Bitcoin Forum

I thought at first that Bitcoin will be a currency to be used in the future. But from what I am seeing here is that it will be treated as a stock, it is even compared to gold. What do you guys think?

This has been brought up before, but my take on it is that bitcoin is a lousy currency, even though it can be used as one (and is).  The price fluctuations are definitely those of a penny stock, but bitcoin's valuation definitely isn't.  And bitcoin doesn't represent a business, as shares in a company do.  It's a strange bird.  Even though it's not technically a stock, I kind of think of it as that more so than a currency.

Edit:  Franky1 said it best a few posts below.

If you think so for now this is true as well, because bitcoin is still a lot of countries that have not yet received it as a currency, and therefore most people use bitcoin as the shares traded in the market

yeah i was thinking the same as you but because of the nature of decentral bitcoin where often occur price changes and the users often make bitcoin as an investment, though I didn't problem it but the value of bitcoin as a currency in the second place after the investment

I would say, in financial terms, bitcoin more closely resembles a commodity. I do believe it was designed to behave like digital gold so perhaps there should be no surprise there.
Now we can make big international remittances by sending bitcoin, rather than sending a shipment of gold!

EDIT: And bitcoin has an ISO currency code similar to gold, XBT rather than XAU.

Bitcoin has a lot going for it as an investment option, even though the intention is for it to be a currency. It has not really took off as a virtual currency because it is not yet widely used, but as a form of investment, much like any other speculative investments in the market, I think it has more than lived up to expectations and still breaking new highs as of this writing. We can expect that more people are going to be more attracted to it as something to add in their portfolio because of the way it has outperformed most other existing investments available.

Bitcoin is truly a store of value. Later on people started to adopt bitcoin which in turn increased the acceptance rate. Further the same served as a payment portal and as an alternate currency. Due to the potential now it has gained the ability to get used as a investment. Now based on the fluctuations similar to stock market users consider it as a stock.

Bitcoin is meant to be a payment method, a currency. Atleast that is what I understood when I read the whitepaper. But since it is fast acquiring value in exchange to fiat, it is a good store of value or investment. And that is what others are taking advantage right now.

Bitcoin, and the altcoins, do not trade differently than fiat currencies. Price changes may be more volatile with cryptocurrencies (except for maybe in comparison to the Venezuelan bolívar), but trade the same nonetheless. I don't consider them stores of value.

nope a commodity is a raw material used to create other produce.
gold=jewellery +electronics
oil= fuel+plastic
wheat=bread+animal feed
beef=hamburgers+steak

bitcoin is an ASSET.
gold.. has 2 categories. as a raw material it is a commodity. but as a final product, it is an asset.

bitcoin resembles golds 'values' in its asset category market. not its commodity category market.

dont confuse bitcoin as a commodity by not understanding that gold sits on 2 markets.

EG
grannies gold necklace(asset) grannies necklace hold value that can be passed down to relatives or used for barter in pawn shops or between people privately, but has a different value than gold in commodity markets sold to industry.

When it comes to bitcoin many options will arise like payment method, commodity, legal currency. But when it comes to my consideration bitcoin should be like gold because gold has long term history and it has spread to worldwide. So if bitcoin becomes like gold then there will be the huge demand for bitcoin because the supply of bitcoin is less when compared to gold.

@franky1, that is only one definition of commodity. Another one is (Oxford dictionary):

a useful or valuable thing

or in investment jargon:

More generally, a product which trades on a commodity exchange; this would also include foreign currencies and financial instruments and indexes.

In a lot of jurisdictions, I believe including the US and UK, bitcoin has been placed in the commodity asset class for legal and tax purposes.

People do different types on how they gonna treat bitcoin some say its a currency,stock,commodity or any other terms but one thing is for sure bitcoin is really worth to hold because of its increasing prices.Its either a stock or whatsoever we do have still one aim.

Yes, everyone has a different view with bitcoin. Indeed bitcoin could also be considered as a currency because it has features such as:

Instant transfers in a peer to peer.
Transfer to anywhere
The transfer fee is very small.
The transaction is irreversible, meaning that once transferred can not be undone.
Bitcoin transactions are anonymous.
Bitcoin is not controlled by agency or any government.
A limited amount

Features like that that make bitcoin considered as a currency because it can be used for transactions. But bitcoin can also be considered as a commodity because it is tradable and have active international markets. Maybe someone would consider bitcoin as a currency or commodity because of the way they use it.

Another point of view is Bitcoin is a ledger. The coin itself is not a coin but a part of the ledger that you control through the private keys you hold and have the responsibility of securing. From that definition Bitcoin can also be considered as a receivable.

Bitcoin have zero inflation, its supply is limited just like gold or more than that so over time with increasing demand price of bitcoin will have steady rise so it is treated as trading assets just like gold. But it is more convenient than gold to send from one place to another as a form of payment so it can act like currency also.

Gold is still used as a form of payment, actually the fiat are backed by gold.

all the definitions and wordplay with "currency/commodity/asset/etc" aside, bitcoin was supposed to be a peer to peer digital money so it should be used as a currency too. but since it is still being adopted and price is rising because of the inflation people treat it as an investment.
aside from that not so many places accept bitcoin yet.
and on top of that with all the spam attacks and small block size it is turning into a hard thing to think of bitcoin as a currency.

In an environment when a new technology are introduced, some definitions and regulations will take some time to be properly defined and regulated. The problem with Bitcoin is, it has several "utilities" for which it can be applied and this makes it more complex.

You will have one country defining it as a commodity and another as a asset and some even a currency. So as time goes by, the regulation will catch up and the definitions will be clearly defined. ^smile^

you are right. I don't know the rationality before people compared bitcoin with gold and now pushing for it to be  approve by Security and exchange commission (sec) to be trade like stock on American stock exchange market. Speculation has set their minds on ETF approval or not without thinking that treating bitcoin as stock will undermined it value as a currency.

You can look at bitcoin as an investment, even a stock, or it can be seen as a currency.
It has qualities of both. The definition what it is in the end lies with the governments, the courts or the central banks.
So it can be different in every country.
Users don't have much of a say how the definition will finally be. But it would be good to have one in order to give the people some security of how to handle it.

Presently, Bitcoin is a financial asset

The word asset means that you use it to earn profits. In this aspect, it differs from, say, a house where you happen to live. But if you rent out your house, it will be an asset too (a tangible asset, more specifically). So the difference lies not in the nature of things themselves, but rather how you are going to use them. Financial here refers to the fact that the asset doesn't have intrinsic value (i.e. direct use or inherent utility outside of finances). In this way, fiat money can used as a financial asset as well. For example, you can trade currencies earning profits from exchange rate changes and volatility. On the other hand, gold can be used as an asset too ("buy low, sell high"), but it is not a financial asset since it has a lot of applications in various industries and as jewelry

Just like other currency, commodities and stuff that can put your investment in, Bitcoin was really treated as one of the things that you can put some of your investments in, there are some profiting investment application that includes bitcoin in the lineup of commodities that you need to predict if it's value is going down or up.

Does no one think that it doesn't matter how Bitcoin is used or thought off? Each and every person will think differently. Each and every person will argue over it concept, do we really need to say hey you can't think of this, no you can't do this. I feel there no need for this question as it's purely to the individual mind as to how he shall see it and interpret it. It will also depend on peer pressure ans his local knowledge. Each one is free to decide how and what ways should he choose to understand or compare Bitcoin with, you can't force some one to change. However gold and btc have no comparison one is a currency other is a metal. Maybe it's compared to show one could make more money in the investment of it as a asset, however that would be wrong as both are different asset class.

I like to think about stocks being the slowest method of making money when comparing it to other things (trading).

Bitcoin has different exchanges that are open all days of the week.

"Size does matter after all"

I suspect that you err heavily. It is not the question of personal beliefs and convention, it is not the question of how people see Bitcoin or interpret it. More specifically, this question has a very practical importance since Bitcoin's ultimate fate depends on how it is used right now and how it is going to be used in the future. Indeed, we may refer it to any class or group as wee see appropriate and that likely won't change a thing. But this itself doesn't mean that Bitcoin may not actually belong to such a group or class, either in full or in part. And correctly determining its role (which is impossible without proper classification), we wouldn't be able to foresee or foretell its future

is not fiat money also so is there an exchange between the dollar and other currencies, it is also not much different from the bitcoin function to present this to a stock can also be as currency any more, that's for sure just now much busier in his stock

practically stock is also trading, you trade stocks the same way. you may be thinking about a different thing though.
because in stocks market you buy stocks from the market with the same way you buy anything else in trading (like trading gold, bitcoin, altcoins, Forex,...) and then sell it the same way on top to take some profit out.

in case of bitcoin I have to say it is being mostly treated like a "stock" in a sense that it is only being traded and not really used as a currency and that in the long run can not be good.

Currently it is considered as a "stock" or "commodity" which can be traded or is hold as investment, more than using as currency. Even if its used as payment processor, later it is converted into local currency. So mostly it is used for investing.


And stocks are being traded or invested on, stock/commodity is common term for both trading and investing. Yes, trading gives faster profits, but with higher risks. Whereas investing are also profitable sometimes might be slower but not always, with lower risks.

Bitcoin is both a stock and a currency. It is a stock since it can be traded and many are holding it to gain profit. But it is also a currency since you can also use it to buy things online, eat in some restaurant using bitcoins, drink coffee in starbucks, ride on a taxi, go to school with bitcoins and many more. Though there are only selected business or institution that accepts bitcoin but the fact that there are people accepting bitcoin in exchange for goods and services it is already a good example that bitcoin is a currency.

It's depend on the people, bitcoin was created as a currency, however because of the high demand, bitcoin has become an investment, and as investment bitcoin value rising is so fast, so most of the people used bitcoin as an investment because it is very profitable and had a huge potential to become really expensive in the future

Why do we need even classify bitcoin and compare it to something already existing? Even top professional economist can't agree upon what bitcoin really is.
Last time I checked bitcoin was considered both currency and commodity in the US. Why don't we came up with new completely new definition?
Stop comparing bitcoin to gold, other precious metals or stocks, bitcoin is a new invention and should be treated as such.

Bitcoin is both currency and stocks like gold. Bitcoin is a perfect payment solution while as if you can store bitcoin for long term you will earn very good amount of profit because with increasing demand and decreasing supply of bitcoin, price will rise constantly.

Definitely an asset. Until it's accepted in more places, NOT ONLINE, i.e retail stores, it won't be see as much else.

Also it's still decently hard to get BTC in most countries. I.e you have to go through quite a bit of effort and cost sometimes (i.e fees to send a wire transfer to some exchange)

you can always easily use other methods. you don't have to necessarily use an exchange service to get bitcoin.
for example i just sold some coins to someone in my country completely peer to peer and the other party used his bank (debit) card to transfer the money to my account with zero fees. and his price was just 1-2% below the market.

well gold isn't a stock, it's a commodities, and in the usa bitcoin is treated as a property not as a stock, where do you live? to be treated as a currency you need first to develop an huge acceptance from all the merchants, and you need that employers use bitcoin instead of fiat to pay their employees, but to do this, the government need to eliminate its currency

Well, in my country (Indonesia) it is indeed treated as a stock. The government doesn't assume it as a currency, because according to our law that the only currency that can be used in our country is IDR (Indonesian Rupiah). But even tho the government treats it like that, I still treat my Bitcoin as a currency and I use it as the way I use the national currency.

It is common sense Bitcoin as a currency can be treated as a stock even all fiat currencies is treated like a stock which they have FOREX (Foreign Exchange). If you mean a stock which has price differences from ups and downs then everything that has demand can be treated as one simple as that. Bitcoin is no different than fiat currency, the only difference that I see is that Bitcoin is more volatile than Fiat.

How do they TAX Bitcoin in your country? Do you pay VAT on every Bitcoin purchase you make or do you pay extra import duties for the purchase

if it was done in another country? We pay a type of capital gains on the "profit" you made, when you sell it... and you have to declare all your

income when you go past a specific amount.  ???

Bitcoin isn't a stock. It is an asset and if the ETF things gets approved then the wallstreet guys will try to make it a stock. In my opinion, Bitcoin can't be called a stock because the wallstreet people will try to put a different ticker symbol on Bitcoin instead of BTC, so that isn't BTC anymore -it's a whole new thing.
It's kind of like how some people did that XBT from BTC, it just doesn't look the same. Bitcoin is just code.

Technically no, you are wrong. Bitcoin still has some inflation as long as there are Bitcoin left to mined. I do not know the exact figures are on how much the annual "inflation" is but the discussion has been done in the forum before.

Your thought did not made you wrong. How do you say that there are thousands of transactions that are unconfirmed everyday? It is indicating that bitcoin is being used as currency for such transactions.


That's the feature of bitcoin, it's not just a single currency but it's like an all in all type of money. When you save then you are actually investing into it already. And stock isn't the right word but hold.

Well according to me bitcoin can be used both as stock and cirrency .if u hold the stock and wait for the price hike and sell it, u can buy whatever with that profit .as even to say then miners hold shares and it will be used as currency in the future.

It's not a problem even many of us are holding a lot of bitcoins and treat it as a stock.

But don't forget that it will be used as an online crypto/currency in the future. So there's no need to think about it.

Bitcoin will remain on what it is right now but I'm sure that there will be some developments in the future.

Others treated bitcoin as a stock because of adoption. Its likely holding and investing that may earn as well. Bitcoin is really treated as online currency were it uses to buy stuffs. Therefore, bitcoin treated as stock and currency that i beleive it has a good future.

Bitcoin at the moment is having a high intensive usage when it comes to people using it for trading on a daily basis in order to make money off of it. I'll have to say it is nice having people interested in our little work of art here, but I'd rather not have less people adopt people based on high volatility because the traders would like to make some good money off this on a daily time-frame.

Personally, I'd rather have less liquidity and a more stable price then a very high amount of liquidity and a crazy volatile price that can allow you to lose all of your money (USD) in bitcoin within an hour.


With the amount of trading that occurs, and the amount of more trading that is going to occur with the (maybe?) approval of the ETF it's going to be treated like a stock more and more and there's nothing we can do about others ambitions.

Bitcoin, and other popular cryptocurrencies, are so versatile in what they offer different users.

So many uses cases; the volatility is tantalising for some, and a big turn off for many others. I have yet to make an "everyday" purchase with Bitcoin, I treat it more as a stock option which has been massively frustrating for me of late.

Nope, as I say before that the government like closing their eyes with this. They don't care about what we are doing with Bitcoin, that's why we don't have to pay any tax. The only tax I have to pay when making a transaction is only for the blockchain or the site that I use.

It seems like you are confusing something here

Liquidity is no case synonymous with volatility (you shouldn't misinterpret liquid as volatile here). Liquidity basically stands for trading volume (technically, it is not quite so but still pretty close, i.e. high trading volume typically follows high liquidity), so more liquidity actually contributes to less volatility, not the other way round. If a market is said to have high liquidity, it means that there are many buy orders opened at any price so you could quickly sell your coins (i.e. "liquidate" or close your position)


That would be quite a surprise if this ETF does get approved after all

yes almost near to stock. people are comparing bitcoin with gold and ot valuable stock assets. Its 1 bitcoin which will always be 1 bitcoin but only its value will change and like USD and INR their value also keeps fluctuating so the same is with bitcoin.
Usually most of the less active people in the internet bought the Bitcoin as a stock and hold it for one to two year or more .
All means is that people are using bitcoin like the gold and silver assets which are useful and profitable for long but but luckily Bitcoin proves it's best in comparison with gold and silver .

This topic has been discussed it already I just don't know what section, but let answer and give my opinion. Bitcoin cannot treated as a stock.  as far as I know bitcoin and gold are both trade able but bitcoin is differ than gold because it can be use as online payment while gold is not, So meaning in that point bitcoin is treated as stock. This is just in my opinion.

I also think that, because right now it's still very little bitcoin scope of movement. So if we are not utilizing prices bitcoin then, use bitcoin is absolutely useless. Now I also use bitcoin as a place of investment, because using bitcoin can I get huge money only in a matter of days or years. Although bitcoin has the advantage, but we should also be able to use the bitcoin is reasonably. Because if not then it is feared will give bad impact
 

But do you honestly think that bitcoin is not a currency right now? but if you are thinking about making bitcoin a currency of the future and speaking of it bitcoin will become the only currency available? I think it is a negative and other countries would find this as a no for them I think every country does want their own currency for them to use and for me bitcoin is a currency for the world and I think that is a great currency that anybody can use!

Though bitcoin is a currency but we cannot deny that it can still be considered as a stock. Bitcoin is both a currency and a stock and the only way for bitcoin to be listed out as a stock is when it will become a fully independent currency. As of this moment bitcoin is relying and being backed up by the fiat currencies and it cannot stand alone and that is the main reason people are treating it as a stock.

Only a tiny portion of bitcoins is used as a currency

For example, many members of Bitcointalk are participating in signature campaigns (me included), and they are paid with bitcoins. This is how currency should be used (in this case, it is a payment for service provided). But most of these members are then either selling their remuneration for fiat (including speculation at exchanges) or just hoarding the coins away. This is not how currency should be used, and such non-currency use of this coin dominates the Bitcoin landscape. So can we actually consider Bitcoin as a currency if it is not used as a currency, for the most part?

If you think that way USD is a stock too. By holding USD you are a shareholder of the United States of America  ;D

USD is centralized by FED and FED owns the money, but they give you the right to hold them.

On the other hand bitcoin is decentralized (or so they tell us) and every person has the same right as the amount they own.

It may be an advantage or a disadvantage, depending how you look at it.

Some people would want their stock to has an owner so you will have somebody to complain when they had a problem.
When you had a problem with bitcoin, whom would you complain about it? You are simply fcked. Irreversibly.

Yes Bitcoin has semblance of currency and a commodity, the last time I checked it was listed by the Commodities Futures Trading Commission as a commodity so it's no wonder it's being treated as stock.

Bitcoin is currency to be use in the future. Why? Because many people treat this like money too, so for me they will use it in future. They use bitcoin like a stock because they saw that many people use bitcoin like a stock.

I don't think that "Stock" is the right term to use in bitcoin, yes, we are storing it on our bitcoin wallet, but it doesn't mean that it is a stock. It can only be called a "stock" if you are not even using it in any ways, but if you are using it in different transactions, then it can't be called a stock at all. Those people who have invested all of their money in bitcoin and not using it because they are waiting for the right time 'till bitcoin reached it highest peak that it could ever reach, then I guess that is when the term "stock" is going to be appropriate to use.

And it is always being compared to gold by many people here, some of them maybe just can't accept that they have invested their money on gold instead on bitcoins, that is why they are debating about this, if what is better between the two, though, we all know bitcoin is much better than gold.

Stock means you have a share over the properties of a particular corporation. Hence, it is not a stock at all! There is no corporation to speak about and there is no properties bitcoins represent. It is just plainly a "digital number" which we just actually give some value to. Without users giving value to bitcoins it is actually nothing. Most jurisdictions that defined bitcoin considered it as a commodity more than anything else.

Bitcoin can be used as both, currency or store of value.

Yes Bitcoin has characteristics of both currency and a commodity on the stockb exchange and so it's no news that it's being treated as a stock. I believe the future if money is to possess both traits of a currency and a commodity and this is the direction Bitcoin is spearheading.

Bitcoin is treated as a stock is a wrong pronounce it should be stated as bitcoin is treated as commodity as gold, because you can do trading and even now its value is above the gold price and it is very good for investing purpose also as in long term you can expect any amount of percentage of appreciation.