Bitcoin Forum

Hi guys. I'm quite new in crypto world (2 months) and trying to understand what's actually going on on the market. The thing is when Bitcoins grows, alts go down (or just don't grow), bitcoin goes down, alts go down even more - why? I don't exactly understand it and feel confused when to trade or invest. I mostly talk about ETH, LTC, Monero and other from top.

Thank you.

hmm good queston.. i would like to know as well.. ???

Good question, i may be wrong and if so, someone will probably correct me and explain it better, but i believe it's like this :

BTC going up -> money goes into btc for a quick ride to skyville
BTC going down -> people selling btc into fiat for protection and also money diverging from alts into bitcoin because it's the messiah coin and every dip is much appreciated to bagholders

Yeah, same..i feel this too.
When BTC Goes up, alts go down..

I don't know the reason is, but i love this.
For me, it makes me easy to predict  ;D

Its quite simple: People don't wanna put their money on alts. There are more sellers than buyers, so the prices is driven down. This is probably caused by the btc forks and people selling their alts to try and get "free money" when the fork occurs.

I think that's a very good explanation so probably that's how it's working for now.

Even more harder question now... When it ends? :-)

I'd like to share my point of view on this.

Bitcoin probably will again grow to 6000 sooner or later. Maybe it will hit the new record about 6500 - who knows. During that Bitcoin might need money which will arrive from new investors and some of it from alts (which might go down even more). But then it will be time for correction on Bitcoin. Maybe massive 30-40-50% correction like before.

So here is the last question: how deep will sink alts like Ethereum, Litecoin or Monero? 30-50% from current level would be serious for them.

I'm honestly a bit worried guys that some bad sh@t is happening to alts as none of them became REAL currency and instead of new heights we might not see new records for maybe long months and who knows what will be later.

Just a quick thought wanted to share. I might be VERY wrong of course.

Thanks!

I second this. The current altcoin dump was because everyone wants to convert to BTC to get free coins from the forks. Now when BTC goes down and alts are still not rising as much as they did it's because people are exchanging to money. Things, hopefully, should go back to "normal" when the forks are done and everyone gets their free money. You should think about getting some alts while they are down.

Yes, that's true. On the other hand, Bitcoin went down a bit after 1st fork and many here predicted that then money will move to alts for some time what didn't happened. I don't expect any bigger correction on BTC before 2nd fork for the reason you just mentioned. Howver, after 2nd fork BTC will be a big balloon which obviously will be corrected and alts will be hurt very much too.

So do you think we should prepare for no gains on top alts in next weeks?

In other words, don't buy alts for next few weeks?

What is the same situation before Bitcoin Cash fork? How it ended? Because I see Ethereum and Bitcoin the same in terms of grow to last 2 peaks (when ETH touched 400 two times).

I have a contract on Ripple, Ethereum and Monero (small ones) which goes down and down and will expire before 2nd fork. Should I just cut loses and sell them now as probably there is no chance to grow before 2nd fork?

One more question: how to explain pump on Ethereum and other alts on 13th of October? Why it went up when Bitcoin was going up before fork?

The correct answer would be,

Every alt coin is tied with bitcoin or compared with btc e.g eth/btc, xyz/btc because it is traded with bitcoin (you buy the alt coin using bitcoin or sell your alt coin for bitcoin). So technically every alt coin price is depending on the price of bitcoin. Well totally depending on the price of bitcoin.

Every time the price of bitcoin going up, the alt coin investor wants a piece of that cake for a short term therefore they would sell their alt coin holdings to get into bitcoin. You may ask why? It is because when the price of bitcoin goes up, almost all alt coins will go down due to the selling off. So the opportunity to getting more alt coins per bitcoin is more. This is one of the best way of accumulating alt coin holdings. Due to this, investors who likes to accumulate their alt coin will take position in bitcoin and wait for the price of the alt coin to drop lower. When this happens, the investors will then sell their bitcoin to get into alt coin again. Successfully increasing their alt coin numbers.

Now to the question of why alt coin price go lower when bitcoin price go low. The same explaination as per the above. Since all the alt coins are tied with bitcoin, the price of alts will also drop when the price of btc goes down. This is normally a temporary drop, when investors cashing out of bitcoin to get into alt coin. The delay between sell of of bitcoin to transferring to other broker, or position of buying into alt coin is when the price of alt is at its lowest. The alt coin price will only increase with demand or with more buys.

I hope this explains to you.

Thank you VERY much. That explains a lot like all others replies. Thanks for helping me - still complete newbie in this world. :-) But I'm trying hard to understand everything! Would you help mi with that below too?

I have a contract on Ripple, Ethereum and Monero (small ones) which goes down and down and will expire before 2nd fork. Should I just cut loses and sell them now as probably there is no chance to grow before 2nd fork?

One more question: how to explain pump on Ethereum and other alts on 13th of October? Why it went up when Bitcoin was going up before fork?

What do you mean by contract and which 2nd fork? I dont get you.


You should just let them be for now. You are not losing value until and unless you sell your holdings at loss. Eth will definitely go up. But the price of bitcoin is still subjective. Too many issues at hand at the moment, best to wait out the storm before you decide anything. The arena is kinda rough for any alt coins simply because much are being traded against btc and not a standalone.


This is very subjective. Can be contributed to many reason but mainly because of what i told you above. If weak bitcoin, buy alt coin. If strong bitcoin, sell alt coin. 

Sorry for being unprecise - I meant that I have a few CFD's with expiring dates in November. I was talking about Bitcoin Silver fork.

[EDIT] Ethereum CFD doesn't have the expiry date though I pay every day small amount of money for holding it.

Ethereum and Litecoin purchased on Coinbase of course I'm not going to sell. It's a long term investment for me. I bought them anyway cheaper compared to current prices.

Thanks for previous answers.

I am trading Altcoin pair Bitcoin and I feel the same thing.The current situation is difficult to predict probably the cause is the Bitcoin fork situation

Sone alts tends to decrease before the fok since we're all waiting and expecting for some freebies dependin on the amount of btc we hold. Maybe after receiving our freebie we might expect some movements for alts too to increase.

It is more about investors movement, the effect of bitcoin users than altcoin investors is different because of its number. Bitcoin can change its value for a fraction of time unlike altcoin it needs more than half of its investors power to make a difference. It only show how demand and supply system works and its instability.

Predictions in crypto currency is very difficult. But you can be sure of unending fluctuations and with that you can trade and short some coin. Your long term position should not be tamper with.

It might be because of another upcoming hard fork for Bitcoin. Investors who pull out their Bitcoin profit currently isn't throwing it back to altcoins because they might feel altcoins might be a bigger risk compared to Segwitx2 next month. Waiting patiently for the wave to calm down further.

That's how markets function? Prices go up and down due various factors? Bitcoin is the foundation and if it drops, alts also drop. Bitcoin mostly goes down because of rumors that create fear in the minds of people, which results in immediate panic selling and altcoins mostly drop because of decreased demand and pump and dump policy of investors.

Bear trap before another fomo

I think this is the argument I will agree with to a large extent because even me I have been looking for a provable explanation to what is actually going on and I think the reason why we always compare bitcoin price with alt prices is because we believe that they are perfect alternative of each other and their relationship should be inverse but we forget there is an alternative of the two which is fiat that can go into and out of bitcoin without touching alts. That alone as nulify any relationship we might want to establish between bitcoin and alt.

LOL. I too thought the price of bitcoins would go down after all this bitcoingold crazy, which came to be true.
But I also thought that price of alts would boom after that event but yeah to my amazement alts too are decreasing.

I think that is very bad. I don't understand why this is happening, but I house for their investment and sell altcoins trying to minimize the losses.

When bitcoin grows, it is common that people will want to trade alt back to bitcoin to get the growth. You will end up getting more alt coin when you trade back later. However, when bitcoin goes down, the money may not move back to the same alt. There are always new ico and new coins/tokens added to the market so it dilutes the market, Giving the value of each alt coins may not return back to its ATH.

The problem is that almost all traders see altcoins not as an investment into a new technology/idea but they see it as a way to produce more bitcoins.

They compare the altcoin price only to the bitcoin price, the $ price is irrelevant for them. Most of them got large quantities of BTC when it was still cheap.

So BTC goes up --> they have to sell all of their altcoins in order not to make a loss on their BTC number. Because for them if BTC goes up and alts stay the same/go down they make a loss in BTC.

BTC goes down --> they know that altcoins go down even more when BTC goes down (I do not understand exactly why it is like this). So they sell their altcoins for BTC and wait until BTC stabilizes and altcoins are at the lowest point, then buy altcoin and like this get more Altcoin than they previously had because of the altcoin discount.

BTC is stable --> they still seek to increase the number of their BTC and try to chose altcoins that have a bigger growth than BTC.

All those stupid forks just increase this problem, but as long as people profit from it, there will be many more forks since it's basically free money. It's one of the many ways to scam people, just like those massive amount of airdrop coins or some greedy ICOs (not alls ICOs).

This behaviour is also the reason why the altcoin prices will always depend on the BTC price (among other things, like for example that you can buy a lot of alts only with BTC).It will always stay like this because this is how you make the most out of your Bitcoin/Money. People also seem to follow traders blindly, contributing to this problem. I wonder what it takes to make altcoins price development more independent from BTC/traders. Maybe being able to buy Altoins with fiat would help. Or if people would wake up and realise that Bitcoin is already an old technology and there are way better options within the world of blockchain.

I’m not sure about your statement which says bitcoin goes down then altcoin goes down even more. I have never seen that happening in first place. It has always been the reverse case for altcoins and bitcoin. They never match up because the most popular trading pair is bitcoin/altcoin only and that’s why whenever people go for selling the alts then they will do it with bitcoin leading to increased rates of bitcoin and decreased for the altcoins. Thus vice verse case is also true for them.

I feel the way you feel, I have joined in this forum about 4 months and follow various bounty campaign, finally I also got quite a lot of altcoin type and until now there is no altcoin that rose again, even decreased

I have seen it happening many times since the rise of Bitcoin from the first of August this year. Everytime there was a BTC price correction, alts were bleeding even more than BTC. They rise only if BTC stays stable or goes up/down only slightly. If it's more than 3% change of BTC, alts are done for usually. Of course it's hard to generalize this, you would find exceptions to this as well. But I have been following a lot of alts and I would say at least that it happens like this often.

And to add one more layer of complexity: Ethereum-based ERC-20-tokens behave in the same way when ETH rises/falls, not only when it's the case with BTC.

During last 2 days the situation has changed. I follow crytocurrency market news and the information says about the new “fall” of Bitcoin and fast growth of almost all Altcoins.

Bitcoin is 3% cheaper today than it was last week. This cryptocurrrency prices fall through the fork. BTG is coming and it seems it will show rapid growth, too.

the life is a game . market is too :)