Bitcoin Forum

Hi BitcoinTalk!

Opening an official thread for our project, distributed exchange called Tomorrow Exchange.

https://tomorrowex.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/tomorrowex_250x58.png

Tomorrow Exchange is a distributed cryptocurrency exchange, a sweet spot between centralized and decentralized (non-existent at all yet) exchanges, combining security and usability of both.

Have questions? Ask away.

Website: https://tomorrowex.com (https://tomorrowex.com)

White paper: https://buildsecureapps.com/articles/on-secure-cryptocurrency-exchange (https://buildsecureapps.com/articles/on-secure-cryptocurrency-exchange)

Video Review:
https://pichoster.net/images/2017/08/08/d59ed594e6f493edb7d0486ce658b54c.md.png (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRioGQ-Y0Pg)

ICO thread here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2052334.0 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2052334.0) (closing on 11 Aug)

Reserved.

Don't you guys have web version something like browser extension, I personally don't like to download anything on first glance. Is it something similar to bitsquare or offers something different.

Will go through whitepaper shortly, sound interesting.

Hi amacar2,

If you need a web version, centralized exchanges provide that. Our exchange being a downloadable Open Source client is the most crucial security feature.

Well, the video explains this, and white paper mentions bitsquare, but to explain quickly, bitsquare is a decentralized marketplace, like Local Bitcoins; and Tomorrow Exchange is a distributed exchange - with central order book, automatic matching, charts (soon), etc. and yet it's more secure than currently existing centralized exchanges.

And there is also an option of watching the video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRioGQ-Y0Pg), cause it's shorter.

Will this platform includes Bitcoin Cash with private key storing options ?

The next planned crypto to add is exactly Bitcoin Cash. We're on it.

At first will RKC  only be available to trade on the Tomorrow Exchange?

Please ask questions about RKC in the RKC thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2052334.new#new (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2052334.new#new)

We are communicating with several exchanges. At this moment, we are positive that at list Bittrex will list us.

The concept is nice.
However, in the video you do not explain what happen to coins currently linked to pending orders.
It is clear that coins not on orders are store in private wallets on user's pc...
but pending orders?
Are the coins tied to the pending orders sent somewhere? hence the "distributed" nature?


thanks

Exactly. The coins are sent to our nodes to perform the exchange. But even this situation is better than the order on the centralized exchange.

For each order, you get a cryptographically signed guarantee before sending anything to the nodes. It ensures that your money will not just disappear, and that we cannot just change your order willy-nilly, for example, to get you the price worse than you asked for, stealing the difference.

So, at each point in time, both passive and active funds are accounted for. Passive (not on the orders) is safe on your computer, and for active (on the orders) you get a crypto guarantee.

So only money on the orders is at risk, but:

1) Users can hold us accountable, because they know and can prove exactly how much they've sent (if you have an insured centralized exchange, you can't provably claim your money, you have to trust their compromised database);
2) In the next versions we plan to only keep the top of the orders, not the whole order book;
3) We have more ideas on security that we are testing right now.

But even the current setup is already much safer than centralized exchanges.

Always excited to see more competition and innovation for decentralized exchanges, but your whitepaper seems (at least in places) poorly researched, notably Blocknet has working and verifiable atomic swaps functioning already.


That's not really decentralized, is it?

Hm... then that's totally putting trust on you... that's exactly the problem....

It's really not a good way to present yourself when you bash other projects when you yourself aren't truly trustless and decentralized.   

Oh hey stormingj! I remember you from the Blocknet slack. Always nice to have a cross-team conversation!

Yeah, we are highlighting this property everywhere in our marketing materials. It still has a server to match the orders, but it's much more secure than current centralized approaches. The word "decentralized" is so overused and abused right now. The community doesn't want decentralization, it wants security first. Decentralization comes after it.

For what it's worth, we could claim that it's still decentralized in a sense that passive funds are stored in a decentralized manner, or in a sense that we'd have more than one server (and some startups do exactly that), but we don't want any confusion over it or misleading statements. So "distributed" it is.

Yeah, I know, on testnet, not production-ready, without a UI, without users, without any external code review for vulnerabilities. Listen, as I said both in the video and the paper, your path (atomic swaps) is the best right now and it certainly trumps DEXes outright lying about decentralization. But when are you going to release it already? The only problem I have with you is timing (you're working on it since 2014). And the community needs a more secure solution right now.

And if you will not make your DEX release in half a year, we are just going to do it ourselves and connect atomic swaps functionality to Tomorrow Exchange as an option. And we're not stealing anything, because the atomic swaps algorithm does not belong to Blocknet, it was proposed long before it.

All feedback is welcome. How's your white paper going by the way?

There is always some level of trust when it comes to crypto, even when someone tells you otherwise (do you trust him on that?)

Our job is to minimize that trust to the minimum level possible.

We bash other projects because they're outright lying about being trustless and decentralized.

We say up-front that's not the case with us. Can you find any statements that we're "trustless and decentralized"?

But we also explain that the trust is minimized and it's much less than the one required on current centralized exchanges.

If you're still not okay with that, well, do you know any real DEX I can use right now? That's the point.

Thank you for the quick answer :)
As you can imagine, after BTCe there is a lot of hype on decentralized/distributed exchange.

I have further questions:

coins on orders are sent in advance?
Meaning:
current btc price 1 dollar.
I place a sell order at 2 dollars for 2 btc.
My 2 BTC are sent in advance to the server nodes... till order is execute?
(meaning severs will store my BTC for an hour or a day or a week... depending on when price meet my target).

If so, I see a problem in that.
Trading activity means place different orders in advance.
If coins are actually sent for each pending order... there is no difference between any other exchange.
People always tell that "you must not store your coins on a exchange".
But they fail to understand that most of the people that stored coins on exchanges... had these coins in pending orders.
Not passively sitting on the online wallet.

Possible solutions:
send the coins only when the transaction is closed.
Not in advance.
The nodes take care of all the administrative exchange and book order... and only when a sell order meet a buy order... coins are sent.
Therefore, till the last second users will have the coins on their private wallets.


users hold MtGox accountable ...
we are holding BTCe accountable ...
This does not provide any additional guarantee, unfortunately :\
Neither the crypto signature.
Take BTCe for example. The problem is not the amount of money or coins we had... even if there was a crypto signature for BTCe... it will have make no difference.

The value of hold you accountable, depends upon your reputation and solidity.
And, as history told us, reputation and solidity are not the solution.

Just my two cents, obliviously :)

Then you haven't done your research before you started this project....  Here are videos to show you what truly TRUSTLESS, DECENTRALIZED and ATOMIC swap working is like... https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCDBoR9fHb21bLH7FGvFrQg

To test the trade, take the coin MARYCOIN, clone BTC
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1929459.0

мoжнo пoлнocтью пpoтecтиpoвaть вce вaши нoвыe идeи бeз pиcкa пoтepять BTC

I've already mentioned this - it's only like this in the current version. We are going to gradually have more and more security features, and ICO money will help us greatly in this.

Answering your question, we only want to keep the top orders, and only tell the client to send the order when the price meets the target.

You would be surprised how many did. Because the system does not incentivize them to store them off-wallet. We would need a poll or something to find out, but I suspect that many just stored the money there out of convenience, .

Exactly. One of the planned features.

Yeah, this only provides security from
1) Silently stealing orders from people
2) Not being sure about insolvency (we plan to broadcast incidents like this P2P so that clients temporarily try to recover money asap when even one order is not executed)

It's already a lot, but not a complete security from theft of the order book. But as I said, we will gradually getting there as well.

Thank you for your good questions!

Oh I had a hunch that you're from Blocknet side as well. Please read the reply to stormingj above.

I said I don't have any problem with Blocknet (which in theory should be what it is when it's actually released), except timing. If you release "trustless, decentralized and atomic swap" before us and develop a UI and finally publish the white paper and get its security reviewed and widely used and stuff - good luck. But I suspect we might have to wait for 2050 with your speed.

It's a marketplace, not an exchange, right?

Бeз pиcкa? Cepьeзнo? A чтo ecли мeня cocкaмят нa плoщaдкe?
And let's speak English here anyway.

is Tomorrow Exchange exchange centralized or decentralized project ? where it was registered ? need to go public for long time before earning traders trust .

It's centralized.   He calls it "distributed" though.

We have a lot of centralized exchange that requires trust and deposit of coins today...  You have a whitepaper... great...  and your wow feature is you can post on bitcointalk to "proof" that you have sent coins to your exchange...?   We have that today too. ..  It's called the blockchain.

Oh really? Well, here's the link to the blockchain entry (https://blockchain.info/tx/c90819ef9dfb7f321828ace68d05fe9a2e78cec2ce66eff262951af3ed3ef7af) proving that I've just sent you 20 BTC.

What? This is not your address? But your website gave me this address, I have screenshots. What? I can't prove it and therefore you're going to continue scamming people? Oh well.

Now imagine you having this conversation with the centralized exchange that stole your 20 BTC. This is one of the problems that TomorrowEx secures you from.

Bashing other projects...... How sad.
Why don't you start showing  your own strength..... This is so cheap.

I don't like this atmosphere, I'll pass

It's a centralized approach plus more security when it comes to order execution. When it comes to money passively stored on the exchange, it's completely decentralized and secure. So it's a middle ground, in a way.

The information about our company, Royal Kingdom Enterprise, you can find in this ICO thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2052334.0). We're a company from Middle East, registered in Dubai.

I agree. At this point it's just a beta version announcement, a proof-of-concept, and we don't encourage people to send large amounts there just yet (we even have this message in the main window of the program).

So pointing out outright lies of other projects like Waves DEX and InstantDEX is cheap?

Regarding Blocknet (are you one of them too?) it was just a passing remark, and it was a positive one, comparing to others. They invaded this thread, not me - theirs.

Bye.

I need to know where to start. Moreover, there is a community of people supporting MARYCOIN  ;D

Need to know where to start what?

Are you asking us to list Marycoin or something? Sorry, it's hard to understand what you're proposing.

When you start a fire..., you get fire.  Calling other truly working projects lies when you don't really have a working product to back it up with.   I don't know what else you were expecting....

Now where did I call your Blocknet a lie?

The only difference is that you guys "don't really have a working product" for 3 years vs. 2 weeks for us.

And if you're calling the current stage of Blocknet "working product", we're way past that.

will you add coins from the region i mean from Dubai like DBIX? did your projekt have the some intention...

You know why I mentioned you? Because I mentioned everyone I could in my paper, around 20 projects. I've spent a lot of time researching decentralized exchanges, reading their white papers, talking to developers and so on.

I didn't want to tell it here initially, but I went to your Slack as well and in the first minutes I've discovered a security problem which has sparked a conversation that spanned days, and your CTO (or the main programmer or whatever) invited me to be your security advisor due to it, admitting there are not enough people vetting your stuff. So that's what you call "working product"? No white paper, no code review, no UI, no roadmap with dates. I know exactly what stage you are in.

Please don't take it personally. I publish research results on every product in this segment, and you were one of the best, until you started attacking us here.

Yes! Actually, we at Royal Kingdom Enterprise is currently in the last steps of delivering Palmex whitelabel, the crypto exchange for ArabianChain team, where DBIX will be listed, but soon we will list as many coins as needed, including DBIX.

I think you will see from the timestamp, that in fact your youtube video calling out/attacking other projects is well before my first comment in your thread....   Unless facts doesn't really mean anything to you.

So my truthful remark on the project not making fast progress offended you? Is that what you mean?

Because I was a lot harsher on the others, that really did lie about their tech.

that's great when this project will be in out there for use i mean the exchange
this project is very interesting i have read its whitepaper and a lots of thing in there is ours needs
specially security is most important
so i am keeping eye on this project from now
best of luck for your project

We already have a working proof-of-concept on https://tomorrowex.com (http://tomorrowex.com), but we plan to use our ICO contributions (https://royalkingdomcoin.com) to expand the development team and make it production ready, as well as other projects.

Thanks!

Thank you, im in

This is why OpenBazaar is similarly a downloadable client, right? I wish I were more technical. I will need to wait until a few people I trust have thoroughly inspected the code.


I'll admit this sounds exciting. But I am unclear about how this works:


Again, as a non-technical user, I would need some assurances before using such a service. It's not clear to me that this is truly secure for users.

Well, kinda, yes. Although OpenBazaar is more like decentralized ebay, while we are doing the exchange itself.


As shown in the video, the server cryptographically signs a message that this is indeed its address and that it will accept the order on the terms described. The client checks the signature and only sends the money after ensuring it's valid.

Of course you should! We are going to enlist the help of the experts to endorse and perform a security audit of our code before we announce that it's production ready. At this point it's just a (working, though) proof-of-concept, demonstrating the features. We will be using the contributions from our ICO (https://royalkingdomcoin.com/) to expand the team of developers to make it production-ready and widely used. But for now we ask whoever wants to test the exchange not to put large amounts there and always back up the private keys from Settings.

RKC is expected to be on which of the exchangers???

I know that on 14 August will be at venturekingdom.com and bittrex.com