Bitcoin Forum

Like Bitcoins rhodium exhibits three properties:

It is very rare, (much) rarer than Gold
It is somewhat of a fringe investment
It is subject to hypes

And most importantly it is one of the few actual assets which exhibit wild price swings.
http://www.kitco.com/LFgif/rd72-98.gifhttp://www.kitco.com/LFgif/rd92-pres.gif

I find it very interesting how chaotic those are, so if you think to know what bitcoin will do next over any longer period of time: Think again ;)

Need Rhodium now!

http://periodictable.com/Samples/045.7/s9s.JPG

I used to observe rhodium prices last year as i noticed that the price pattern always had a unique behavior. Real good find that you managed to find a pattern between BTC and rhodium. What this needs now is some detailed analysis  :)

As a lover of precious metals this pleases me.

I heard someone is making ASICs to mine Rhodium  :D

Well spotted OP.

Remove the smilie and post this as new topic for endless laughs.

I think the man who discovered Rhodium, William H. Wollaston, would agree.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7d/Wollaston_William_Hyde_Jackson_color.jpg

Most people don't realize this, but he was an ardent Bitcoin fan, and early adopter. You can see him above looking over his paper wallets in this famous portrait.

gibberish

I have a Rhodium tooth.

No, it's digital coffee.

Cuz look how volatile coffee is. Must be the same underlying dynamics:

https://i.imgur.com/dMBXcnM.png

Not volatile enough.
But there is a point here, historically grain was used as a backing asset for the first occurrences of currency.

Other than that the similarity ends here since it isn't really limited, it is mainly dependent on fundamental production demand and it is consumed.

bump

How about responding to my post?

Ok. Eyeballing it, the volatility of Rhodium and Coffee looks similar enough.

Bitcoin, of course, has been more volatile. NewLibertyStandard quoted $0.0007639 per BTC in 2009. Now we're close to $300. OMG, the volatility!!!

Bitcoin is still a toy in terms of global relevance. It's in its infancy. To cry "volatility" is both to miss the point, and to fail to acknowledge where we are in the lifecycle. In short, such observations are meaningless.

erm. no... it's too poisonous to use as a tooth.
Rhodium makes for badass drill bits/cutting tools etc.

Shut up and take my money

Where wiuld you say we are in the lifecycle?

Eaaaaaaaaarrrrly adopter stage.

Hilarious.

It does not seem an unreasonable thought that Bitcoin rises in value steadily, with short term spikes along the way. Indeed, a commodity. Better pick it up again when demand is lower again.

Good find, although bitcoin feels just a touch more useful then Rhodium.

There is no long term trend up in Rhodium, so very different from Bitcoin imo. The volatility is all they share in common.

I disagree.

The thing with precious metals is that they have a fixed supply. We just don't know what that fixed supply is, whereas with BTC we do.

More importantly, we don't know what the ultimate demand is for rhodium.  Maybe we come up with some great application and suddenly the really limited supply of rhodium is incredibly valuable.  Weird ideas about what this might be are why rhodium values fluctuate so rapidly.  (Or at least I speculate this wildly out of my ass with no clue about rhodium other than what I've read on Wikipedia.  Actually, I do know a fair amount about rhodium because it's very interesting, seriously, look into it, but nearly nothing about it as a commodity.)

Bitcoin is fundamentally different from rhodium, because its value or lack of value depends solely on inherent attributes of the commodity.  Those attributes are deliberately built into it.  Unlike, say, rhodium, Bitcoin has no values other than as money.  You can't make wire out of it.  You can't make jewelry out of it.  It won't get put into a catalytic converter (like platinum or palladium or whatever). 

So its price isn't going to go into weird spirals based on external ideas.  Okay, its price can and has gone into weird spirals because of weird ideas about its actual attributes.  But that's a different thing.

Bitcoin isn't an electronic anything.

It's Bitcoin.  Sui generis, bitch.

Best response yet. You are of course right.


What I am pointing out are the similarities, which end here.
What remains is more like how Bitcoin works as an investment which is very similar, to how rhodium is threated, the amount of investment taking over the largest portion of the price.

False.

As an aside, I have a Bitcoin tooth.

So you do you think one Bitcoin will be traded for US$ 117,816,468  in 4 years?
Good riddance.

I propose you the following exercise: Look at any 4 year period of rhodium prices and tell me it can't be mistaken for something bitcoin is doing.

How is Bitcoin more or less rare than gold?

There's more kilograms of one, but more satoshis of the other. How does that compare on the rareness-scale? :)

Notice the 's' in Bitcoins? I was talking about single Bitcoins, not any named subunits some guy came up with.
There are more Gold atoms than Satoshis btw.

You may see that as "common unit" bitcoins, troy ounces, oil barrels, etc..

Why compare entire bitcoins (which are digital, thus infinitely divisible) with *atoms* of gold no less?
Why not femtocoins of BTC with megatonnes of gold?

Is it just me or do you guys also have a desire to try this piece of metal between your teeth? I wonder if it's somewhat soft like tin.

FTFY
Keep in mind that changing the smallest denomination would make old clients unusable and doing it would also affect the market, so it's not as easy to do as you might think.


Because nobody else does it. Again I compare ounces with bitcoins because most people use these denominations.

IIRC it's the second hardest metal.

Good find EM, again I salute your Gadflyness.

In response to the earlier comparison with Coffee, their is a kernel of truth here, Coffee is volatile because of a consistent tendency of Coffee growers to over-plant new Coffee trees which take ~5 years to mature, so the market swings from gluts to shortages as lots of trees are planted during shortages and almost none planted during the gluts.

This long-lead time is more like ASIC based mining, where as GPU mining would be more like growing sugar-cane or any other annual crop.  ASIC miners are almost certainly going to overshoot their equipment purchaces and be producing coins at a loss very soon and this may create a Coffee like volatility.

Rhodium is way more useful for hardening/toughening cutting tools.
Ask any high-end machine shop.

[altho-theoretically-the same electrons used to store bits can be used in an arc or laser cutter...]

No it isn't. There will be nearly 2100000000000000 Satoshis but only 171,300 tonnes of gold in the world.

/silliness

I'm always amused by how people compare the rarity of bitcoin versus gold. You can't compare it since the units they're measured in are so different...

The big spikes seem to be just before or during the recessions. Early 90's and 2007/8 ish. I guess this is the reason for the spike as people rushed for a save haven.

Will people rush to Bitcoin during the next one in 1,5,10 years or whenever? Who knows.

the market is pretty the same, but they're contrary different things!

And the finance people seem to love it.

cant believe wallstreet actually taking the move to add a index finally. but, that means a huge potential of influx of buyers.. grandma is about to talk to her FA whats better then 1-2% and they prob mention bitcoin if she can afford the risk.

http://mashable.com/2015/05/19/new-york-stock-exchange-bitcoin/

I disagree.

Rhodium's major use is as one of the catalysts in the three-way catalytic converters in automobiles. White gold is often plated with a thin rhodium layer to improve its appearance while sterling silver is often rhodium-plated for tarnish resistance.

Catalytic converters in automobiles are probably used considerably more than Bitcoin.

All of the Platinum metals seem to exhibit wide price swings. These charts from a report by the U.S. Geological Survey (http://pubs.usgs.gov/sir/2012/5188/sir2012-5188.pdf#Platinum-Group) show long term price trends. Red line is inflation adjusted.

http://i60.tinypic.com/2uh1o3b.png (http://i60.tinypic.com/2uh1o3b.png)

Ruthenium went from $13/oz average in 1993 to $574/oz average in 2007. In 13 years, Iridium fell from $666/oz to $47/oz.

To be honest though, we're really too narrow-sighted when we look at a mere forty years in these metals. Trends can emerge over very long time periods indeed, and what can appear as randomness on one scale can be a pattern on another.