Bitcoin Forum

  Many of you will have noticed the sudden gains in prosperity. the reason for it may not be the best...
We are experiencing another wave of scammers and eager amateurs.

Cold Calling, advertising, luring people onto their insecure websites and systems.
this is bringing in people to our environment, but they are bound to get a very bad experience...

It's time to step up now... Many of the systems we have, have stood the test of time.
When we first set them up we did not intend to scam but to provide safe heavens for Bitcoin enthusiasts.
These new players in our ecosystem... may be just more stupid scammers, we should prepare for the victims yet to be...This is because of our prosperity, we should help.

All people who are involved in established systems, must begin to advertise, it is imperative...

The volatility we are experiencing is coming from people being drawn into the crypotocurrency market without knowing anything about investing.


Here is my current tl:dr Cryptocurrency assessment:
 We are creating value, so much value that by merely existing the cryptcurrency market has created 10 trillion dollars of value and has added 10's of trillions more in value by allowing internet access of all sorts of assets across the world. Cryptocurrency will triple the global market by 2024.



The Bitcoin network has value, it's value is based on how it improves efficiencies in comparison to the current Banking system:
We clear out transactions every 10 minutes... the traditional network can take 2 weeks or even months to transfer money physically from one location to another; this is why there are different currencies in the world... it's easier to transfer money if it's just a change of moneys.

This is not the only value of the network, the companies, products, people, services, that use Bitcoin; They all generate value for the bitcoin environment, even gaining efficiencies creates value for measurement. providing data to asses and predict economic movement is important.

And remember the cryptocurrency market is one market... as separate as we may be... they were created by the same team to test out hundreds of technologies... the rise of all these currencies was no accident.
Our total value of all cryptocurrency is the value of the telecommunication of secure value and ownership... of which 60% of the world are not part of.

We will bank the unbanked and release 100's of trillions of dollars in value globally...

We are automating, business, government, charity, everything. Our technology changes everything, the value that all these institutions have... we will have, there is a sea change coming and I hope you have the sense to save your fellow human beings from losing out.


You must remember why we built the Bitcoin network: It was to change the world, to try out new technologies, to see what is truly possible and above all we are in a fight Vs Evil to save the world, We will prevail.

Where did you get those 10 trillions from?
The entire market cap is below 800 billiosn and market cap means nothing.
Imagine somebody trying to cash out 100k BTC , the market cap will be down to 100 billions, if it will hold ..

And what other 10 trillions of value? To what????And cryptos will triple the global market By 2024?
What global market?
Let's say you have stocks in mind, triple of what we have today it would mean another 40 trillions.
If that happens by 2024 then we're heading indeed to the bubble of all bubbles.


You know.... this is not quite the right time to post this.
Because what you say and what happens now in reality is a loooot different.

With the continued popularity of cryptocurrency markets, a lot of MLM and fraudsters are beginning to involve cryptocurrencies, so we should be more cautious.

The Blockchain network replaces everything... and I do mean everything.
How much is Mastercard/Visa/American Express, etc worth? What is their market cap? How big is their network and what services do they provide?
How big is the cash flow of all these companies? not what they own, but how much are they responsible for?
What about the banks how much money do they manage?
Add it all together and you have the amount the blockchain network can handle and have throttle to spare.


The Economy...
It is the movement of dreams... and this dream has been deprived for billions of human beings, this is unacceptable.
They have needs and desires that must be fulfilled, how do we reach out to them?

 With Commerce, these peoples will be joined together by technology and an exchange network, facilitating all sorts of possibilities.
People just don't see it yet, they still are so fixated on the price, they don't see the bigger opportunity awaiting them, everywhere, if this is done.
In time these emerging economies will develop products ideal for their regions, who will facilitate these entrepreneurs?
 We will, with cryptocurrency... our network will be the first one there, that's how.

Real Value, developing in real time.

Hmmmm... I've reassessed what you have asked me: Let's say you have stocks in mind, triple of what we have today it would mean another 40 trillions.

The technology required for the uplifting of billions of people will generate 2 trillion dollars in value alone... annually...




That money has to travel man, that's why they have armored vehicles so they shuffle that cash around... it's horrible.
how much power do you think those diesel engines are using?
How many people need to be employed to deliver all that cash?

I have my reasoning, even if I do not clarify myself.

but the bigger problem is the scammers and shoddy quality work showing up, things need to change, for the better to evolve into something that is amazing,
 and I'm worried this will make what our detractors have been saying all along that this is a den of scammers, thieves, con artists... well are we?
no of course not, but shit we are going to have a hard time proving it once these fools are through.

Scammers were always there in the online market. Before crypto currency came in to existence, people used to earn online using various methods like affiliate marketing, forex trading and ponzi market. We used to have a lot of online forums like DreamTeamMoney, MoneyEarningForum, MoneyMakerGroup and TalkGold. These forums used to function using ponzi money. Ponzi market was always a scam market. Now with the rise of crypto currency, ponzi market came to a standstill as crypto market provided a lot of good opportunities to them to earn a good amount of money. So this is not a surprise that a lot of previous scammers from ponzi market have joined the crypto ride and trying their old tricks of scamming people in a new format. I am sure a lot of them have started ICO instead of opening up another ponzi website.

That is where a forum like bitcoinTalk came handy because it is one of the biggest communities around the world about the crypto currency. Experience people in online field will have a better intuition while choosing a program, we just need to be cautious. Scammers will always be around, but we need to just filter it out from our way. That's it!

Well it's expected that when we have a period of time such as the one that'll come soon, scam ICOs and all joke projects will disappear. They'll be replaced by those that actually matter and all will be well  :D

I agree

Yes, but I think it is time to setup a metric system to evaluate these new systems/businesses/etc

I am thinking of using the network itself against them... :)

We can evaluate absolute truth through data and metrics if we can discern absolute truth isn't it obvious we should advertise it?
We use the Blockchain to evalute these metrics and establish relevant data for people to know any new business or coin that emerges.

Comparing the market cap of bitcoin with the stock value of a company or the  turnover it has.
Noob mistake



Let me tell you this dream of your...
Socialist bullshit
The block chain will not make make everyone rich, will not make everybody in India own a Mercedes (produced in this century) and won't grow 10 times more potatoes from a square acre.
The blockchain won't turn illiterate starving Africans into CEOs.
What bitcoin does right now is making the gap larger, wider and deeper.



Well, with 40$ of gas you can drive that car for a tour of the city.
And that's the amount you have to pay for a simple tx.
That car holds money for thousands of atm withdrawals.

I thought that we were already moving on from blockchain techniques.

yes you are right, with the technology of bitcoin and blockchain it seems we can fight them, because the technology provided by blockchain is the encryption technology and the results of the cipher can be seen by anyone but very difficult to break.

it becomes tiring to have to check 10 times the site on which we are, check 10 times the address on which we send ...

With the bitcoin being a decentralized making it hard or you could practically say impossible to traced the transactions whether it is legal or illegal it is no wonder to all of us that many persons who are capable of doing such things are will take advantage of having this benefits making their transaction hidden from the government.

Yes.Bitcoin being a new market,it seems to be an easy target for scammers to scam the unknown people.They easily scam the unknown people by promising them to give huge returns and ask them to invest bitcoins in their company or just ask them to provide their private key and just run away once getting access to their wallets.

Yeah I know, but you know how I love to see what the blockchain tech can do.
A hybrid solution taking advantage of what each method can do, would work.

As an initial thought: We use ssl type certificates to establish businesses, we can send that in the transaction and know our money is going to the right business at least.
these certificates could be put right on the blockchain easily.

for unreliable startups? not sure yet. I've seen some other threads discussing, an escrow pooling system to defend against runs, like what happened to the DAC.


Agreed, even if it takes 10 seconds to verify... that's time wasted, should be instant. some aspects should get automated, they are common tasks after all.

And you're claiming that based on what evidence? Any research being done in the field?
I could say that all this volatility is coming from North Korea. Kim is buying BTC in secret because it's his new weapon of mass destruction aimed at financial markets. When Kim dumps the whole world is going to feel it.


What's the point of this thread? People have always been targeted by various criminals. The more money there is the greater the incentive to claim it for ourselves. Cryptocurrencies are not an exception.

https://www.coindesk.com/icos-tech-standards/ This is my reasoning: the technology has solved some problems of trust, but others have been left open, this article mirrors what I'm thinking.

well duh, have  you been watching the news lately? do you think all this activity is coming from angel investors putting in billions of dollars? Do you think it's idiot millionaire investors doing this?
Bitcoin was designed to do this on purpose... 21 million coins trying to service 100 million people? What do you think is going to happen... the fucking thing is going to go ape shit.

We need this analysis, to be able to assess what works, this isn't a call to reel in innovation, but to develop best practices according to group consensus.

This is what this thread is about: To be smart about how things are deployed , while maintaining the open exploratory nature of the technology.

yes, since scammer are everywhere they try also trying to look opportunity to gain or victimize people who want to earn fast or people who doesn't have enough knowledge on the process of bitcoin and other crypto currency,,,,, or they are not yet equip enough with the strategies and some techniques, scam often happen to people who are rushing to gain...but doesn't have enough awareness on trading.

Ok. Make it clear. Who are "we" in the thread?
Bitcoin investors? Cryptocurrency investors? Forum users? Or maybe those who invest in ICOs?
I agree that a lot of ICOs are scams, but I thought we were talking about bitcoin holders becoming a target of scammers. Go back to 2012 or 2013 and read some threads. There were scams and inexperienced users back then and there are now. How many experienced traders were on the market in 2013? 10%? 20%? IMO this hasn't changed much in the last 4 years.
You're ruling out angel investors and millionaires, but recently we could read the news about Peter Thiel spending 15-20 million USD on it. Even Jamie Dimon's daughter is investing in it. It's unwise to think that BTC is growing because newbies are buying. They are just a part of the crowd, like in any other investment. How much of google shares do you think is owned by millionaires?

I usually refer to the royal "we". Everyone and everything, thinking at every level, and thinking smart and clear sighted about how things are working, to show our understanding of the blockchain ecosystem.

point taken...hmmm but the market has increased; where are these investors coming from then?

https://www.jbs.cam.ac.uk/fileadmin/user_upload/research/centres/alternative-finance/downloads/2017-global-cryptocurrency-benchmarking-study.pdf

Unfortunately, I can't access that site as it shows in my browser as insecure.
As for the question, I believe they are coming from all levels of society. For instance, I have been chatting with a number of exchange users on different forums, exchange shoutboxes and so on. They represent all levels and backgrounds really. Some are poor kids or students who have no clue about what they're getting into, some are rich kids who borrowed money from their parents to make a quick buck to sell and buy themselves a new car, and some are experienced traders who switched from forex because cryptos are much easier to trade (according to them).

You don't see it do you? I feel obliged to reply to this and explain my position for the sake of enhancing this thread.

By the mere act of living these people are buying, selling, creating, analyzing, learning, teaching, etc This is economic activity that justifies the position of countless stocks.
These stocks do not have arbitrary value, they must match the economic inputs and outputs with actual physical and mental resources, time and complexity within a vast global logistics train.
When these people are meeting their needs they are driving this massive co-ordinated global effort; funding the growth of rubber trees for shoe soles, extraction of excess lithium from oil and gas wells for batteries, driving up power consumption  to fund power generation upgrades, driving up demand for exotic foods grown in green houses, increasing the demand for entertainment globally.
Don't you think these people know what they are doing? That they have ideas and businesses worth investing in that they have toiled, sweat blood and tears for years to develop successfully?

You see this as socialist; I see this as business.

The Blockchain changes everything, let me paint you a picture.