Bitcoin Forum

I think it's safe to say that the premiums will continue to go down as the price rises. Similarly the risks of selling become ever more alarming.

I have a few ungraded coins. There's no way I'm posting them off to ANACS now and the people flogging them on Ebay must have some type of death wish.

The addition of Bitcoin Cash also rather messes with things too.

At some point in the future what will your plans be if you need to liquidate your Casascius coins?

Never..pass them on to my kids

I will probably hold onto the ones I have left until I can auction them at Heritage.  I expect this to still be quite some time in the future.

These ungraded coins you have, if any of them are Casascius please message me before you peel them.

As far as security goes, I've done some face to face transactions in the last couple of years, and I'd likely prefer those in the future.  I go with a friend, he's armed and intimidating.

Anyway, we'll likely see the collectibles market move away from person to person sales and in to the realm of physical auctions as the price continues to move up.  I doubt I'd ever sell off my collection, but if I did, I believe that is the route I'd go.

I'd recommend not peeling any Casascius coins.  Even what you may think of as an ordinary Casascius is really very special.

The only point in peeling would be to liquidate your BTC holdings for cash.
That's kind of ironic as it shows that we still have uncertainty relating to BTC and a greater level of trust for FIAT. Having been said, for someone that's in it for the short term and looking to cash out is say that the time will be when the risk is too great to send abroad.
If BTC got to the $10k point then I could understand if someone would only be willing to sell a Cas coin face to face and if a buyer can't be found in person then peeling would be the next best option.

I can't think of a scenario where I would ever peel a coin.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0Cky9b6mHY&feature=youtu.be&t=2m10s

So you can't of a scenario where you would ever need/want to spend your money?

Not necessarily. I might want to spend it. I might not want something physically accessible lying around. I may want it all installed in a hardware wallet.

I really couldn'tbe arsed with face to face sales and showing up with a sawn off in my panties. I like the sound of a legit auction house but a long wait could be in order indeed.

It really depends on the particular coin you have. The higher face value coins are already getting to the point where I would be nervous to ship them... Cas 25 = $100k+. Something like a 2013 brass single or half I would continue shipping those until 10k+

Cas 25's are worth a peel - 25 of the new shitcoin @ 0.072 each puts in the same ballpark as a sale, plus you have the empty coin to sell.

Definitely reaching the upper limits of insurance and sanity for shipping a Cas 25.

For Cas coins, I could consider peeling them all in the next 5 years if the price continues to hold at these levels or increase.  I can't imagine that the ink will not start to fade to the point of illegibility at some point.  Especially for the raw examples that are sitting in a desk draw or other humid environments.  Perhaps the Cas coins in ANACS holders could delay the fading by several years.

Some of the newer physical crypto makers put some more thought into the ink and substrate that they printed the private keys on.  Those might last another 15-20 years, but at some point I would think they are all a risk for fading.   

For an alternative to the sawed off shotgun idea....US seller, European buyer....both fly to Heathrow arriving around the same time.  Meet in the really fun Polish bar owned by the angry old Polish woman and do the exchange there.  You know the other guy isn't armed because you are still in the terminal of an airport.  Seller can fly with the coin in his pocket the entire trip.  Both get on return flights never leaving the terminal.

Same.

I don't think I'd peel unless it was a coin with very low premium.   For example, it would just be silly to peel a casascius coin as it would essentially be throwing away money as they all command a worthy premium. 

I've had individuals fly out to meet me on a few occasions. Always at a location of my choosing.

Never tried meeting halfway behind airport security, that's clever. Will have to give that a go sometime.

Sell me a couple goldies and silvers at the right price and we can do it!

If this rocketship crosses 5k usd, I might try to cash in and trade a few for a kilo brick of gold. Got one of those?  ;)

This make no sense, you've the public key in the front no? I never see any front public key fading so far, could last forever IMO. If the public key in the front start to effectively fade it can be a problem, but for now no one have ever reported any problem.

(I'm not a pro, but I own some)

Maybe it's worth considering the conditions at the time of their creation. They were purely created to shine a light on Bitcoin. The brass ones were manufactured by a car wash token company. They were selling for about $7 when first launched.

If he'd realised just how valuable they'd become he might have put more care into the printing. I assume everything'll be fine but it probably wasn't military grade stuff.

Exactly.  For now most of them are likely just fine.  My point is what their relative condition will be in 5 years time or more. 

Yes, you would likely have some warning when the fading begins, but it's not a matter of if they fade, but when. 

Denarium prints on plastic paper, which likely offers a longer shelf-life. 

Of course no one knows for sure.   But, if you have a 25 BTC Cas coin are you willing to let that peel value "fade" out of existence.  At some point it would seem a risk. 

I imagine various forensics methods could get the key if the ink fades.  The ink is still there.  The paper surface is different on a microscopic level.  You might be able to re-dye the ink on the paper using a solution that binds to the old ink and shows up under UV light.  The future value of these coins kind of insures we will figure this out if it becomes a problem.

325 ounces generic .999 silver, all stamped with mint, purity and weight, for 1 graded Cas Gilt silver.

Now that's a lotta silver!   ;D

To add to the thread, I'd believe it depends on your financing and willingness to accept risk.

I would throw in an extra 10 ounces for the one with the gold heart on it.

325toz at 17/toz is only like 1.3btc @4250usd.  Kinda low bro... ::)  

And the golden heart from our AWOL pal bitmarket isn't for sale. Part of my oddity collection with a 2011 "double" error now

I could add a 1/10 oz 1985 gold panda and 6 twix bars (or candy bar of your choice).

Don't worry about fading.  When the coins are worth enough we may use advanced scanning techniques to read the keys (unless the collectible value of unpeeled coins makes the option moot).

http://eu.greekreporter.com/2015/01/22/scientists-read-greek-volcano-burnt-scrolls-found-in-italy/

Talk about high transaction costs :)

Not really.  A 10 btc CAS is worth around 13btc = 52,000.  I can fly from east coast USA to heathrow for less than 1500 in business class.  1500/52000 = 2.8%

You also get a few nice drinks from the angry Polish lady and duty free cigarettes. 

I think I know a licensed auction house.

Probably schmooze them into listing some cas coins.

but it's got to be me because the ingrates and sheep forget the important details...

...

An interesting point to note: Casascius 25's have long been selling for 26-27 btc; currently they're the only coin where the BCH is more valuable than the numismatic premium of the coin itself  ;D ::)

Blazed must be eyeing his 25 stash pret-t-t-t-t-y hard these days

they sell for that much for a reason.

Because we're all too cheap to own 25 BTC coins?

That's a very kind offer. I'd still have to get them across the Atlantic though. May as well restore a Concorde and fly it over. Clear a highway for me.

I've no plans to sell, but the actual options for secure sales get hairier as the values rise. The idea of meeting in an airport is a valid one.



'Cos they look like a dictator's self awarded medal? Just a personal opinion.

What I think you'll start seeing, depending upon personal situations, is that people will begin peeling them because there will be a dwindling demand or willingness to pay any premium for them. I seriously want a MS69 Gilt 1BTC, but at 2.25-2.5BTC asking price it doesn't make economical sense. That was the going rate when BTC was $1000. A $6000 premium for any thing is pretty baller, but the seller won't take that into consideration. He won't let the gilt go for less that 2BTC. In the end, when BTC goes to $5000, $10000, $25,000 the coin just turns into a safe way to store your BTC and the premium will go to zero in relative terms.

On a totally unrelated note, please PM me if you have a MS69 Gilt 1BTC for sale :D

I personally think the golden age for premiums on physical bitcoins is over.

Holders will keep their ask prices steady because they don't want to write up a loss, but you're fucking bananas if you think, e.g., that anyone is going to pay 16 btc for a 10 these days. Seriously, a $24,000 premium for a privately minted round? Get outta here. The only people with that amount of coin to burn are old hodlers, and they've already finished their collecting.

At least the folks who bought 0.5s/1.0s/25s paid a smallish premium. Even the 5s weren't *too* bad, although you'd be looking at a loss of at least 1 or 2 btc selling them today. Can't imagine being stuck with a bunch of 10s.

Those 10s are actually closer to 12s now considering the BCC they hold...  Not to mention if forking is the new trend (already looks like we'll be forking again in ~2 months) we could see premiums rise even further.  Folks that bought 25s are most likely sitting on profits if they were to peel or resell now...

Well, there are less than 500 10 BTC coins, but outside of the usual places interest in them doesn't seem to be heating up. Perhaps it'll be a slow burn, but equally prices may be considerably higher by then too. A couple I bought had modest premiums but I discarded them in my mind anyway.

There's two schools of thought I see around here when it comes to premiums.  Please correct me if you disagree.  We have the collectors who spend $ on BTC to support their collecting habits and we have the 1btc = 1btc crowd.  There's some crossover but these are our two main groups.
 
How this affects premiums is that you have what I call $ thinkers and then BTC thinkers and they think about premiums in this sense.  I am a $ thinker because a lot of what I purchased, I purchased with $ and immediately sent the BTC to the seller.  When I look at premiums today, I see the same premiums but lower BTC.  In some cases the premium is higher and others it is lower.  A good example is an MS70 .1 Casascius I purchased for 3BTC.  I think I spent less than $1k on the bitcoin to buy it.  Would I have more money now if I kept the bitcoin?  Sure, but I wouldn't have my collection and I did buy and hold bitcoin too.  I'm sure I will get more fiat value when I sell it and in the mean time I've got the shiny. :)

Very true, the 25s are close to 30 in FV right now between the two chains

Those BTCC 1BTC coins that originally went for 1.1btc are profitable if peeled now, too. Singles and halves no longer available on their website

I would never peel any of them to preserve history, you can always find a buyer if $$ is needed.

Tell that to the guy who had to peel a 25 because he couldn't find a buyer at any price

Peeling them is the last resort, but if money is needed trying to sell to another collector should be done.

If BCH makes it a little harder wait until the November fork, hope not, but then they'll hold 3 different coins.  ;D

 

Not sure how it is in other countries, but US airports (and by extension, planes & passengers thereupon) have only security theater, with 95% failure rate https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/investigation-breaches-us-airports-allowed-weapons-through-n367851

Effectively anyone who wants to get a weapon in, will. Weapons are even fabricated in prisons.

So potentially 95% of passengers are packing heat? I'm surprised there aren't more fire fights with shop staff at the overpriced Pepsis on sale.

Even if your buyer did produce an assault rifle from their panties, there are still enough cameras and security around to put a halt to them after they've emptied a clip into your face. It'll be too late for you, but not for your coin.

Armed robberies usually end with the victim's compliance, no bloodshed. A pistol covered from CCTV but revealed to the law-abiding/defenseless victim, or even the 95% believable threat of having a pistol, will do.