Bitcoin Forum

Hi all,

I’m Tony Cui from the Achain and I plan to present my recent theory on blockchain’s chain-split at our upcoming Blockshow on November 29. For now, I would like to share with you folks where my framework comes from and how the theory works- in just a couple of bullet points:

1.   Our current elitist blockchain technology faces the challenge of opening up to the larger general communities. Creating new systems for various application purposes usually demands too much from new developers having just entered the game. How could they quickly develop secure blockchain applications? And where could they even start to find their first customers?

2.   Keeping those questions in mind, we now look to the variety of newly derived forked cryptocurrencies in the market. Bitcoin Gold, for example. It is, of course, made for the goal of better profiting, but that’s not enough. The blockchain industry can use the idea of forking to meeting a better end – the end of innovation that can lower the standard of the technology to include participation of all.

3.   This is how Achain’s Fork Theory functions: Achain splits into a main chain and several sub-chains. All information can be shared among all chains, and value can exchange freely in avoidingdisruptions of communications.

4.   The main chain is committed to the basic blockchain infrastructure, while its sub-chains can be customized to the various needs of their applications.

5.   Since the sub-chains are split from the main, they inherit the main’s basic stable structure, which also contains all of the main chain’s existing users. This serves as the initial reservoir of users and solves the new developers’ concern of their insufficient customer markets.

6.   We will update our smart contracts, announce the plan, and obtain the community’s general consensus. Different types of forking (whether soft fork or hard fork) will be implemented according to the need of specific applications.

7.   We will provide a standardized Value Exchange Protocol and a detailed instruction to forking. Stay tuned! C:-)

Any thoughts/questions/advice? Looking forward to hearing them out!

Thanks for your attention.

I hold some ACT, and enjoy the earning on it.
I hope this post and blockshow asia will boost the price to the moon!!!

just like bitcoin cash, gold, diamond, sliver, segwit2, should I expect Achain cash, Achain gold, Achain diamond?
Make me rich please, Tony!

 Very cool idea - just a quick question: how free / independent are those sub-chains after splitting?

I don't think Achain  has the value of being forked

I have a question……How much practical value does the theory have?

From what I know thus far, Achain only supports DPOS, which permits the delegates to make decisions or function as executive?

WOW, so all sub-chains can get their users from Achain?

If there’s no limit to the forking of Achain, will ACT be eventually diluted, followed by risks of currency inflation?

Actually, I can see Achain's posting here. Although I have a part of ACT, I do not agree with this split view. Therefore, I do not recommend that Achain initiate such a bifurcation.

It is said that ACHAIN reputation in China is very bad, before the jubi exchange, is the achain author team co-exchange malicious price manipulation, resulting in a lot of investors lose the same investment.
This is just a goodwill reminder.

chinese scam，be  careful :-[ :-[ :-[

Your statement is ambiguous, not to say that all projects from China are liar, such as NEO and QTUM are very good projects.
However, ACHAIN does not belong to this list, ACHAIN team I think it is not reliable, because they put the team responsible for the technical developers were dismissed before the ICO, ACHAIN only focus on publicity, but did not pay attention Development.

i can prove that he says is true

Team manipulate prices to deceive investors, so bad！ :'(

I do not know where you came from to put forward this theory. Achain's community groups are like feces. They do not look at the problem of community building. They always think about money. ::) ::) ::)

so evil :-[ :-[

As we all know, Achain reputation in China is not good, and community construction is also quite poor, and now another way to want money, this is not a good idea Yeah, the founder, should change

I guess some people above don't understand English? What 's the relationship between this "fork theory" and money? Cui said it's about innovation and it's just an idea.

I'm not sure if I'm correct but to me, this basically means Achain is open to splitting of chains in future for specific uses to make it simpler for developers who are not blockchain experts. This would in turn mean for every split ACT holders will get free money. Just like BTC, BCC and BTG

I like this idea althrough I think it's still pretty new and it will take a long time for the team to accomplish this idea.

Hi brother....What does soft fork and hard fork mean in No. 6? How are they different? ???

 Do sub-chains have to inherit all properties of the main chain? Is there an option of (even partially) not to?

If a sub-chain chooses not to subscribe to the main chain’s consensus mechanism (e.g. DPOS), can they adopt a different one?I'm sorry, my question may be a little more, because I am very interested in forking, so I hope everyone can help me to answer.......thanks

 Emmmmmm........Regarding Point #6, who have the rights to vote on whether or not to split (and the type of splitting)? Is it just the token-holders, delegates, or all the community members?

Approximately when will the VEP 1.0 mentioned by Point 7 be available and take effect? ???

I think it is possible, but there are lots of work to do. Thinking about current ethereum and etheruem after fully casper being implemented, two chains with some common users.

Probably Tony will tell more in Singapore Blockshow summit.

I don't know the details, but in theory it could be, right?
For instance, they can change the block size, the bonus of generating block, etc?

I do not agree with you. I think such a view is foolish. After all, Achain's community has not yet been built yet. Do you want to fly before you learn to walk? ?

From my poor understanding, their fork theory try to resolve 3 issues.

1. Scalability:
I saw different solutions on this issue. If all business run on one chain, it has huge pressure on performance. And the nodes dont need all ledger but the ledger they cared about. From this perspective, it is good to have different block chain to support different business, and communicate with each other with careful authorization and trust (consensus).  
I am NOT technical expert, while I heard different solutions. For instance, EOS and previous graphene from BTS could support really high transaction rate. And Vitalik also emphasized the performance issue is going to be resolved in next 2 years by "sharding" at DEVCON summit.
Also Lisk has side chain which try to make Dapp development as easy as possible at the same time. The side chain technology can partially resolve scalability issue ,if I understand the tech correctly, and kind of isolate security issue.
Ok. I missed the lighting network on bitcoin network and ethereum, the off-chain technology is suitable for low fee, quick, small payment, and also cross chain atomic exchange.
What's the advantage, difference, and the current progress of the each technology?

2. User base:
The recent Bitcoin fork show lots of debates. Some radical users support one of them, and look down upon others. While lots of BTC holders don't care the debates and only care the "free" coins. Should I say you can get free users from fork? I don't know, probably people just care free coins. The technology behind represent the core value. You need people support the core value, which need "real" innovation based on current chain.  At this point, it related my next topic: do you think people who know very little about blockchain should fork any chain?

3. The barriers building one's own blockchain.
We have to admit it is still the early stage of blockchain technology. I dont judge on various blockchain solutions, and they are valuable innovations.  The market may finally determine the winner, maybe it is the one what you think it is impossible. So I support more and more people enter this industry, learn, contribute, and evolve continuously.  
I do think as a Dapp developer, he need understand the basic knowledge of blockchain, but no need to know the tech details of blockchain. For instance, he should never change the consensus, encryption, which should be done very carefully. However he could build the Dapp using his current skills on normal internet Apps.  The blockchain cornerstone guarantee App transform into Dapp. So I think they are good attempts, like ethereum using solidity, even it is still vulnerable, and like NEO using multiple programming languages, and like Lisk which helps to build Dapp. We need avoid the issues on parity's multi signature, but don't stop try, what makes the technology improve.
Building one's own blockchain is similar with building Dapp? I am doubting. I am not saying we only need one blockchain in the world which could resolve all issues, but is it really good that every one build a blockchain easily? It's hard to differentiate scammer and real builder. And Achain has the rule to approve the fork. It doesn't describe the detailed rules, at this time I keep my neutral opinion.

I think it as a good thing when you try to help more people understand Blockchain

This is a foolish idea. I do not agree with this view. After all, listening to Chinese friends said that Achain's reputation in China is quite general, and there are not many people who are concerned about Twitter. Why is the first batch of users saying?

Absolutely! do you know Achain collaborate with Tsinghua iCenter holding a blockchain classes. The courses are very serious.

And I also notice Jimmy Song teach Bitcoin together with Stanford. Really helpful.
https://bitcoinedge.org/event/stanford-devplusplus-2017

I alway suggest everyone could judge independently. What's Twitter are saying?

whatever you support or not. Please provide information to support your opinion. That's helpful and sprit of blockchain!

I saw some valueable questions under the same posting in the Chinese Board (Chinse version), I did the translate.


Someone asked:

Any investigations on Lisk sidechains?

I suggest to look at the following techniques:
1. To solve the scalability problem with a Layer 2 protocol. (e.g. Lightning Network, Cross-chain)
2. To implement Ethereum's Sharding  - to avoid the seizing of transaction performance between contracts
3. A more expanded version of Lisk's design of sidechains
4. Achain's fork theory

Pros and cons? Who's better than others?

Very good question, hope to hear more here...

Thanks for the thought. When we compare the four solutions we'll have to keep the following criteria in mind: security level, scalability, decentralizing level, and performance rate. So here we go on a scale of 1 to 10:
1. Lightning Network only works when relying on the Bitcoin main chain. It's good for transactions of smaller amount and higher frequency. It also lifts restrictions of performance of transaction authentication. But it does so at the expense of security level. Rating: 3 (security), 3 (scalability), 10 (decentralization), 8 (performance rate).
2. Ethereum's Sharding technique assigns different nodes to authenticate different transactions, thereby logically distinguishing out subsections of the chain. Like Lightning Network, it boosts performance rate. But it does so at the expense of its degree of decentralization. Rating: 8, 5, 3, 10.
3. Lisk has all of its applications built on its sidechains, which makes it more scalable. But it does so at the expense of security and decentralization. And as to what extent can the sidechains interact with each other, we are yet to find out through more research. Rating: 3, 7, 5, 5.
4. In Achain's Fork Theory, all sub-chains are equally independent (self-governed), and every one of them is free to decide to split into further forking. The ultimate mutual and reciprocal bond is the VEP (Value Exchange Protocol) for all to obey. It requires high technical commitment, which we will try our best to fulfill. Comparatively, Achain opts for the most balanced strategy. Rating: 6, 8, 7, 5.

Is that true? There have been similar rumors before, but there is still no evidence that it is real, I hope you can change this situation

I am also Chinese, achain just when I was concerned about the publicity, but also involved in achain ico. Although achain does not yet have a large online exchange, achain's technology and value are there, I believe achain should be able to enter the top 30 shortly thereafter.

From your theories, I'm not quite sure what this has to do with Achain. What is the specific relationship between the redistributed sub-project and the original Achain?

 Regarding Point #6, who have the rights to vote on whether or not to split (and the type of splitting)? Is it just the token-holders, delegates, or all the community members?

"1.Our current elitist blockchain technology faces the challenge of opening up to the larger general communities. Creating new systems for various application purposes usually demands too much from new developers having just entered the game. How could they quickly develop secure blockchain applications? And where could they even start to find their first customers? "

This may be able to answer your question

To be honest, I do not quite understand what this is all about

You can see the project in more detail here: https://www.achain.com/

Thanks for the link :)

Really thank you, Tony! I am glad that you keep open mind to discuss any issues here!

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/dreamworks-dragons/images/d/d5/Wonderful.gif/revision/latest?cb=20131104193200

I still dont get why LN harm security, Sharding harm decentralize, sidechain harm security. Maybe I need check those in details.
While if you can share more about the reason, I do appreciate you!

Be patient! Waiting for Nov 29 - singapore blockshow summit!

Or white paper may help? https://www.achain.com/Achain%20Whitepaper%202.0_EN.pdf

So the white paper has been updated?

Yes, that's the latest one.
Previous one doesn't include the forking network.

Is it only available in English? Translations into other languages are not planned?

I think they provide a Chinese version, but I can't find now.

I once setup the ANN thread. Official guys seems has no plan on bounty program or translation bonus.  :(

Very sorry if this is so. I was hoping to take part in the campaign bounty =(

What about security? Do you write that any released contract on the Achain network will be automatically tested by the system correctly? How will this be tested? And what happens if the contract fails testing?

Very interesting project
I wish the developers luck on BlockShow on November 29!

In fact, I did not quite understand the difference between DPoS technology and your RDPoS development. I did not see any cardinal differences, or am I wrong?

Probably such a contract will burn, is not it?

Can I already use this currency?

I believe that yes. You can download applications from the site, follow the instructions and start using this currency.

if I understand correctly, Achain plans to become a bitter bitcoin and claims to be the main crypto currency in the market, right?

This is possible only if the majority of users lose interest in bitcoin and begin to use this currency as the main one in the crypto world

Well, generally, Achain is technologically far superior to bitcoin, so I see great potential in this!

I do not quite understand the idea of forking.
From Achain, users can branch out an infinite number of new chains? Or how? What is it for and what are the advantages?

So, do you think that in the end bitcoin will go to the background?

Naturally yes. It's unavoidable. The only question is, when will this happen. :)

In what real spheres of activity is the Acein technology applicable?
And what are the advantages in this?

In many spheres, for example insurance, electronic documentation, crypto-currencies, study of records, credit rating, etc.

The advantages are obvious. Low cost, decentralization, security, convenience in setting up the chain

That is, there will be a main chain and all the others? Would not it be then lost productivity? Or something negative?

I did not quite understand either. I would like more information

I do not quite understand what benefit this can bring. It's just a theory

How much I understand, it can affect speed of transactions?

And by the way, how is it possible to monetize?

How independent will these chains be after separation?

As far as I understand, completely autonomous.

I think I do not have enough knowledge to understand this correctly

I think we will be told more about this at singapore blockshow summit!

When will it take place?

Tony has a speech at 29 Nov

Wow very very interesting topic to think about

I agree with you theory is interesting

can I find somewhere information about that?

I think that the Internet, you will find something extra

 is a one man created everything?

Well, it's just a theory, not ICO, the more it's written that one

 can someone throw the link to the site?

read their white paper looks cool

where did you find it?

Well, in general, the Internet has all the information and you can take advantage of this

White paper is easy to find but I could not find the site

you are so unfortunately not one ahah

I think this information can still be obtained as it is

 in the white paper there is a historical background I like

agree to beginners will easily in this way understand the essence of the theory well, and in general it's exciting

This is a very stupid way to die, Tone seems to be the decider of the entire project, he will think about what will allow him to get the maximum benefit.

comparison with the great industrial revolution makes you think that is something very global

why do you think so?

why are you talking about death?

actually, the blockchain technology is an absolute innovation

Of course, they start talking about this only now, I think it is only at the initial stage of development

  no one argues with that

In general, I would like more information about this

Well, it seems to have been discussed that on the Internet it is a lot of

I mean bitcointalk it would be more convenient to discuss this if the information was contained in the forum

maybe in the near future it will be found and laid out by anyone here.

too, so I think the discussion started a couple of days ago

for these couple of days but the discussion is quite stormy

 good luck to Tony in his future success

I think that you can contact Tony directly and ask him questions of interest

do not agree with you I do not think that the person who came up with this theory will answer all the questions although you know depends on where you are going to ask questions

  think that it is quite possible to contact him on social networks

 the theory is aimed at improving technology?

well, maybe he will still act somewhere with a presentation and you can ask about anything

Is not it something new?

read the white paper in it everything is clearly described by the way I will note the quality of its performance very good text

in fact, it is difficult to understand the meaning, no matter how the white paper is made

why?

in order to understand the technology of blockades and in its sense it takes a lot of time and it is necessary to understand the essence of the work

of course, without this, there is no way to understand the theory

I do not think that in order to discuss this, we need in-depth knowledge about the technology of blockchain

I think that with an expert it will be much more intractable to discuss this matter besides that he can even help you in what either to sort out

I do not understand why everyone is so suspicious about A chain. If it is really so productive and innovative, as the developers say, then it really can significantly change the whole sphere

I came up with a curious idea. Suppose your theory is correct and the introduction of such an approach will improve the blockchain system. Then after all, all developers will use this approach. Do you propose to patent this and take money from each team or all this for the sake of science?

I think that developers will find a way to monetize their invention

The idea sounds interesting enough. How realistic is it to implement this in any project?

I think that it is quite possible to implement and even without much difficulty

And it seems to me, on the contrary, it is only a theory that will not bring real benefits. Yes, it's curious, but no more

Why do you think so?

It seems to me that the system works fine  without this innovation

What exactly can this theory give?

When will developers be able to provide more complete information?

The idea is interesting, but one should not first discuss with the narrow specialists in this field. In any case, it's worth experimenting. I only have a question: will not the sub-agreements conflict with each other?

I agree, the idea should be discussed first with narrow specialists

It seems they were talking about some kind of exhibition or conference. But I can be wrong

I'm not an expert, but judging by the community's approval, the idea seems interesting. Can it somehow improve our work?

It is not yet clear whether this theory is viable

Oh, well, I think it's very viable. I would like to see the project using this theory. It's still necessary to try in business

Very interesting project, will the developers deal with the translation?

I do not think so, usually this is a bounty campaign. This project does not have such a campaign. I do not think that the developers will involve translators and localize the project.

Will it be a system based on POW technology or will it work on the basis of POS technology?

It seems to me temporarily. When the project spreads around the world, more localizations will appear!

It works on the technology of RDPoS, it's own development of Achain, it is based on the technology of DPoS

Well, if the project gets widespread, then it will happen, yes. But I think that it will take a lot of time

Wow...
And what are the main advantages of the system developed exactly Achain?

I think it does not take much time, the platform looks very profitable and interesting. I think it will be very popular in the crypto currency market :)

This technology is much faster, more stable and much safer. Also, this system automatically tests all the released contracts in the system, and many other improvements.

It sounds very interesting, can I read somewhere technical details of the implementation of this technology?

I hope that this will happen, good luck to the developers!

I do not quite understand the idea about the network fork. That is, users of Achain can infinitely branch the chain and at the same time the network will function?

You can read the information on this technology in the Whitepaper or if you need details, then try to contact the developers directly. ;)

Something like that. The developers believe that the fork of the network is the opposite, on the contrary, and supports it in every possible way. I do not know exactly how it works in terms of technology, but I like the idea!

I still do not understand how this works, the permanent separation of chains, how does the system preserve its integrity and functionality?

Actually the original idea was to kill as many altcoins as possible
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2381234.0