don't own the private key, you don't own the Bitcoins.
Bitcoin isn't like any other share. What if the ETF managers mess up and "get hacked"? It happened to various exchanges. What makes you think this ETF will be any different? And why would you trust them with your money in the long term?

Don't get me wrong, I like the idea, but I have some reservations. I can also use the same argument in favor of the ETF: what if you lose your own private key? What if your wallet gets stolen? What if your own computer gets hacked and the hacker takes your Bitcoins? This has happened much more often than exchanges getting hacked, and a centralized ETF could protect your own Bitcoins when you fail to do so.

I can't respond to your $10k prediction, that's possible with or without ETF, just like $100 is possible. There is no upper and lower limit, only a combination of chances, greed and fear.

What makes you think that we will see a dump? You think it will not get approved? Let me remind you how Brexit happened against all odds, and Trump happened against all odds too...

So don't be so sure, if you short you may lose your coins quick.

I actually believed that brexit and trump would succeed. In the coming days we will see that the market will prepair for march. So expect an high volume in the coming days. Isnt that exiting :D

I just... Don't understand why they would approve ETF.

Well after I'm a newbie in economy so it's perfectly possible I'm wrong, but I just don't get why they would accept it.
What's even the point in fact?

why would they not? what do you think?

i think the main reason why it would be a no is that bitcoin is still too young and sketchy, but there are some real weird etfs out there already.

they're in the business of protecting investor interests. if enough investors want it, and i don't think that's the case at this stage, then their duty is to look into a way of letting get exposure in a safe manner.

Most of the old timers in Wall street with the huge cash reserves will not invest once the ETF is approved. They will wait until the price goes down

after the hype and then start buying. I see a small spike to $2000+ and then a sudden dump and then a steady climb upwards as the old timers

climb on board.  ;)

If you're referring to the elite with hundreds of millions (perhaps even billions) of investment capital per person, then they will just laugh at current price and its volumes. If they and institutional investors massively jump into Bitcoin by pumping hundreds of millions into ETF's, it will be their play toy, where current major Bitcoin exchanges will be degraded to fun/hobbyist services. It's of course pure speculation, but if this happens to become reality, then we will look at $2000 how we right now look at $200. Peanuts.

Yeah, that's kind of what I was thinking, but the gold price IS SET by the paper gold traders, not the physical retail gold buyers.  I don't really understand what's going on with this ETF thing.  I know what the term means, but I'm unsure how it's really going to affect bitcoin.  If at all.  We'll see.  It's definitely interesting.

Were they going to invest in the first place? I highly think not. >:(
They are and will continue to be against having anything to do with bitcoin and it's potential future.
They are all about old money of what they were brought up on and will continue to be until their dying breath.
They were raise on oil and security bonds and rely on their pensions for working for the last 55 years of their lives. So they are set to die and not give a flipping F about what comes next.
You really think they would want the stress of bitcoin of it's wild roller coaster rides of elevating ups and crushing downs? They will get a heart attack investing into bitcoin at the point of it's apex in their market.

yet trillions were thrown at the dotcom bubble at a time when not very many people understood how huge the internet would become. and they certainly didn't understand how shitty the companies they were throwing money at were.

bitcoin is of course not a stock and very different in many ways, but there are parallels.

Because I don't see the point!

An ETF for oil or gold is logical, because investors aren't going to actually buy solid gold or oil and stock it.
But BTC? What's the point to have a digital index for... A digital currency!?

tax advantages and security are good enough reasons for it to exist. if my elderly relative declared they were gonna get some bitcoin exposure they'd be better off doing it via their financial adviser rather than virwox and a burner phone.

You get tax advantages? Oo

Well ok for security for elderly people. On that one I can't say much it's probably important yeah ^^

you can put it in a retirement account of some sort i think. i'm not very familiar with the details.

even if someone isn't aware of how important security is, the convenience of it being just another listing on the sites investors normally use removes another barrier to entry. i wouldn't feel too comfortable recommending bitcoin with its current setup. there's alot to learn.

This may be happening in the following years, major entrepreneurs can buy bitcoin very easily through ETF fund. Very positive news for us.

Elderly relative? I would advise them to stay off Bitcoin and invest in (almost) risk-free products.
If Bitcoin crashes, they may not live to see the next boom.

waiting for the next rise would give them something to live for. and if they get bored they can cash in their etf, get some real coins and buy some barbiturates on the dark net to wrap things up on their own terms.

That would be a remarkable milestone to surpass and if does happen then all those bag holders will be cashing out their bitcoins for security funds in no time at all. ;)

That got dark quick...

I think even without ETF  Bitcoin will reach $10,000 if we are talking about the long term price of BTC.  Having all the issue with Bitcoin fixed or solved, Bitcoin will eventually get there at $10,000 a piece.  But if ETF will be approved, it will hasten Bitcoin to reach that price because of the massive investment pouring in the Bitcoin economy.

What issues do you mean? IMO bitcoin can definitely reach that price, not through "fixing it's issues", but rather through more adoption. Compared to the 2009 - 2012 era, both price and adoption have increased substantially.

I agree that the ETF is a very significant step in terms of bitcoin because non-technical investors can finally get into it. Personally I'd really like to introduce bitcoin to some of my older family and friends, but they're not very experienced with new technology so there's a high possibility that they might lose it all due to carelessness.

The ETF provides a way for the not-so-techy people to invest in bitcoin. Yes, you could argue that the Winklevoss twins' system could also be hacked like any other exchange, but that shouldn't really be the investor's problem. Since their target audience are non-technical people, their company should cover all the security measures needed. If not, there will be a lot of angry investors and that'll be a loss for everyone involved.

I think in a way bitcoin is a stock, or like an asset, an "internet protocol asset". It's like being able to buy shares of the TCIP/IP protocol, back then you couldn't so people were limited to buying good websites. I can imagine some guy buying a site like bodybuilding.com. Nobody gave a fuck back then, but now a simple forum like that is worth millions.

This is the same, but now we can buy the protocol itself in the form of BTC units.

It will be interesting to monitor the situation regarding ETF,if or when this happens it is very likely that a certain amount of fresh money will be pumped in bitcoin market and it will certainly affect the price goes up.This would be one of the easier ways to invest in BTC,and some new players would likely take advantage of this opportunity.

Regarding drop in price if ETF is not be accepted,it is possible that we can see small drop caused by this news,but I do not think that current price just depends on ETF approval.In my opinion, the reason is mainly in the measures implemented by the Chinese authorities on their exchanges.

I think still very dificult if bitcoin price in year can incraese until reach 10k dollar/bitcoin
although ETF and SEC aprove bitcoin i think still imposible is bitcoin price can incraese 10k dollar in year 2017

Most people are not concerned about ETF at all.Bitcoin is gaining popularity in India and China and they have not worried about ETF so there is no chance of some big dump.
Minor corrections is possible though after 11 March.

If you read the OP you would have known that he wasn't talking about this year. In the long term if everything keeps going in the right way, then the chances of reaching $10K will be on the higher side.

It's not only this ETF that will make a difference, but at some point we'll have plenty of them to choose from. One thing is sure, if we ever want to reach such price points, we must have larger blocks.

Without larger blocks it's simply impossible to serve a massive number of people at the same time. If you want to be the best, then you must be able to compete with the best. It's that simple.

Larger blocks + Lightning Network = BOOM!

ETF is the one that's gonna make a big change in the bitcoin price history. By the days after ETF approval there will be major pumping or dump based upon the approval. If price moves forward we can expect price above $3000 and of price drop occurs it would go close to $800.

Of course that is not going to happen.Even if we had 2 or 3 ETFs.
But that range would be possible in 5-10 years in my opinion.
If the ETF should get approved, what I still highly doubt, then a price of $2000 would be a possible target for this year.

I can imagine that there are people willing to buy funds that include bitcoin.
You can sell nearly everything if the advertisement is right.
For bitcoin I think it will gain a general plus in trust, even if the coins are not included in a trust.
So it is really possible to rech 10K within the next five years if we have a positive ETF vote.

I think $10,000 is definitely a realistic target but surely not for a couple of years at least? I'd be delighted to see $10,000 soon but I think we'll have to wait a while yet.

Yeah, bitcoin need to get that pending transactions confirmed faster in order to get more users on board. Once more people see how effectively bitcoin functions, then $10,000 will not be a problem. The ETF confirmation news will definitely be a big boost to bitcoin, but at the same time bitcoin needs to improve by having large blocks and lightning network. Hands down!

Yes, ETF or not, the price will tend to continue going upwards forever due the deflationary nature of bitcoin and the fact that its properties will keep getting increased demand, but having an ETF which allows a lot of people to get in the game without being technologically savvy is a great way to get things going faster than predicted.

well of course it would take like a few decades in order for this to happen, even it took a few years to reach a new all time high, for me it would be enough to at least reach 2000 dollars in like 5 years or something, everything comes with time when it comes to bitcoin, we just need to wait patiently and everything we want will be achieved. the next huge price growth is going to happen when segwit is going to be implemented or the block size is going to be increased.

I agree with this post and I believe its very likely to reach $10.000 in 5 years.
But I am scared of rejection chance, rejection would kill all the hype and it may return to $850s.

I think the $10000 figure can be reached between 3 to 4 years, depending on the adoption of bitcoin in the world.

Who knows what will happen in the next 10 days, but if ETF is approved, we will see lower prices immediately afterwards, which does not mean that they will be lower than today.
Check out the GLD chart. First 4-6 mo-flat to down after an initial spike, from $44.38 on day 1 (Nov 1, 2004) to $41.26 next May.
The equivalent would be btc at 1230 now and $1143 six months later (or COIN at $12.3 to $11.43 if it starts at the same price as today, which is probably doubtful).

If ETF is rejected, there will be a small correction maybe, but it will not last for long. I'll be waiting to buy the dip. . .

I think bitcoin reaching 10000$ in price ain't possible on post ETF era maybe it will be possible years from now not after ETF has been approved. I agree with the others though that there will be a slight correction when ETF is rejected so for those who want to buy bitcoin wait for it there is a chance that ETF will be rejected. As a bitcoin user though, I really hope that ETF will be approved for it's price to rise more.

My dear!
Have you read the opening post closely?!
He explicitly wrote that the $10k won't happen over night!
This is a process which will take several years. And in that case I totally agree with that opinion. In 5-10 years, when probably 1 or 2 ETfs will exist, and 2020 after the next halving, and Bitcoin being seen more and more legitimate and serious over the years by big investors...5 figures can become reality without a doubt.

In terms of your last sentence. I don't think it's the right time for an ETF now.Way too early.Bitcoin needs be more mature.
But it will happen.Just a question of time.

Agreed, its too early for an ETF, BTC needs to get a few things ironed out first, like its scaling issues. Once Segwit is implemented, it would be a good time to introduce Bitcoin to the rest of the world.

i disagree with when you are putting it like this.
the $10,000+ price is still possible without ETF and with it. the only change that it can have for bitcoin is a very small more publicity and then that may lead to more people investing in bitcoin directly by going to one of the exchanges like coinbase and buying bitcoin to hold.
if they go to bank as you said and buy coin shares it won't change anything for bitcoin, its adoption and the price of it.

and i disagree with saying "bitcoin shares for not tech non geeks" because these days opening a wallet and using bitcoin is as easy as opening a paypal account. check out coinbase if you don't believe me. and although i don't like it but it is a good option for any newbie.