Bitcoin Forum

https://www.neowin.net/news/star-trek-themed-ransomware-kirk-has-a-spock-decryptor-uses-monero-for-payments


https://s3.amazonaws.com/neowin/news/images/uploaded/2017/03/1489738728_ransom-note-kirk_story.jpg


SUCCESS !

Monero has made it now.. Dark market usage and Ransomware.. MISSION ACCOMPLISHED !

Meh, it's not like Bitcoin wasn't used for this for years or that cash can't be used for nefarious purposes.

You probably know by now that I couldn't care less about monero but this is a poor FUD vector.

Well, for sure it indicates that true crypto currency niches are using monero.  "Things you can't do with fiat"

Try to do that with google coin !

If you can do it with google coin (that is, fiat), there's no use doing it with crypto.

FUD Vector ?
I am supporting Ransomware by advertising it as most of you said when i posted about one in Javascript in BTC main before..  ;)

It is YOU guys who have a "vector" with your replies.
And you are a notorious Monero cult shill so don't pretend LOL

All i can say is maybe keep a stock of at least 50 Monero ahead of time in case you get infected.
That way you will be ready and won't have to wait to send the payment (it keeps doubling until you pay)

@Dino
You may be on to something here.. i do not totally disagree with what you are saying.
But we clearly have a different ideology on crypto.
In a twisted way this really does legitimize it ..it could be perceived.

But yeah in a way i did intend to FUD Monero but it's deserved.
They made the coin and now it is used for nefarious purposes.. it is what it is.
More importantly though i posted in here before wondering when the Ransomware makers would start to use ALT's.
It seems they are now !
So this is a follow-up to my past commentary and.. a WARNING !

You either seem to have lost your FUD-edge or you have a short attention span or just don't care anymore about the actual topic at hand, only your ego.

Feel free to read back my comment history but I was always against (or at least completely neutral of) both monero and dash.

Even if I were a newbie account, your comment would still be a cheap way of discarding mine instead of arguing.


To summarize, I couldn't care less about DASH/XMR but ransomwares were blooming long before them and will unfortunately, probably will do so long after them.

Naw i couldn't remember really LOL
I was calling you out to get a response ;)
Shit, there is a flood of new accounts here it gets hard to keep track of everyone.  :(

Added an edit above and you got your response but I'd expect some facts or arguing from you by now.

Help ?
Well think of this guys.. recall the news story about the FBI saying they would look into Monero ?
..they will now.

- The FBI investigates Ransomware.. FACT !

So they will now be looking at defeating the Monero anon security like i predicted long ago.
And by buying Monero coins you are all essentially betting a wager / investment on one side or the other.
If you don't mind let me clarify that further..
You Monero supporters are all now betting the farm on fluffypony's security vs the combined might and infinite resources of the United States Government.

PS:
Not long ago fluffypony's Monero Gambling site was hacked and he said what i said about Monero itself..


Only problem is with the Monero "eventual scenario" it would mean that every transaction ever made would be exposed.. leading to mass arrests of countless users from Dark Markets etc.
So.. fluffypony said himself that Monero will fail and they will get arrested.
When i said it, all the Monero cult shill's cried Troll and "FUD"  ::)

I am flattered they took the words out of my mouth and used it as a shitcoin defense excuse though.

@kingcolex
You are correct i think though.. they do in fact need all the help they can get  :D

@bathrobehero
NOW THAT WAS "FUD VECTOR" ;)

---

EDIT:

Oh and apparently Coindesk got in on the FUD attack "vector" too LOL

Monero under scrutiny of the FBI (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1772255.0)
When they posted = http://www.coindesk.com/fbi-concerned-about-criminal-use-of-private-cryptocurrency-monero/

Crypto can ONLY have value where fiat cannot go.  All the rest is at most greater-fool games, or fiat mimicking as crypto.  If fiat can do it, crypto has no value.  And fiat can do almost anything that is fully legal, so anything that is fully legal is mostly not open for crypto.   If fiat can do it, it can do it faster, better, cheaper.

This is why non-anon crypto is mostly meaningless/dangerous, like going to war with plastic guns.

If you are interested in crypto, it means that you are interested in doing things where fiat cannot go, and hence, mostly non-regulated/illegal/criminal OR you are interested in ripping off people in greater fool games OR you didn't understand what you were doing.

Well, between: "if they break the crypto, they might get the transaction history" and "I openly show the transaction history to everybody in this world with a bitcoin node", I would for sure think that the former gives a higher chance of protection than the latter, where there isn't any. 

That is: if in any case you're going to operate a dark market, should you:
- open a bank account under your name and do all the trading with that fiat account ?
- do the trading with bitcoin, and then check out at an exchange ?
- use monero and obfuscate your trail cryptographically and then check out at an exchange ?

What gives you the highest chance to get caught ?

Note that of course, operating a dark market IS risky, so if you go for 0 risk, you don't operate a dark market.  But that's not the question.  GIVEN that you are going to operate a dark market, what lowers you chances to get caught fast, most ?

@dinofelis
That was off-topic sort of..
Fair though and i see why you brought it up.
I don't think i should rail on repeating what we have already been over though.
We have already hijacked plenty of topics here with the ole Anon debate.

I am more focused on WHAT IS.
Than what should be..

Is this the same gambling website were another Monero coder won over 20,000 monero which was also run by the main developer Fluffy?

No, it is perfectly on topic.  If you REALLY want to know what crypto is about, it is about the things you think are "FUD" and which you mentioned in your OP  No, it is its only true value proposition.  If crypto doesn't serve to do unregulated (and hence also illegal and sometimes even criminal) things, it has no use case.  So you coming up with "hey look, with that crypto, they do criminal things", duh.  Of course.  That's what it is made for.  If you can do it legally, you don't do it with crypto.  But if you cannot do it legally, you better protect yourself somewhat against being found, hence obfuscated transactions.  Crypto without obfuscation is an oxymoron.  Crypto is NOT about the rosy propaganda of "Alice buys a cup of coffee with bitcoin at Bob's coffee shop".  That only served to make greater fools enthusiastic.

Yes, there is a niche where you can do "unregulated" stuff that is not entirely illegal, because you are operating in a legal vacuum.  There, you can use transparent crypto like bitcoin.  Say, between offshore gambling sites or something.

All the same Dino the handcuffs click closed regardless..

- Criminals get arrested all the time.
- Computer code is not trust worthy.

You leaped right over what i said and what fluffypony said.
You focus like a laser beam on your anarchist crypto ideology.

Arguing on the internet will not keep people from going to jail.

If i was to accept that crypto coins can only be fully anon i would have to say then that they are doomed to be hacked and exploited leaving users highly vulnerable to getting arrested for the various crimes they commit with it.

The difference is you are talking about crimes Dino.
See how your crypto coins run into law ?
Why does law apply to drug trafficking but not money laundering with a currency ?

FIAT is used for legal or not tasks but it's also regulated.
So this notion that a crypto coin MUST be defiant to any and all regulations doesn't make sense to me.
Pandering to criminals is not a high priority of mine.
Privacy maybe yeah.. but you crypto-idealists seem to have NO PROBLEM with giving that privacy away.
Or you wouldn't be using Cryptsy, Poloniex or Coinbase or Github or this US based forum.. or ?

You see guys you sort of lost the battle long ago and are now complying with law and harping on that you are fighting the man.. when you are not !

@Dino
Think of this.
How can an anon coin exist when there are no anon exchanges ?
See a problem ?

You all chant about wanting decentralization (as do i)
While you use centralized services to accompany your allegedly private / decentralized coins.
Further more why was the JAXX wallet abandoned ?
Because a dictator waived his magic wand.
Don't be fooled by the illusion of a democracy or decentralization.

Look instead at what is actually happening and what actually MIGHT happen down the road.
And if you all want to place bets on Monero vs the US govt then go ahead.
I'd say they lost the battle already and the rest is a formality yet to play out.

All they have to do is throw their ass's in Guantanamo Bay and be done with it.
All the Risto's and fluffypony's and Febo's and smoothie's etc can be dealt with swiftly.
Let's see how much crypto rebel angst they have when the men in black knock on their door.
Let's see what they say when their computers are seized..
Will we see a French Police fraud story and a vanishing MEW treasurer again ?

There is no battle to be won guys.
If there was i am not taking the side with Ransomware makers and Dark Market users.
And not so much because of morality reasons either but because of risk.
I want no associations with any DM's bullshit.. i will not be shoveling a path through the forest for them to use.
Because you know who would be next.. Trillion dollar a year drug cartels doing mass money laundering.
Why build and defend a system for them ?
I am not sticking my neck out for those types.. fuck 'em.

And Dino FIAT exists because it was needed.. crypto coins are NOT.
FIAT has been around a long time.. Monero has barely been created.
One is entirely based on computer code.. the other is to an extent.

Is the purpose of crypto coins to circumvent any and all law across the globe ?
FIAT *IS* regulated and for good reason.
Bail-out's or law enforcement or even security for the end users.

Anyway i don't think i will change your mind Dino ;)
..and you suckered me into it again LOL

I posted a quote from fluffypony that has links to the source topic.
I have never heard of the incident you mentioned though.
*If that was true then yeah it would be suspicious for sure.
Do you have any links etc to show us all what you meant ?

The only "tool" that a crypto ultimately is, is a payment method in one form or another.  And the only "investment" one can make, is in the utility of that tool, that is, in that payment method.  Thinking that chasing greater fools is "investment", is, well, deluded in the long term - although one can make a hell of a lot of money if one is in early enough, and gets out early enough, and have the bill paid by the last layer of greater fools.

Now, the tool, as a payment system, has to compete with fiat, which is the world-wide payment system in existence.  So it must have a competitive edge over fiat.  Fiat being centralized, and subsidized, it is difficult to have a competitive edge, but there are niches.  The ones I mentioned, where fiat cannot go.

Bitcoin, at this moment, costs $8 a transaction.  It used to be more expensive, before the halving BTW.  This is what is spend on keeping bitcoin running and secure.  If you want to invest in a system that costs $8 a transaction, there must be a utility that justifies that.  If you are only gambling on "it will rise", then you are playing a greater fool game, which is what most of the crypto scene is about for the moment, but this is not sustainable.  Get out on time if that's what you're doing.

Anyone have any idea why the Star Trek theme ?  :D

And i wonder if Monero dev's have been contacted by the FBI etc and then given and NDA.
Could there be holes in the privacy already ?
I was also thinking about Dash etc too..
Did they choose Monero for a specific reason over other anon coins ? Hmm ?

Monero is Captain Kirk approved !
And Spock (RIP) too i guess ..it's named after him.

Because of all currently "big" altcoins, it is the only one with credible anonymity.

DASH is only as anonymous as the tumblers don't collude and don't keep logs and that's highly doubtful with Evan in control.  ZCASH is not anonymous by default and has a very small anonymity set.

The smaller coins are too hard to get by for the victims.  Monero can be bought on several exchanges, it is traded a lot, and as it is essentially not traceable, if you withdraw monero from an exchange amongst all the traders, nobody will be able to point at you specifically.

Sure.  Soldiers get killed.  That doesn't stop armies from fighting.


See above.  It is a matter of risk management.  IF IN ANY CASE you want to do something the state doesn't like, then you better use the tools that help you do so.  That doesn't mean that the risk of doing so is gone, but it is simply diminished.

If you trade on a dark market with monero, chances of being caught because of that are smaller than if you do it with bitcoin or fiat.


No, if in ANY CASE they would "commit these crimes"  (I don't consider selling something to someone else a crime, only the state does), then the chance of this happening is smaller if they use crypto protection than if they do it open in the blue.  That should be obvious, no ?  IF the crypto "gets cracked" (not sure), then they are on the same level as if they did it outright in the blue.  So doing it outright in the blue is ALWAYS riskier than trying to hide with crypto.  


Huh ?  My point is that if you can do it with fiat, you should do it with fiat.  And if it is fully legal, most probably you can do it with fiat.  So no crypto needed AT ALL.


But if it is not regulated, it will not be legal or it will end up being regulated.  No thing with value is unregulated in our world. Otherwise, states know that people flee into it, and states cannot steal it any more.  So ALL things of value are regulated or end up being so.  What unregulated, but perfectly legal things do you have in mind ?  I can't think of any.


No, I'm simply saying that crypto has no use outside of these things.  It has absolutely no sense.   Crypto is for unregulated (and hence lawless/illegal/....) stuff, or for greater fool games.  And that's it.  


In circles of course.   And distributed exchanges for other crypto.  Suppose only bitcoin is allowed on exchanges.  Then put in place distributed exchanges where you can trade bitcoin for anon coins and back.  What's the problem ?  


Of course you shouldn't.


Monero's code is too complicated for the JAXX programmers.


How so ?  What stops me from launching a monero2, monero3, monero22352 in small communities that want to have closed economies away from state and so on, and of which those states aren't even aware ?  Connected on distributed exchanges in a mesh-like way ?

But tell me, what use is crypto if it isn't that ?  Why go through all the hassle if you can do it legally with a credit card ?  What's the point of this stuff ?


Sure, but then, you're not interested in making Ransomware, or in running a dark market either. So you have no use for crypto.  That's my point.  Use your credit card.  Good enough for what you want to buy.

I love how you make assumptions then parade them around as fact.
If i was setting up a Ransomware last little while i would probably be looking at Monero simply because the price is / was more positioned to go up than DASH that already peaked.

Your a fervent rabid maniacal Monero shill.
You only ever comment to defend Monero.. usually by proxy for maximum deniability plausibility.
AKA: you do it all clever & shit so you can play dumb about it.
Look around ..you showed up here on this topic didn't you ?
Ding ding ding Monero topic.. out comes Dino with the usual bullshit.

I have no idea who is eating up all your bullshit Dino.
I'd like to poll the community to see just how much of your speeches these Investards here are eating up.

And look around you are being led around like a horse and yeah you were off-topic.. you hijacked it with an anon debate.
Yet again as you have done lots last few months.
Kinda funny you showed up not long ago and have been pounding this place with anti-law monero bullshit.
I don't recall seeing you all along with me here commenting the last 4 straight years.

So Dino..
You wanna open the can of worms ?
Go back and read what i said and don't look for the weak sentence in the entire rant and home in on that like an obsessive mental case and address the underlying point or point(s) i made.
I love how you bend over backwards here ignoring 99.99% of everything i ever say then make arguments over unrelated bullshit like a fucking contrarian.

You said what i quoted above because i herded you.
Because once again you railed off topic hell bent on defending ANON.
Your incessant anti-law campaign here is tiring.. start your own topics maybe instead of spamming mine.

First thing you assholes here said was i had a "FUD vector"
Look in the fucking mirror.  ::)
Did i post this to rail on for the billionth time about ANTI-ANON rhetoric ?
No.. because i created a topic on that topic long ago addressing the matter specifically.

Dealing with people here is frustrating.
You have nerds who think they are mensa geniuses yet do not possess basic forum skills.
You all know what is or is not appropriate to post but you don't care..
You simply post what ever you want on any topic for any reason.
Almost like there was no topic titles at all.
Then you have the bloody audacity to rail on lecturing people like you are "smart"
If you can't stay on topic then you lose pretty much all of your credibility right then and there.

So.. want to continue to hijack my topic with a FUD "vector" then please divert your efforts to the appropriate discussion topic guys.
Starting with Dino ;)

[FACT] Anon coins will never work ! (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=853767.0)

Maybe the FBI should hurry up and arrest some of you so i don't have to hear your crypto rebel anarchist rhetoric.

Because you think these guys KEEP it to "invest" ??  ;D

DASH didn't "peek".  It will go to the moon.  Being centralized, it is the perfect crypto for "investors".


What bullshit ?  That monero is about the only seriously anon coin with some volume (so that you can hide inside) ?  ZEC has also quite good anon crypto, but the fact that it is not compulsory is maybe a problem.  But I have to admit that now that the anon part went up from 6% to 29% makes it look more attractive as a respectable crypto coin.  It should have been 100%, but that's a fundamental error that the ZEC people made, but if the anon fraction remains high enough, it may be one of the other coins I technologically like.  It being a corporate coin makes me dislike it on that side, but I do appreciate the crypto part of it.


I didn't.  It is quite obvious that monero was picked by these people for the anon side.  Because it is a true crypto currency application, to ask for ransoms.  (whether ransomware or other ransoms).   Might be a niche for kidnapping too.  THAT is the true nature of crypto, and if you still don't get it, you'll never get it.



Because anti-law is the only serious niche for crypto.  All other applications are not going to work out, because centralized systems are better at it.  What's the basis of crypto ?  Trustless ; decentralized.  Why do you need that ?   To not have single points of failure by mighty enemies.  What enemies ?  Violence monopolists.  Because if not, you can make a deal with the violence monopolist to protect your single point of failure by law and by police.  So the only way to NEED a trustless decentralized system is if you have to fight the violence monopolist.  Otherwise, it is wasted effort.


I can say that of you too.  I'm stating that crypto is a useless exercise if it is to be legal/law abiding/regulated.  Any centralized system with legal protection will be better.


Because it is the only thing that makes sense in crypto.  And who started a topic about an anon coin and something illegal ? Isn't this what this thread is about ?  I just say that this is a perfectly right application of crypto.  Not more, not less.  That's what crypto is made for.  Even though most idiots in crypto don't understand it and think that it is a replacement for VISA.

If crypto can't work for this kind of niche, then crypto is entirely useless.

Finally...  ::)

Spoetnik, plain and simple you're such an idiot that man can rarely encounter. Such a poltron mentality & monumental stupidity, congratulations.

That's nice ..anything to say on the topic ?

I came here to hear YOUR opinion and chat about crypto.
I didn't get it.
All i got was an insult.
Fine, but it would behoove you to illustrate your point.

I will thank you for the opportunity to Google search the word "poltron" though..
Apparently people he thinks i am a coward.
Sure.. what ever floats your boat bud.

What i find interesting about that is it's a FRENCH reference.
Which i have pointed out how there is a French connection with Monero.
Supposedly there is 1 or 2 guys who are French that always defend Monero.
But the stats tell a different story.. it seems fair to draw a conclusion that half of all Monero shill's are french.
*IF* you actually believed all these accounts that show up are real separate people  :D
And no i won't bother going through the list and naming names.. you will all lie about it anyway.
Many of you know damn well who i am talking about and some of them may be on the topic..
[NEWS] Monero David Latapie French Police Fraud [updated] (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1272304.0)

So yeah.. surprise surprise a French insult  :D
Who's dumb now ? ;)
See you guys slip up time after time year after year and i am here to rub your nose in it.  8)
No idea why but Monero seems to attract an obsessive deceitful crowd that thinks the ends justifies the means.
In other words Monero is a "good coin" there for what ever we do is justified.. you all think.
Problem is.. THAT is what makes it a bad coin in the first place.

Should i carry on trying to stay on topic and respond to more insults ?
They troll me and neg me ruining my rating and mouth me off and harass me and my topics.
And you wonder why i posted this here when i seen it browsing a tech News site ?

https://cointelegraph.com/news/us-corporations-are-buying-bitcoin-to-quickly-resolve-ransomware-attacks

I've seen your other posts, and I'm pretty sure I know who you are in the Dash telegram group.

It's pretty obvious what you are doing here and it's not working.

They probably used monero because, I don't know, someone intelligent enough to write ransomware is intelligent enough to see that Zcash isn't Trustless and Dash is less anonymous than Bitcoin.

If I be honest, this is not really a surprise. I've heard about people selling Monero RATs before on this forum. Essentially the program mines coins on the victim's computer, resulting in a botnet of Monero miner. Not really a Monero supporter, but why does it matter, these criminal activities are expected if a coin is anonymous.

Interesting story for sure.
I hope people take this threat more seriously.
I was joking before saying people should buy Monero just in case ;)

I think these Ransomware guys are 1,000x worse than any Dark Market guys.
It's one thing to be buying & selling goods with willing participants
and another to prey on people.

It always surprises me how often these guys pay the ransom.
This just gives crypto a bad name and brings heat to the scene.

@francis
I have no clue what that Dash telegram thing is.
I have had nothing to do with Dash or had any Dash coins ever.
I just post a lot that users should apply their criticism equally.
As in not ignoring what one coin does and harping on about the competitor only.

Nah, ransomware is a tax on people not making backups.

I bet Spoetnik don't eat French Fires.

Taxes are also there being fuck heads to strong arm your money.

In my opinion this is going to hurt real bad news for monero.

I think that Bitcoin is idea of keeping a public letter is better because there is really no point of having full anonymity it's just going to let the gangsters be the only users and promote the act of illegal good purchases.

I'd stick to bitcoin...

See this guys shtick ? Talk about a contrarian  :D
His analogies as usual fail miserably..

Infecting people with a virus so you can extort a ransom from them by holding their private data captive..
is NOT like a government tax paid that gives you GAZILLIONS of services.

Who pays for the following ?

- Fighter jets to patrol your skies.
- A Police force to catch murderers and Ransomware makers.
- A Fire dept to put out your house or forest fire.
- Roads.
- Medical..

blaaaaaah blah b;lahahahahah

Who pays for that ? Ransomware makers ?

@Febo
I like "Freedom Fires"  :D
..even though they are not French LOL

Hey ..post more stupid shit guys it amuses me.

---

EDIT:

@user27
A key point guys like Dino forget about is crypto coins like Monero are NOT ADOPTED yet.
So we have yet to give the sales pitch that will of course have to overcome crypto's growing bad reputation.
He likes to rail on about FIAT but it's ALREADY used !
FIAT has nothing to prove.. MONERO DOES !

Monero is one of the only coins having a closed form of economy.  Make ransomware, force people to pay in monero, buy drugs on dark market with it ; dark markets selling it to people needing it to pay ransomware.  

Note how close this is to fiat: states force people to pay taxes in fiat, people needing to obtain fiat, states buying "drugs and prostitutes" with it.  Real currency value.

This is a typical niche application of crypto.  Fiat can not do that.  I'm not saying it is the only niche.  I'm not saying it is a "moral" niche (haha, morality and trustlessness, big joke).  This KIND of niche is the true economic value of crypto.


*I* 'm the one pointing out that crypto is useless where fiat can go, and can only serve niche applications such as the one I'm pointing at.  YOU're the one shouting for "legal crypto adoption" which is totally crazy: as you say yourself, fiat proved itself, crypto not.

All non-niche crypto is just a greater-fool game.

Why don't you stick to fiat ?  Much better as a currency.
And, BTW, bitcoin has been the market leader as for now in ransomware.  And in dark markets.  So if this is bad publicity for monero, it is even more bad publicity for  bitcoin, no ?  Except that bitcoin is dangerous to be used that way, you need to trust tumblers...

This news here *IS* bad news.
Yes it does in a perverse way legitimize the currency.. i get it guys.
I said waaay back crypto coins will have made it when prostitutes on the street accept it or drug dealers.
And no not just dark market crap but actually people in person selling drugs on the street corner etc.

I have no problem with them using the currencies really.
If we want the mass population involved then i guess we will get criminal activity too.
Problem is i have told you all endlessly that i have talked to friends family and strangers on the street and ALL of them have bad things to say.. Bitcoin's reputation is horrible !
Many think it's dead and say ohhh that drugs and guns internet coin thingy is still going ?

So when Monero is started they had to overcome that stigma BTC created with Silk Road etc..
NOW the Monero idiots proudly brag about getting *minor Monero usage on Dark Markets.

I can't see this any way but bad (news).

So..
Why do i favor the legalization of crypto ? i said lots.. ADOPTION.

We will need the entire planets FIAT financial structure to integrate with crypto coins.
All of a sudden there is a problem !
Remember when i said laws were coming and you all mouthed me off and said.
- We don't need ties to FIAT.
- They can't stop us.

Remember all of you in the scene saying that over & over ?
Well.. Cryptsy started taking Picture ID then Poloniex and Coinbase.
Then they added US & CAN tax rules..
THEN i said "I told you so" as Ripple was Fined by FiNCEN and Localbitcoins users were arrested by the FBI in a Florida parking lot for going over the AML limits. (30k worth of BTC was sold in person)

I was right and i knew it !

And i am telling you guys you are in for a battle and if you want to fight then fine but that is not a good way to get mass adoption.
For one thing most of the world doing business can not integrate with crypto coins because if they violate their own countries financial laws then forget it.
Is the Royal bank of Canada going to integrate Monero transfers ?
Fucking hell no.. NEVER !

Financial people were talked to in my town in the Newspaper 1 year ago when they did a story on Bitcoin.
(90% wanted nothing to do with it and 1 guy admitted he dabbled in it but would not tell his colleagues etc about it because it is deemed highly sketchy shit. (he did not want his name published)
Crypto crap is not something professionals talk about publicly.
It's not a giggle factor it's a sleazy sketchy pyramid scheme drugs & guns and RANSOMWARE factor.

I am one of the few people here feeding you all the truth.
I don't live in some fantasy world like some of you.
What is important here is the causalities are going to mount in this war.
Exchanges vanishing with money after getting legal pressure should be the norm.
Many of them are govt compliant as it is already so what are you defending ?
Cryptsy said they lied to users and made up excuses then locked peoples accounts and then handed their info etc off to the fed's.. so what you all do ?
You brag about Dark Market usage then hand Polo your ID and buy Monero "Anon" coins.

..good luck with that  :D

But Spoetnik, the real question to you is: why do you want to favor adoption of crypto ?

Suppose that I was saying: "I want pink noise to be integrated with the music industry, because I want greater adoption of pink noise listening".

Would that make sense ?  Why would I want people to listen to pink noise ?  Maybe I'm selling pink noise.  That would be a motive.  Maybe politically, I want pink noise to rule the world.  That also makes sense.

But why would you want people to adopt crypto, and bitcoin in particular ?  What good does that bring ?  To you ?  To people ?

I don't want crypto adoption for crypto adoption.  I think that crypto is great for those things were legal money cannot go, and as I think it is important that a lot of illegal things can happen, I think crypto is great, for that purpose.  

But you ?  Why would you want crypto adoption ?  What good does it bring ? If it goes where legal payments also go, what good is it ?  LIke what good is it to make people listen to pink noise if they listen already to music ?

No.  I want these things abolished.  That's why I like crypto.

Dino if it's not used ..it's not a currency ;)

Why do i personally want adoption ? Interesting !
I had to think for a minute and i'd say because of the advancement of humanity.
When i seen Bitcoin and Grid Coin and Prime Coin etc i thought ok shit.. this could change humanity.

I have said lots before i always envisioned a digital currency that was tied *somehow* to doing a productive task vs mining burning up electricity for pretty much no good reason. (see Bitcoin LOL)
If we had a world wide grid of mining computer hardware that got a block reward or something in exchange for farming out the computer power i see that as an advancement for humanity.
If ALL users on earth were backing it we could have a lot of computer power combined.
Then if all that computer power was used to to do an extra scientific task over-top of the currency aspect then hell win/win right ?

Problem i see though is getting it done.
So far people are not interested in currencies.. they are interested in "penny stocks" in unregulated crypto markets.
I think people were in the past idealistic and optimistic but it waned and faded.
People can debate if it's better now than day mid-2013 but i say it's way worse.
We have believers replaced with profiteers.

We have projects like what i mentioned above ignored because *fast* profits dried up.
Prime Coin from SunnyKing was a rising star here and i got on it a bit late but..
It WAS big for a while.. it got a market on Cryptsy for example.

You see the shift in crypto overall ?
NOW we have profit mongers asking what gives me money ...and fast ?

Anyway i mentioned in my last comment what i think the problem is.
Take again the Royal Bank of Canada.. will they ever have anything to do with Monero ?
Nope.
Bitcoin ? that is an actual possibility (far more so than dedicated Anon coins)
The Bitcoin mixers are wise thing.. having that separate is a smart decision i think.

Why do YOU want crypto coins to succeed ? Profits ?
I'd like to see advancement.. I'd like to see a currency ..used as a currency  :o  :D

@Dino
No offense but i still think you are awful with analogies ;)

PS:
Dino i have no interest in destabilizing humanity by destroying the existing financial structure.
..like YOU do !
I like my paved roads and don't mind paying my taxes.
And i am not just saying that so i don't get put on a watch list ROFL  :D

Dino you have railed on lots saying FIAT should be destroyed and no taxes / governments type crap..
Uhhh dude ?
Just what would that look like ?

I knew it

Ah.  Me too.  Because it permitted to transgress laws.  But if it is not transgressing laws, we already have good legal payment systems: fiat.  I don't see any, but absolutely any, advantage for people to get involved in other payment systems that are risky, clunky and will, in the end, not allow anything else than what you can do with the legal payment system.  I don't see the use of adding the burden of trustlessness and decentralization (it is a HUGE burden as compared to a swift centralized system) if there's nothing more that you can do with it than what you can do with the existing fiat system.  Bitcoin has been costing between $12 and $8 dollar a transaction the last few years.  It is not scalable, except if you go to a banking system, worse than the fiat banking system.  You take on top of that the high volatility, the risk of being stolen and the burden of having to be extremely careful, because everything is irreversible.  You broadcast your financial transactions open in the blue to the whole world, cryptographically graved in stone ; a fiat bank is way, way more private.

No, honestly, bitcoin doesn't serve any purpose, doesn't bring in the slightest bit of value over fiat payments if you can do it with fiat payments.  The whole of Amazon is a credit card click away.  If there is a problem, I can discuss with my bank.  If someone steals my stuff I can complain, and this is reversed or in any case, guaranteed.   With bitcoin, you are depending on 5 Chinese guys to make your block chain, when they don't get enough fees, they block the network with spam, your payment doesn't get confirmed. 

Why on earth would I want people to adopt such a wasteful, clunky, dangerous and volatile payment system to buy coffee or books on Amazon when everything works much, much better with fiat ?

Only when I cannot do it with fiat.  And banks will try to make you do everything which is legal with fiat.  So, essentially, crypto only has economic value when it is unregulated, illegal or criminal.

There is no reason for Joe to adopt crypto if he doesn't want to go there.  Fiat is much, much better and unbeatable: it is centralized.  You can never build a system with the burden of decentralization and trustlessness that can compete with a centralized system.  So the only ways where such a system makes sense, is if there's no centralized system that can compete.


You don't understand the basic principles of these systems.  Primecoin tried to do something of the kind.  PoW is a very rough concept, that only makes sense to kill seigniorage, but is a horrible idea to secure a cryptographic system.  In fact, it is the worst possible form of cryptography, because the "good guys" and the "bad guys" are on equal footing.  Normally, a cryptosystem gives an advantage to the "good guys" (for instance, those that know a secret key).  PoW is the worst form of cryptographic protection. 


No, it is totally meaningless.  If you do something valuable with PoW, then it is not punishing you if you double-proof.  You get then the "nothing at stake" consensus divergence.

Suppose that I do PoW to sell heat, in such a way that I earn (money wise) exactly the cost of my "mining PoW".  I wouldn't have the slightest problem upscaling a thousand-fold, selling thousand times more heat (in competition with non-PoW heat providers which is a huge market), and redo the block chain.  It is only when the PoW that I have to deliver is actually WASTEFUL and COSTLY that I will not do so.  If I can sell the by-product of my PoW for the same value as what it costs me, I do not care about wasting PoW and it loses entirely its security aspect.


Because these projects are naive and misguided (and yes, me too, I bought some prime coin because I liked the idea before I understood much better these systems).


I hope not for monero's sake !


I don't see the use of it.  If they do so, it is to "mine the speculators".  But bitcoin has no use for the public, if the public can do it with fiat.


Getting rid of state and law is freeing up humanity, not "destabilising" it, but this is difficult to understand for most endoctrinated people.

That was a joke referring to when i posted about a Javascript Ransomware i seen also at Neowin.net.
I posted in BTC main here and i got flamed hard for posting about it saying i was advocating it etc.
If anything i was warning people.  :D

Sorry for the confusion i had my intern post for me a bit lately.
FUD is big business and i gotta farm some of it out.. Indian Call Centers are surprisingly cheap.  ;D

@Dino
It does not matter what YOU see the use of.
YOU do not matter.. nor do i.
You refuse to grasp reality.
You are bloody nuts with weird views that the general public does not share.
Most people driving to work like their paved roads etc. (paid for by taxes)

Hey Spoetnik,

Dash sucks. It's going to crash hard and you're going to lose everything.

Good night.

Last i checked i had about $23 in Litecoins on Bittrex  :D
Lie more Junior  ::)

Your Monero coins you have on the other hand.. well they may be in jeopardy ;)