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Other => Politics & Society => Topic started by: computerlamp on June 04, 2013, 04:17:36 AM



Title: Verbal Contracts
Post by: computerlamp on June 04, 2013, 04:17:36 AM
So in an anarcho-capitalistic society what do you do if ...

You are with a couple of people and one guy says he'll give you something if you do something, you do the thing and come back for his end of the contract.

He refuses and won't hold up his end what do you do?


Title: Re: Verbal Contracts
Post by: myrkul on June 04, 2013, 05:12:01 AM
There's a saying that sums this up well:

 "An oral contract is as good as the paper it's written on."

Basically, enforcement of that contract is going to be tough. There is one thing you can fall back on though: The discipline of constant dealings. You said you had witnesses to this agreement. That's good, that makes it more than his word against yours. Using the discipline of constant dealings, you can tell him that since he is not going to hold up his end of the bargain, you're not going to ever deal with him again. You're also going to tell the witnesses to the agreement that he reneged on it, and they will cease dealings with him as well.

Now, this might encourage him to play fair and pay up, or it might not. But if it doesn't, he's hurting himself more than he is hurting you.


Title: Re: Verbal Contracts
Post by: oakpacific on June 04, 2013, 05:42:33 AM
Why do you need to go verbal when you can notarize with blockchain.... ::)

My experience is that, if you don't even care to put things down, most likely you will miss out on crucial details, like lending someone money without specifying a repayment date, which is not enforceable whether on a forum(the TradeFortress case) or on a court.


Title: Re: Verbal Contracts
Post by: NewLiberty on June 04, 2013, 05:47:18 AM
There's a saying that sums this up well:

 "An oral contract is as good as the paper it's written on."

Basically, enforcement of that contract is going to be tough. There is one thing you can fall back on though: The discipline of constant dealings. You said you had witnesses to this agreement. That's good, that makes it more than his word against yours. Using the discipline of constant dealings, you can tell him that since he is not going to hold up his end of the bargain, you're not going to ever deal with him again. You're also going to tell the witnesses to the agreement that he reneged on it, and they will cease dealings with him as well.

Now, this might encourage him to play fair and pay up, or it might not. But if it doesn't, he's hurting himself more than he is hurting you.

Taking one for the team.
Being the first to trust someone who has no trust established.
Those with an established reputation for fair dealing have more to lose by violating it as well as a history of not doing so.  
"Good Will" is an asset.

Lex Mercatoria is the free-market mechanism by which these situations were self governed in ungoverned areas.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lex_mercatoria


Title: Re: Verbal Contracts
Post by: Elwar on June 04, 2013, 06:36:34 PM
So in an anarcho-capitalistic society what do you do if ...

You are with a couple of people and one guy says he'll give you something if you do something, you do the thing and come back for his end of the contract.

He refuses and won't hold up his end what do you do?

Ever been to the lending subforum here on bitcointalk? There are many "verbal" agreements to loan money that end up with someone skipping out.

What is done then?

And how many people are willing to accept a verbal agreement with a user with only 10 posts asking to borrow 1000 BTC?


Title: Re: Verbal Contracts
Post by: dadomado on February 04, 2014, 01:25:34 PM
so the situation ovakoj man can very easily and well set up, there's an excessive thinking ....


Title: Re: Verbal Contracts
Post by: Sindelar1938 on February 04, 2014, 02:38:06 PM
Generalising hard

Trust but verify


Title: Re: Verbal Contracts
Post by: chaff on February 04, 2014, 03:24:04 PM
So in an anarcho-capitalistic society what do you do if ...

You are with a couple of people and one guy says he'll give you something if you do something, you do the thing and come back for his end of the contract.

He refuses and won't hold up his end what do you do?

Ever been to the lending subforum here on bitcointalk? There are many "verbal" agreements to loan money that end up with someone skipping out.

What is done then?

And how many people are willing to accept a verbal agreement with a user with only 10 posts asking to borrow 1000 BTC?


I don't think anyone would be willing to accept that. Its a horrible idea for a loan. I'd trust one of those emails I get from Zimbabwean princes saying they need my information so they can get their money out of the country.


Title: Re: Verbal Contracts
Post by: bitgeek on February 04, 2014, 04:18:55 PM
So in an anarcho-capitalistic society what do you do if ...

You are with a couple of people and one guy says he'll give you something if you do something, you do the thing and come back for his end of the contract.

He refuses and won't hold up his end what do you do?
Same thing can happen when somebody approaches you and wants to borrow something for a while like a pen and then takes it and walks away. What do you do? Take it back by force, shout at him, call your friends if you can't take him alone - you do what you can.

When trading with people you gradually build trust. Take a small village society - people traded for centuries and what you mentioned was never a problem. If someone was a known thief or liar nobody traded or shared secrets with him. Most people are honest and trustworthy.


Title: Re: Verbal Contracts
Post by: thetruth on February 07, 2014, 03:24:36 PM
Freedom = Responsibility
When you make a contract you must be ready for any outcome. If unsure do not agree on the terms of the contract. You have to be responsible for your actions, including the risks you put on yourself by binding contract terms. If the second party of the contract breaks the terms, you are f*ed up.

To secure the people from fraud Governments are instituted. Governments are also evil but supposedly exist to fight greater evils. Eventually they merge with each other and the Orwellian nightmare comes true. You don't want that to happen.

So the answer to your question: keep the consideration of the verbal contract very small and very short period of force.