Bitcoin Forum

I have heard that selling bitcoins on Ebay using paypal is very risky. I have recently listed several small amount bitcoin sellings on Ebay and indeed received some scammers. Fortunately for me, paypal blocked most of them before I even received the money :P

I am wondering if it is a good idea to have a blacklist somewhere that we can check if a buyer is a scammer. Most sellers on ebay won't sell their coins to new ebayers and user with bad reputation. So creating a scamming account will be time consuming if we can have a such list so that every seller can have a check before sending the coin. Ideas? ???

The blacklist is simple. All!
It's been said a lot of times before.
Don't use PP or E-bay.

DO NOT SELL CRYPTO ON EBAY OR USE PAYPAL

Sorry for the all-caps, but form personal experience, don't.  You are not covered by eBay or Paypal should you in the likely event, get scammed.  In their TOS digital items are not covered by seller protection.

Ebay


Although they let them slide, you are not covered by seller protection.

Paypal


I have had chargebacks earlier this year through people buying Bitcoin through compromised accounts.   So even if the buyer has committed gross negligence by not securing their account.  It is your fault when someone logs in to it and buys your item.  Stay away from it altogether!

I think instead of working hard for one name here and there (which won't work most of time),

JUST change your SYSTEM for selling bitcoin on ebay.

The whole problem stems from ebay's requirement/need for proof of physical delivery of a physical good. Some sellers have overcome this by selling a cute related nick nack that offers a free bonus of X number of bitcoin - once the items shows as delivered, then send the bitcoin. This way the buyer can NOT (successfully) claim non receipt and ask for refund.  
iow ebay and paypal protection plan will side with you instead of them.

You could use bitcoin-otc (http://bitcoin-otc.com/) to find trustworthy buyers.
Of course there is no guarantee but it is better then to sell to a complete unknown party.

Having a blacklist wont really help. Scammers just move on and steal or create new accounts. Try send paper wallets with recorded delivery to only verified paypal accounts if you must sell on ebay.

Sellers of cryptos should be really careful on ebay, the scammers reverse the PayPal payment !

Bitcoin-otc is not the the easiest way to find a "friendly" seller of BTC.
Anyways, about scammers they can be everywhere and a while-list (not just a blacklist) should be more efficient , somewhere on this website, in my opinion. 

Paypal typicall takes no stance for the buyer or the seller when dealing in virtual goods. So money is transferred, nothing happens. Problem is that buyer will use a compromised account to buy it and sellers will take advantage of the fact that paypal won't reverse the money because the item was virtual.

Sellers however will get their account locked and money frozen after too many complaints.

I know this because I've designed and created a ton of websites and software around Paypals payment solution with regard to virtual goods.

ebay allow people sell cryptocoins only if you send them in usb pendrive lol

They don't even have to use a compromised account. All they have to do is tell them they didn't authorise the transaction and they usually get their money back. Paypal really need to get their act together.


Or Paper wallets. They're cheaper and easier.

Seems like there should be a way to do business through PP. If someone could set up a trusted user website or something.

Doesn't matter. It's Paypal that's the problem. Hopefully they'll adapt their terms towards cryptos and/or ebay will implement their own crypto market/exchange.

It's unfortunate that it's so easy for both the buyer and seller to scam of eBay, because for beginners it's one of the only ways to get decent amounts of BTC.

There are like 100 of these threads. Don't try it. It looks too good to be true because it is.

Seriously guys, if you want to trade BTC don't do Paypal

I don't know why anyone thinks it's a good idea to sell BTC (or any virtual currency for that matter) on Ebay.  Or using Paypal for that matter, which is even worse.  Can anyone give a good reason to not use established marketplaces?

If you really want to sell independently you'd be better off selling for cash at a flea-market or something like that.

Some of us are legit ebay sellers with long positive sales histories...
And selling on ebay is our only job because we want to be self employed and not be someone elses b!&*#.

Selling as you say in the regular established way, I assume you mean brick and mortar store, if you don't have a bankroll for a lease to open a store or even want to be out of the house for 60-80 hours a week at an indoor flea market and the regular flea market theres these things called seasons, and the very real danger of being robbed at gunpoint, because in the physical world the people who have guns and intend to use them to rob and or kill you or follow you to your house, look for sellers with lots of cash!!! So I'll take a few bucks missing at the end of the week, anyday of the week, and twice on sunday to be anonymously stacking coins and paying rent...

Just saying don't do it is what I think people with regular day jobs or btc millionaire early adopters say as a cop out...
It's like saying abtinence works...

Yeah o.k. just look up bitcoin on e-Bay and you'll see 1500+ active auctions and buy it now listings.

We need to band together to get friggin paypal to change...
I've actually made a few hundred bucks clear this week (not a kings ransom but I'm surviving) and out of the 100 plus listings that went just fine... you guessed it... Bam... unauthorized charge held for XXX...

Rule #1 for selling on ebay keep it small...

I almost had my ass handed to me til paypal actually blocked a transaction for 1,000 Feathercoins for $750 a few weeks ago that an account hacker almost got from me. Since then I've limited my auctions to $5 worth of coins or so...

Rule #2 Well the buyer has all positive feedback? They may just be on the surface... Read through your perspective buyers feedback (Before sending coins) to see if they have any negative positives, regularly buy cryptos, and that theres no major gaps in feedback dates. If at least 2 of these 3 things to look for aren't met consider it a red flag for a hacked account or a scammer. But use your own judgement...

Rule #3 You do not talk about fight club...

I digress... If I had just followed my second rule I wouldn't be out $12.50.
Lessons in the real world aren't cheap, good ones cost even more...
It's the cost of doing business, now that's fairly cheap for the several hundred clear profit, I just figure like any business 1-3% for fraud...

So......

First for the blacklist is......

daynalada

Got me for 150 Goldcoin from 3 buy it nows and if I'd seen the feedback someone else got hit the same day and left a negative pos feedback stating SCAMMER... The feedback I left was a litte more harsh...

I forgot, to add legitimacy to a claim, one must not remain anonymous.

My name Is Kenny, My ebay user ID is 1975tgh.

Please, by all means, if you sell on ebay, feel free to copy and paste any ideas I have in my listings and incorporate them into your own listings.
Have a penny leave a penny... Feel free to message me there if you have thoughts to share with me as well...
 
Like Mike Wolfe and Frank Fritz say... Spread the love, but make a buck or two!

You can always sell on here or on localbitcoins, but obviously you're not going to get the inflated premium prices people pay on ebay. Yeah, ebay/paypal needs to get their act together and change their system, but until they do the risk of being scammed is the risk you take.

I actually have to earn a living. This isn't a hobby for me, so selling to make a few bucks a week like most sellers do doesn't work.
You hit the nail on the head local BITCOINS...
I sell alt currencies, those don't sell to people who know how to buy and trade bitcoins for them now do they?
Inflated? yeah theyre called ebay listing paypal payment and final value fees which amount to about 17.5% of my gross revs then theres the 5-9% I pay over World average from the guy I buy My BTC from.
Then theres about a 0.5 - 1% pop for withdrawal and trading fees.
What about the wild market fluctuations of late?
How the hell do I rebuy coins to sell for... oh no... a profit?
Evil a-hole I am... when I bought my first bitcoin for 800, the second for 1100, and the third for 1350?  The 60% margin I enjoy when the market is stable for a couple days gets shot.
Then the coins I sold for 50 cents each pop in a week to $3...
I list the coins I pay $5 total for for $9.99 I make a whole $3 after fees...
Out of that I have to rebuy the coins and usually at higher prices than the last ones I sold. I dont have thousands to play with to buy deep when the markets dip. I have to pay the daily rate of the coins...
So please if you're one one... get off your high horse about inflated prices...
When in the desert you would pay anything for a glass of water.
But I don't gouge people, I do make a fair return for the risk!

I don't know where you got that I was on a high-horse. You obviously feel like you're doing something wrong here. I've seen Dogcoins and Infintecoins go for £100s for a literally worthless amount, so even with fees etc that's still a huge markup.

Nice idea. Would be nice if we put them all together.

I don't think I'm doing jack s&^% wrong I hate seeing people complain about Inflated prices... They are typically on a high horse when they do. Tired of seeing inflated prices? Well, do something about it... Sell your coins at a loss if you're so concerned for the community, put up a buy it now on ebay for what you paid for your coins and see how fast you go bankrupt... ebay will have you owing them 1000 bucks in no time.
Its ebay thats inflated with their partner paypal they take 12.9% WTF!
Why do you think the gas stations 1 block from the freeway charge 10 cents more per gallon than the ones off the highway? Because they are open at 3 a.m. and CONVENIENT!!! And a bottle of friggin filtered water? It's free for all intents and purposes but at 2 bucks a bottle thats over 16 bucks for water!!! Again CONVENIENCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I wasn't complaining, you were. And I'm not tired of seeing Inflated prices. People pay what they're prepared to pay. I don't by my coins from ebay, so it's irrelevant to me. Again, you're complaining about ebay and paypal, yet you're still using it. You can't have it both ways.

Did you see where I said professional ebayer? And how I broke down those costs? I do know what im doing, and how much it costs... And accept the fees. Who's asking for both ways?

BUT...

This is detracting from the main point my good sir...
Selling on ebay has and will continue to grow...
Therefore it is our duty to recognize scammers and put their usernames in one central database so that sellers may update their blocked bidder lists with them. Thats the sum and substance (or should be) as well as tips to make selling on ebay safer for all...
This will not end scamming on ebay, nor does a seatbelt always save lives,
it will however lower the numbers of scams considerably.

Whitelists are better than blacklists. Google everybody you're about to purchase from and try and make sure (to the best of your ability) that they're reputable. If they have some reviews online, if nobody is calling them a scammer, you're not perfectly safe, but you'll have better odds by choosing somebody with a good history.

The point of this post, I thought, was to have a list of known scammer user ids for legitimate ebay sellers to update their blocked bidder lists with...
Re: Blacklist for scammers buying bitcoin and litecoin on Ebay with paypal

There are other threads for bad ebay sellers, who, may in turn, burn good ones, so I guess, those guys need to go into your blocked bidders lists as well... (dammit)

If the accounts were hacked (both ebay and paypal?)
I guess the hack-ee probably wouldn't be buying cryptos anyway...
And I'm sure there are VERY few cases where theres someone smart enough to hack an account but dumb enough to leave the phone number associated with the account intact, and that shows up right on the view sales record page!!!!!!!

Tip #3 for sellers, My wife called paypal today and the rep said to mail a copy of the transaction page printout and to get and upload that tracking number, then you have a fighting chance with paypal.

daynalada

153 Goldcoins scammed from me 1975tgh

http://gld.cryptocoinexplorer.com/address/EF39hhvhSJRLxuG3E2UGLXpW2pZjdnMXty

Then had the balls to message me and thank me for the 150 goldcoins!!!

Posted with sellers permission...
Legit ebay seller Scott a.k.a. i.d. roseyatrid

daynalada stole 35,000 Devcoins:
 
http://darkgamex.ch:2751/address/15Htn5tZWECyBtgKKqJhTLKBdjuXQcCQNm

and mccrearyta stole 10,000 Devcoins:

http://darkgamex.ch:2751/address/1CYP41pUiSvnLVghm2m4SZMdaBF4ZrWKm6

Looks like they got 50k from someone else too...

Heres the feedback daynalada left for others????
Hacked account??? Me thinks not...
http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=daynalada&ftab=FeedbackLeftForOthers

http://www.ebay.com/gds/How-To-Block-An-eBay-Bidder-/10000000012835288/g.html

http://pages.ebay.com/help/sell/manage_bidders_ov.html#block

Forgot to mention you should probably delay feedback for a few days...
Just a thought...

Possible hacked account: georgeia

This is my 1st post

I just got off the phone with eBay and paypal, Who by the way are great, right up until you get ripped off.
I have a 285 positive 100% feedback so they are at least nice to me.

I just want to go on record here on bitcointalk that I have given them an idea to solve the whole problem and make them billions.
All I want is my $250 or my 8 Litecoins back.
It's so easy eBay should give me a job firing people for not thinking of it.
I will do it! "EBay, hire me and I will come in and be the bad guy firing people for not doing their job." I don't have a 'job'. I sell on ebay to stay alive with two kids.
They are rich college grads and they need me to give them this idea I guess.

TWO STEP AUTHENTICATION--
"For the seller, make a buyer requirement like the ones that filter out buyers with low feedback. Have a filter saying buyers must use the Google Authenticator at purchase.
You can also have people set their ebay account to login with the authenticator in the first place. DUUUUH

I know I use ebay all the time and I would not mind one bit logging in and taking 10 seconds to authenticate.
I would also love it if sellers could see that I DID login with the authenticator.
This is a billion dollar idea.

If eBay does not do this then I would be inclined to think they are complicit or at least negligent.
Don't they have billions of dollars and want to make more? I just want to be an honest seller.

Thanks

RW


LTC: LSGUikLw7PMEyt3XH8cHG5yQmqBNBKjeHb
BTC: 1HuTzXhhXHDryDCRPeHDax3mvyh9WYp2MD