Bitcoin Forum

We know that "anonymity" is one of the main characteristic of Bitcoin and many people love to use Bitcoin because of this feature but is this causing problems worldwide?

The recent  Wannacry Ransomware attack is the biggest Ransomware attack in the history and the hacker/attacker has asked to pay in "Bitcoins" because it can't be traced . What can be done in this type of situations?

A group or individual has also threatened a big company in our country to pay him certain ( big) amount of money in BTC otherwise their employees would face many problems . Payments from other methods ( which hackers or attackers used before ) was traceable but what about Bitcoins ? What can be done ?

Bitcoin is not anonymous but if you are clever you can cover your tracks using other coins and exchanges. And governments are very opposed to anonymous crypto. I see a battle coming in the future over this issue.

I understood what you said . Yes bitcoins can be traced by writing down all the addresses it has been sent to and the final destination ( bank account or any other account where we can find to which person it belongs to) but as you mentioned its not difficult to exchange it to other coins and trade it and again convert it back to BTC ( whole new address ) and use it .

Put some time to research, how much people become prison dreaming in it.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-netherlands-crime-bitcoin-idUSKCN0UY0V8

not exactly true, bitcoin transaction are not anonymous, but the identity behind who is sending those transaction is very well anonymous, until he link his name to the address by shipping something to his home address for example

until that happen there is no way you can tell who is behind any of those address


i suspect they exchanged and transfered to their bank account, if they used directly bitcoin for payment, there is no way to know who they are, unless they sent it to the police directly, which were under cover to caught them

Bitcoin is less anonymous than a suitcase full of cash.

There are many ransomware schemes involving digital transactions other than bitcoin tend to be more effective, and for some strange reason aren't as widely publicized.

Its possible ransomware schemes involving bitcoin are false flag ops.

Bitcoin IS NOT ANONYMOUS and is basically a dream-come-true for records available to police globally and agencies equivelent to FBI & IRS to have freely accessible bitcoin ledger data that will not change and can be used in a court against you. No need to subpoena private banks or for them to request you provide the records. its PUBLIC, just need to match some IP data/telecom/username/login/geographical pattern data.

yes bitcoin is not anonymous but the person who is holding bitcoin is really anonymous, but i am hopeful that it is not causing problem globally. hope that bitcoin will be economically helpful for the people of the world. as it is already helpful for those people who do not have any day job and they have invested even a little amount of money in trading. or those people who do not have any money and they are still earning bitcoin from joining a signature campaign in bitcointalk.org forum.

https://www.ucl.ac.uk/scs/people/academic/dr-sarah-meiklejohn

Call tomorrow to this lady, maby she give to You some story.

As it is Bitcoin is more anonymous than the traditional banking system. This is desired and people are trusting banks less and less and less....

Bitcoin is not really anonymous, actually we can track the transaction, but there are also ways to make it harder to track, a lot of people believe that the anonymity has caused so many problems, that is because the people doesn't understand about bitcoin, bitcoin and fiat is almost the same it is a currency, so actually bitcoin doesn't add problems, the ransomware like to used bitcoin because it is valuable not because it is anonymity

Well by reading all your comments and also going through some cases like
we can say that Bitcoin can be traced and eventually it is like any other currency but it will be just harder .

"Bitcoin isn't anonymous but the person who is holding it is upto some extent ".
I will close this thread if we don't see a new approach to this soon :) Thanks all for the clarity.

Bitcoin's anonymity is great cause you dont have to type your personal information and dont get victimized by identity theft like paypal thousand of credits information being leaked online and getting used for financial gain, bitcoin helps you from those kind of things
But also not everything is perfect there are also some disadvantages to it like being used in illegal ways like what you have mention ransomware but the question is bitcoin really to blame or the users?

Bitcoin is not really anonymous, I think the correct term is fungible, or something.

But even if you can hide your identity, the address the coins would be sent will be know, so if you upset powerful people, they will be flagged and may be refused on exchanges, or the mines could just refuse to mine your transactions and you'll have nothing

Hackers have a better chance staying anonymous by demanding ransom in the form of prepaid gift cards than bitcoin. Gift cards offer a higher degree of anonymity when it comes to tracking transactions than the bitcoin which leaves a trail on the blockchain. So there is nothing like bitcoin is causing a problem. It is just a matter of choice. These ransomware attacks were happening successfully even before the bitcoin came into existence.

the gift cards could be cancelled, and it is probably possible to detect which account has been used to redeem a certain gift card

cash still is better for ransom, at least regarding anonymity

It's really up to the individual on how he wants to utilize the benefits of bitcoin to his advantage. It so happens that pseudonymity is one of the characteristics of bitcoin, and some people took it to their advantage. I think the same can be said of fiat or any other currency, for that matter.

In 1989 when the first attack happened they demanded payment through banks and Western Union and they easily got traced down to panama. But this time hackers have not got traced till now. Moreover, they chose bitcoin because bitcoin transaction can be easily verified by the hackers and they are faster.

Bitcoin gives you no more anonymity than cash gives you. So if you use cash, you would be more anonymous than when you would be using Bitcoin. The pseudo-anonymity is necessary to protect your financial privacy and unfortunately some people take advantage of that to commit crimes.

Question : Are you going to shut down the internet, because people use that to spread Randsomware OR that it is being used by criminals? < Unfortunately you have to take the good with the bad in these situations >

Bitcoin can be a really big problems when it comes in the government because bitcoin is anonymous in the sense of it is really digital we cant know the trase of the transaction so bitcoin can be use in such a illegal transactions and more applicable in it so it cant be trase by the government they really doing it in the black market.

This issue is a serious one and I am sure the way this unscrupulous individuals are abusing the anonymity characteristics is definitely not what Satoshi had in mind from the beginning and this pose more problem than we could imagine because since small guys are exploiting this means, then others will start seeing it that way which may force the hand of government if it becomes unbearable or if they don't have the technical capacity to trace where the funds are going into. With this getting to a head, ban will be the best option thereby price comes crashing. Its really a problem.

Bitcoin is anonimous. But not really. You can't buy bitcoin without giving your identity. But this ransomware is a different case. The hackers can't be trace on his btc address only. That's why the authorities still have no idea who the hackers are. I think its the perfect hacking in history. Because no trace at all and it worldwide. 150 countries, absolute incredible.

Many cryptocurrencies are anonymous ,but bitcoin is the most popular amd with the most stable price and that`s why the hackers are using it.
If they were using some weak altcoin,the altcoin`s price would collapse.

Bitcoin has lost a great deal of its anonimity so far but still is convenient for criminal activities and atractive to hackers. One of the reasons is the value of Bitcoin and the fact that it could be easily used for different goods and services in the darkmarket.

Many crooks are using Bitcoin on order to finance their activities.
I think that they can do it with or without the Bitcoin.
The crimes will happen either way and the dark-net/terrorists can find their way no matter what.

The question is what the world and the countries can do in order to regulate it.

We don't need to lie because it is true that anonymity is one of the causing problem in some of the conflicts that we have now especially the ransomware attacks. They choose bitcoin to be their payment method because bitcoin is anonymous and cannot be traced so they have the advantage and they can get payments without being track down.

Right , when we take a look at the pros and cons of Bitcoin we can easily come to a conclusion that Bitcoin is by far useful than any other currency online but If this becomes a big issue and government need to take some action then they will find one proper disadvantage and  may make a rule against the usage of Bitcoin in some countries ( Like our country which doesn't monitor the crypto-currencies ) .


We can actually buy Bitcoin without giving our identity .

I think yes, it is not directly causing global problem, but bitcoin anonymity gives a new way to do bad things, a lot of people think that bitcoin cant be tracked so they are safe to do bad things with bitcoin, but actually the transaction can be tracked, so it almost the same doing bad things using fiat

Not certainly. That's not the reason why it's causing problem globally. What more reason is the issue regarding that and also its legality. Actually, anonymity makes currency better but problem.

All those things also apply to cash, yet there is no general opinion that cash is a "money for criminals". If something is used with malicious intent, it doesn't mean that it should be banned, just like with guns - they don't kill people, people kill people. Also, banning Bitcoin won't solve anything, criminals will always find a method to make their transactions. I think owners of exchanges and other services should cooperate with investigation if there's solid proof that criminals have used their services.

That is like asking if computers, Windows bugs, NSA leaks, cash, the internet, air or water is causing a problem globally.  After all crooks use them too and without any one of them the Wannacry scheme would fail.  They are all neutral tools that can be used for good or bad..

One thing that can be done is to write software that is more secure, don't write software with government backdoors, and use traditional law enforcement techniques to trace bitcoin if needed.

In my opinion, since Bitcoin is an anonymous so you can't​be tracked. but in future, it may be a problem. In recent times we've experienced a lot of hacking and currency trafficking, in which the culprit demands Bitcoin against those cases so concerned authorities may focus on the identity of those people,
When it will occur then Bitcoin may rethink about the procedure.

Yes it is true that even if bitcoin is anonymous but the moment you use an exchanger to convert your coins into cash or to use your cash to buy bitcoins the site will first require you to submit some legal identification for verification. After which you can be allowed to do some transactions. The wannacry ransomware on the other hand uses some kind of code so they can remain invisible to the eyes of the searching authorities.

Exactly its not anonymous because many people who use technology know what bitcoin is. Butbin every transaction its also true that they are anonymous because this serves as their protection and privacy for them. I think it will not be a problem because as of now bitcoin helps a lot people who used it.

If bitcoin transactions are masked (which can easily be done), it allows for money laundering operations from illegal activities/theft/hacks. Its definitely "causing some problems" by enabling/facilitating the operations of these illegal organizations. Even with KYC checks done by bitcoin exchanges, it's not enough to definitively single out people involved in these operations.

Well, this is quite opposite of what I understand about Bitcoin and thank you for enlightening me on the subject of Bitcoin anonymity. Of course, there are many proven ways to cover the tracks if one is really good on what he is doing. The fact that hackers are using Bitcoin that can be telling us that Bitcoin is an effective tool for their illegal activities. However, this is not really the problem of Bitcoin and I think right now authorities mostly in the Western countries are already aware of this fact.

I don't think anonymity of bitcoin causing problem globally, bitcoin can be tracked if we know the wallet of bitcoin, although there are bitcoin mixing service, for big problem (illegal activities globally using bitcoin) the police can ask helping to the owners of bitcoin mixing service to track the bitcoin.

Yup, will be difficult for getting peoples who made criminal with bitcoin
because there are not identity needed when use bitcoin,
 we can not find the peoples who made criminal with bitcoin
especially small criminal with bitcoin.

we all understand that one can make it to hide himself under bitcoin mixers and exchanges, the anonymity is still there. if he buys zcoin and use that zcoin to pay then that would be anon as simple as that can make his transaction anon.

but i don't think it causes problem due to being "anon". its due to being decentralized and only market can dictate its price.

The hackers will always taking advantage of the anonymous transactions of bitcoin and crypto currencies to get valuable from their evil operations. I do think is there no way to make bitcoin transactions transparent! Bitcoin will actually create problems if it remains anonymous.

bitcoin is not the problem, the people with bad intentions and bad purposes making it bad.

I agree but because of these "Bad guys / Hackers" Bitcoin is getting a bad name is what I am trying to convey . People who haven't heard of Bitcoin before will learn about BTC now and the first impression may not be that good is what I am afraid of.

The article says they were caught because large amounts of cash were deposited into their bank accounts and quickly withdrawn from ATMs. Their Bitcoins were confiscated.

So in fact, they were caught because of their fiat transactions - but your point still stands, just not with that article:)

We can't do anything because that is how bitcoin created and it has a feature of being anonymous and that is the vulnerable side for bitcoin because hackers love being anonymous and also the criminals so they take that advantage and use it to crimes and the effect of this is getting involved in the illegal activities and building a bad image towards the people who watches or read news.

Actually, the anonymity of bitcoin is really good but in that case those who are in illegal way of earning really love to use this because they cannot be trace by public or government and love to use for any transactions. People are getting clever so the internet does well develop. Also the anonymity of bitcoin were took advantage by those who are in illegal.

The anonymity of bitcoin will not causing problem globally on bitcoin but it will protect indentity of users bitcoin
their indentity never be known by all of people,
the anonymity of bitcoin is new revolution in currencies, it is new fetures when put the money in bitcoin
there are is not anonymity in fiat currency.

even not fully anonymous but bitcoin had a feature which is don't have from other currency especially legal currency such as dollar or poundsterling but for those who blame bitcoin as the latest incident for ransomware i think they should be think twice because the main problem is to the hackers them self because even if bitcoin doesn't exist the hackers also will use other way to get money so bitcoin not deserve to be blamed

Well that's what I am talking about . If it protects the identity of the users then it will make officials harder to find the hackers / attackers who are using bitcoin for malicious purpose . I agree that BTC is the future :)

If this hackers wants a large amount of money to be sent then they will be having a lot of problems.
One there is a limit to someone who wants his profile hidden. They cannot receive or send money like that. Wallets did that for security purposes like this.
Or they could hack someones profile and make it like his. But still there are ways ro trace IP's. Hell, even I love you Virus was traced in the suburbs of Philippines.

Yes I agree with you so the anonymity in bitcoin is not problem
because everything depend on the users of bitcoin what will be done with it,
 and doesn't mean we must blame the bitcoin because it is anonymous
we can not blame the technology behind blockchain of bitcoin.

It is always up to the people on how they will use bitcoin because even the currencies that is not anonymous is still causing problem globally so we don't need to blame bitcoin for causing a problem because the only thing that we can blame is the users of bitcoin that keeps abusing it and using it for illegal stuff that is the root cause of global problem.

Someone in this thread has name the bitcoin property ideally. Its not anonymous but a pseudonymous. People hide behind the pseudos called the id's. There is a user, there are transactions but there is no info about the user. That info can be gathered from various sources. Mainly the IP, surveilance, malwares, hacks. Its a work for a possible new job, or maybe not so new but involving the cryptocurrency tracking.

Using various mixers might be a way to safely withdraw your money, not giving yourself troubles, but only if you are not under surveilance already.

So the issue with bitcoin pseudonimity is that it helpes people not to be surveiled. If you are already surveiled your anonimity is most probably breached, unless you really know what you are doing. So the bitcoin is not design for large crimes without feeling the inpunity, at least not for everybody.

Nowadays many people are VPN plug ins to be hidden to avoid to find the IP location. Hacking and malware injection and all reduced completely in real project and in bitcoin as well.
If you being anonymous, will you do the scamming attempt in payment or illegal activities. As like most of the people won't do that. I agree, some people will do that. This is one of the highly recommended feature in bitcoin.

Everyone should be looking at how to solve the problem of criminals using Crypto without  taking away (even a little bit)the anonymity. PEOPLE COMMIT DANGEROUS CRIMES WITH NATIONAL CURRENCIES wonder why the focus is on Bitcoin.
How do we even know  anti Bitcoiners aren't behind the attack to make Bitcoin look bad? There should be an intellectual debate on best way to resolve this problem without taking the lazy route

Well no doubt that the criminals like to anonymous but if we look at the feature of the bitcoin that in the end we need to convert them to fiat and it is through a banking system which is too strong to be breach and it can identify each and every person withdrawing the cash. So, those who have a problem with the anonymity shall know it that at the end it is not anonymous.

Anonymity was never the problem of bitcoin but the users who don't know how to protect themselves in such hacks. Bitcoin was being used for such illegal activities because of its pseudo-anonymity BUT it can be traced. Addresses could be watched, and it leaves taints whenever it create transactions. From there you would be able to identify where the money went--whether it ended to an exchange or no. Certain mixing services could be utilized, but if matters comes to the worst case scenarios, these services could end up giving the information of the output address for the said tx.

And that's the problem. Every government wants to have access and the maximum possible control over the life of its population. Not only because they do not respect the privacy of the population, but because there are times that it is necessary to have a certain control to guarantee its security.

As Bitcoin is totally anonymous, they lose that control, and so malicious people can commit crimes without huge risks.

what are you talking about? What is the problem you want to mention here? I have not ever seen Bitcoin causing any problem to the world and it even makes the world better. Bitcoin creates a new chance for people to become anonymous and protect themselves from the centralized sytem