Bitcoin Forum

Just in: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=101902.msg2751536#msg2751536



1. How much money is Satoshi Dice being bought out for? (prior owners+MPEX share holders)

For a total of 155394.05 BTC


2. What is the public share in the buy out and what is the prior owner's (Eric, etc)share in it?

3. Will the TOTAL amount be payed out in BTC or USD or parts parts?

4. WHEN will the money be released? All in one go or in intervals?

Around 12pm UTC today, the 18th of June 2013. Over a period of a few hours in 20 increments.


If it hits exchanges, which ones will be chosen in shadows of current withdrawal issues at MtGox?[/b] (>>>Short on BitStamp via Bitfinex now ;)??

Goodbye, triple digits.

Also, If I trust what I read, it's actually 350k BTC:

who HAS that many coins - very few people in the world.
do they need to buy the coins first? very interesting indeed

Either early miners like Satoshi or knightmb or a conglomerate of people like the Winklevoss, or a company like MtGox/Tibanne.

Why would they be exchanged for dollars? Isn't it far more likely they'll find their way into other BTC denominated assets??

Not all of them need to to depress the price. Even a small fraction would be sufficient. It's summer in the hemisphere that most people inhabit, and I'm sure some people would like a good vacation on a yacht. :D

Just watching the charts... $65 - 104 was 150k BTC rally...

If payout is tomorrow, I pressume they have already acquired those Bitcoins.

so what's left on MPEX? Except MPEX shares? So MPEX is officially a Ponzi now?  ???

What if the buyer is an established casino firm that wanted to get into the Bitcoin game? If that's the case, then they would've been accumulating beforehand and have been responsible for some of the buying pressure. This would now be gone, along with 350k coins released on the market.

I smell blood.

Cross posted reply to Erik "Business As Usual - What, are you mad?" Voorhees:

Well, thank you Erik for showing once and for all you're just a profit-chaser - you don't care about bitcoin, well, only enough to get your money out of it.

As I understand it - and please, feel free to add your crocodile tears here - you're going to DUMP a shitload of BTC on the market in general, to "shareholders" that will no doubt seek to "cash out" in droves. In a short time period, no less.

"I know some of you will be upset"

Yes, I am upset - first for your wholesale abuse of the blockchain, and now, for not only continuing your abomination but now trampling all over the BTC market in your urge to scratch that profit itch.

Will someone please hire Erik so he stops this pattern of wholesale dickery? What the hell is the next business enterprise, monetizing desperate immigrants? I can only sit and wonder, since I don't have the obvious lack of social acuity you display in your business schemes.

Just 'effing unbelievable....looks like we got "DICED" again.

Jumping to conclusions much?

Why would s.dice holders receiving modest payouts dump their dividends all at once?

They're not releasing all BTC126k to one person you know.

"The sky is falling, the sky is falling!"
^ THIS is far more likely to depress the price, and it's YOUR fault.  Judging by this thread, you guys probably know that well.

*edited for auto-incorrect

There are 100 million shares, so it's 350k BTC, and they're to be released tomorrow within a few hours:


The sky isn't falling, the sun is exploding and it's consuming the earth. Goodbye.

edit: Nvm, I read you wrong. Of course they won't dump their dividends all at once. Just a fraction.

What if you're making shit up?

Seriously, you love these scare stories, don't you?

I smell bearshit.

he said that mpex shareholders are being paid more than private investors. he also mentioned total he is getting from the sale so he's not going to be adding an extra 20000 coins out of his own pocket

OK PPL, PLS LETS GET SOME FACTS STRAIGHT HERE BEFORE WE GO ON!

I will add those in the top post for easy visibility:

1. How much money is Satoshi Dice being bought out for? (prior owners+MPEX share holders)

2. What is the public share in the buy out and what is the prior owner's (Eric, etc)share in it?

3. Will the TOTAL amount be payed out in BTC or USD or parts parts?

4. WHEN will the money be released? All in one go or in intervals?

I think those are pretty clear from his post. All BTC, and on the time:

"This letter is being posted roughly 24 hours prior to the payout, at which point MPEX holders will receive .0035 BTC per share plus the small additional amounts mentioned above. MPEX will then de-list the asset and the S.DICE MPEX Agreement will be satisfied. The payout will occur in roughly 20 increments over a period of several hours and will arrive in S.DICE holders’ accounts (in the same manner as dividends). All passthrough operators are responsible for their own assets and customers, obviously."

Yes, thx. I edited your citations into my OP.

I don't know what's so complicated about question 1.

126 315/0.00126315=100 000 000

100 000 000*0.0035=350 000 000

350k BTC.

Im not sure whether you interpret Eric's statement right;
there are 100M shares.
EACH share is valued @ 0.00126315 BTC
100M*0.00126315 BTC=126315 BTC

So this is the maximum sum of BTCs to be released in this trade.

ONLY MPEX holders will be paid an additional .00223685 BTC per share bringing the total to 0.0035 BTC per MPEX share.
This bonus has to come out of other share's pockets. Not sure how the shares on Havelock investment are treated or if Eric pays this extra out of his part of the deal but I guess the new owners wont pay double the price Eric stated the shares are worth.

If this deal hits mainstream news, I bet that will raise a lot of eyebrows from investors (seeing that they missed this huge opportunity).

I think the number you want is:

13 000 000 x 0.0035 = 45 500
87 000 000 x 0.00126315 = 109 894.05

For a total of 155 394.05

That sounds right, actually. Does anyone know how many of those particulare shares there are?

edit: Thanks CHM, looks like 13 million then.

But what about when, in the past, you said price was driven by miners desperate to sell, not by investors accumulating? Doesn't this mean we can get our time machine out of the closet and cancel out Blitz because the past Blitz is not saying the same as present Blitz? Is this the title of new movie Back to the Blitz: Timezone Accumulatrix? The new Blitz paradigm- more economy always drops price because BTC receiver is by nature as desperate to sell as a miner- Buyers of BTC only exist when they've bought something off someone desperate to exchange it to USD.

Erik is taking a pretty decent hit. But the end result is the other investors have been treated very well. At the end of the day Erik is making a pretty penny off the entire thing.

>>> The payout will occur in roughly 20 increments over a period of several hours <<<

Here's a crazy idea:

If they don't already have that many coins together, what if they were to buy between the increments, thereby keeping their cost down and the price generally stable?

There are only MPEX shares.

The operators of pass throughs on the various exchanges all hold MPEX shares.

On a different note, if the new SD owners had to purchase BTC to buy this, does that explain the recent rise back near 100?

yeaaahh, no. If they would (which is a clever idea anyway), they would have to have a deal with the exchanges in advance (prob. MtGox) to raise their withdraw threshold up to 155k BTC/day. Dont know what the current threshold is for Trusted accounts?

Also:

"Hey everyone, we are going to buy 120k+ BTCs, please don't jack up the price, mkay?"

 :D

No release on the new buyer or info my reply went unanswered so it will be interesting to see who is the new player in the gambling game
Out of left field

(Well I had suspicions on Havelock activity but that was a legit trade with bad timing EH being offline for nearly a month however was something noticeable but still it caught me by surprise personally)

Not technically but they might need to finally give in and start getting AM shares
Heck mpex has money they could just fold and give their remaining offerings to the other exchanges

How did you ever become a mod?

Hmmm.....

1. Those coins to buy SD are already bought.

2. Those coins will be bought tomorrow.

3. Current holders invest in other assets.

4. Current holders sell their coins.


Well.. 2 3 uber positive, 1 negative and 1 neutral.. I call that quite positive news. ;)

Edit:

5. Giant media attention incoming.

Compared to the last mod of this subforum, Blitz is an angel from heaven.

I think you are confusing the words "angel" and "troll"

Hehe, fair enough. Troll from heaven.

He is doing that to prevent some angry shareholder from coming after him, no real choice. I wouldn't say investors were treated fairly though. Pretty much every one of them comes out having wasted their time and money. Vorhees is the only one who benefitted from this endeavor.

Not true. From an investor's point of view I do not think it is very reasonable to use the BTC as numeraire due to its lack of capital pools and incredible volatility. Pretty much anyone who bought between April 2012 and March 2013 who have held for the long-term have had tremendous returns using the USD as numeraire.

Ummm......if an established casino firm was serious enough about bitcoin to buy SD, that would be INCREDIBLY bullish for bitcoin. Missing the forest for the trees, man.

126k btc for Satoshi Dice?  Well done, nice sale.

I remember visiting Satoshi Dice around two years ago when it was still a pretty plain site.  Now... "The Ghost of Satoshi will roll the dice".  LOL!  Well done to whoever wrote that gem.  Anyone who is influenced by that into parting with their bitcoins deserves to gamble them away.

WTF, does this make good business sense???

126,315 BTC

That's $11 million dollars at the current rate..,

What is the turnover of Satoshi dice?

That sound's ludicrous, think I could make a much better investment with 11 Mil

All this discussion about a major casino etc. is all bullshit until more info is released...if we ever find out anything about the "new" owner.
I'm still not convinced that he sold it for that much, it may be just a play to privatize the business.

2005, flickr, a profitless website, just 13 months old, sold for $ 35 Million
2006, Twitter, a profitless website with less than 5000 users, just 3 months old, sold for $ 5 Million
2006, YouTube, a profitless website that consisted mainly of copyright violating content, just 18 months old, sold for $ 1.65 Billion

I think I could have made a much better investment with $ 1.65 Billion.

 

It's not all great though. People that bought in March 2013 have payed around 40 million USD for the company, while it was only sold for 30 million USD (mpex shares) when it was announced. That's a loss of -30% in just a few months.

It must hurt even more for those that sold their shares for market price the past months. You can't hardly blame them not to hold for the long term since Erik showed signs of serious neglect towards the business and turnover (in USD) was stagnating and even taking a serious nosedive this month of July. They sold mostly around 20 million USD, taking a loss of -50% in USD from the high in March and a loss of -33% compared to the price payed today.

Considering around 5 millions shares have been sold in the month right before the buyout the above category of people who have USD loss is likely larger than presented here. 

Even though Erik negotiated a very good price for mpex holders, this company had much more potential.

Why is this site worth so much?
Completely easy to replicate.
Are bitcoiners so degenerate in their gambling?
It's not even poker.

The sky isn't falling - price is.

Keep convincing yourself that this action is coincidence, rationalization is a powerful thing.

As usual, excellent analysis. Thanks.

Thank you Pale, really appreciate that :)

Watch as its all an elaborate ruse and then I laugh.

Why are the bitcoins used to buy the site worth so much?
Completely easy to replicate.

Think about this too much, and you can ask the same of most companies. AOL was worth $350 *Billion* dollars to Time Warner? Huffington Post was worth $315 Million to AOL? Just as much nonsense.

You've never studied business or accounting have you? Google 'goodwill'.

Unless your Abu ^_^

so............ is the price going to jump? I read some people say that the buy of this huge amount of BTC will accrue within a few hours... Then again, I read some people say that the BTCs for the buyout were already bought...

So... which is it?! :)

likely the coins were already bought/steadily accumulated

Second one price will jump where ever the bitcoins go

<smirk/>

They couldnt possibly buy everything up now, because there are not enough BTCs on MtGox's order book to satisfy the demand (135k BTC!). There are currently jus under 120k BTC in ASK orders on the book.

who is the buyer!!!!  ???

That is speculation they don't plan on telling us for a while

Smart observation!

Turns out it was MtGox!

Heres the Press Release:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=258649.0

Thinking about it, I don't see SD investors being the same type of people that push walls around. Rather, more long term oriented people for the most part

 ;D

A suiting image

If anything this will just attract more development into things only bitcoin can allow, like provably fair on-the-blockchain gambling.

probably

I'm not very familiar with SD earnings, but does it make financial sense that it has been bought for this much?

Surely that much money you could build a superior product and out market SD, and still have a lot of change left over.

i'm convinced the only reason why SD was so successful in the first place was because it was the first BTC non-mining business anyone could buy in for a part of the profits

This deal is probably fair.

Only Eric Vorhees knows the secret ;)

That's exactly what I was thinking... holy crap that's a lot of BTC...

No takebacks ;D

Truly an amazing amount of money...

This. They could have put an Ad on the Superbowl, Stanley Cup, World Series, and NBA Finals


edit: and possibly even my signature space

Not to much loot, in the long run. Current SD's profits are at 74k btc and there is still a month to go for a full year. Imagine SD all dressed up and marketed right. Maybe the new owner did a decent return on buying cheap shares through straw men, before the deal was pulled off? At least somebody did, that popping volume weeks and days before the announcement is too obvious. Nothing to proof, sure. This is a wild free playground that benefits the bright fellows.

I bought 9 shares(900 mpex ones) in havelock the day prior to the announcement, not a great amount of money but a good deal, considering I received more than 1.5 times what I paid for them.

I's interested in who bought this. May be MSFT can change sentiment (they are down >8% in pre-market trading).

We're in the speculation thread and noone claimed Satoshi to be the buyer? For him the price must be a peanut, and as long he's not able to cash out his heavy btc-amount without disturbing the system, the bought of SD must be the funniest thing to do with it.

I can't wait to hear who's the buyer! But maybe we will never know ...

All my hopes are going to Sid Mayer or Boris Becker.

Somebody said it already, saying that he hated that the site carried his name and spammed the blockchain :P

Is there any proof the shares have been payed out yet? By that I dont mean the statement on MPEX, but actual Bitcoins in the wallets of share owners.

Is anyone here a shareholder?

I think it is more likely EV bought it off himself to get rid of the shareholders burden. It was probably nothing but a headache. So he was able to borrow their capital and give them a little pittance, then return it. Cheap loan. Win win.

OK, even if thats true, how large was his share in the shares (get it?) and have any share holders been payed yet?

/facepalm

I am (was) a shareholder.


All MPEX shareholders have been paid, as of around 7:30pm (PST) or so last night. Pass-through fund holders, such as those through Havelock, received their payments around 30-45 minutes later, with the exception of those who held SDICE through bitfunder, who won't receive theirs until the 28th, due to DeadTerra being on vacation.

Someone correct me if I got any of that wrong.

Edit: Just to clarify, yes I received BTC from the shares I held, so I can verify that payment was actually made (not just an announcement).

I held shares via coinbr and I've received my funds.

this has to be the biggest BTC denominated deal ever

this is a big milestone, kinda like the 10K BTC pizza


( I got a nice BTC payout form this deal, I was holding a few shares... I actually wish i could've held these shares for longer but i can complain! good deal :D )

My question is, who would bother to buy SD in it's current state? With the MUCH superior clones being released (J-D for sure), SD is starting to fail. Sure, it might be established as an old gambling site, but I wouldn't think that it's a very good investment. Does it bring in profit? Yeah, but not forever.

Utter nonsense.
You pay in BTC, you get BTC as dividends, you get BTC for liquidation... USD isn't part of the equation.

If BTC price appreciated over USD, you would have got the same returns just holding BTC.

So you must compare "just holding BTC" with "holding BTC denominated assets".

I'm puzzled as well.

This.

That's pretty much the bottom line.

It is getting more and more apparent to me he sold it to himself, there is just no logic in paying $12 mill for that site.

Probably to his company somewhere else...

hey I'm not telling   :D