Bitcoin Forum

If its not Mt Gox it will be someone else.  A currency that just requires hacking into a computer to steal is never going to last.  Bitcoin must be traceable if it wishes to survive.  This is not on Mt Gox.  They are just the first victim.

people who want a trackable currency are already surved just fine with credit cards and/or paypal.

Bitcoins are fully traceable from the day they are generated to their current owners address. The anonymity is that no one knows who's address is who's unless someone is stupid enough to paste one of their addresses  vvvv see bottom of post vvvv. So in theory if someone sent me 0.00000001 BTC, and I stored it in the same wallet.dat as the rest of my bitcoins, once I spent it with other bitcoins they MAY be able to trace back and work out how many bitcoins I have. But there are a lot of assumptions there. It does makes things difficult to trace. But everything is possible, the impossible just takes a little longer.

i think anonymity is bitcoin's stregth

agreed...as the other poster said, it is all tracable. Instead of names, we're numbers.

but if it will be used for crime, it will either not be used at all (people wont use it because it supports crime) or it will be actively persecuted by the authorities.

You have no clue sir.
Bitcoin is BOTH TRANSPARENT AND ANONYMOUS.
Which means, we ALL can track where the money went and to which account and for what amount.
Yet it is fully anonymous since we can't reach the owner of such account.

But if there were some illegal activities detected, the money can be tracked until the stupid asshole makes a purchase with the stolen money in the real world.
Cheers, viva la bitcoin!

It's actually much more transparent that any of the "legacy" currencies. Everyone could look up the whole transaction history for any known account. And it's possible to follow the chain (and web) of transactions starting from some known account. Bitcoin is bringing the whole new meaning to the financial transparency!

It's far from being fully anonymous. If any of the accounts in the chain of transactions is identifiable, the anonymity of the whole chain could be compromised. See a long list of caveats here:
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Anonymity

LOL, it's anonymous, let's face it, guys...  :D

I keep seeing all this criticism of bitcoin that is basically "hackers can steal your money".  It's amazing how no one seems to remember all of the hacks of major financial institutions during the last 12 months that were much worse for the individual customers.

Citibank had 200,000 customer names, account numbers, and email addresses stolen.  Google, Apple, Lockheed Martin, etc. all had break-ins that resulted in more sensitive information being stolen than hashed passwords and email addresses.

The fall-out is what is VERY different when you compare btc-related break-ins and the major $ businesses.  Citibank says "too bad" and since you can't avoid doing business with them and they know it, they can do what they want.  A btc exchange operator knows there are no barriers to entry in his industry so he has to win you back or go out of business.  That is one of the primary reasons bitcoin was created.

Why would people care if their transactions are anonymous or not if everything they do is legit?

SeW: Why do you close your curtains in your house, if you have nothing to hide?
Yeah, allow the police to install cameras in your house, why refuse it if you got nothing illegal going on?

With this rationale, they can keep invading your privacy, and by doing that they can control your life.

The problem is how do you get bitcoins back if they are stolen?  With money, you can go to the authorities and have some chance.  Bitcoin is just going to attract criminals and they'll just swap in for cash. 

If it's not anonymous as a lot of people here are claiming, then why hasn't somebody tracked down the thief and got the money back.  It isn't going to happen.

In the long run, this will be btc's downfall.  People won't trust it.

Long live anonymity.

"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
   
    Benjamin Franklin (1706 - 1790), Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759

I'll Take the Responsibility of Liberty, No thanks on the Faustian Bargain of Trading it on an Illusion of Safety.

Then have fun with your toy currency in economic obscurity.

a currency that can be stolen just by breaking into a safe or making a copy of it seems far more
risky than one with good encryption and people seem to still use cash?

+1

I see this argument a lot, but it's wrong.  If I'm holding cash, it's usually a few hundred at most.  I'm willing to risk losing that knowing that I probably won't be able to get it back.  Anything more than that I put in the bank because I know the bank and government give me safeguards.  There's little to no chance I lose that money.

Unless bitcoin's intent is to just represent petty amounts, it will need to more secure and provide consumers with safeguards.  If it doesn't, it will only be used in libertarian fantasy world. 

I don't think criminal will swap it for cash in near future, since more and more merchant now offer services and others good with bitcoins, criminal will only do money laundering to cash it out.

I tought about a protection mechanism to prevent this, such as reversal but without reversal, and I didn't find anything working. If we ask exchangers to track orders and don,t process bitcoins stolen, how do you prove that this is a real steal? So for getting criminal out of our wallet, we need to have something such banks have. A "strong" protection at the start.


I work as a computer security consultant and I can really say this: people don't know how to secure their things and even if they know they just don't want or are too lazy (for the majority) to do it. So I think that the current software (bitcoin client / bitcoind) must include protection for wallet.dat in order to prevent malicious people to just steal it and get your money.

just my 0.02 BTC.

I was wondering if there was a way to require wallet be stored on an external drive?   Would get people to treat it more like a credit card and keep it off networks when it wasn't in use...

I think we need something less complex for the average users, this is one problem about security in general, more you put security measures in place more you'll loose users because they don't want to use it. Do somethign completely transparent without asking effort to users and you,ll find a good solution for this. I you find it, let me know lol I'm still searching.

Your nick is too big for you, clearly you have no clue.
As I said, bitcoin transactions are transparent, there are public records accessible by anyone.
The only peculiarity is that your identitiy is still unknown.

If you start a big illegal operation based on bitcoins, you will leave red trails over the whole network. The whole network will have logs of your illegal operation.
As soon as the bitcoin touches the real world (ip addresses, delivery addresses, purchases, email addresses, bank deposits, conversion... etc) your anonymity is prone to be compromised.

Small illegal transactions might get undetected under the radar, big illegal operations are vulnerable to statistical analysis.

We all want anonymity but we also know that bitcoin transactions aren't entirely anonymous.

This is correct.  I'm sure we've all had the experience of explaining bitcoin to someone ... and anything that takes 15 minutes of Q&A is not going to be used by most people.