Bitcoin Forum

I know Tails have Electrum added as default, but is there any other Operating system with a default wallet added to the software? There are
so many Linux based implementations, but none of them seem to have a default crypto currency wallet built in by default. Should we not
approach these developers and ask if this can be added as a default option? <Out of the box?>

Too many newbies are scammed with "scam" wallets and "phishing" scams and a verified and tested wallet that are approved by the OS, will reduce these scams.

This will be a great opportunity for people to get introduced to Crypto currencies, when they install these operating systems.  ???

Honestly, not everyone wants to use cryptocurrency. There is no point of putting a wallet into an OS which normal users use. They won't be interested in opening it and would probably be treated as a bloatware.

Putting programs that isn't necessary just opens up possible attack vectors and complicate things.

Maybe in future we may have these kind of features in the operating systems,but now the crypto users are very low when compared to the world population,so we the operating system developers may not think about these feauteres on their system.But I don't think it is necessary now because the wallet like electrum is very easy to download just a small file.

Knoppix has it too. Both are LIVE CDs, they're meant to be complete and ready to use.
Most Linux distributions have several wallets in their software repository, I installed Bitcoin Core with just a few clicks.

No. It has enough pre-installed software that I never use. That's what package managers are for.

Not that I suggest it but there is also BitKey with focus on security (being air-gapped): https://bitkey.io/

Well, even if they think it will be bloatware or not, it still adds a opportunity for some developers to push their software. People are just lazy by nature, so they will not go the extra mile to install something to test it. A built in wallet will also give it a bit more legitimacy, because the wide variety of choices is confusing and some are even scams.

If we can get a tested and verified wallet to be the "default" wallet, we will be reducing Crypto currency loses on "scam" wallets that are being tested by new users.

That's what the software repository is for: only verified software is added. Once it's in there, I assume it's safe to install (if I can't trust my software repository, I can't trust my OS).
I won't upgrade my wallets until my Linux distribution tells me to.

For about 1 second... until the scammers simply start distributing Linux images with scam wallets built in that users don't even bother checking digital signatures of because "it was included with the OS so must be safe, right?"

Personally, I feel like this is a "Bad Idea"™... You're forcing other users to download something they may not want/use which increases bloat in distribution images... and it creates another possible attack vector because, as you yourself state, "People are just lazy by nature"...

Developers choose what operating systems they build for, and usually only pick the most highly used and safe ones. The OS market is much larger than the crypto market, and always will be. I think the best system is to let there be major operating systems, and then have the best cryptocurrencies develop great wallets software for those operating systems.

I agree with your statement that it is definetely a bad idea to include infrequently used software into an OS image.

But i think it is definetely less probable for an attacker to distribute linux images with malicious wallets.
1) I think people who do know how to install/use a linux distribution won't just download any unknown distribution just because it has a wallet included.
2) If an attacker would upload a malicious distribution, he probably won't just install a scam wallet, but will open a backdoor for full control.

Ok, this is also acceptable. How many people actually know about the software repositories? I was pretty impressed when I installed Tails for the first time and when I booted and found that it had a built-in Bitcoin wallet. You could add a feature to disable it during the install procedure, if you do not want a bloated OS. <Specifically for the people who wants to use it, by booting from a single DVD or a small memory stick>

I am just saying, give the newbies a first introduction to Crypto currencies by providing them with a scam free wallet.  ::) <Their first experience should be a good one>

That's why you check the signature of your ISO download.

I'm hoping the answer is everybody! It's one of the best things of using open source software:
http://i63.tinypic.com/2mow9hi.png
(now compare this to the hassle of installing commercial software that requires your credit card and long serial numbers)

I'm not familiar with Tails, and my assumption was you used a LIVE CD. I didn't expect it to be installed.

On the other hand, I can imagine a clueless newbie running it from a LIVE CD, and losing his wallet the moment he turns off his PC.

The people in my country is not interested in any different O.S let alone discover cryptocurrency they used to utilizing windows 7 or later and haven't thought about changing and I really doubt they know that there's a different O.S other than windows.
I used Parrot Sec O.S (https://www.parrotsec.org/) debian distro before and it has a built in Electrum wallet you can use it before installing to the system like any other linux distro in my experience I didn't have any problem while using it in cases of signing and sending.

This also puts a lot of trust into the OS. How do you know the OS is supplying you a correct version of the software (and not one slightly modified to benefit the creators?)

it is linux, it is flexible so you should be able to install it anyway you want as long as you know what you are doing :)
but in this context i believe "install" means installing it on a USB stick which can basically be the same as burning it on a Disk but with the option to add persistence if you wanted to and make some files permanent. but the focus of this distro is on NOT having any sort of permanent storage and everything is discarded.

Tell me: what alternative is there? Of course you need to trust your OS, and Linux distributions in general have quite a good track record.

You don't. But you rely on the fact that many others people use it too, and some people actually check things.

"Internet of Things". With several products and Home and Kitchen Appliances that connect the internet directly, I do not see any nonsense in starting to create OSs that already have some wallet to be used in a fast, practical and safe way. I believe that eventually, this will be a pattern in some products. And with the practicality and the huge number of Linux distros, it's even more practical to have some who are willing to place secure wallets, preferably open-source wallets.

Imagine the impact that we would have if Microsoft decided to make a wallet available in the next office package, it would be something extraordinary. I found it curious the amount of rejection of so many people on this topic to something like that.

Tails allows you to configure a persistence volume, to store the data that you want to keep. I like Tails, because you can basically boot from a clean OS, every time. This is one reason why I want the wallet to be integrated into the OS. It just adds to the value of booting with a clean OS, if you do not have to re-install secondary Apps.  ;)

Your comments still adds value to this discussion, so thank you for that. I just feel, the OS should be a one-stop shop for everything you need. <When I still sold computers, people got mad when they had to pay extra for Microsoft Office, because they wanted a out-of-the-box solution>

I am just saying, give them a out-of-the-box option with a basic wallet that are trusted and tested by a legitimate company and things will be more secure for the newbies. <These OS companies buy smaller companies every day, why not a wallet provider with good code?>

There's no way in hell I'm going to send Bitcoins to a wallet on my fridge or toaster! The security on those things is terrible (example: How a fish tank helped hack a casino (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/innovations/wp/2017/07/21/how-a-fish-tank-helped-hack-a-casino/)).

Isn't MS Office the one with so many exploits people have been warned for years not to open any unknown documents? No thanks!


All Linux distributions allow you to do this.
What makes Tails special is this:
If I'm fully paranoid, I wouldn't want to run it from a USB stick, with the risk of any data being stored on there. A single-write DVD would be safer, but less convenient.

I use either Knoppix or Ubuntu when I need that, but I admit that choice is mainly based on the fact that I'm familiar with them already.

I don't think this will protect clueless Newbies from dumb mistakes, or from attackers.

Even better: add a free open source wallet. But I wouldn't like being force to use the OS' choice of wallet, and it will quickly be outdated. Imagine using a LIVE CD with a critical vulnerability in Electrum!

You mean like Tails?^[1] ::)


[1] They finally upgraded "Electrum from 2.7.9 to 3.0.6." in Tails 3.6 that was released March 13th (https://tails.boum.org/news/version_3.6/index.en.html)... Electrum v3.0.6 was actually released over a month prior to that and the big security flaw in Electrum was actually publicised on January 6th (https://github.com/spesmilo/electrum-docs/blob/master/cve.rst)... with the "fix" verion v3.0.5 being released around Jan 7th/8th... just over 2 months prior to the Tails 3.6 release :o

Another question is wether this is somehow important?
As far as i know tails is designed to stay offline. If this is correct and people use tails how it is supposed to be used, i can't seem to find an attack vector which makes use of the found vulnerability.

This, of course, is no excuse for using an old (unpatched) version. But this still does not expose one to a higher risk.

If you can think of any attack vector which might exploit this vulnerability (in any way), i'd be happy being enlighten.

sorry it is incorrect.
Tails is a linux distribution focusing on privacy. it has Tor for anonymity and is set up in a way to redirect all the traffic through it and prevent anything else. it also is design in a way to store nothing anywhere including your hard disk (no persistence) and memory (it flushes it completely when you are done).

the "stay offline" thing was BitKey https://bitkey.io/

Ok, I concede that this might be a problem with zero day releases of a new update to a wallet. I should hope that developers of OS distributions would take that into consideration and include that timeously into new releases. Let's be honest, how frequently are new critical exploits being discovered, compared to the new releases of these OS?

I would much rather include a wallet that are secure <most of the time>, than allowing newbies to experiment on wallets that are dodgy and even scams.  ???