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Title: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: btvGainer on March 18, 2017, 11:06:33 AM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees.
What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: davis196 on March 18, 2017, 11:34:46 AM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? Some other altcoin?Which altcoin do you suggest? This will pump the price of that altcoin and the altcoin`s transaction fees might also increase. Anyway,the bitcoin price might go down soon and this will decrease the transaction fees for btc payments. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: btvGainer on March 18, 2017, 11:38:44 AM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? Some other altcoin?Which altcoin do you suggest? This will pump the price of that altcoin and the altcoin`s transaction fees might also increase. Anyway,the bitcoin price might go down soon and this will decrease the transaction fees for btc payments. This will avoid any quick pump. Bitcoin price can not always remain low so high transaction fee is inevitable. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Xester on March 18, 2017, 11:39:24 AM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? Well that is convenient but there is another trouble that will come along. If you convert your bitcoin into altcoins then you send it to a recipient then the receiver will actually complain. The reason is when he will convert the altcoins back to bitcoins he or she will pay the transaction fee and lets add to that the withdrawal fee of 50k satoshi. Thats rude and it just eats more of your bitcoin rather than saving it. Hence I do not see your suggestion feasible due to this flaws. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: sportis on March 18, 2017, 11:42:51 AM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? I agree with your opinion and I would go with litecoin for several reasons; it's a cheap coin, very good confirmation time, it's be around from 2011 and so on. Moreover, people are willing to accept an altcoin there is no rush to convert it back to btc because they can use it for micropayments too. But if the blocksize debate ends maybe some kind of side-chains could be used for these small transactions. Till then we can use an altcoin like I said. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Winner on March 18, 2017, 11:44:05 AM What your discussing been around since Peercoin was built. People were trying to get more Bitcoin exposure while having another digital currency get some promotion as well. Digital Payments are the main thing in this niche, that is why most of the Altcoins are getting known from news websites and the such.
Bitcoin transactions could have a highspeed if there was a third-party payment processor to sort of loan money for Bitcoins so the sender could immediately recieve the money. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: SONG GEET on March 18, 2017, 11:48:43 AM What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? To convert bitcoin to any other altcoin you have two ways;1. Send bitcoin to shapeshift like service and get altcoin to your desired address. 2. Deposit your bitcoin in exchange, buy alt from market and send those alt out in the form of withdraw. in both scenario you have to send bitcoin to exchanges address which will cost you some fee so how this gonna save fees ??? The only exception for this is that you have to use your exchange wallet or gambling site wallet (which supports other alts and have inbuilt exchange service) as a normal bitcoin wallet, which is not a good practice. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: bitcampaign on March 18, 2017, 11:48:52 AM all wallets working to arrange a transaction fee or even someone ever tried to use without Fee
256301465d77affb6bc7087432a9130db48dd64efa28b0460fb674eda704f382 so the problem is how to get a quick one or more of the transaction confirmation Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: franky1 on March 18, 2017, 11:51:08 AM addressing the FUD that spam is related to pools wanting income: pools do not care about fee's as a NEEDED INCOME. to them its just a bonus. and will continue to be a bonus for a couple decades. the block reward will be sufficient enough to cover real costs. those pushing the fee war are not actually the pools. but blockstream devs that have 1. tweaked the code to make the old priority formulae near useless (infact 0.14 is removing priority formula completely) 2. removed reactive fee's and replaced it with AVERAGE fee's 3. added fee filters and relay filters all of which are biasedly making tx fee's rise, even in times of low demand. what is needed is to reintroduce a REAL and NEW 'priority formulae' mechanism that makes the infrequent LEAN tx users get cheap tx and those that want to spam by respending every block pay more. and those that want to bloat a block pay more. that way it becomes fairer for everyone, rather than just 'everyone pay more' banker economics here is one example imagine that we decided its acceptable that people should have a way to get priority if they have a lean tx and signal that they only want to spend funds once a day. where if they want to spend more often costs rise, if they want bloated tx, costs rise.. which then allows those that just pay their rent once a month or buys groceries every couple days to be ok using onchain bitcoin.. and where the costs of trying to spam the network (every block) becomes expensive where by they would be better off using LN. (for things like faucet raiding every 5-10 minutes) so lets think about a priority fee thats not about rich vs poor but about respend spam and bloat. lets imagine we actually use the tx age combined with CLTV to signal the network that a user is willing to add some maturity time if their tx age is under a day, to signal they want it confirmed but allowing themselves to be locked out of spending for an average of 24 hours. and where the bloat of the tx vs the blocksize has some impact too... rather than the old formulae with was more about the value of the tx https://i.imgur.com/WnGb05Q.png as you can see its not about tx value. its about bloat and age. this way those not wanting to spend more than once a day and dont bloat the blocks get preferential treatment onchain. if you are willing to wait a day but your taking up 1% of the blockspace. you pay more if you want to be a spammer spending every block. you pay the price and if you want to be a total ass-hat and be both bloated and respending often you pay the ultimate price Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Tigggger on March 18, 2017, 11:51:58 AM What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? To convert bitcoin to any other altcoin you have two ways;1. Send bitcoin to shapeshift like service and get altcoin to your desired address. 2. Deposit your bitcoin in exchange, buy alt from market and send those alt out in the form of withdraw. in both scenario you have to send bitcoin to exchanges address which will cost you some fee so how this gonna save fees ??? The only exception for this is that you have to use your exchange wallet or gambling site wallet (which supports other alts and have inbuilt exchange service) as a normal bitcoin wallet, which is not a good practice. But then on top of that even without exchange fees there is always a difference between what you can sell at and what you can buy at, that may cost more that the original bitcoin transaction fee. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: talkbitcoin on March 18, 2017, 11:53:58 AM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? first of all spam attack has been over and fees aren't high anymore. good ol' bitcoin is back. secondly if block size debate finally comes to an end and we no longer see spam attacks there is no need. finally your idea would cost even more. 1. bitcoin transaction fee to send to exchange site or shapeshift for example. 2. exchange fee based on your volume to exchange bitcoin to that altcoin. 3. altcoin transaction fee. or did you think sending altcoin is free? 4. exchanging that altcoin back to bitcoin and paying another percentage exchange fee. 5. another bitcoin transaction fee to withdraw the exchanged bitcoin to your wallet. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: audaciousbeing on March 18, 2017, 12:01:14 PM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? From the way it seems, high fees will only compound the problem because it might erode the spread on profit but the issue is that it cannot be avioided but rather minimise and to do that, first thing is to avoid send small amount of btc and then instead of making withdrawal every now and then, it could be aggregated to move at once then wait for a while to do same. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: calkob on March 18, 2017, 12:09:24 PM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? So how would you get your bitcoin to an exchange to convert to the altcoin ? im not sure that would make sense and you would have t pay a fee to the exchange also? i think you need to rethink this. unless i am missing your point. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Barbut on March 18, 2017, 12:17:48 PM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? So how would you get your bitcoin to an exchange to convert to the altcoin ? im not sure that would make sense and you would have t pay a fee to the exchange also? i think you need to rethink this. unless i am missing your point. You are not missing the point, I have same conclusion from OPs post. This can not work like he imagined, especially for the people who wish to transfer low amounts of bitcoins. Xapo still doesn't have fees, low transaction fees are also available with many wallet's, and maybe we will wait a bit more, get annoyed by that but it's only way for many of us. Have patience like I have, I don't complain on that, I find something to do until confirmation. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: ubercool on March 18, 2017, 12:19:26 PM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? So how would you get your bitcoin to an exchange to convert to the altcoin ? im not sure that would make sense and you would have t pay a fee to the exchange also? i think you need to rethink this. unless i am missing your point. Yes, I think the OP is missing out the factor of fees of altcoins. It may sound an alternative way, but it also will take fees from us, may be less but it will be there. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: AngelSky on March 18, 2017, 12:46:59 PM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? Yes you can rid out from this issue by changing the minimum fee level in your wallet. Please check your web wallet or desktop wallet according to change it. If you change to minimum fees for transaction, we need to wait for long time to transaction to complete. If you okay with transaction time change to low fees else let it be as default. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: teilwalL05 on March 18, 2017, 01:03:49 PM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? My concern is if an altcoin really is not a scam coin or whatsoever I am feeling a little doubt over some altcoin gaining something because the fee's on bitcoin transaction is to much but I think the value is dropping right now and the high fee's are getting lower we are having a problem just like these because of the value of bitcoin skyrocket I think we don't need another coins anymore instead wait for it to accept the transaction or let bitcoin drop it's value. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: dearbesz1219 on March 18, 2017, 01:21:08 PM I remembered when I do transaction using electrum wallet, for thinking that I want to avoid high fee transaction I adjusted the fee to the minimal fee which is 0.00003BTC I was so happy but the disadvantage of what I do was worst and disaster to me it tooks 2 in half days before I received the confirmation it has been stocked for a couple days my friend told me within 36 hours it will go back where it belongs. then He advised me that next I must set the fee adjustment at the middle not in minimum/lowest fee.
Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: aso118 on March 18, 2017, 01:22:58 PM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? I agree with your opinion and I would go with litecoin for several reasons; it's a cheap coin, very good confirmation time, it's be around from 2011 and so on. Moreover, people are willing to accept an altcoin there is no rush to convert it back to btc because they can use it for micropayments too. But if the blocksize debate ends maybe some kind of side-chains could be used for these small transactions. Till then we can use an altcoin like I said. People might not be comfortable holding on to an alt, because its price could drop drastically. That is where the conversion back to BTC and the associated fees comes into play. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Labumi on March 18, 2017, 01:41:27 PM Hmm, it's probably one of the solutions that fairly well. But I think, that all of them will not necessarily accept it. Because the Fee they would get will also be getting bigger, because the prices of most of the altcoin have a high level of risk (automatic price can be high and low). So this probably could be the solution for those who are indeed doing great deals, for if they do big deals it needed is speed
Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: dfd1 on March 18, 2017, 01:46:27 PM This is exactly what litecoin was made for back in 2011, actually.
Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: naughty1 on March 18, 2017, 01:52:36 PM This is a good idea; however, it is not entirely convenient, because we still lose a small fee when exchanging currencies, and it can cost us a lot of time and effort. To perform many different transactions. I support this idea, but we need to take a different approach, we need something more convenient and faster, a technology that integrates everything and works steadily. It would be very difficult, but it is possible.
Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: ShowOff on March 18, 2017, 01:56:26 PM in my experience i only use 1 address only even in blockchain the address always change. so the input will not much and it not takes high fee to send a transaction
Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Kevin77 on March 18, 2017, 02:00:06 PM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. You are indirectly suggesting to use exchanges as wallets. Otherwise converting altcoins into bitcoins will be again a head ache as we might be needing them send back to our personal wallets by paying higher tx fees. I foresee your idea will be viable only when we are using an exchange services as our wallets. After accumulating significant balances in bitcoins in exchanges, we could send them back to our desktop wallet.What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? This way, I believe dogecoins would be the right choice to be used as transaction carriers as they just need 1 dogecoin as tx fees which is equivalent to merely 20 satoshi (5000 times lesser fee per 1kb). Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Iranus on March 18, 2017, 02:05:20 PM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? Some other altcoin?Which altcoin do you suggest? This will pump the price of that altcoin and the altcoin`s transaction fees might also increase. Anyway,the bitcoin price might go down soon and this will decrease the transaction fees for btc payments. This will avoid any quick pump. Bitcoin price can not always remain low so high transaction fee is inevitable. Still a lot of effort to go through for every transaction when you're only talking about ~$1 in fees in most cases. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: dothebeats on March 18, 2017, 02:32:45 PM If you are not okay with the fees then don't input any fee at all. You will still have your transaction confirmed however it might take days or weeks on end, though. If you feel that you are paying a large amount of money just for the fees, you can always convert to an alt then convert back to btc once you're don, however that would be a hassle.
Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Catmony on March 18, 2017, 02:36:54 PM This is exactly what litecoin was made for back in 2011, actually. But still there are not many web wallets for litecoin and i think that is one of the main factor for the very low userbase for litecoin compared to bitcoin. For micro transactions bitcoin can still be useful if you include as much transactions as you can in one transaction. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: CyberKuro on March 18, 2017, 02:55:10 PM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? Well that is convenient but there is another trouble that will come along. If you convert your bitcoin into altcoins then you send it to a recipient then the receiver will actually complain. The reason is when he will convert the altcoins back to bitcoins he or she will pay the transaction fee and lets add to that the withdrawal fee of 50k satoshi. Thats rude and it just eats more of your bitcoin rather than saving it. Hence I do not see your suggestion feasible due to this flaws. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: DeanJVR on March 18, 2017, 02:56:28 PM There is a way to transfer any crypto cyrrency to someone else without paying anything and bypass the blockchain all together.
I have address 1/ wallet with 10 BTC or 5 or 1 BTC in it (you can move amounts to get to a amount that is exacly what you want to send to someone else) For example Say I have 11 BTC's in a wallet or address and I only want to pay my brother 10 BTC for his car I transfer 1 BTC to another wallet or address I own send or give him the address or wallet with the 10 BTC's in with the password so he becomes the new owner of the wallet or address. The actual 10 BTCs never moved anywhere the only thing that changed is the ownership of the 10 BTCs. With alot of brainstorming by core developers the BTC ecosystem can change completely. Emagine all 21 million BTC has been mined and spread all over the world (decentralised as one big pool) If they were all broken up in sets of 100's 50's 20's 10's 5's 1's 0.01's etc BTC's So if I own (like money) 1 set of 10's BTC and 2 sets of 1's I can store it in a address of 12BTC and give you the whole wallet/address with passwords etc and you do whatever you want with that wallet (1st thing is to change the password. I can give ownership over physycally too in return for your TV etc. Need alot of brain storming though. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: giveen on March 18, 2017, 02:59:52 PM Come on man you are complaining because the fees is what 0.5$ per transactions. All these years if you see other payment processors like paypal,skrill , payza , etc have been charging 3-10% fees and no one complains about it much as we have no choice. Even though the bitcoin fees has increased it is still cheaper than other alternatives. And converting to altcoins also takes fees so it basically useless to convert.
Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Mr.Nath on March 18, 2017, 03:12:08 PM The Value will definitely not be same again. One would lose some coins in the process.
Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Kprawn on March 18, 2017, 03:14:32 PM You cannot solve the tx fee problem by using other Alt coins... that would just be stupid. No matter what you do, you would have to come back
to Bitcoin, and then all fees will be applicable again. This is like saying... use Xapo for all transactions and then balance it out by doing the final transaction on the BTC Blockchain. We do not want Alt coins or 3rd party services to be the solution... we want Bitcoin to be the solution. ;) Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: LTU_btc on March 18, 2017, 05:52:09 PM finally your idea would cost even more. This is exact reason why altcoins can't solve high fees problem. And it's very inconvenient way to send money which also requires additional time for confirmations of transactions.1. bitcoin transaction fee to send to exchange site or shapeshift for example. 2. exchange fee based on your volume to exchange bitcoin to that altcoin. 3. altcoin transaction fee. or did you think sending altcoin is free? 4. exchanging that altcoin back to bitcoin and paying another percentage exchange fee. 5. another bitcoin transaction fee to withdraw the exchanged bitcoin to your wallet. Come on man you are complaining because the fees is what 0.5$ per transactions. All these years if you see other payment processors like paypal,skrill , payza , etc have been charging 3-10% fees and no one complains about it much as we have no choice. Even though the bitcoin fees has increased it is still cheaper than other alternatives. And converting to altcoins also takes fees so it basically useless to convert. Well, cheap transactions was one of the main bitcoin advantages. Now, when transaction fees increased, I can send money cheaper via bank transfer than bitcoin. And it's not good for bitcoin development. People will remain to use banks, PayPal and other similar things and they wont try to search for alternatives.Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: webtricks on March 18, 2017, 06:09:16 PM Ultimately you need to send Bitcoin to exchanges first in order to convert them in Altcoins. No difference!
Whereas, for receiver there will be a eagerness to convert his alts to btc as soon as possible. In this, eagerness he would be ready to sell them off at lower prices. As the result, receiver will loss gradually. Dumping will become widespread! Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Arcteryx on March 18, 2017, 06:16:34 PM Wouldn't sending these bitcoins you want to send out to a bitmixer site cause you not to pay out so much in transactions fees?
Or even a casino type wallet and spend some just to keep it active. Just a suggestion of what I've have experienced in having to do so to avoid these upheaval of bitcoin transaction fees. ;) Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: btvGainer on March 18, 2017, 08:14:45 PM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? first of all spam attack has been over and fees aren't high anymore. good ol' bitcoin is back. secondly if block size debate finally comes to an end and we no longer see spam attacks there is no need. finally your idea would cost even more. 1. bitcoin transaction fee to send to exchange site or shapeshift for example. 3. altcoin transaction fee. or did you think sending altcoin is free? 5. another bitcoin transaction fee to withdraw the exchanged bitcoin to your wallet. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: mobilestrike on March 18, 2017, 09:10:47 PM But that will take some more time for the transaction. For that you will also deal with the receiver to accept that and you will need to do the transaction from exchange to make it convenient and so people will not be able to show their payment in bitcoin in any currency and then there will be a lot of other complications start to occur. The better is that we go direct with the current fees.
Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Dizaster2015 on March 18, 2017, 09:29:58 PM But that will take some more time for the transaction. For that you will also deal with the receiver to accept that and you will need to do the transaction from exchange to make it convenient and so people will not be able to show their payment in bitcoin in any currency and then there will be a lot of other complications start to occur. The better is that we go direct with the current fees. Some because of long transactions have long switched to altcoins. Nevertheless, this problem must be solved. It was very inconvenient to use bitcoin Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: leopard2 on March 18, 2017, 09:30:39 PM Jeez i can do an international wire cheaper than those stats Franky posted :o
It is not surprising BTC price drops like a rock It is very surprisign, however, that that money is not moving into the obvious alternatives: PPC and LTC. Even PPC with its slight 1% yearly inflation would be alot cheaper to use than paying the massive fees to miners. :( Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Wapinter on March 18, 2017, 09:55:20 PM There is a way to transfer any crypto cyrrency to someone else without paying anything and bypass the blockchain all together. If you mean 2 different addresses from same wallet,then the person having private key will own both address.If you mean two different wallets,then you still have to pay feeI have address 1/ wallet with 10 BTC or 5 or 1 BTC in it (you can move amounts to get to a amount that is exacly what you want to send to someone else) For example Say I have 11 BTC's in a wallet or address and I only want to pay my brother 10 BTC for his car I transfer 1 BTC to another wallet or address I own send or give him the address or wallet with the 10 BTC's in with the password so he becomes the new owner of the wallet or address. The actual 10 BTCs never moved anywhere the only thing that changed is the ownership of the 10 BTCs. With alot of brainstorming by core developers the BTC ecosystem can change completely. Emagine all 21 million BTC has been mined and spread all over the world (decentralised as one big pool) If they were all broken up in sets of 100's 50's 20's 10's 5's 1's 0.01's etc BTC's So if I own (like money) 1 set of 10's BTC and 2 sets of 1's I can store it in a address of 12BTC and give you the whole wallet/address with passwords etc and you do whatever you want with that wallet (1st thing is to change the password. I can give ownership over physycally too in return for your TV etc. Need alot of brain storming though. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: LeGaulois on March 18, 2017, 10:43:04 PM There is a way to transfer any crypto cyrrency to someone else without paying anything and bypass the blockchain all together. If you mean 2 different addresses from same wallet,then the person having private key will own both address.If you mean two different wallets,then you still have to pay feeI have address 1/ wallet with 10 BTC or 5 or 1 BTC in it (you can move amounts to get to a amount that is exacly what you want to send to someone else) For example Say I have 11 BTC's in a wallet or address and I only want to pay my brother 10 BTC for his car I transfer 1 BTC to another wallet or address I own send or give him the address or wallet with the 10 BTC's in with the password so he becomes the new owner of the wallet or address. The actual 10 BTCs never moved anywhere the only thing that changed is the ownership of the 10 BTCs. With alot of brainstorming by core developers the BTC ecosystem can change completely. Emagine all 21 million BTC has been mined and spread all over the world (decentralised as one big pool) If they were all broken up in sets of 100's 50's 20's 10's 5's 1's 0.01's etc BTC's So if I own (like money) 1 set of 10's BTC and 2 sets of 1's I can store it in a address of 12BTC and give you the whole wallet/address with passwords etc and you do whatever you want with that wallet (1st thing is to change the password. I can give ownership over physycally too in return for your TV etc. Need alot of brain storming though. No he wanted to mean 2 differents wallets and yes he still needs to pay the fees. In ocurrence for the transaction of sending the 1 BTC to the other wallet he owns. Reading all the replies make me think about the internationnal companies trying to cheat the taxs income for paying less, by hidding some millions here and there in different countries under different companies entities Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: aardvark15 on March 18, 2017, 10:50:30 PM If you convert of an altcoin on an exchange, that exchange will charge a fee for you and another fee for the recipient when he/she converts back. I guess it depends on how much all those fees add up to be and if it is still profitable.
Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: positivezero on March 19, 2017, 02:55:57 AM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? So am I. I also avoid to make some transactions because of higher fees. Maybe some ways to avoid high fees is that converting bitcoin to altcoin as you've said but i think this is not easy and convenient to use. In my opinion also, just dont mind the higher fees as long as we can bitcoin is an easy way even how high the fees is. Or if we want to have no deduction or fees, then i will just keep my bitcoin safe Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: indiangrad on March 19, 2017, 03:59:35 AM What your discussing been around since Peercoin was built. People were trying to get more Bitcoin exposure while having another digital currency get some promotion as well. Digital Payments are the main thing in this niche, that is why most of the Altcoins are getting known from news websites and the such. Bitcoin transactions could have a highspeed if there was a third-party payment processor to sort of loan money for Bitcoins so the sender could immediately recieve the money. This sounds interesting. In fact, banks in india do something similar for their instant payment system IMPS. But this would lead to increased centralization I guess... Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: pooya87 on March 19, 2017, 05:36:16 AM if we wanted to use an altcoin and if we could use an altcoin the way we are using bitcoin then we wouldn't have hesitated one second. but the problem is that altcoins have numerous problems that you don't see until you use them.
one of the problems that i actually had today because i was doing some arbitrage trading is the number of confirmation these altcoins require. when you are left waiting an hour for 60+ confirmation and no block is found on that altcoin chain you come back crying to bitcoin :D Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: numismatist on March 19, 2017, 05:45:54 AM If you convert of an altcoin on an exchange, that exchange will charge a fee for you and another fee for the recipient when he/she converts back. I guess it depends on how much all those fees add up to be and if it is still profitable. The idea was born dead. If an altcoin is needed there is that opposite implication - the original seems to be unneeded. That leaves it behind as a collector's token. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Rude Boy on March 19, 2017, 05:54:34 AM The fees for Bitcoin transactions are equal or bigger than those for bank transactions, that means that there is enough demand for Bitcoin transactions for those fees to be being paid. That would mean that Bitcoin is succeeding magnificently, the exact opposite of collapsing.
It's like seeing a restaurant that's always crowded (fully-packed), and asking "Is that restaurant about to go out of business? It's too crowded to keep operating!" In actuality, the restaurant is prospering, not on the brink of bankruptcy. In other words, if you begin with the assumption that fees in Bitcoin are super-high, you are implicitly assuming that there is super-high demand for bitcoins, i.e. that Bitcoin is doing super-well. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: coynedterm on March 19, 2017, 05:59:11 AM A lot of people complain about increasing transaction fee of bitcoin and some even consider to postpone their transaction to avoid these fees. I think here we need to pay the suitable amount of fee that is needed to get speed confirmation because the fee is not only incease for our loss but it is helping to the bitcoin network and this will improve the bitcoin future and technology .What about we always convert btc to some other Altcoin before sending and recipient can convert it back to btc as per is convenience? We can do it for smaller amount of transactions as paying high fee for them is not feasible. This will also reduce the network congestion to some large extent as most of these transactions are usually of smaller amount. What is your opinion? So i will say just pay the suitablle fee . But if you want pay low fee then keep in your mind that you don't need speed confirmations . Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: dodgecharger on March 19, 2017, 06:01:48 AM The fees for Bitcoin transactions are equal or bigger than those for bank transactions, that means that there is enough demand for Bitcoin transactions for those fees to be being paid. That would mean that Bitcoin is succeeding magnificently, the exact opposite of collapsing. Yes, you are right. In such a situation users were waiting hours for transactions getting included in a block before the purchased products got delivery. what will they think about? If I were him, I would switch to other payment method.It's like seeing a restaurant that's always crowded (fully-packed), and asking "Is that restaurant about to go out of business? It's too crowded to keep operating!" In actuality, the restaurant is prospering, not on the brink of bankruptcy. In other words, if you begin with the assumption that fees in Bitcoin are super-high, you are implicitly assuming that there is super-high demand for bitcoins, i.e. that Bitcoin is doing super-well. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: ASHLIUSZ on March 19, 2017, 06:39:36 AM The fees for Bitcoin transactions are equal or bigger than those for bank transactions, that means that there is enough demand for Bitcoin transactions for those fees to be being paid. That would mean that Bitcoin is succeeding magnificently, the exact opposite of collapsing. Yes, you are right. In such a situation users were waiting hours for transactions getting included in a block before the purchased products got delivery. what will they think about? If I were him, I would switch to other payment method.It's like seeing a restaurant that's always crowded (fully-packed), and asking "Is that restaurant about to go out of business? It's too crowded to keep operating!" In actuality, the restaurant is prospering, not on the brink of bankruptcy. In other words, if you begin with the assumption that fees in Bitcoin are super-high, you are implicitly assuming that there is super-high demand for bitcoins, i.e. that Bitcoin is doing super-well. Title: Re: Idea to avoid high fee Post by: Amph on March 19, 2017, 06:48:03 AM If you convert of an altcoin on an exchange, that exchange will charge a fee for you and another fee for the recipient when he/she converts back. I guess it depends on how much all those fees add up to be and if it is still profitable. i guess bitcoin subchain would work better in this case, and would not require additional fee, too bad the idea of subchain seems to be forgotten enterely, as i have not heard anything anymore about it also subchain would have avoided hard forking or soft forking and added a security to zero confirmation transaction, but i guess miners were not in agreement with this too... |
