Bitcoin Forum

If eventually ASICS take over, what to buy apart from the shady Chinese? Where are western ASIC manufacturers? USA, Germany, UK, France, anyone? Where are the competent "men of the West"? Are there any left?

Well there is bitfury.  There was those guys in Europe who turned full scammers, KNC.  There were those guys from Israel, Spondoolies, but they sold out or went out of business or something.  Of course there was BFL, fuckers.

The rest of the world makes money selling there ideas for China which then makes more money selling the products to the rest of the world.

The labor force and materials are a lot cheaper in China than anywhere else in the whole Europe.

Trump will be charging tariffs on a shit ton of Chinese goods. Miners?

If so  things may change and Japanese or Korean asics will rule.

Bitmain doesnt build his own chips. Intel has a foundery business so anyone could contract with them to build ASICs. It comes down to ROI, experience, money, and fore site. The western companies that have the experience and the money dont have the fore site to see the profits are there.

There are shady people everywhere.  Reason why Chinese rule in asics space is because they have deep pocket.  They're able to purchase all the materials at early days (google TSM and you'll know why).  Us Americans are not risk takers but we do like to bitch and moan afterwards that other countries have "stole" our ideas...

As for trading wars....We as American will suffer the most out of this (no more 99 cents store and we will pay more for everything now and also soybean milk will be very cheap soon) :)   It's time to stock up zip ties and electrical tapes before we have to pay more :)

They actually bought their chips from TSM.  Bitmain paid premium for them to make chips before apple/samsung...DEEEP POCKETS

First of all, what do you see around you that is not made in China? Probably you'll find some stuff made in Vietnam, Indonesia and other countries but most of everything is made in China. Mostly cost driven.

But as for miners there is another big reason, legal framework. You establish your company in China and your miners are late, they break, you don't honor your warranty, good luck for people trying to sue you. If you are based in the US and your miner comes out in a different shade of silver, you get your ass sued to hell.

Exactly this is what bothers me the most - idea of giving hundreds of $$ to someone far far away in a country with no customer protection whatsoever. Also, when it comes to more expensive stuff, i sure as hell would not buy (for instance) Chinese car over US or Euro one.

this is what we said about Japanese cars back in the 70-80's.   I said the same thing about Korean cars in the 90s and now they're everywhere!

I do not find it right to split it as east and west, because it has to be a global market, but there is a monopolization in China, I do not support it either

If you can't beat them....learn from them and beat them at their game.

Let's all gather our money and start bite-main and make them go under :)

SWEDEN, NORWAY, GERMANY, USA , JAPAN should start developing and release to public. These countries they build quality products why not miners.
Everyone is tired from Chinese overpriced garbage miners ....

when Taoisms meet Confucianism you have two of the most powerful helps in the world to achieve anything... specially when applied under the words of the khan : you lie, you die.

You are right about that one and i might`ve gone a bit too far. I was really surprised that no other country (except maybe Russia, i don`t know who manufactures Baikals) produces pro mining gear. C`mon, not even Japan?

You could say this about anything really.  Impossible to buy a GPU or x86 CPU from a non-American company.  Impossible to buy a TV from an American company, etc. That said, the reason you see so many weird electronics and cheap stuff is because all of the manufacturing is done there.  If you are Chinese you already speak the language, know how business works, and have close proximity to the factories.  If you are trying to start something like this from scratch in the USA you are dealing with factories that are a 15 hour plane ride away and a business environment that is different.  This makes starting a venture like this more risky.  Not to mention the risk of cryptocurrency value when you do bring a product to market.  Just look at the Obelisk.  I doubt those guys are idiots or are unsavy, but from a simple concept it has taken them a year to get a product made.  I imagine if someone wanted to start an ASIC company now, they would be looking at the same time frame.

There are few active and legit ASIC hardware manufacturers in Europe area, but not too many..

Bitfury
http://bitfury.com/ (http://bitfury.com/)

Hotmine
https://hotmine.io/ (https://hotmine.io/)

RMC (Sunrise and Pantech miners)
https://rmc.one/ (https://rmc.one/)


There are two guys in the USA, GekkoScience (sidehack) and FutureBit (jstefanop).

GekkoScience
http://www.gekkoscience.com/ (http://www.gekkoscience.com/)
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1651958.0 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1651958.0)

FutureBit
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2125643.0 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2125643.0)

Because if company outside China make asics someone in bitmain will reverse engineer it and thanks to low work force they are cheaper to produce,so any company investing milions in research and development will go to waste