Title: I think I got robbed for 0.0005 bitcoins and why it may matter for the future. Post by: Skybuck on December 01, 2013, 10:25:03 AM Hello,
I think the robbery went down as follows: 1. I was testing bitcoin at the time to see if it can handle the minimum ammount which was something like 0.00000001. 2. I set the transaction fee to 0. (At least I think so ? Can I go back in time in the blockchain and see if a transaction fee was offered or not by me ?) 3. I send the minimum ammount to myself, to a new bitcoin address. 4. The transaction was accepted and confirmed and is now part of the blockchain however: 0.0005 bitcoins were deducted from the account where I sent it from, so that transaction now says: -0.0005 (also the client doesn't even show the 0.00000001 maybe it gets rounded or so in the gui, also the client crashes was trying to catch up to latest blocks I will restart that later on). So apperently somebody accepted the transaction but still charged transaction fees ? Is this allowed ? The issue at hand is: If in the future people want to make small little bitcoin transactions and they set the transaction fee to 0 they might be fooled into believing it's free, while in reality they get "robbed" like this ?! ;) :) So either I did something wrong ? Or bitcoin robbed me ! =D (Another possibility could be that the little transaction was getting through for free and maybe I set the transaction fee to 0.0005 ? I don't think I would do that but I simply can't remember so... there ya go 3 possibilities.) Bye, Skybuck. Title: Re: I think I got robbed for 0.0005 bitcoins and why it may matter for the future. Post by: Remember remember the 5th of November on December 01, 2013, 10:37:40 AM Transaction ID to verify this? Also, it's not possible to set the fee to 0 on the client, not without some "hacks" anyway. Bitcoin used to support 1 satoshi transactions, but they were dust amounts, so the minimum amount you can send is 5430(or 54k?) satoshis I think.
Also, miners CANNOT charge you a fee. You are the one who willingly provides it, or you agree with the client to provide the necessary fee. Title: Re: I think I got robbed for 0.0005 bitcoins and why it may matter for the future. Post by: gmaxwell on December 01, 2013, 10:43:04 AM It also always prompts and asks in the GUI if it needs to provide a fee to satisify the network rules, and in current software the fee required to satisfy the rules for dust transactions is 0.0001BTC/kb, so 0.0005 sounds surprising unless the transaction was build from a lot of dust or done with an old version of the software.
Title: Re: I think I got robbed for 0.0005 bitcoins and why it may matter for the future. Post by: Rluner on December 01, 2013, 10:44:51 AM Transaction ID to verify this? Agree with the above quote; to look further into this incident you must provide the Transaction ID. Then all will be explained. Title: Re: I think I got robbed for 0.0005 bitcoins and why it may matter for the future. Post by: Skybuck on December 01, 2013, 11:08:02 AM Transaction ID, (I wrote about this years ago, so privacy was already gone back then ;))
https://blockchain.info/nl/tx/12451e79632533ee082d304b09658a1da9be1cfb00797ba8bd99acd5423269eb Title: Re: I think I got robbed for 0.0005 bitcoins and why it may matter for the future. Post by: inkadnb on December 01, 2013, 11:12:10 AM Doesn't make sense, you have a remaining balance, why would you get robbed for a low amount when there's more in that address?
You sure it wasn't a change address? Title: Re: I think I got robbed for 0.0005 bitcoins and why it may matter for the future. Post by: Skybuck on December 01, 2013, 11:25:47 AM It also always prompts and asks in the GUI if it needs to provide a fee to satisify the network rules, and in current software the fee required to satisfy the rules for dust transactions is 0.0001BTC/kb, so 0.0005 sounds surprising unless the transaction was build from a lot of dust or done with an old version of the software. I have two older versions of the software still on my harddisk, one of them was used: bitcoin-0.4.0-win32 bitcoin-0.5.0rc7-win32 Today I installed a new version: bitcoin-0.8.5-win32 I just started up one of the older versions: 0.4.0-beta. It's actually better for displaying the ammounts, it shows all 8 decimal places behind the comma. I think what happened is the following: Perhaps I got confused by the text in options, maybe I didn't read or understand it right it says: "Optional transaction fee per kB etc". The new client still says this. Perhaps I believed the 0 in that field indicates that no transaction costs will be charged, so for a newby maybe this mislead me believing that it was free. How can a newb have any idea what this field is about ??? I still find it a bit weird to this day ;) Also why 0 transaction fees (still) not allowed ? weird. I also find it a bit weird that no miner is present... if people want to play the lottery why stop them ? Title: Re: I think I got robbed for 0.0005 bitcoins and why it may matter for the future. Post by: Skybuck on December 01, 2013, 11:29:31 AM Doesn't make sense, you have a remaining balance, why would you get robbed for a low amount when there's more in that address? You sure it wasn't a change address? As far as I remember I did not want to pay any transaction fees, there is an option in the bitcoin client that says: "transaction fee: 0". Apperently that's some optional transaction fee ? I don't understand how that would be collected or why it would matter ? I guess it has something to do with many many destinations or so or perhaps comments for the transaction... really weird. So I believed I could do free small transactions and then somehow bitcoin send 0.001 btc ? then 0.0005 was taken away as transaction costs, and 0.0005 was returned or so ? or just 0.00000001 ? You guys suppose to figure out what happened not me :) So what does it look like to you ? Title: Re: I think I got robbed for 0.0005 bitcoins and why it may matter for the future. Post by: grue on December 01, 2013, 04:59:23 PM Doesn't make sense, you have a remaining balance, why would you get robbed for a low amount when there's more in that address? You sure it wasn't a change address? As far as I remember I did not want to pay any transaction fees, there is an option in the bitcoin client that says: "transaction fee: 0". Apperently that's some optional transaction fee ? I don't understand how that would be collected or why it would matter ? I guess it has something to do with many many destinations or so or perhaps comments for the transaction... really weird. So I believed I could do free small transactions and then somehow bitcoin send 0.001 btc ? then 0.0005 was taken away as transaction costs, and 0.0005 was returned or so ? or just 0.00000001 ? You guys suppose to figure out what happened not me :) So what does it look like to you ? also, bitcoin transactions were never supposed to be free. Title: Re: I think I got robbed for 0.0005 bitcoins and why it may matter for the future. Post by: Barek on December 03, 2013, 01:27:15 PM If you're using bitcoin-qt, you could try out Armory. It adds another layer of security and usability and gives you more control over the transactions.
Edit: As others have already mentioned, you payed 0.0005 fee. |