Bitcoin Forum

The $129 version, unfortunately:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102946&cm_re=5830-_-14-102-946-_-Product

EDIT: feel free to tow; didn't see thread in Hardware subforum. 

I wonder how long they will last?  Has miner demand finally turned around?

100+ in stock.

Yup mentioned this in the other 5830 thread, picked 3 of these work horses.

Buy buy buy...

You shouldn't buy these. At 129 it isn't worth it because when you calculate the megahash per dollar you get 2.325. You might as well go for a 5850 in staid of that because its ratio is 2.424.

Is there a particular 5850 you can link to that is in stock with price so we can verify this math?

Amazon ships in 2-4 weeks. lol.

I dont know of a place where you can buy them currently but the price on newegg is 165(http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161332) it isn't unreasonable to reach 400 megahash on a 5850. 400/165=2.424.
A 5830 can reasonably produce 300 megahash.
300/130=2.307 (looks like in my original calculation I went with 129 and forgot the 99 cents)

That's the math behind those numbers. If you cant wait for good opportunities to arise you will lose money.

edit: the ratio for an amazon 5850 would be 2.482

It's very easy to get 320 out of a 5830 with latest drivers, 1.5 Phoenix and 3% hack.
320/130=2.46

Right now, there are some in stock. I could buy them. But I am not.

Right now, the BTC is $13.50, and there's no (rational) reason to believe it's going up any time soon.

The payoff period for $129.99 + $7.56 shipping is 79 days at the current difficulty, which is about to go up in 1.3 days (sure, not a huge leap, but it WILL shave off some earnings).

So 82 or 83 days to payoff -- sorry, but that's too risky for me.

I know some people are critical of me on here. But I'm putting my money where my mouth is. I don't want to competing with hundreds of other miners to unload 5830's at fire sale prices in a month or two.

You know what scares me the most about Bitcoin?

The fact that every 2016 blocks (about 11 days), 100,800 new BTC are minted. That means that, to maintain the CURRENT price of $13.50, we'd need $1,360,000 of NEW MONEY entering the system every 11 days.  Considering that Bitcoin isn't *that* convenient, popular, or necessary for day-to-day life yet -- and the Mainstream Media seems to have declared war on it -- I see the market correcting even further until it hits an equilibrium -- which unfortunately we be lower.

What does that mean for my rigs? Well, I'll be making less from them. Hopefully something will happen to increase BTC demand -- because that's the ONLY thing that's going to raise BTC prices long-term. BTC can't rise in price from a bunch of speculators buying & selling -- if anything, the price would go down from attrition (as Mt. Gox & Tradehill -- "the house" if you will -- take their cuts)

Just my .02 BTC.

Matthew

Oh, I forgot to mention --

I looked at eBay -- the COMPLETED LISTINGS -- and it looks like the going rate at eBay is coming down.
Selling for $140 with free shipping -- and you can't ship a 5830 for less than $8.

Let's see...$129.99 plus $7.56 shipping, then I have to ship it to somebody -- I wouldn't be making anything.

So I don't want it for mining (83 day payoff), nor to resell on eBay.

Never thought I'd be passing up a 5830 like this -- I'll admit, it takes some getting used to. My brain is almost hard-wired to snatch up these things. By my reason has to override my emotions -- things are different now.

If you don't operate by reason, you're a fool. And we all know "a fool and his money are soon parted".

Unless BTC shoots up to $18 or $20 in a few days, I made the right decision.

Matthew

That's assuming that all BTC is being sold. I don't have any solid stats, but I'd assume that a lot of people are hoarding coins rather than cashing them in every 11 days.

But, you still have a point, even thought it might not be as bad as you think.

Believe me, I've been doing a lot of deep thinking about Bitcoin and its fundamentals.

For example, as more and more people mine, the difficulty goes up. What it basically does is slice the pie into smaller and smaller pieces -- the pie stays the same size.

But which situation is more likely to result in a higher % of BTC being sold immediately:

1000 miners getting the BTC produced in a given week

OR

2000 miners


I'd say 2000 miners. It's a smaller piece for each, but statistically you're more likely to get more of them sold, since the smaller miners (newcomers, etc.) gotta pay off that $160 card that bought on eBay ;)  Just kidding -- but you get what I mean.

If the same money went to a smaller group of miners, it would be more likely that a great number of BTC would be hoarded.

Matthew

Complete BS. Two of these will eat a single 6970 alive in terms of hashing power @ lower price tag. I would get two instead of buying a single 6970. It doesn't apply to everybody though since I have dual PCI-E on my old P5E board.

I'm confused... you bash him for comparing MH/$ ratio of 5830 to 5850, then continue to compare 5830 to other cards over their MH/$ value...  ???

I was just going for simple numbers but the person below is getting 423 megahash with his 5850. 423/161=2.62
Its still a better card and I didn't even get into the lower power consumption or the megahash per total cost of server which does make it a even better card.


edit:
You do realize I never recommended getting a 6970? The only two cards I believe are worth buying are the 5830($109) and the 5850 at the 160 mark. If you can find a card for less then retail and it beats these ratios then by all means get it but at the lowest retail price the 5850 and the 5830 are the best.

What I'm trying to say is this card is better than a 6970 pricewise and performancewise. With that being said, obviously there's no need to compare it with 5850 since 6970 is better than a 5850.

see above I edited my post.

If some one can supply that I would too though the highest I've ever heard any one get is around 330 megahash with a 5830.
330/130=2.538
2.538 is still less then 2.62

That's probably without latest optimizations...

In order to tie the 5850 you would need to get 340.6 megahash out of your 5830 I highly doubt some one has reached this with a 5830. If they got the full 3% which I don't think they would have 330*1.03=339.9 which is still less. There's also the possibility that this 5850 record didn't include the 3% increase.

I just noticed you said that and I don't know where you did your numbers but acording to newegg the cheepest 6970 is $335(http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161356)

I checked on mining hardware comparison(https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mining_hardware_comparison) the highest noted megahash for a 6970 is 423 while a 5850 on that same site is 392. A 5850 costs 161 while a 6970 is 335.
335/161 = 2.08

That means you can get two 5850's for the price of one 6970.
6970 megahash=423
5850 megahash=392*2=784
423<784

Then if you want to look at power consumption(https://spreadsheets.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AsSwOT3E1XTGdGtpa1BQcmJLN2x6TG1MRmxzb29BeFE&hl=en_US&authkey=COWC8toK#gid=0)
A 6970 gets 1.472 megahash per jule while a 5850 gets 1.818.
1.472<1.818

So please do some research before you try and say statements such as that.

You realize the 5850 you linked isn't in stock right? So... not exactly a comparison with an instock card.

Not to mention you're linking ONE card that is labelled "5800". The usual run of the mill 5850 gets nowhere near 400MHash/sec, even on water that's hard. To say you can consistently get 380 out of 5850s would be a stretch.

The 5830s are available, and they're close to the top in terms of $/MHash, so if you're going to get a card, this would probably be it (though the power consumption is an issue of course). If you argue against getting a 5830 then you argue against getting any other card basically.

Outta curiosity, what's the diff between the two 5830s?

Obviously one of them is price but is there a diff in performance?

Card 1, $129.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102946&cm_re=radeon_5830-_-14-102-946-_-Product

Card 2, 109.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102878&cm_re=radeon_5830-_-14-102-878-_-Product

no difference

Just bought 20.

I don't need to do some research because I have 3x6970s, 4x5850s and 4x5830s all currently mining for me. I just "don't" read research, I based it from my experience.

Next time buy the product and post the facts based on your experience.

 

Good luck with that.

Bitcoin just dipped again last night, now it's playing with $12.

Supply is up so we can just wait for it to level down and expect another major bump. Hah! 30$ / BTC again (daydreaming)

I'll daydream with you...

Hey $30 BTC sounds great to me, too!

But then I'll make sure to come back to reality before I get out my wallet or visit NewEgg.com  ;)

My point was that you should wait for the best card you can purchase.

If this is true then it changes things. I was going with hard facts I found on the web. I also get top megahash per sec out of my 5830's (320) without watercooling and it runs around 68c so I assumed it would be fairly easy to reach this mark.

I'm not saying the 5830's aren't the top in terms of megahash per dollar but you should still pay for only the most efficient cards you can get. Why pay 130 for the same card that comes in stock at 110 every couple of days?



My question to you is why do you have 3 servers with 3 different cards? If you knew you were going invest heavily into bitcoins I would think you would pick the best card you could so you saved yourself the most money possible.

Also basing it off experience is like saying I know this works trust me. Basing it off research is like saying here are some articles that list bench marks you can figure out for yourself what the best card is.

Quit doubting, negative Nancy (24/7, I just had to restart the miner trying to get a screenshot, the system is unusable at aggression=12):

http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff99/qubez1/5830-345mhash.jpg

At what temperature....for how long did you run at this level?  Our 5830's run ~308mh/s @70C (never get above 75C)...more frequent crashes happen at anything above that, to me the couple extra Mh/s is not worth the time/gas of resetting multiple times a day.  An extra 160mh/s per rig would be great but not worth the issues in our case.

Well, there you have it... 345/130 = 2.65
Anyway, all this was started because it was proposed that at $130 5830 is no good.  Obviously that's not the case...

Are we gonna put this to rest, or continue with non-productive arguments?

24/7? See quote above.

This is the exact card referred to in this thread, the $129 Sapphire -2L variant. It has a different PCB than other 5830s, and has no overvoltage control from Trixx, so this is at the stock voltage.

I have other 5830s that max out at 1030 and 990, so this one is just a rare overclocker. The low temperature is with 200mm fan in the side of the case blowing straight down on the card, card fan at 100%, in a room that has outside air going through it.

With this new proof yes the 5830 at 130 is better than a 5850 at megahash per dollar. I still believe you should wait to purchase it at 110 because you gain nothing for purchasing it at 20 dollars more.

I call bullshit...55C with that overclock...whatever.

I do agree that 110 is better than 130! :)

Uhm, every couple of days? Not sure where you are getting that from, search the forums for the last time that the $110 sapphires went in stock. Was weeks ago. And I'd be willing to bet you will basically never see them in stock again. The $130s are here, they will be in stock for a while, when they are gone they will likely be near to the end of the 58xx retail batches. That's why I don't care about the 5850s you linked, because they're not ever coming back. Same with the sapphire 5850 extremes, they were good buys, but they're gone, so they're irrelevant.

I'm not actually advocating buying these, because with the increase in difficulty, the decrease in price per bitcoin, and the lack of resalability once the bitcoin craze dies down, these cards will likely be big losers, BUT if you are looking to buy a card, they are near to the top of the heap for mining, so there's really no reason not to grab them.

You clearly don't know how to search...

June 30th
http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=24858.0

June 28th
http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=23889.0

June 16th
http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=17991.0

June 13th
http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=16368.0


In 23 days there have been 4 times where the 5830 at 110 has been available. And you say its been weeks more like 5 days.....

When averaged that's once every 5 and a half days.

edit: July first was mentioned so that would make the average 4.6 days

Please add July 1st to the list! :)

I was able to snatch 2 of them at 110 on the first.

While the $110 one is def a good deal and there is an advatage to the $130 one that has been pointed out several times and that is the direct support of trixx in that it has further ability to mess with voltage and clocks on it. Also, that it is easier to snag up if you are unable to ninja the very few $110 when they pop in periodicly.

also, we are lacking a good price point for the 5850... the $164 dollar one has been out of stock for who knows how long and the only other ones I could find any stock on as of a check June 20, 21 and again July 4th were priced at $221-$286 on Shark and Amazon. Also noting the current Amzon ones do not state direct stock but suggest there is none with a 2-4 week until shipped note on them.

Well, its at 67C degrees now (computer room is 85F after hot day), if that makes you happy, with 2300 accepted shares since I restarted the miner trying to make screenshots.