Bitcoin Forum

She is probably the most vocal critic of the US banking system, and might be interested in the technology to make them permanently obsolete. Any MA bitcoiners have ideas on how to do this?

Interesting idea. Two links for an idea of her views on banking:

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/05/elizabeth-warren-student-loans-91079.html
http://www.politico.com//story/2013/03/elizabeth-warren-plans-book-on-middle-class-89095.html

The libertarians are going to hate it. She's all for better regulations. Remember that not every enemy of big banks will be a friend of Bitcoin. For some, this might appear worse. Of course, no harm trying :) I don't know how to get her attention though.

Some in the Bitcoin community are already in favor of regulation. Bitcoin is only a currency, a tool, and there are many ways to use it, just as there are many ways to use cash. Adding regulation doesn't change some of the core features Bitcoin has like the inflation limit and anonymity to those that take the time required to ensure it.

Someone like Warren, who is at heart a socialist, would never support something like Bitcoin.

If she figures out that Bitcoin 'accounts' can't realistically be confiscated, seized, taxed, or regulated (bitcoin->bitcoin is unregulated, and can never be regulated), she'd probably try to get the government to ban it. Especially if all of a sudden a bunch of wealthy people decide to start buying bitcoins to avoid capital controls, or other regulations.

Also, remember that the goal of socialism is to abolish the use of currency all together. Because it's 'unfair'.

You can't be serious with this.  She is a statist, through and through.

REAL friends of bitcoin in congress (anti-legal tender laws, pro-competing currencies)

Justin Amash (R-MI)
Thomas Massie (R-KY)
Kerry Bentivolio (R-MI)
Raul Labrador (R-ID)
Walter Jones (R-NC)
Ted Yoho (R-FL)
Jared Polis (D-CO)

See Ron Paul's bill on competing currencies (a bill annually introduced, and annually killed in committee)  http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/112/hr1098#

Bitcoins can be taxed. Remember that (rich) people already avoid taxes by clever money management & loopholes. That's why there have been ideas floated about letting people bring offshore money back into the U.S. at a special rate, so that money can actually be put to use.

It's sort of like pirating music vs. people that pay legally. You'll always have people willing to pay and play by all rules because that's the easiest.

As for what's in her heart she seems to be populist, and at the end of the day that's what Bitcoin is really about.

Only if you hand them over.

They won't like the fact that:

1. They can't determine how many you own.
2. They can't scare a bank into giving them your money.

MOST of the community want bitcoin unregulated. but agree with the regulations revolving around the exchange to FIAT.

i personally prefer experienced and licenced financial institutions to control the FIAT to bitcoin exchanges.. much more then some 17yo zit faced guy that can run off at a moments notice.

but for the:
bitcoin for other altcoins
bitcoin for goods
bitcoins for services
bitcoins for everything else

should remain unregulated, but atleast follow a certain moral compass and understanding of security risks, which we all independently learn and use to control our own funds

Most of the current community, that is. If Bitcoin is to take off, it needs to cater to a broader political spectrum. Having my mBTC taxed is a small price to pay for a low-fee and fast decentralized global financial transaction system.

I agree, but I am pretty sure the anonymity part isn't going to sit well with her. It is also definitely harder to regulate, especially through her own agency. I see no good reason why she should be enthusiastic about Bitcoin given her agency wouldn't be able to regulate it on a practical level.

Why not? Cash is anonymous.


As I said above my instinct about her is she is in favor of the little guy, not the privileged/elite. That's what Bitcoin is about. I believe the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau is in line with that, for example, ensuring banks can't charge loan shark level interest rates on credit cards, or have obscure non-obvious penalties and fees. Such protection I'd say is a good thing because, guess why, ordinary people have no financial alternative to banks!

In other words the regulation she would champion is only necessary because the financial system is so abusive to the little guy.

Bitcoin gives people options and it's a voluntary currrency. Regulations on Bitcoin for that reason are far less necessary, if they are at all. Bitcoin is not very different than people deciding to trade gold nuggets. That's anonymous and irreversible too, and wouldn't be very easy for the CFPB to regulate, but would she say Americans shouldn't be able to trade gold? I doubt that.

having bitcoin taxed.??. no, because bitcoin is not government owned.. thats like an american being taxed by france because he does a trade using us dollar.

it has nothing to do with france.. the dollar is not owned by the french so the french should not be taxing dollars

bitcoin should remain nregulated and untaxed. but if you convert it to fiat, then yea expect taxes

If you earn francs in America they are taxed; albeit only "capital gains" and in USD equivalents. The same should apply to Bitcoin.

+1

... famous last words :)


... uumm, don't we have that (i.e., no-fee) now -- without even being taxed?

This part is important. If nobody takes it, it's not global.

Well...the fallacy of her thinking is that by implicitly being in favor of big-gov/deficit-spending, she's actually helping the privileged/elite at the expense of the little guy.



That is NOT how a pro-regulation uber-dem is going to see it. She'll see bitcoin as "hoarders'" and scammers' electronic-gold delight, rife with theft and loss concerns, money laundering, scams, etc. The inability to do chargebacks will make her want to put incredible scaffolding in place around everything bitcoin in order "protect" the poor little helpless souls that we Americans are in her myopic mind.



As noted above, the fact that bitcoin trades electronically with no chargebacks is going to be the dealbreaker for someone like her with regard to being pro-bitcoin.

She IS the privileged/elite:

And:

Do you really think that someone who has a net worth of about $14.5 million (USD), who works at only tax-exempt institutions, and plainly does not donate much to charity is going to favor bitcoin?   It is about power, and whatever it takes to get there for her, and bitcoin is anti-power because it is decentralized by its nature.

She makes "the rich" who make more than $150,000 per year look like mere pikers.

If she really was in favor of the "redistribution" she claims to favor, she would do it voluntarily.  Instead, she favors it for others, at the point of a gun and not herself.  Look at Warren Buffett and Bill Gates.  They are very much in favor of higher taxes on "everyone" -- except themselves when the set up foundations for tens of billions of dollars to protect it from taxes.

Warren is a progressive ("Progressivism is a general political philosophy advocating or favoring gradual social, political, and economic reform through government action.") and that means statist and the state will have a much harder time controlling bitcoin as bitcion grows and improves.  

I agree with the poster above, by all means, try to get her in favor of bitcoin.  It would be great, but I seriously do not believe that there is any hope when you look at what she believes in.

yeah i can see it now "OMG BITCOINS R KILLS THE CHILDRENS WE MUST STOP!" 

D - whammy
MA - whammy

I had no idea we had so many Elizabeth Warren experts? They even know her opinion on things she has never commented about. 

The attitude in this thread is far too negative. "Statists hate Bitcoin"? Myth. Bankers hate Bitcoin because it is competition. But Bitcoin makes no claim to compete with the state. Bitcoin does neither garbage collection nor road building. Bitcoin neither collects taxes nor regulates markets. There is no reason whatsoever for a statist to hate Bitcoin, unless said statist is affiliated with the banking system.

Elizabeth Warren, in my opinion, would be a good fit for Bitcoin.

While he's been disappointing on some key issues, I'm glad to see he's got some cajones on this. I still have like 70 of his yard signs in my garage and was thinking about putting them out with the trash but he's redeemed himself a little on this one. Now, if he only doesn't vote in favor of another fiscal cliff deal like he campaigned against. The others you listed are no big surprise, Massie, Jones and Amash are top shelf congressmen for sure. Yoho and Labrador get honorable mentions.

I understand the skeptical views on Elizabeth Warren. I'm skeptical too.

It just seems to me someone writing a book called "Rigged" about how the economic system is often rigged against people who work hard and play by the rules might be open to Bitcoin. Neither she or anybody else can stop it anyway, but she could be a powerful ally.

A world in which bitcoin was a major financial force would begin to curtail governments' abilities to deficit spend to the degree to which they currently do. Thus, pro-big-government statists who correctly think these things through would be anti-bitcoin. But that *does* take some vision, and is a long-term thing that's perhaps not on the radar of a politician constantly focusing on near-term election cycles.

Then, please, feel free to pay those taxes for yourself. Just don't try to make everyone else join you.

Every you post about this reads like it's from the hip. I could write a book called "Demon Summoning Cancer Babies for Jesus" and it would have more credibility than anything written by a politician.

I don't get why you are looking for friends in Washington. At the end of the day, there are none. Look to this community, look to yourself. Find a problem and fix it. Make something better with your own means. That's positive. That benefits the world.

Hiring a politician to point a gun at people to get your way isn't any different just because it's YOUR politician

It's about PR. Politicians (and journalists) need to be educated lest they perceive Bitcoin only in a negative light. Taking a strictly "us against them" viewpoint seems shortsighted.


Doing that is fine, but has limits. If Bitcoin is to grow it needs to enter the mainstream, which includes more moderate political viewpoints. Elizabeth Warren might not be a good fit, but some politicians are open to Bitcoin, like state rep Mark Warden from New Hampshire.