Bitcoin Forum

http://techcrunch.com/2013/05/17/with-1-5m-led-by-winklevoss-capital-bitinstant-aims-to-be-the-go-to-site-to-buy-and-sell-bitcoins/

News just gets better and better.

This is G00D!

The funny thing is that they did it last fall, they are announcing it now.

Im glad vcs are taking this seriously

In the VC world, this type of money is still chump change.  So far, Coinbase has the largest investment at 5 mil.  Bitcoin won't really be taken seriously until we have a 100 mil VC investment and a few IPOs. 

Yeah IPO is so important LMAO I doubt any bitcoin company will IPO on the stock exchange, that goes against what bitcoin is and that means the company is a sell out, and I know I would never use that company again.

Why does being a publicly traded company "go against what bitcoin is"?

is it hard to see that some proponents of bitcoin are against centralized corruption that the banks and wall street have inflicted upon this world?

I don't know maybe cause out of wall st and big banks came bitcoin...

Hmm...what?  So for example if I have a company making shoes, I want to make a lot more shoes and get a lot more customers so in order to raise the capital required to build new factories, hire more employees, and get more machines I sell off some ownership shares in my company to the public....

Somehow in doing this I have gone against Bitcoin?

Can't really go wrong with news like this. Good luck BitInstant. Let's hope this goes well eh

I think the point was that listing on a $USD denominated stock exchange is going against what Bitcoin is. Listing on a Bitcoin denominated stock exchange would presumably be different.

I guess if you are of opinion that any transaction that does not involve Bitcoin is "going against Bitcoin" then sure...I'm not sure how you would function in a society today with this kind of mindset, as I don't think it would be possible to only transact in solely Bitcoin for everything; does this mean "everyone is against Bitcoin"

No, it does not mean that. It needn't be such a binary issue. It's not that USD transactions mean anything in particular, but the major US stock markets are something of a staple of the legacy economy; churches of the religion of money, if you will. Assuming we agree that the point of Bitcoin is to displace legacy monetary institutions, surely you could see how someone could consider it going against Bitcoin to use them.

How is US stock market any more a staple of the "legacy economy" than going to the Kwik-E-mart and buying a candy bar with a US dollar bill.  They both perpetuate the use of US dollars, and the legacy economy as a whole...if fact the collective use of US Dollars at the Kwik-E-Mart does more of perpetuate the use of the fiat than does the stock market.

You previously stated that it wasn't the issuing of public stock that you took issue with, but the fact that the stock was sold for US dollars....so somehow:

Public Stocks != Against Bitcoin
US Dollar Transaction != Against Bitcoin
Stocks + US Dollar Transaction == Against Bitcoin

Flawed logik

Why would you want to list on a stock market (NY stock exchange), that is causing more issues then it solves. You have read this so wrong, but I am not going to explain it, but yes if you listed on any stock exchange beside bitcoins you are against bitcoins. Cause bitcoins grew from what wall st did so why give them business ;)

It was explained to me that the size of any investment is limited by Bitcoin's market cap. In others words, at some point, the value of a company must be limited by the value of Bitcoin, so it becomes better to just buy bitcoins than to buy a company.


Dave, you are being trolled.

"Cause bitcoins grew from what wall st did"...

Pretty sure bitcoins grew out of a P2P network protocol that Satoshi wrote; how does Bitcoin protocol have anything to do with Wall street?

"...causing more issues then it solves".

What exactly are these "issues" that the NY stock exchange are causing?

"Why would you want to list on a stock market"

So that I can raise additional capital to expand my business, without having to fund the expansion through interest baring loans.

I don't actually think these guys are trolls, because you can see plenty of these types of people sitting in tents in various locations (such as "occupy wallstreet"; protesting the man...but actually they have no clue what they are protesting against, or what the reasons behind their protests are...IMHO these people detract from their cause rather than advance it.

*facepalm* Satoshi was upset with big banks of wall st, that is why he created bitcoin, so it did grow from that.

NY stock exchange is very inflated and very manipulated.

You can do that thru bitcoins ;)

Last fall, they found out about bitcoin, and decided to invest. One way was putting money together for this BitInstant fund, and the second way was buying 1% of all bitcoins. If they would have announced last fall, the price would have shot up before they were able to buy up 1% of all bitcoins. Now that they are done buying, and announced that some time ago, they decided they might as well wait until the conference, to add even more hype good news.

Source please, what exactly did Satoshi say about "the big banks of wall st"....

Saying "Bitcoin grew because of Wall Street" is like saying "Physics exists because of apples"

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Satoshi_Nakamoto#Motives

so a statement about the British Chancellor of the Exchequer (Alistair Darling) organizing a government bailout of banks is relevant to the NY Stock Exchange how?

Gweedo, the purpose of that was to show that he didn't pre-mine the blocks. Of course, you can infer something from his choice of headline, but not much.

But now I think Dave is the real troll here.

*facepalm* cause UK and US is very similar and especially at that time so yeah...



I know he was showing that he didn't premine any blocks but I looking more at the headline from someone that hardly talk you have to take every little bit. It talks volumes for the little words he uses.


Also just so everyone is clear I am not trolling, if any bitcoin business got listed on the NY Stock Exchange, I be very disappointed in them, and probably stop using them. I hope I am not in the minority in that thinking.

Good argument.  I think you may well be correct!

I think you may have summed it up better with just "Cuz..." though

I vote dave.

Of course a successful BTC business could list on NYSE given the chance. Far from showing weakness, I think it shows great strength. That BTC is so successful that it doesn't need to hide from dollar denominated markets. It's just a forex thing, the same way some US companies have FTSE listings.

The economy isn't binary "bitcoin or fiat", its a mix and it likely will be for a long, long time. The reality is, that there are a lot of very powerful dollar rich people who are going to make damn sure the dollar doesn't collapse. They might fail at that eventually, but don't underestimate how hard they will try, and to what lengths they will go. In the meantime BTC just needs to keep its own back yard in order and do what it does. There is no rush...

I fail to see how this arguement works.  Based on that logic you would have to be anti venture capital as well.  All of the venture capital investments so far have been denominated in US $ and the current venture capital investments in bitcoin are very similar from a economic perspective as a public listing on a US stock exchange.  The VCs are infusing capital for an equity stake with the expectation that they will be able to sell this equity stake in the future for a profit.  When a company is traded publicaly, investors can purchase an equity stake with the expectation that they will share in profits or be able to sell the equity stake in the future for a profit. 

At it's core, the concept of publicaly traded stock is actually a very libertarian concept.  It is true that the current US stock market is plagued by the big banks and the IPO process has a ton of problems.  However, from a small market participant perspective, it has never been better.  Buying shares is very inexpensive and maintaining an account is almost free.  Of course you can argue that the current system puts way too much pressure on near term profits and that investment banks still get away with a ton of undisclosed fees on many ETF and mutual fund products, but in my opinion those problems are overshadowed by the power given to individual investors to choose investments in companies they would otherwise have no access to. 

In order for bitcoin to flourish, it needs to be complimentary to the established monetary system including venture capital and the stock market.  Money from these venues will allow bitcoin companies to expand and improve the entire bitcoin ecosystem.  A seperatist, bitcoin only view, will limit the investment possibilities, slow down infrastructure build out, and ultimately put the entire project at risk.   

I am not against Venture Capital, your talking about 2 different things. VCs have nothing to do with the stock market, yes they are hoping for an IPO, but that isn't the only way to get the ROI back. Also we have some bitcoin stock markets when those grow then I see more companies going on there. But it is funny how you failed to see how this argument works, cause I laid it out very well.

wow this is awesome! on many levels. the obvious but also for the ''rich influential types'' to get involved and have some clout with making this more "legal" as in the gov wont bother them as much as say some nerds who want pretend money.

 These people have 11million worth of bitcoins! they will no doubt tell the other wealthy friends, family, acquaintances....even FB founder will follow what these two are up to and maybe buy in with some small "fun money" ( to mark thats a few million) this will have huge impacts on bitcoin and the price of it. im telling people and you yes you that anything under 266 is a bargen. buy up as many as you possibly can afford now and it will pay of huge dividends in the future.

go with out that night out, go without that newer car, go without that vacation. invest in to coins now! and in a few years when its quadruple or even ten times what you put in then you are gold.

im one of those people that everyone makes fun of. cashing out 401k and buying up coins. no way can the most agressive 401k produce a balance like the possibility of bitcoin can. if i wate 40 years my 401k would be ok but in 40 no 30 no 20 no 10 years i will double what my 401k would have done.

ya make fun but i believe.