Bitcoin Forum

China has more of everything or soon will have and that includes Bitcoin.

They also don't like to advertise that much and hide their true holdings in Gold in particular.

Official Gold 1,000 tons..Estimate of actual Gold 7,000 tons

http://dailyreckoning.com/how-much-gold-does-china-have/

so how many bitcoins do they now have?

to start the ball rolling.  I suggest 15% of 2013 bitcoins mined then start adding


As of Nov 20 China has 14.9% of nodes

http://getaddr.bitnodes.io/

http://getaddr.bitnodes.io/188/china/

Can anyone make an estimate?

Several million? Or maybe just 1 million? no clue really :P

China has a lot of everything haha.

China also has the largest country population, 1.2 billion I think!

And they have trillions upon trillions in cash reserves

I think China will be No.4 in terms of BTC maket cap, after the US, EU and Russia.

Well, considering bitcoins are more expensive in china than any other country, there's a good chance the demand there is very large.  Who knows, could be that soon China has more BTC than any other country... What would that do to the price though?

More of everything , doesn't mean all the good stuff , they have also lots of bad stuff , and more than the whole planet combined.
Also , china =/= chinese people =/= chinese goverment

Also nodes mean....nothing
Lot's of people having 100+ BTC and not running a node. Lots of newbies running bitcoinqt for the first time and not owning a single satoshi but still running a node.

maybe today no 4 but in 2014 they will be no 1 or 2.

chinese are very familiar with digital currency (qq coin etc). i guess its a great country for btc/ltc

Doubt total ownership in China is yet that high

But they are gonna be massive players long term, unquestionably

not in the cawk department

I guess being there are more people over there, there would be more of these things there.

Whenever they visit Vegas they literally buy everything in sight. They have a LOT of new money. It makes sense though since the whole world has given it to them haha.

That's not hard to do when the people paying you back just keep printing more of it for you

Its impossible to say :/ but think its a lot more than we think ...

The chinese are smarter than that. The majority of it is government bonds and what not.

1 International reserves China #1 by a long way

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2188rank.html

http://www.gfmag.com/component/content/article/119-economic-data/12374-international-reserves-by-countryhtml.html#axzz2lLbOI5sQ

2 Cars /autos

China was #2 in 2010 but now probably #1

According to Ward's, the United States has the largest fleet of motor vehicles in the world, with 239.8 million by 2010

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_vehicle

but 2012 figures

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-02-01/china-vehicle-population-hits-240-million-as-smog-engulfs-cities.html

China Vehicle Population Hits 240 Million

3 Appliances

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/med_hou_wit_tel-media-households-with-television

example  Tv's in  2002 china had 87% of households ..USA had 98% of households but as China has 5 x more households the number of tvs is more ( same goes for refrigerators etc)

4 Economic indicators

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/china/indicators

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/united-states/indicators

5 Savings 7 Trillion $

http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/292513-chinese-household-savings-surge-to-50-percent/

USA 5.35 Trillion

http://forecasts.org/economic-indicator/personal-savings.htm

6 Gold..covered above ( 7,000 tons estimate of true holdings)

7 Luxury goods

http://www.mckinsey.com/insights/marketing_sales/tapping_chinas_luxury-goods_market

20% plus of WORLD market by 2015

8 Diamonds

http://www.bain.com/about/press/press-releases/bain-2012-global-diamond-report.aspx

and so it goes on..and on and on.

Whatever you define as something of value they are #1 owners or soon will be

On the other side they have 160Million BELOW the official poverty line but the yearly reduction on this number is HIGH with a probable 0 million in 5-10 yrs

You left out French wines. Typically most of the batches of Petrus and Château Lafite Rothschild wines end up in China as they are now an investment, since a good year will multiply in value. I imported a case of Château Calon-Ségur to Canada that would have been worth 3x what I paid for it if I didn't drink it all lol

My apologies LOL

http://www.gallus-group.com/DesktopDefault.aspx/tabid-327/488_read-1003


China:

Chinese wine industry: China is in 7th position in the ranking of wine manufacturing countries. The Chinese wine industry has entered a high-speed growth phase in recent years. The international financial crisis in 2008 did not have a severe impact on the Chinese wine industry. In 2008, Chinese wine production totalled 698 million litres, a 5% increase over 2007. In 2009, Chinese wine production amounted to 960 million litres, rising by 37.5% YOY.

The concentration of the Chinese wine industry is much higher than that of the beer and liquor industries. The sales volumes of Changyu, Great Wall and Dynasty account for over 40% of the Chinese wine market. Today, China has more than 60 thousand hectares of wine grapes.

Wine belongs to the fast moving consumer goods market. Competition in the Chinese wine market concentrates on market capacity and sales channels rather than product function, attributes and technology. Sales channels have become the key success factor for competition. Wine consumption in China mainly falls into two categories – restaurants/hotels and retail channels such as shops and supermarkets. According to statistics, restaurants and hotels have a share of more than 50% of the Chinese wine market, while the share of retail channels is less than 50%. Among these retail channels, supermarkets and general merchandise stores account for more than 50%, while convenience stores, exclusive stores, independent food stores, etc. make up the remainder.


http://www.ibtimes.com/chinese-wine-consumption-all-time-high-no-global-shortage-expected-1451582

http://business.time.com/2013/10/31/how-china-became-the-wine-worlds-most-unlikely-superpower/

Unless you are in the market for super-premium or collectible bottles, where Chinese investors do dominate says Veseth, there isn’t actually much to fear from China

Read more: China Grows as a Wine Superpower

Well ,
List of countries by vehicles per capita
111    China   85
3    United States   797

Yes the per capita issue :)  If you realize the per capita is a ratio to POPULATION and that China pop is so much larger than USA and everyone else then simple maths show that the actual TOTAL number is higher even though the per capita is lower as in the TV example above

Cars are neck and neck and production in China is double so very soon ( if not already) they will be no 1 in TOTAL autos owned  ( but still lower in per capita)

China:

Exchange	|	Volume %	|	Volume ฿
btcchina	|	62.02%	|	82371.97

America:

Exchange	|	Volume %	|	Volume ฿
btce	|	43.93%	|	32543.84

Statistics are coming from BitcoinAverage.

You know , China has more cars than the Netherlands , does this mean the dutch are a third world country
Also , China has more highways than Germany , and Germany will never be able to compete , those poor Germans and their dirt roads
Also , if you took your time , to go to this
http://www.tradingeconomics.com/china/indicators

Please let me know how the balance of trade looks , for China and Germany.

Definitely not. Netherlands is VERY wealthy for its size and even compared to far larger countries  Quality of life and social safety nets are far better than most countries ( probably top 10 or 20, I got married there and lived for 2 yrs in Rotterdam 1979-81) unless of course things have greatly changed for the worse which I doubt. Germany is also unquestionably wealthy, probably no 1 in TOTAL wealth in Europe

So you realize , that India might beat China on this numbers pretty soon  at the rate their population grows , while there are still thousands of people starving from hunger and dog bites in that country.

This is a possibility and maybe one of the reasons ,after Governments realization, that China is relaxing its 1 child policy with a probable eventual aim ( in small steps) of removing all restrictions. At which point female baby clothes manufacturers/ retailers will BOOM in China :)

I don't know if you have ever been to China , but judging by the air there and all the pollution , I doubt most of them will be able to make the second child.

Please let me know how the balance of trade looks , for China and Germany.

http://epp.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/cache/ITY_PUBLIC/6-18092012-AP/EN/6-18092012-AP-EN.PDF

Germany only Member State with a trade surplus with China
Among the
EU27
Member States,
Germany
(34 bn euro or 47% of EU exports) was by far the largest exporter to
China
in the first six months of 2012, followed by
France
(8 bn or 11%) and the
United Kingdom
(6 bn or 8%).
Germany
(30 bn or 21% of EU imports) was also
the largest importer, followed by the
Netherlands
2
(26 bn or
18%),
the
United Kingdom
(19 bn or 14%),
Italy
and
France
(both 13 bn or 9%

Balance of trade :

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/china/balance-of-trade

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/germany/balance-of-trade

China recorded a trade surplus of 311.07 USD Hundred Million in October of 2013

Germany recorded a trade surplus of 20.40 EUR Billion in September of 2013

80 mils germans vs "the country that makes everything in the world".

Yes been there (mainland)  and was in Macau last August where you can see the wealth from mainland being splashed around.

In the unlikely event they need help in procreating I will offer my services as I have 9 kids :)

Germany doing a great job. Not belittling their achievements. Due to its size and population China still has more of most things.

Yeah , it's due to it's size , nothing more.


I don't wish for this  , but in a case of a poor agricultural year , Buddha helps China.
Because the one who afford 10$ for a bread will be the ones safe. And that ain't the average Chinese.
You country could be the most powerful in the world or the richest , it doesn't help a growling stomach.

Wow people are hating on china here... lol... if it wasn't for the chinese, we would not have cheap shoes:D

Actually I had a talked about this a few weeks ago in a store and it seemed all the shoes there (all types of them) were made in Bangladesh actually.
The same misconception applies to pc parts , lots of them made in Malaysia or Philippines Taiwan etc.
Don't worry , once the Chinese demand a wage increase most factories will move to the next cheap labor country.

China is still cheap but not as much as before and the excess labor supply is not expected to vanish until 2020-2025.

http://chinalabourmarket.com/china-will-maintain-labor-cost-advantage-in-foreseeable-future.html

Xu said that the cost advantage of China’s low-end labor force will not disappear in the short run because: First, the average salary of U.S. manufacturing workers is much higher than that of Chinese workers and this phenomenon will remain for a long time. Second, there is surplus labor force in rural areas waiting for employment. Third, it is not easy and needs lots of money for transnational corporations to relocate their factories to another country.

The International Monetary Fund estimated that although the supply of China’s surplus labor force is dropping, it will completely be consumed away in sometime between 2020 and 2025.

“Chinese workers have certain comparative advantage because they have a wage level higher than the workers of Vietnam and Laos but lower than that in Taiwan, Hong Kong, South Korea, Singapore, Brazil and other countries and regions,” Zhang said.

For Americas Mexico is cheapest and Europe Poland Hungary and lithuania.

http://www.scdigest.com/assets/newsviews/13-04-11-1.php?cid=6923

http://epp.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/statistics_explained/index.php?title=File:Table1_Average_Gross_annual_Earnings_in_the_business_economy_%28full-time_employees%29,_2008-2011.png&filetimestamp=20130619135352

The hourly rate is not the only factor which affects production costs but that's another topic. China is still cheap but getting more expensive obviously there are some items that are less suitable to be manufactured in China but so many do have a cost advantage for now.. Production cannot however be transferred quickly so it will take some years to alter the balance. Meanwhile China is already anticipating that and starting to move to promote more of a  consumption based economy.

IMF overview

http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/fandd/2013/06/das.htm

That said they will still probably gobble up most (60% +?) of all Bitcoins which is what this thread is meant to be about before it got sidetracked :)

You can't buy whats not for sale :D