Title: Basic noob question about hashrate % among top pools Post by: Savik on July 09, 2017, 06:30:29 PM So it seems like the top 5 pools control over 50% of the hashrate:
https://blockchain.info/pools What's to stop these 5 from getting together and messing with the block chain ledger for their benefit? I understand the miners in these pools are not necessarily controlled, but what if the Top 5 pools changed fees instead of -1% to +1% just for mining with them on a corrupted blockchain? Basically bribing everyone to accept their way? Title: Re: Basic noob question about hashrate % among top pools Post by: Last of the V8s on July 09, 2017, 08:28:57 PM So it seems like the top 5 pools control over 50% of the hashrate: nothing to stop them. they could. but it wouldn't make them much money. they'd soon be found out and ostracised.https://blockchain.info/pools What's to stop these 5 from getting together and messing with the block chain ledger for their benefit? I understand the miners in these pools are not necessarily controlled, but what if the Top 5 pools changed fees instead of -1% to +1% just for mining with them on a corrupted blockchain? Basically bribing everyone to accept their way? there is such a pool - and it's happened before - it just doesn't work for long, as they run out of money or confidence. note that of these top 5, 3 are owned by the same firm, and most of the top ten are mining on that firm's chips. they could probably attack now, but meh Title: Re: Basic noob question about hashrate % among top pools Post by: franky1 on July 09, 2017, 08:43:20 PM .........
if their changes do not meet the rules that nodes/merchants also have then those blocks would get rejected in seconds.. its not about hashrate.. its about rules and whats acceptable to the symbiotic relationship of the network a block of data is not accepted simply because more hash power was used. what would actually happen is if the rules were too controversial.. the pool with more hash power could produce more blocks but find the majority of the symbiotic network just rejects more blocks more often.. its that simple. the end result would be if the nodes that were part of the collaboration would end up in an orphan fight with its peers objecting... which normally ends up with nodes banning communication with each other to avoid the drama. .. but the end result is .. if a block is not accepted with a merchant, which the pool wants to use to cash out its reward. the pool will realise it has wasted its time and then give in and follow what its favourite merchant prefers. otherwise its just making foreign blocks that the merchant cant accept/understand. and thus the pool cant spend its winnings its not a simple hash power wins.. there is a symbiotic relationship... best known as CONSENSUS many people lack understanding of consensus and lack understanding of what makes bitcoin so special. its multilayered with multiple possible results depending on scenario Title: Re: Basic noob question about hashrate % among top pools Post by: Xavofat on July 09, 2017, 09:03:06 PM So it seems like the top 5 pools control over 50% of the hashrate: there is such a pool - and it's happened before - it just doesn't work for long, as they run out of money or confidence.https://blockchain.info/pools What's to stop these 5 from getting together and messing with the block chain ledger for their benefit? I understand the miners in these pools are not necessarily controlled, but what if the Top 5 pools changed fees instead of -1% to +1% just for mining with them on a corrupted blockchain? Basically bribing everyone to accept their way? if their changes do not meet the rules that nodes/merchants also have then those blocks would get rejected in seconds.. its not about hashrate.. its about rules and whats acceptable to the symbiotic relationship of the network a block of data is not accepted simply because more hash power was used. If they attempted a 51% attack, miners would just move to the numerous other pools available which were not participating in the attack. Title: Re: Basic noob question about hashrate % among top pools Post by: unamis76 on July 09, 2017, 09:27:33 PM Miners also have an economic incentive to play fair. If they don't do it, they're not contributing to Bitcoins success, thus not contributing to anyone, neither to users, other miners, themselves or their pockets. "Bribing" wouldn't get them far.
Title: Re: Basic noob question about hashrate % among top pools Post by: Savik on July 09, 2017, 11:18:59 PM Thanks for the replies all. My learning curve is pretty shallow :P
Title: Re: Basic noob question about hashrate % among top pools Post by: Last of the V8s on July 10, 2017, 11:26:59 AM there is such a pool - and it's happened before - it just doesn't work for long, as they run out of money or confidence. quite right. ghash and indeed btcguild and an older one all approached/exceeded 51% in their time and did not attack however i was referring to op's q about pools bribing miners to mine - pool.btc.com does this for now |