Bitcoin Forum

What in the world is going on, talk about a moron fest or what. Did everyone lose there mind. Someone has to sell and someone has to buy to make the price, but it has gotten ridiculously out of hand. What the hell is going on, other than pure market manipulation?

Dash is the most well marketed scam I have ever seen except for the scam that is the Federal Government of the United States.

Welcome to the  Altcoin World.The power is in the hands of the few pumpers who'd go heights of being stupid to make a few pennies out of their investments.These newbie traders are delusioned by everything that seems to hike on daily basis.Can't believe numbers can be so manipulative.I will be the happiest person on this planet if the price drops down to $5 tomorrow.

I think almost all coins was sold under 16, no big real buys appear now and bots just pumping air and dust. Dash, if climbs on 100,  can go to 1225 overnight and no one can really stop it. No buys no sells besides bot fake walls.

Seriously, are you guys all just butthurt that you didn't buy earlier?

Whats the deal with Dash? Why o you call it a scam?

Because masternodes are anonymous and there's no way to prevent a Sybil attack. The behavior of the developers in the formation of the coin strongly suggests that they control the vast majority of masternodes.

Clearly you need to do more research into your assement. The coin is anonymous and no knows how much DASH someone owns and DASH is double spend proof. DASH goes over 150 just because of what the technology can bring now.

Are masternodes anonymous?

I think people mean the founder(s) own a very large percentage of the coins. How large? I don't know but probably large enough to pump the price by simply holding and not selling. So you combine the following: 1) launch coin in such a way you control a very large amount 2) market coin with funds 3) Speculators don't do much research so when price starts rising they jump in causing more spiking

It's a perfect storm of high coin price, at least until large holders start selling or a better market understanding of the coin's story happens. I admit I haven't spent a lot of time researching DASH but here is an example of what I've found so far.

The first thread to look at: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=999886.0


There are of course two sides to every story, but even the coin founder seems to agree there was something unfair about the launch:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=559932.0

Why Dash is the Most Sybil Attack-Resistant Cryptocurrency -- By Far
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bz6rFZQywOE&index=34&list=PLiFMZOlhgsYJPIiG0bjT1_SuT5h7NqPCC&t=264s



Anyone that has been following Dash saw this coming miles away. Go check Amanda B Johnsons Dash Detailed YouTube video's if you want an explanation
why Dash is growing at the rate it is --> https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLiFMZOlhgsYJPIiG0bjT1_SuT5h7NqPCC  

Channel Reminded me of  Starship Troopers - I'm Doing My Part
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMTz9nIUkGc

Growing? Who are you kidding? Prior to this pump dash has never had any transaction growth in the history since inception. It's stayed at around 2000 TRX per day for years now, which includes block rewards and MN distibutions. Does that sound like growth?

There are now 7,166,498 DASH coins according to coinmarketcap.com. If the founder(s) instamined 1.5 million coins it would mean holding at least 21% of the currency supply. That's a large enough position to influence price. Of course it's impossible to know how many coins anyone has. They could have sold some (I think I saw this was claimed), bought some etc. However, if you knew you planned to market the coin heavily it would make sense to hold onto a large percentage of the coin, maybe even buy/mine more over time.

The question is, is there a limit to the number of masternodes? If it is, that is suspicious because it means that the initial ppl have an incentive to pump up the price. We may be seeing that with the masternodes controlling the general treasury (eg, focusing on marketing instead of product). The # of masternodes should based on supply and demand, and no restriction on new entry, as it is with bitcoin mining (whose limit is only based on market factors).

If an individual or small number of people are controlling most of the masternodes, it will result in currency problems.  

Dash added by BTC-e
Dash added by xBTCe
Dash added by Wall of Coins
Dash added by soft wallet providers like Myceleum, Jaxx, Coinomi, Exodus
Dash added by ATM providers like General Bytes, TigoCTM, Lamassu,
Dash getting 5 ASIC miners
Dash added by several hard wallet providers (KeepKey, Ledger Nano S, Trezor)
Dash added by Living Room of Satoshi (who dropped ETH, LTC, & DOGE by the way)
Dash created its own LocalBitcoin.com
Dash added back again by Bitfinex
Dash added as debitcard by Shakepay, Spectrocoin, Bitwala, Wirex, Uquid
Dash created its own BitPay service
Dash successfully hardforked into v12.1
Dash successfully surviving its first major DDoS attack on its masternode network
Dash accelerating its next major update named Dash Evolution, Alpha to be released in a few months (mid summer)

These are all telltale signs..
 
 

dash fud isn't over yet?  ;D
eth was fud more than usual because of whatever issues that were thrown but still the tokens created today are usually running on their platform including those token where these troll are promoting. funny because i saw myself but continue to fud still.

@qwizzie it seems obvious you're interested in promoting DASH. I'm curious to hear your view about this coin's history. Do you think the founder(s) instamined around 1.5 million coins or not? If so, don't you think that's a bad thing for the overall market?

Next to Garza .

Its a fact that Dash has an instamine history, this has never been denied. Official statements from Dash about the instamine go all the way back to 2014 but you have to realise that Dash
Founders were not the only people mining at the time and massive amounts of Dash were sold off on the markets early on as people did not see any value in it.

Here are some links that are dealing with the instamine history of Dash :

https://www.dash.org/forum/threads/the-birth-of-darkcoin.162/
https://dashpay.atlassian.net/wiki/display/OC/Dash+Instamine+Issue+Clarification

With regards to your last question :

Was The Instamine A Positive Thing For Dash?
https://dashdot.io/alpha/?page_id=118

Its really up to the individual investor to decide if Dash instamine history from more then three years ago should still play a role or not.
Dash community has long long long ago moved on.
Dash instamine history has no influence on the market whatsoever (Dash has price and marketcap increase every single year, from its first year to its current year)

Let me guess, those who haven't yet discovered PIVX because they only use polo :)

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1262920.0

Funny how none of the Dash shills will answer this.

Out of the 4014 masternodes currently active .. can you tell me which one is mine ?

Can you prove to me that any subset of those masternodes are not controlled by the same person?

please answer my question

Sure, I'll answer (because I'm not trying to be evasive). No, I can't tell which masternode is yours. But I also cannot tell how many masternodes you own. For all I know, you own ALL the masternodes. Because with Dash masternodes are anonymous. Now I will ask my question again:

How do you prove that any subset of the masternodes are not controlled by the same person?

Thanks for the reply. Regarding others mining at the time, don't you think that can be problematic? Let's say I want to game the market and control a big percentage of a coin. I announce it so it seems fair and not premined. Everyone is all set. At the designated time, though, I say wait, there are bugs so the launch is delayed, remove your attention from this matter for at least X days (or weeks) while I fix things. Then later that night when everyone has gone to bed in most timezones I start mining. Maybe there are a couple other nightowls awake and see the activity. Still, however, I have the advantage of knowing exactly when to start (even nightowls wouldn't be ready right away). With such low competition I easily amass most of the coins created over several hours. So your statement about others mining wouldn't exactly set things right, see?


According to that link the founder puts the instamine at around 2M coins. He then says this too:


Okay, let's say the founder received 1.5 million coins from the instamine and others mining at the time got the other 500K. The problem is even if the founder had 200K coins on the hacked exchange and the other early miners had say 200K on the exchange that would mean a total of 400K coins hacked and effectively distributed. Note the quote says 'hundreds of thousands' were distributed, not millions. That would mean with all official statements being true (others mining, hacked exchange with distribution and selling etc.) the founder could still hold 1.3 million coins from the instamine. See my point?

There is another problem. Due to the design of DASH, 'masternodes' apparently receive (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dash_%28cryptocurrency%29) 45% of the block reward. Having a masternode requires having DASH currency. If the founder did have 1.3 million coins in the early days that would have been a very large percent of the total supply. Even if they sold another 300K that's still 1 million coins while at the time there may have been only ~2-3 million total in existence. That means the ability to control a large percentage of masternodes too, and automatically receive a constantly supply of new DASH being mined, forever.



With all due respect, DASH still exists, and is actively pushing for new users apparently. The price rise means a lot of new people looking harder at DASH like myself. Are you suggesting we just move on? That sounds more like a push from being biased about not wanting to really look at the history. I don't know what the real story is. Only the founder knows 100%. However, I don't like that the launch of the coin was done in a way that looked very intentional for the founder "accidentally" ending up with a huge number of initial coins. Why not simply re-do the launch cleanly/fairly? Well, as you say people will need to decide the events for themselves.

People were buying Zcash for over 1 Bitcoin when it first came out.
Nothing is logical in the altcoin market. Just a ton of people following trends trying to make a few dollars.
Marketing is the most important thing. Get hot and drive the price up while you can. Most people aren't paying attention to the technology.

That being said, maybe Dash will stick around. Healthy competition is always a good thing.
But they are definitely riding the hype wave right now.

A scam? Any proof to post of this for all to see?
I didn't invest in them but was thinking about it. :-\
Now if there was some proof in this and anyone seeing it collapsing soon then I will be sure everyone here would like to know it too. :-[

I fully agree with you, and this is why it is going to be extremely successful.  People just love scammy winners.

Bulls make money, Bears make money, Pigs get slaughtered
https://www.fool.com/knowledge-center/bulls-make-money-bears-make-money-pigs-get-slaught.aspx (https://www.fool.com/knowledge-center/bulls-make-money-bears-make-money-pigs-get-slaught.aspx)
Watch the DASH/XMR market
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=753252.msg18203247#msg18203247 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=753252.msg18203247#msg18203247)

Much more, because DASH is a half PoS system, and masternodes, which you can buy for 1000 DASH (back in time, I think it was 5000 DASH) take 45% of the mining rewards for them.  So if you own all master nodes, you get 45% of the new coins too.
Compound interest formula, and you find that the instamine must have, if always re-invested in master nodes, close to 50% of the stash.

Of course, it is possible that the instaminers spend all their holdings on cocaine and prostitutes when DASH was at $3.- and that the coins are now redistributed.

Hell no.. this price rise has been damn near SILENT.
As usual you are posting retarded bullshit here bud..

Ethereum wins that title hands down !

Anyway i just looked now at the price and holy tap dancing christ $96.20


Just WOW.. and no i myself would not be buying them right now.
But who knows how hard this shit is gonna get pumped.
It would be far too risky for my taste though..

Bloody insane shit we're seeing !

Yes, I'm still learning the history and design of DASH. The masternodes certainly mean an advantage for someone holding a large percentage of coins, and it just so happens the founder accidentally ended up with a large amount of coins at the beginning. Another thing I find interesting is that masternodes get 45% of new coins. Why 45%? I mean I think it's an interesting design to have masternodes in the first place (I think DASH invented this). They perform the mixing as I understand it. However, isn't that a bit high of a payment for mixing?


That doesn't make sense to me. If I held 1 to 1.5 million DASH from initial instamine plus a never ending supply of new DASH from masternodes (which I'd obviously set up) then at $3.00 price I'd have somewhere in excess of $4.5 million with new money always coming in from mining. This doesn't include having 10% automatically going into DASH treasury to pay for marketing. Even if I loved prostitutes and cocaine there is no way I'd blow through over $4 million on them. Just spending $100K would be plenty and leave me in control of a large part of DASH market for the future. To be fair to DASH supporters all this is speculation, but surely anyone would agree the founder would be in a pretty sweet position at the minimum and downright in control of a market monopoly at the worst.

The sooner this dashite crashes the better.

The lack of clarity around the masternodes is amazing. The only thing that seems agreed upon is that a small group of people control the majority of the supply. Whether or not there is a fixed limit on the number of masternodes, since it takes so much currency to have one, there is a de facto limit, and so there is centralisation.

Yes, the premine situation was a fiasco. Maybe it was a deliberate attempt by the founder to control the supply in perpetuity. They should have scrapped the project and started over, instead of allowing hundreds of thousands to millions of coins to be unfairly taken by a small group. Some are offput by that and will not use/invest in dash. But if there is value in what dash is and can do now, and ppl are willing to overlook this blemish (or don't know about it), then dash can continue to grow and be viable. But that's not the issue. The problem is that we have a currency that is largely controlled by a small group of ppl, with factors intrinsic to the currency design that prevent others from getting in. Centralisation is an anathema to cryptocurrency. Not only will you have decisions that are not in the best interest of the currency being made, but if the allegations are true that the founder unfairly and intentionally pilfered a plurality of the currency, and said founder is still in control, then what other decisions based on personal gain will be made?

Epic fail. Can't tell him which masternode is his LOL

I don't see why that is a fail. He has a good point.

Seeing as the instamine appeared to be deliberate, and that Evan Duffield deceived people about the timing, and released early, I'd say it's very likely that a small number of people control a lot of the Master Nodes.

But at the end of the day we don't know.

The circumstantial evidence is that Evan deceived people so he could control a lot of coins. Otherwise why would he have reduced the number of coins so much after the instamine?

I've never seen any other explanation that makes sense. But feel free to explain why he would reduce the number of coins after he was involved in the instamine.

A huge number of coins were distributed to a small number of people, whilst others were lied to and so missed the instamine. But then to make things worse the total number of coins was vastly reduced.

I hope that a lot of small people make money out of Dash. The more the better I think. tha's what has been so good about crypto. Lots of small people have been able to benefit. But, Evan tried to make a small number of insiders benefit

Indeed, and I think this is the hidden power of DASH.  It is a private fiat currency, mimicking as a crypto currency.  Because if you hold the keys to the voting system, you can do ANYTHING if you want to, including inventing a block that assigns you an extra 5 million coins.  This is a central bank system.  And these systems work well, and make their owners also very rich.  But it is also a payment system that will work much better than one where there is true decentralization, with all the burden it brings.


Well, he is still limited by the credibility of his decisions, and has to keep up the monetary belief.  Just like the governor of a central bank cannot just start printing like crazy without harming the value of its currency.  But that's about it.  

Indeed, the question is rather the opposite: as there is circumstantial evidence that at a certain point Evan Inc must have had a large fraction of the coins, and as this is amplified with the masternode PoS system, it would be rather natural that Evan Inc controls about half of the coins and an even larger percentage of masternodes (not all coins are in master nodes).  As such, he also has almost full certainty to have full control over the development voting system (and the 10% budget that it has).

In other words, simply accounting for the coins he must have, unless spent a lot, he must be in total control of the community, and of about half of the master nodes at least.

This is a bit like using a Tor-bis network of which all nodes are owned by the FBI.

Dino are you and the other forgetting the pother coins "hold the keys" too ?
Ya know it's stupid sitting here harping on ONLY about Dash when they all do it..
It reeks like agenda here.. open a window  :D

Evan is the big bad evil monster ?

Then what the fuck is Risto / rpietila from Monero then ?

One difference that jumps out at me is one is allegedly not even apart of the team.
When he is and.. they have lied their ass off about since the coin started 3 years ago.
But hey.. let's just put our little Monero blinders on and rail on about Dash right ?

And when you look at most of these coins + schemes they are *ALL* controlled by 1 entity.
Wanna talk about keys Dino ?

What about Github account passwords ?
And the fact that Github is FULLY 100% US govt compliant.

You guys spend all your time dancing around spotlighting 1 coin etc when 90% are the same.
THEN you have the nerve to accuse me of doing that.. when all i am doing is posting what i said above.

No, he is a genius that knows perfectly well how to "mine the investors", and how central control is way way more efficient than decentralized consensus.


Is not a PoS coin, so this doesn't matter.  There is no centralized tumbler system in monero. There's no fake voting system in monero.  And yes, development is OPENLY centralized in monero: there's a hard fork every 6 months or so.  And there is tail emission.   And there wasn't such a huge premine. 

In monero, maybe devs have a big stash, but that's about it, and it will not come to proportions like Evan's at all.
They can dump once if they want to.  They don't keep on earning because of an initial monstruous premine. 


What keys ?  In monero there is no PoS, there is no voting, and coding IS centralized for the moment, but can be taken out of the dev's hands (as has happened in the past !), just like with Bitcoin Core.


So ?  What stops you from downloading the code from github, reading it, modifying it and compiling your own node software ?

But you are talking about monero here, while the thread is about DASH.  DASH is not a scam.  It is a private fiat currency, mimicking as a crypto, and under full control of central bank Evan Inc.  And it can work very well to do payments until it reaches high volumes of the order of bitcoin, which is not the case atm: all volume is essentially on Poloniex at this time.

The problem is that nobody knows when they can just sell all and drive the price back to what it was months ago, or maybe even under that amount.

There are many investors at the moment coming in and buying as much as they can. In case this happens and turns out for Dash to be an actual scam, it would be a disaster for a lot of people. We have to be very careful about it.. I have seen tweets from important people saying that were saying a dump is incoming, it's not about if but when.

A genius who made an 'accidental' mistake instamining 2 million+ coins for himself upon launching his shitcoin.

... and shoved it down a lot of people who pay a lot of money for it with which he buys propaganda for even more.  That's what makes him a genius.  Not many people can pull that off.

No, it makes him a fraud, and his ponzi shitcoin a scam.

He's not crazy and crash the market.  I would very, very slowly dump small amounts of coins, but keep the price high enough for "young blood" to come in.  When he will be done, he can hire Bill Gates as butler.

If it works out for him, he's a genius.  Nobody's obliged to buy what so ever any DASH.  He didn't sign any contract with anybody.  The facts are out there.  If he can still obtain your money, that's what I call a genius.  He's not promising anything.  People just come and buy his coin.  He sells it. 

No, a genius is someone who uses their intellect to bring something to humanity. Not a crook who deceived for profit. Read up about Ponzi schemes because that's all Dash is.

Ps I've never touched your ponzi Dashit and never will.

<crickets>



<whoosh>

I won't say that I never had DASH.  I bought a few DASH 2 years ago (less than 10 coins) and I couldn't use darkmix, so I sold them.  Now, I'm not touching it with a stick. 

"realise that Dash  Founders were not the only people mining at the time" - 40 Amazon instances and 40 Microsoft ones instamining the shit out of it. The windows wallet was not available at the moment and neither the roadmap.

"and massive amounts of Dash were sold off on the markets early" - That carrot looking motherfucker (Duffbar) never sold a Dash out of his >1M instamine. He knew exactly what he was doing, as seen in the masternode implementation that came shortly after. On top of the 45% that was/is taken by his instamine every day, the Carrot even had the cojones to ask for an additional 10% for development.

"Was The Instamine A Positive Thing For Dash?" - LMFAO

Most likely victims who have yet to find out its a ponzi scheme,

learn more about dash
http://www.nasdaq.com/article/op-ed-a-closer-look-into-dash-part-1-cm760740
http://www.nasdaq.com/article/op-ed-a-closer-look-at-the-origins-of-dash-part-2-cm761072

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/4BJOUdwAy3d9yUIGFopDoAy3zbIRs6otXaTrVvOrUnjCLE-4ZHwqvxq4urr9rb_Nw9zS1DfALcYKPo91nSYCjL03c80SynrXeow8G-oZFG3oB5yw6TnOlBzHOyzsrRgjoficbjdk

If the DASH people were serious, they should have taken the DRK code, and started a new coin from scratch, called it DASH without the Darkcoin instamine legacy.

90% of trading is bots on these big boy coins.  it's messed cos they are so manipulated and controlled by those that have the most.

sadly a legit/fair coin like WBB with REAL work and business applications about to become real very soon see no $ into them. fucked.

bitcoin price is already $1200 and yet people are still buying it.  DASH is less than 10% of its price. why not buy?



where the hell is darkcoin now? if its better they should have more value today than dash. dev team always have the crappiest fud to spread when they know their coins has less value.

at this point only those who are newbies and panic buyers are buying Dash after this much pump because the rest of us know very well how risky this is to buy it after the huge rise and when the price entered a bubble!

 ;D  Funny joke.

DASH is just the new name for darkcoin, when the promotion machine realized that the dark in darkcoin was going to push away potential "investors".  Darkcoin was to get it going, the new feature was automatic mixing.  But then, better anon cryptography came out (cryptonote and zerocoin) and their anon feature was clunky.  So they changed communication strategy, and changed names.

ohhhh dashit! no wonder i couldn't find darkcoin on coinmarketcap.  :D
they decided to take dark away and potential investors moved into them, seem a fair analysis actually. i can see why the price rise. seem like their team always have the way to blend with the new  technology.  kinda like Metallica that dresses hiphop and raps.dash team seem to be pretty effective though price speaks.

Not at all. If there is a complaint about Monero let's hear that too. I'll certainly be looking into the history. A lot of people are not familiar with many of these coin's history, but the price rise is drawing more scrutiny.



No, they're not. Who controls Bitcoin? The community can't even decide on a simple change to increase capacity. Even Litecoin founder Charlie Lee is apparently having problems getting miners to accept SegWit.



What's that supposed to mean? The government created TOR too (Navy). In fact, the Internet itself is based off a government project (DARPA). There are limits on what the government can do. As long as it's known what the government can and cannot do people can operate safely/anonymously. Open-source software means anyone can review the code. There are literally thousands of pairs of eyes on Bitcoin's code. There is no way the government could change code to compromise user privacy in a way nobody would soon find out about.



This is a thread about DASH, due to the price rise. As I said, nobody is stopping anybody listing complaints on other coins. If other coins are also problematic then they will become more exposed as they gain market attention too. That's how it works.

Interesting how this question is yet to be answered :)

I also find it interesting that folks here jump all over Ripple calling it a centralized coin, even though node operators are free to choose any desired validators (which are not anonymous).

But these same people think that Dash is not centralized, but as a node operator you have no choice but to trust any masternode that has put up 1,000 Dash even when that masternode (and all other masternodes) are completely anonymous.

LOL!!!!

I don't see anything wrong happening out there people are just taking advantage of the low market cap and that's totally allowed as bitcoin or even the altcoins were made to give profit to it's investors and currently it is doing that successfully. Even though it has gone too far we can't do anything about it.

No that's not why Bitcoin or altcoins were made. That's called a Ponzi scheme. Bitcoin was made to try to give privacy and control over money back to people, and freedom to make choices. For example, if I'm a grown adult and I work a job to make money why the hell should the government say I'm not allowed to gamble my own damn money on poker? That's BS. That's the kind of thing Bitcoin was made for. It's trying to set things right from corrupt government and corrupt laws. For example, the government is fine with lottery gambling, or gambling they approve because they get a cut, where the odds are often far worse.

That's just a small part of the story. The real story is about how inflation robs people of purchasing power. That's why people have been getting poorer since the 70's and the middle class has been shrinking. That's a long complex story so I won't go into it. The point is Bitcoin and altcoins are trying to make the world a better place. They are legitimately trying to help. People should make tons of money for inventing things that improve people's lives. That's capitalism. That doesn't look like what we have here with DASH, though. Instead DASH and possibly other coins I haven't researched yet may end up giving cryptocurrency a bad name and de-legitimzing the idea. That's not cool. Not at all.

Amen.  However, it is indeed what crypto became.... unfortunately.

Here you go folks.

These are the reasons for the rise. No pumper "exit" nonsense, no "scam expansion", no....[fill in your favourite green-eyed imaginary scheme here].

Just plain old hard work, good design decisions and....essential ingredient....survival time ;)

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1828377.msg18215222#msg18215222