Bitcoin Forum

http://www.wnd.com/2013/06/now-fbi-wants-back-door-to-all-software/

Time for open source to become more common.

Closed source is becoming more and more dangerous these days, since software houses are no more free to do what they want  :-\

The power grabs are really troubling.   What is more troubling is the populace gets a little outraged and then lets it happen so they know they can take a little more each time.    Makes you wonder if you should post anything, anywhere other than your edited thoughts.

there is still time for the US people to stop this nonsense and petition to their politicians, create organisations who will remind US government and its departments that they are going wrong way. You cant just sit and watch wtf they are doing. Take Turkey as example.

So, basically they want a backdoor. Within no time, hackers will crack it and they will whine about it...


But I suggest giving them the backdoor. I suggest using encrypted communication and simply leaking them the whole communication. Get it delivered to their doorstep. And then let them have fun cracking AES.

that is how apple does it and lately I heard an amusing story of complaint, since Apple acted in a security request and delivered the data from Apple imessage or how it is called. Of course, encrypted. And said "We don't have the means to encrypt this, but as you asked, here is the data you requested." "We can't read this." "Neither can we."

The terrorist filled us with terror.  We are acting scared, giving up hard won freedoms.  

I am hearing a street fighter like sound that says "Al-quaia wins." Terror is everywhere. People are in fear. Governments overreact and instill even more fear in their citizens... sad.

Depending on how crypto-anarchist one is, one can claim that it bears the question of who are really the terrorists, the sandal wearing teenager in Afghanistan or manhunting agents that storm into wrong houses and murder everyone (mostly for the kicks and excitement of it)?

since when is apple with the cool kids again?  ???

they'll order them to remove encryption or provide a special key, simple as that.

That shit is older than life. In Europe we know it very well. Just check what Strategy of Tension (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strategy_of_tension) means - the US Government has used that tactic forever.

Just a hint on Wikipedia:


And now they are doing it over and over again, blowing up their own towers and killing their own citizens.

True this. But at the moment, if you even hint this, you're treated as a tinfoilhatnutjobwacko.

Apple just neglected this. They made encryption, implemented a protocol where clients handshake and agree on the keys with each other and need no server side on this. I doubt they actually thought about this too much...

Removing encryption would probably violate 1000 federal standards.


Here is the problem: The moment you do that, your program is not secure anymore and the important customers, business, will stop using stuff. Apple's imessage might not be a problem, but I have had businesses refuse using skype due to MITM problems. So we used Ovoo or Silent Circle.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I understand the FBI wants a backdoor on exchanges. The FBI can already look, like anyone, at blockchain.info and get all the info they want about any wallet and any transaction.

This is ludacris. It will open more problems than it will fix.

This has been happening since the dawn of software.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c8/Ludacris_2011.jpg/220px-Ludacris_2011.jpg

This was linked on the front page of Drudge.

Americans are super lazy though. It'll take being rounded up and sent to a camp to wake them up.

Sounds totally illegal to me, maybe someone in a position of authority should tell them no.  Next they will want a key to every locked physical door.

I believe, its more that;  FBI wants a backdoor to all "Communications"

They want complete access to communication rather than software.  Although, laws have already been passed and it's, of course, already happening.

http://rt.com/usa/confirmed-nsa-phone-records-330/


Kinda funny, there was a time when the "Safe thing" to do was store passwords on a computer.  Now, we are BACK to the "safe thing" being paper.  Bleh, seems the "safe thing" for communication may soon go BACK to verbal.  (Lol, Doh, Sigh and Facepalm)

It really isn't just that most of us are lazy (believe me we are) its that we don't have real alternatives. Being locked in a two party system, both of which are bought and paid for by corporate interests, means we fundamentally have 0 choice. Sure they differ on social wedge issues (gay marriage, immigration, abortion, gun control etc) but when it comes to foreign policy, corporate money in politics, the patriot act, Guantanamo, selling arms to US sponsored terrorists, etc they are all exactly the same. We elected Obama because he promised us change. What did he give us? More of the same old bullshit.

We got fed up with it and responded with The occupy movement, how did they react? by kicking us out and ignoring us. Rinse wash repeat and fuck the general populace.

When your entire government is bought and paid for by the 1% writing letters and calling your congressmen is pretty much useless.

They have, they call that  a "warrant" ;)

Or everyone's cellphone records

So effectively this backdoor will have to be added not only to software created and distributed within the US, but internationally, otherwise one cannot sell/provide software to US customers.

I can see hackers taking advantage of this.. it's a no no.

open source ftw!

Exactly.

And with guys like a certain Google Employee that just LOVES to embarass companies through exploits...

Well, let us see ships going down. I wonder what companies like SilentCircle would be doing then. I mean, they do provide their service to military contractors and servicemen of the United States... adding a backdoor there would compromise security.

this is excellent news. it means there will soon be another reason to switch to open source for users and another reason for companies to switch to open source as well.

economic reasons are more powerful than moral reasons. so it appears that this will be a big boon to the open source community.

of you are a developer of open source, you should support this effort as it will help eliminate your competition.

just make sure you are using open source software and encryption for all communications so you aren't swept up like a dolphin in a tuna fish net.

+1

So wrong.

This is why we need bitmessage. Check out my thread and add your address.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=226770.0 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=226770.0)

Good luck with that in the open source age.

Sometimes there is a difference between what you want and what you get. Sick Bastards.

Are you locked up in some institution? There is a libertarian party, even as a non-US person I know that. And in many countries there is a pirate party. If people don't vote those, they get what they deserve.

Of course the large parties are all the same, their "politicians" are actors and they are performing quite well.

I would be absolutely happy with backdoor access to all electronic communications, with the caveat that access must also be allowed by all citizens to all government and corporate communications.
In fact, not just the citizens should be granted access, but anyone on Earth potentially impacted by any action of government and corporations.

Only closed source software I use is made by Russian and Chinese. Should I worry? About the FBI, that is...

this is only an issue for closed source software, but i think that instead of just allowing any call to be listened into the software providers should program a key into each internet call or each username. and only release this key when FBI produce a warrant showing that they have good reason to listen into username XYZ123.

for instance with telephone systems it should have been set that a phone company only releases recordings or access to a specific persons phone line on production of a warrant that stipulates a time-frame of x hours/day/weeks they are allowed access. and not just a open gateway to listen into anyone, any time for however long they like.

some countries say they have these laws inplace, but telephone/software companies just gave full access and hoped the government agencies would self regulate their actions to only access calls when there is good evidence to do so. which then allowed the authorities to side step certain laws by making up evidence and require only their chief/supervisor to authorise the snooping in.

this is almost as bad as allowing the government to have a key vut of your house doors, microphones fitted in the home and also access to your bank account.

im glad im not american.. the land of the free.........

That's a great idea and in an idealistically pure country it would work. but realistically even if the libertarian party got 20% of the vote the republicrats and demicans would just unify on all things freedom and security related. So what you are talking about is a party, coming out of nowhere, getting at least 51% of the vote for the president and in both houses of congress. Even then the judicial branch will be against you until enough judges die off to be replaced. If you think 51% care enough about freedom from warentless searches in ANY COUNTRY you are super idealistic. Most people have been conditioned to trade freedom for "security" the median and out political system encourage it. It has nothing to do with the people who realize how evil our government is acting but everything to do with all the less than intelligent people who couldn't care less.

That's the issue we're facing.  People still want to play the game, and when they realize they can't win, they don't stop playing the game, they just fold their arms and huff and say, "Well, we can't win, so why bother trying?"

So anyway, those who are winning at the game are also in control of public education, so it's taught that if you don't play the game, you're some kind of freak, an anarchist, and a terrorist, probably communist, and likely a witch.  Get them while they're young and they're much more likely to stick with you forever; just look at how successful those religious have been at this.  We still have grown men who believe in fairy tales; it's all they know.  Same goes for government; if you don't know the alternative, you can't solve the problem, or even be aware of what the problem is, you only ever see the ragged ends of the problem's tentacles but never see the core of the problem, so you try to change things within the game but you never really solve a problem, you only improve your own condition and make it worse for someone else.

The point isn't to get a Libertarian into office.  The point is to help society understand why the game of state and politics only works against them.  Understanding the difference is what separates the men from the sheep, as is common to say nowadays; people must learn to educate themselves, which is exactly what is avoided in public school, and exactly what we push on the Internet.  I have little hope for the generations before the dawn of the Internet, but high hopes for those who've spent most of their lives with it.  Luckily, people don't live forever.

How to get a backdoor to the FBI ?

1. Find out were some female agents work.
2. Court them and get at least 1 to become your gf, or the lover for a night.
3. ???? Profit ?


 ;D ;D ;D

Fuck the backdoor... I would just enjoy the back orifice ;D

I couldn't agree with you more. I was simply trying to argue the point that under the current geo-political system it is pretty much impossible to see meaningful change. An argument you have articulated much more eloquently. When I spoke of a lack of meaningful alternatives I meant within the system, revolution is always a meaningful alternative, just not one many people are willing to accept as a first course of action.

If I remember at last election Congress had about a 25% approval rating. All but a few seats remained the same after the election.

If everyone had voted for their individual member how they felt about Congress, every seat would have changed. They'd pick up pretty quickly that they need to pull their head in. But people didn't: they thought everyone else should make a change, it's not their (representative's) fault. When anyone grumbles as to how useless Congress is, I ask them if they voted for the incumbent in the last election.

People if they can assemble have the power to fire every politician and give someone else a chance. If they don't perform, fire them as well. Keep going until they're working for the people. Idealistic maybe, but this is where things should be, and I believe can be.

And that is not the backdoor?  ;D

The problem is that people don't realize that they have a choice. It has been ingrained in our minds that voting for a third party is giving away your vote for the last several generations. That leaves you with a republican or a democrat. the two parties have done a great job of dividing themselves on a whole host of inconsequential issues while having the exact same views towards the largest most pressing issues of the day. Doesn't matter which party you pick the results will be exactly the same until a viable third party emerges...or revolution. Its pretty much as simple as that.

I don't think it needs to be that drastic. If people make noise and have a solid message, politicians will realise this will affect their career. It happened with SOPA. It happens with gun control.

Does this really belong in the bitcoin thread when it has zero to do with bitcoins?  Just saying....

Although you have a point, and that's how a democracy should work, I personally just don't want to control how other people live their lives, which is what a democracy is about.  Further, even if people were on their game and actually kicked people out of office when they didn't perform satisfactorily, we're still stuck with someone else for however long it is until they can be reelected, whether we like them or not.

If people were smart enough to do that, the answer would be a direct democracy, as opposed to a representational democracy, where everyone is a politician however many times out of the year it takes.  If we're okay with enforcing how other people live and how companies should do business, that's what we should be rooting for.  I have no idea if this will squash corruption, as you would still need a strong, central force of power to enact on these decisions, in either form of democracy.  But I'm personally rooting for freedom, so neither systems cut it.

They don't need it, lol. They kick down the door. DUuh.

Really? Cuz last I checked no gun control laws have been passed since Sandy Hook and they have turned their focus from SOPA to CISPA...they let the public cry out, pretend to care, then wait 6 months when everyone has forgotten and return to business as usual.

rinse, wash, repeat.


In the strictest sense it doesn't but bitcoin was intended, at least partially, as a way to restrict government intervention (granted in currency rather than security) but they both relate to how the government treats the privacy of individuals. Its a tenuous relation at best but I will take it  8)

This is more of a US social (or political) topic and probably belongs in that area.  Bitcoin does not even relate to this. Not everyone is a US citizen.  That's why I raised the question.  

But here is my two cents....screw the FBI!  :)

That's my point. How many people would vote someone out because they voted for increased gun control, compared with how many would vote them out because they didn't? Even though the majority were for it, the majority are also not single issue voters and will not let it affect their vote.

EDIT: but yes, saying 'gun control' rather than 'preventing gun control' was possibly misleading.

And also +1 on the moving this topic.

This is called "voting".

This is really related to the tone of this thread.. I lovr it, it's true, funny and everyone should have listen to it at least once..

Culture in Decline | Episode #1 "What Democracy?"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTbLslkIR2k

(preaching to the choir)   ;)

In the US, third parties don't really push this as much as they should, but the US is not just a de facto Two Party system, it is encouraged through most states' laws ("to prevent confusion among voters"). It's extremely expensive and otherwise resource-intensive for third-party candidates to get on the ballot in most states. If the party doesn't pick up somewhere between 1-5% of votes in a state in the previous election (and it resets each cycle), they're not allowed to get on the ballot without tens or hundreds of thousands of signatures. Third party campaigns are mostly a battle to get on the ballot, and much (sometimes all) of the funds donated are going toward that instead of any type of marketing. While Two Party candidates are out campaigning, Third Party candidates hitchhiking to different states to collect signatures.

While there is a Libertarian Party, Constitution Party, Green Party, Socialist Party, and a handful of others -- they can receive millions a year in donations, but still not even appear on the ballot in a given state. The Libertarian Party in particular seems to like measuring their success by how many ballots they get on instead of how many votes they pick up, because that's the metric all the time and money's being spent on, while other third parties are lucky to get on the ballots of a small handful of states with relatively lax ballot laws.

Ballot laws are generally less intense for Congress, but the donor/volunteer pool is also much smaller for congressional seats, and third parties are largely seen as a joke in the US, so even if they got on the ballot, the same "oh, I can't vote for him because he'll never win" mentality will persist. People in the US rarely vote for who they think is the best candidate, but assume there are two viable candidates and that they must pick between those two to not waste their vote ("lesser of two evils" mentality).

1984 anyone?

Wow...

That is the problem, not the US election system. Look at Europe where the system is different; pirate parties are there but the gojim don't vote for them. They need to get it hard from behind, really really hard, before they wake up.

The retards deserve it but the problem is, everybody else is suffering too.

A fiat currency crash would be desirable as a wakeup call.

This all damn day!

A bit of hyperinflation curtesy of our friends at the FED and their "quantitive easings"? :D

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_YGLQQZTHoU0/TL9BaZHkvuI/AAAAAAAAL8M/_S2gtkS7Pmg/s1600/Inflation-1923.jpg

Paranoid people are paranoid.

"auto-updates" = Backdoor

I feel this kind of surveillance is widespread. I recently changed my telecoms operator, and they provided me with a backdoored router. Even though I notified the company about the issue, they refused to change it.

Not only is the admin password not hashed, it is also accessible remotely by the telco company and whoever has access to the router.

Explanation in Spanish: http://www.securitybydefault.com/2012/08/nuevos-routers-asl-26555-de-movistar.html (http://www.securitybydefault.com/2012/08/nuevos-routers-asl-26555-de-movistar.html)