Bitcoin Forum

Thread moved here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=254929.msg2714038#msg2714038



12.07.2013 update: I am not making any profit for ordering Bitfury unit, due to rising price of bitcoin each share will have more hashing power. Hashing power will be splitted by the amount off invested BTC.Recent shares number was set with much lower BTC value. We need less than 14 BTC to close our order at the moment.


Since we missed the August units delivery batch we are moving our group buy to October delivery.
Group buy is still open, hurry up! there aren't many devices left for us to buy.

SOLD SHARES:


UNIT #2 - October delivery
249/300
 
 Shares - Name

- 12 - Fajman
- 40 - Anon #1
- 2 - Greenbone
- 20 - czspeedycz
- 20 - riclas
- 2 - tuxxilla
- 2 - sealight (fiat transfer)
- 4 - sealight
- 49 - Anon #2 (private investor)
- 4 - adamlm
- 6 - minerpumpkin
- 2 - masisty
- 4 - anon #3
-
-
-
- 82 - buffer shares to close order and resell shares later





UNIT #1 - August delivery
49/300

  Shares - Name

-
-
-
-
-
-
-






Hello

Since Punin is only shipping his Bitfury units only to Europe me and my friend Felipeo decided to expand our mining farm project.

http://www.bitfurystrikesback.com/

Details of our current mining farm can be found here:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Aq4YXCoAvifBdGRRSk02NkZtM1FrbHN0elIwZ0t2SlE#gid=1

We are also setting up our online store which is currently in beta stage.

http://store.bitcoin.org.pl/      

Once you click FAQ button, you will see our company adress and that we are fully registered company in Poland.

For those who will try to research transactions you can see that we also got Avalon batch #3 paid order, coming on our way.

We will try to collect funds for one 400 GH/s unit delivered in October and for one unit delivered in September. If we fail to collect in reasonable time I will sum all funds and order only one unit. If there will be more demand we will try to order next units.


Each unit is divided into 300 shares which equals ~1.3 GH/s
Each share is worth 0.5 BTC for October unit.


Unit #2 - 400 GH/s October delivery
payment adress:


After payment please post in this thread or send PM if you wish to remain anonymous.
Please post in the following format:
<forum nick, unit number, total paid amount, transaction id>

Be aware to use only adress you control.
In other words adress that you can send signed message with.

Terms and Conditons are the same as for our current farm except we reserve 13% of hashing power.
When mining is not profitable anymore, we will attempt to sell the miners or find another use for them. Any proceeds thereof will be distributed as dividend.

In case of hardware failure
We believe the gear should be able to run 24 months, but since there are no working devices yet we simply don’t know. In case of hardware failure we will try to repair or replace the machine. Any costs involved will be deducted from payment as costs.

Dividends
Dividends will be paid to adress which has been used to pay for shares, if you wish to change payout adress please send signed message.
Payouts will take place bi-weekly. Statements will be made available on our website.
Power rate in Poland is 0.19$/ kWh
All transactions and orders will be transparent

Due to Bitcoin price fluctuationsons each unit is divided into 300 shares. If bitcoin price will go up and total amount need for order will be available at the moment, we will order our unit instantly. If there will be any money left they will be send back to last investors in que. If in fact price will go up, whole unit hashing power will be distibuted to each investor according to owned shares.


Update: After consultation with our accountant, we are sure that we will be able to purchase Bitfury unit WITHOUT VAT therefore each unit is cut back to 300 shares, and each share will have more hashing increased by VAT amount.[/size]

I got an idea of streaming 24/7 our minig project via webcam, simply because the cost of making that would be basically none, but it should bring a lot of fun, confidence and calm for our investors.

share price went up? im sure it was 0.25BTC/share when i last looked an hour ago

indeed but I've decided to split units into 300 shares instead, so the price of each share went up.

ok im in, detailed pmed  8)

Can you confirm the hosting arrangements i.e. will the units be hosted at a residential address? Is there any sort of redundant power supply/UPS and/or redundant internet connection? It isn't clear from the BitFuryStrikesBack product page whether the full kits include cases or racks, will you be providing these at cost if they are not included?

Yes there is backup internet connection,
At the moment there is no need for UPS power backup since I haven't got a single electric power loss since two years.

As for any additional stuff as racks, psu or whatever will be needed.
I will cover that cost from my pocket and then split that cost to each investor according to number of shares he owns.
That cost will be substracted from first payout.

Hello all
Like pajak666 said we will provide all needed stuff.


This is right, if we have single problem with power in future we will provide needed solution like UPS to solve problem. 

Any proof that you are legit  ?

best regards

Hektek

We a Polish private entrepreneur. I run my own registered IT company since 2012. If you want proof of my or my company identity i can provide all document you need.
Also if you would do a little resarch you would be able to give us a phone call easily:)
Details http://store.bitcoin.org.pl under FAQ section

Also confirmed Avalon chips orders and order of Bitfury machine via metabank.ru.
Bitmit profile? :)
https://www.bitmit.net/en/user/Pajak666

so it is 13% + electricity? seems quite a lot compared to other hosting options I have seen.

I would buy 10 shares. But could you explain me please the plan with Starter boards? The price is +- the same for the same hashing power? So if I buy 10 shares (it si 11 GH/s) I will have then 11GH/s in these boards? And when they will be ready to hash? Thanks

Plan with boards is backup plan, if we will not be able to collect 300 BTC we will order those 25 GH/s boards with money we will collect for our group buy.
According to seller they should be available the same time.

And the price is also the same (for the same amount of GH/s)? Thanks for answers

unfortunately not, when we will be forced to order few single 25 GH/s boards, our hashing power will be decreased by ~6.5%, therefore each share hashing power will be slightly lower (-6.5%)

And the air cooling? And the power to run it? And the redundant internet connection? And the space where all the stuff is placed? And all the work made to set up things?
No hard feelings but simply imagine all the costs and fact that we you are saving 23% at the beginning of the hosting deal becouse there is no VAT applied. We can provide that since we are legitimate tax payers as registered company.

Simple math: You are saving yourself some time and money (+10% even with 13% hosting fee)

we have already collected 14 BTC, that means that for sure we will order something from punin, even one 25 GH/s board:)

czspeedycz, 10, 10 BTC, 7b9c9aaf76fae4159d4187beabd5c9b4e2ae9de80efb5dfeec9c49c7cd2512e5

Thanks

why do you think the 1 month advantage over say Knc Jupiters is worth the difference in cost?

First: Simply because I have never seen KNC working chip, or even prototype of ASIC chip made by them.
We got quite nice signs that bitfury chip is working and that it actually exist.(correct me if I am wrong)
KNC still has to develop \ deliver working chip.

Second: I want to start hashing asap, because that one month difference can be crucial to total amount of hashing power of the network. If Avalon will deliver chips & KNC will deliver, there will be huge difficulty jump. Until that time we will be happy hashing with our 400 GH/s. Maybe KNC or Avalon will have some sort of delay so difference can be even bigger for our favor. In other words we will slightly gamble on them failing to deliver on time.

Hey guys, I was wondering if you'd be willing to share what your accountant's thoughts were on the VAT issue (please feel free to tell me to get lost)? I'm afraid that I'm a little confused (I'm easily confused ;)). I wasn't aware that it was possible to avoid paying VAT, just that the country in which you pay VAT could be changed in certain circumstances. A VAT-registered EU company should be able to buy stuff from bitfurystrikesback.com zero-rated, but aren't they then liable for VAT in their home country? Likewise, if bitfurystrikesback.com exports stuff outside the EU then VAT isn't due at point of sale, but will need to be paid on entry to the destination country. Tax law is horribly complicated, so I'm probably missing something crucial, but if you have a solution that you'd be willing to share that would be great.

Yes I run VAT-registered EU company so we will order without VAT.


I don't know what tax law will be in non EU destination, but If in fact you have to pay whatever it will depend on the declared value of the shipment IMO.

Hi Felipeo, thanks for taking the time to answer, I appreciate that. I just have one more question, if I can try your patience for a little longer. So VAT-registered companies need to charge their customers VAT at the local rate right? (unless customers themselves are VAT-registered). So in a simple case, if a VAT-registered company in the UK buys a shovel for £100 they can claim the VAT back on this from HMRC (or get it VAT free when they purchase) and get the shovel for £83.33. However, when they sell the shovel to a customer for, say, £85 then they need to charge the customer VAT (or absorb it in their margin) on that to give a total of £102 and then pay the VAT to HMRC. I don't mean to be patronising, I know you guys know this already, I'm just trying to get my thoughts in order and check whether I understand things correctly. So my question is what happens if that company sell shares in the shovel rather than selling it as a whole? Shouldn't VAT be charged on these shares, won't HMRC be sending a VAT bill at the end of the quarter?

Thanks again, and sorry for turning your thread into a tax accountancy advice forum ;D!!

Coiner.de, 1, 20, 943458f8885f51bfa304dca3db5a8f142e3aae71aeaf848f86dd59c2cd19de0b

No, shovel stays at our company, it will be used by our company so we don't need to pay VAT.

tuxxilla, 1, 2, 1b2c9a677f2de9af216de3d1103fa911ee0a2fc6e4e3c19e68826f5b7048cef6

Thanks for that, I wasn't sure if you could do it like this or not. Thanks also for your patience with my pestering. Hope you enjoy your shovel!

I would be interested if the expense ratio was maybe 8-10% instead of 13%. At 13% you earn something like $2700 in month 1 alone, to cover "management" (not including electricity!), then incrementally smaller payments from there. There is already a pretty big premium on group A, and trying to make our way back to a profit at 87% payout rate could be daunting. Just bringing this up since you may have to adjust the GB anyway, depending on what happens to BTC prices.

Again, I'm interested just a little concerned about the expenses.

Thanks for listening.

I've answered this before.
I will copy paste it again.

And the air cooling? And the power to run it? And the redundant internet connection? And the space where all the stuff is placed? And all the work made to set up things?
No hard feelings but simply imagine all the costs and fact that we you are saving 23% at the beginning of the hosting deal becouse there is no VAT applied. We can provide that since we are legitimate tax payers as registered company.

Simple math: You are saving yourself some time and money (+10% even with 13% hosting fee)
First month that might be quite good payout, since there was no big difficulty jump. But then it might become battle over pennies, and would you like to take care of sth everyday for 300$ a month?
this 3% will be hard to feel by investors anyway, but it's necessary to keep the stuff running in good conditions.
Sorry to hear that it's too much for you.
Feel free to join in anytime

I'd be interested but I see there is no big interest in this buy just a few hours before its end.
With current status: 46/300, let's say +10-20 till the end, what exactly are you going to buy? 25 GH/s devices?

Yes, they will buy starter kits.
As we are just shy of three starter kits I added a buffer order.

Coiner.de, 1, 10, 95786c80ce63185b376bf093915d61e4063bc7509057efc2c9e5f0f1ddfacec1

"buffer"?

Please add this to the very end of the queue and only use as much shares as are needed to get that extra device.
That is, please place all following orders ( if there are any ) before this one in the queue.
I hope I made my intentions clear and you don't mind any extra effort you have.

After reading all details on pajak666's store I can assure that it looks like a legit company, all this can be verified in national business registry etc.

I'm also from Poland and I am going to support our local bitcoin mining farms :)

adamlm, 1, 2, 3983b0ee164c2ed48c8beeb8a56a9d54bceb66ffefcc8b7a74080caa49f0d2c3

Thanks for your response earlier today!

If you are able to reserve 3 shares for me, I'll forward payment tonight when I get home from the office.

because there are still some shares left,we will hold a bit with our order to collect a bit more from our investors to make total order bigger

So I should still send my payment, correct (or is the GB on hold)?

Anyone can buy shares for at least 24h more from that post, I am waiting for some more detailed info from Niko about closing time for orders.
I remind that even if we will not collect whole amount we will buy 25 GH/s boards instead of 400 GH/s unit, so no shares will be lost.
I got to sleep after long night car driving, in about 8 hours I will make all necessary updates about new shares that were sold.

There was a clear deadline. Devices should have been bought immediately after the deadline.
Buy the devices until 18:00 CET or count me out.
Please send all my BTC to the address they were sent from as soon as possible then.

I'd like to buy one 25G miner.
Could you ship it to me after you receive it? I am in China.

Thanks.

I totally agree with this. If we wait until all 300 shares are sold it is > august already.

Agree.
You shouldn't change the rules in that way.
People have joined your group buy with certain terms & conditions. The deadline was clear and have passed.
 ???

riclas, 1, 10, be57f42142b5eeb9d521f5e04b4f8cccf94bd9237f52e5e9f247c91693143e66

hoping you buy the 25gh/s boards for august.

We will make order for 25 GH/s boards in about 2 hours.

do you accept paypal payment (as a gift payment)

if yes

please PM me the paypal account and 1 BTC = USD currency for paypal payments

I see on the bitfury page, they are out of stock on 25GHs for august.
  
http://www.bitfurystrikesback.com/product/400gh-miner-starter-kit/

Does that mean you can't offer the *resend* of those units for august?
Are you still even offering hosting shares for august?

[update:  U.S. site obviously also out of stock  https://megabigpower.com/shop/index.php?route=checkout/cart]

not good...

PayPal payment done for 1 share of UNIT #1 - August delivery
please confirm my payment

I think we must all move to "UNIT #2 - October delivery" with double shares...

Or just request refunds.

So what´s the plan now?

I am waiting for reply from insider @ bitfury project.
Once I wlll get his response I will post update, patience, not everything is lost, we still got small chance to get our units in August.

I've sent PM to all the investors about possible refund or possible moving your investment to buy unit with October delivery.
the October unit price is 7500 Eur which is half of August price so we should be able to get quite the same ROI.
Punin stated that he will open orders for 25 STARTER GH/s boards (currently not in shop) with October delivery so all investors please reply to PM as fast as possible so I can calculate everything once again and don't miss the train and make that October order.

NEW SHAREHOLDERS ARE STILL WELCOME

I hope that our investors will see possible advantages that come with October order.

1) we will get second batch of units, so all previous producer mistakes or bugs will be corrected by first wave of users who had trouble with their modules.
  
2) if they will have some shipping problems or wrong estimated timeline they will be able to correct that in October batch

3) unit price is cut down by 50% that is actually HUGE discount so we will be able to get the same or even better ROI.

4) until October I should recieve unit ordered with metabank.ru (that one stated in google docs). If I will receive this actual group buy unit, I will be able to set it to work instantly. there will be   no single day lost.

5) by moving your shares to October order you will get 2x hashing power for the same amount of btc invested.

I hope all of our investors will choose to stay with us! Remember KNC has still not shown working unit! Bitfury will deliver for sure:)

Hi pajak666, can you clarify what item #4 means? Thank you...

I have one bitfury unit coming to my doors. Ordered when there was first small preorder with possible delivery to russia.
https://metabank.ru/asic/1612cb2dedd2e4f26ecf6c4e2cefca3c
https://blockchain.info/tx/004dec9abd032d7c200b819b16f52137716e3d2b2154d75ed2c8f4237d39fda1
That means I will be fully aware of how to set up october unit very fast so we will loose no single minute for starting our mining farm

Ok, I understand. Are you considering selling shares to the group in that device as well? I'm in if so.

I'm in for 12 shares in October

6btc sent

b5ec97b3c465ee0051b3c850f8b70035f4923a001256545bb0655cce6f061979

Cheers,
Fajman

Are they planning on expanding to the states?

If you wish to order units and host them by yourself you can use our store as a gateway
store.bitcoin.org.pl (http://store.bitcoin.org.pl)

or you can buy shares in this group buy with hosting and recieve freshly mined bitcoins each month to an adress provided by you :)

Hi, ignore my pm, just put me down for october share please

thanks

gb

please put me to the October GB with double share :)
thank you

Shareholders list updated for October delivery.

i'll be on the lookout on this with great interest  :)

I'm staying for October, please update my shares amount.

Which wallets allow signature besides QT?  I dread having to download the blockchain. 
[Ah, Blockchain has a signed message option.]

Are you still doing the "resend" for a 25GHs unit for october?  I started my order at the store but didn't complete payment when i saw that august was out of stock.  

Yes I will add them to the store in few hours.
I am still waiting for some sign from Punin about starter boards with October delivery (he should add them to bitfurystrikesback store soon), I belive this product would be better deal, for you.

question for investors, let's assume we will order our October unit. do we wish to order one backup board?
http://www.bitfurystrikesback.com/product/bitfury-55nm-asic-h-board/
it's damn cheap and it would be nice backup if one of 16 boards in main unit would fail.
obviously that additional 350 eur would be  splited among all investors according to owned share.

I guess it depends on whether the rig will run ok with one board taken out.
If so - then it wouldn't make much sense to buy a replacement in advance. They'll probably be cheaper later.

Agree

I paid 2BTC for my "4" reserved shares

7983d44f06b6fb04ea0834e32ba39859fd44a53268a6ffb452b59876ef78a218

I have total 6 shares now...

Good point, I agree to check this first.

I got really nice message to all investors, with my own btc added and rising value of BTC we are really close to order our unit, hashing power will be greater than previously stated.
We are only few BTC left to close order (much more less than stated in first post) if you got some more spare btc send them asap and we will finalise our order.