Bitcoin Forum

What it does it shows us, you ask?

Well, very simple: This shows how easy the price of bitcoin can be pumped if there is FOMO. So imagine that big pockets move small amounts of their portfolios into bitcoin. Even without a ETF, we would be in $10,000+ in DAYS with continued FOMO.

People forget the marketcap for bitcoin is tiny, and rises can look like massive green candles easily.

1 btc = 10K at the end of the year, and 100 K at in 2020. Confirmed. No i dont use facts , look at the f**king chart

Sellers are having a field day!  :(

right, there will always be sellers and buyers but what i do not get is why sell at this moment at a lower price .

It shows us how easily Stop Buy, and Stop Sell orders can be triggered by exchange insiders.

On Stamp, a big bunch of break out Stop Buy Orders were triggered. On Finex, where they have margin trading, Stop Orders on both the long and the short side of the equation were triggered, hence the total wipe out candle on that exchange.

Currently, Bitcoin is just a few 0.X% above where it was when the shenanigans started, but a whole bunch of Bitcoiners are considerably poorer, with a very 'special' select few being much richer.

total fkn smash n grab. If Bitcoin were regulated, this would be getting investigated.

NO.
you are confusing market cap size with orderbook size.

this is the clear example that the exchanges and their orderbooks are too small to handle a moderate amount of sell/buy.

and no price can not go to $10,000 in days the same way it can not go to $100 in days because there is always resistances. there are lots of order triggers that will kick in and there are even more alerts that will lead to people act on them by depositing fiat/bitcoin and buy/sell respectively.
in the end it will be slowed down.

After watching that today, it is not of the question for $2,000 to be touched TODAY if ETF is approved.  I think the bigger gains would come in the weeks to follow as it begins trading.

However, ETF rejected will probably result in sharp jolting selloff that will probably get into the 700's before spiking back up to around $900.

Thats my prediction, hopefully we get some long awaited clarity today.

it did also show, today  the tree is shaken harder then normal. Market is being played harder today,  a spike and then 1 hour later the price is going back to where it started.

Thinking that we will reach 10k in matter of days is just impossible even if ETF gets approved and hype kicks in at higher gear it will not happen. highest we will go based on a yes will be 1500-1800USD and that is not bad if we can keep that level for couple of months and build support

Well the aftermath of this ETF denial has shaken the tree and dropped the price.
But now today is when the recovery process begins. ;D
It is nearing $1100 again since it's massive drop to $986 just a week or two ago.
Being the last day of this roller coaster month I think it will stabilize now and will keep above $1100 going forward.
Let's all hope it does that is! :-[

Usually when people create threads about moon and FOMO then it is a sign of a correction sooner or later, and all because of a rise of a few dozen of dollars

I would be careful now and I expect at least one more drop in the $900 and $800 in the next 2 or 3 months, then true recovery, unless something unexpected happens

mother fucker :D

FOMO MOFO  :D

HODL, MOFO's gonna have FOMO and then we CCMF

Only if the fear exists...right now there is no fear of missing out. How does the initial rise get triggered to send waves of fear (of missing out) through the market place around the world?

Don't know how much FOMO there was whilst plummeting from $1300 to $870 or wherever it was that we dropped down to before rebounding.  I agree that the market can be moved by big players and concerted effort(s) by a lot of different little players.  The market is relatively small, but it's bigger than your average penny stock (I think).

All we need is a whale to make a big order and the price could move. Some big investors who wanted to invest in the ETF could decide to buy bitcoins directly. This would fuel a self sustaining rally.

none of these are needed for a rise. just let the pumping phase end in the altcoin markets and then watch bitcoin price move up to the moon.
all the money has gone into the altcoin market and it is being doubled every couple of days and that money will come back to bitcoin in a short while because we are reaching the end of the phase. and when it comes back, the accumulation below $1100 is also going to be over and price will start rising.

A lot of bitcoin whales are tired, A lot of the migration to the altcoin. It makes opening the gate of the massive pump for the altcoins. Which mean the greedy dev must not to continue his fuckin political argue to get more control in order to get benefits from the bitcoin itself.

More whales are migrating to the altcoin right now. At the same, the useless argue about the scalability of bitcoin still continue.

It won't last.  Bitcoin is still stable at a high price, and the Ethereum whales pumping it aren't actually taking it far enough to significantly dent Bitcoin's credibility.

when viewed as a whole in my opinion is starting to be seen a significant increase. The most needed now is the consistency of the movement of the prices bitcoin steady rise .

haha, what a funny comment.
dude you know nothing about how market works :)

"whales being tired" that is the most meaningless comment i have read in a long time. a trader who is tired of trading, quits trading and goes on a vacation. others who are still trading, pause their bitcoin trading and go join the altcoin pumps and make more money to come back to bitcoin even stronger.

and everyone actually wants you to believe they have given up so that you sell your coins cheap (like the 900 range) and then buy it back from them at higher prices (like 1300)

it shows that bitcoin is so volatile and its price can drop so suddenly and the price of bitcoins could go up so rapidly . we can conclude at this poiint that lets assume we are sleeping the whole night and in the morning we can expect that the price of bitcoins could go as low as possible,well then it will be the best time for buyers.

It can be the opposite way too, sleeping the whole night and in the morning we might see btc price pumped 2X or more or with a huge difference that's what every holder is waiting for in my opinion and if that time comes surely it will go back to original price or a dump presenting an opportunity to buy cheaper bitcoins. It does not show only how volatile bitcoin's market is but it also shows that many transactions really do happen in bitcoin resulting for a huge pump or dump to occur.

I think that often it's not bitcoin that is pumped or dumped.
It's the altcoins, and bitcoin is the center where the money is usually parked.
If an alt gets pumped, the money goes away from btc, and it comes back when the alt is dumped.

pump and dump is a manipulation of the market and any price resulting from a pump will never stay around which means that would be a fake pump.

if bitcoin was pumped the price would have gone down already, back to $200 level but as you can clearly see if you check some charts, price is not only not going down but also it is rising with much strength. and when in the long run price goes up that means the demand is increasing. in other words bitcoin has real price and it is not pumped.

I thought a pump was just a mere word that tells it is increasing. So that deepens it.
I dont really think like that in bitcoin, It is more of making people buy bitcoin then make the demands go higher to make the value also bigger. Dont mind if it is a pump or a dump as long I see it back to the price that I want. If not, then hold again.
This increase tells me that those who panicked from the fall to just $900+ are getting back their coins which is a lost to them.

yeah, pump has a specific meaning in economics.
you can read these two:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pump_and_dump
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/p/pumpanddump.asp
i like this deffinition from investopedia:
Pump and dump is a scheme that attempts to boost the price of a stock through recommendations based on false, misleading or greatly exaggerated statements.

it is exactly defining what has been happening in altcoin market.

i don't think that pump and dump is always manipulation, buyers and sellers don't know each other and they can buy for whatever they believe and the sellers also sell for their own reason, can happen that the value go high and low because of randomness caused by their decisions

if we are referring to some big projects i can agree with your statement mate, as we see movements between buying and selling coming from exchange those who's in the buy side really believes that something will happen and holding the project will benefits them in the long run same
thing with the seller might be already gaining enough profits or they have some personal reason why selling what they have, in the case of btc for me its already have value inside investors mind so we will continue seeing the fluctuation and enjoy the system.

as i explained and added two links above, going up and down doesn't mean pump and dump. that is a bigger rise and a rise without a logical reason.

pump doesn't have to be verbal either. there are so many different ways of manipulation, the most obvious one is the verbal advertising it like what ethereum does every now and then to pump it.

maybe my English is bad!!!, read those links, you will understand it easeir.

Buyers and sellers does not need to know each other,but manipulation occurs when there is a massive sell order and people who is holding the coins would panic seeing those high sell orders and thinking that the price would crash, people starts selling everything they hold and that is how manipulation works most of the time and a small news would aid in the price movement.

I agree that FOMO definitely increase the demand for Bitcoin and people will buy in whatever price the seller throw them because of they do not want to missed out the train of Bitcoin.  I also observed that even with the rejection of its latest ETF case,  Bitcoin price is unaffeced and continue to rise.  This means Bitcoin does not need ETF approval and lastly even with this Bitcoin political drama, price keep on recovering, what more if the scaling issue is fixed.  This only means one thing, Bitcoin beyond the moon!

We will always have sharp drops and sharp increases in price with bitcoin, it has been like this since the beginning and only those staying idle and are bystanders will regret, how many times should you see price dropping $200 staying there for 3-7 days and again start to rise back up to make you believe in bitcoin?
Da*n even when price fluctuates 2% you could earn more than $20 trading only 1BTC now imagine the current market with a volume of $400M+ every day, all that will happen certainly isn't crashing but value increased over time year after year.

Even some unpopular altcoins had some unexpected rise in their price now we're talking about bitcoin which is the most popular crypto.

i will never understand the fascination of people for comparing bitcoin with altcoins or even mentioning them in a bitcoin related topic.
i mean yeah, altcoins have had pretty good rises in the past and they continue to have them and there is a lot of profit there but the rise of the altcoins is not similar to bitcoin at all. they are fake pumps which is always followed by a bigger dump and they eventually die off withing 1 or 2 months.

now where is the similarity!

this will happen, but only if the blocksize debate is settled once and for all.

As soon as the debate is finished it's immediately (within a month, maximum) 10k.

There is something you should take into consideration - Price will surely go up when Segwit gets activated, but it's not a proper long term solution with its 2MB caps. After a year or two the same discussions will come to life as by that time, blocks will once again be full as is the case right now. Demand is strong, don't underestimate that. But to reach $10,000 levels, it will require a good number of years to build up the price. $2000 is a good start when Segwit gets activated.

While I hoped that people would get tired of debating the blocksize indefinitely, this doesn't seem to be the case. Unfortunately, the price of Bitcoin will be restrained until this comes to an end.

but how is the guy who is dumping with a big sell order, going to knwo that his dump will cause a panic seller, and so inducing a market manipulation? this is just an assumption imho, the big guy that sell a huge amount of coins, need to force the other to sell to buy cheap coins, and it's not that easy as many believe, most of the time the rise and fall you see are just normal trading on the market

Some exchanges ARE regulated (Gemini, GDAX), but strangely traders don't want to use them, they prefer the unregulated exchanges where they get taken for a ride.

I think that you are right about pump and dump: pumped coin or price wont last for long, sooner or later the price will drop, or the coin will dissapear (if weak enough).

Anyway i cannot agree with your words, that bitcoin isn't pumped at all: sir, hell yeah it is.
You cannot see the pump until the price of asset goes down a lot and only then you can see it was overpriced, but with big amounts of money pump may stay for a long time: price jumps (result of pumping) and that triggers the part of the market to book their profits or even hop into the trend which may cause even bigger raises.

Psychology of a crowd plays a big part in it.
When a crowd spots some big player spends a lot of money to get a big slice of a pie, the crowd (most of it) will follow him, in trust that he knows what is he doing.

If it is timed with the bad press, and some other major FUD like the announcement of the exchanges about BU and fork.  It is not that hard to think of it.  This has been proven several times and even used multiple times by whales to drive the price of Bitcoin lower.  But then when it is a manipulated dump it will gradually recover because manipulator need to move the price up after the accumulation to take another batch of profit.

People tend to rationalize everything. Another trait that people have, especialy when lacking in knowledge, is trying to make things either too simple or too complex. Actualy the reality is neither fully rational nor very simple nor too complex to explain relativly easily.

The people that have heard the term pump and dump, try to explain every market behaviour by it. Thats understandable. People in general tend to avoid getting into risky sittuation. Calling everything that happens in a market a very risky sittuation give them mental security.

Its not true that bitcoin is a penny stock that is suspectible to pump and dump mechanism. The price of penny stocks are mostly relativly stable outside of times of huge spikes in price, following by huge drops. Bitcoin price is constantly volatile, with overall rise in value over time, so it does not have the characteristics of a penny stocks. Those characteristics have many other pump and dump altcoins.

Another reason why bitcoin is not a subject of pump and dump is that after a huge unreasonable and irrational spike in price, following correction stops at the prices a lot higher than before the spike. That means that the correction in price is just that a market correction and not a dump that was preceded by a pump.

It also show us there are a lot of bots around doing the trading instead of humans since there is not a way for the price to move that quickly in such a short amount of time.

Maybe that is true but the least that we can do bout it is be happy. This past weeks had been weeks of temptation and stress because the price is low. Many people had been  waiting for this, for the price to  move up and even if I expected it to get low again because many people will sell due to financial needs, I am still happy that it is showing increase. No one knows if it will continue to get high or to what price will the increase stop, what matters here is that it is increasing.

This is a sign that recovery from dip is not difficult because we are not going to see more push before we see  a good progress. The market is completely drive by emotions and you should hold in other to makes good profit in future.

I would disagree with this to an extent--look at where we're stalled at.  We're relatively stable at $7800-$8200, and in 2015(?) we were stable at $420 for months, and yes we've been volatile in between.  I'm not saying penny stocks are similar to bitcoin in any other aspect, but the price volatility and even the characteristic of temporary stability in between spikes are traits they both share to some extent.

I hate penny stocks, by the way.  Someone very close to me got burned on one that has an actual company behind it that he believed in.  Lost a small fortune.

Fomo is a big push for bull runs like this and yeah i get your point on how a whale can start manipulating the price with a snap. Especially now that we're coming from a draining red first quarter of the year. People will have their hopes high in an instant with a little "pump".

Sudden spike of bitcoin price in seconds that indicates how fast bitcoin and easily recoil when it down it may be because the technology is faster and the reactions of the investors are faster, and because the market cap is thinner massive buying can easily affect it price.

I think you're wrong. This sharp rise in prices suggests that the whales have agreed to stimulate the bull market. They have invested their entire investment asset and now want to make a profit. To do this, they simultaneously left the market. This creates a deficit of coins and the price increases. Also easily they can lower the price.

Happy to see I'm not the only who thinks that lo and behold, me might actually be in for a repeat of 2015 after all. Not a crash. Not a bull. Just months of consolidating, I mean for bitcoin to stay in this range of about $500 for days and days. That's pretty much unheard of when we're more used to extremes in volatility.

I hate penny stocks too, sort of like I hate the satoshi alts and tokens. They take you for a ride and leave you in the dust, then die on you when you need them most.

And now BTC is at $8500. So its for the time being at last out of that ~7800-8200 range. Besides there is nothing strange about Bitcoin holding within a range for a week. It isn't always moving like crazy in one direction or another. Furthermore, if you look at the whole market, everything is green. This is clearly a longer move off the bottom of the market. Whether it will be sustained or it'll take several months to really get something going I don't know. But no this is not going to be a 2015 in which it takes a whole year to make the turnaround in market sentiment.

Last crash-boom cycle it was pretty much 2014 falling, 2015 consolidating, 2016 moving back up close to old high, 2017 boom.
While as this crash it seems to be 4 months falling, might consolidate for the rest of the Spring, slowly moving up, and then in Summer and maybe part of the Fall make the real push back close to previous high, late 2018 into next year boom.