Bitcoin Forum

Indian Central bank warnings forced the Largest bitcoin exchange and other exchanges in India to Shutdown:

http://www.thehindu.com/business/Industry/bitcoin-operators-shut-shops-in-india-amid-rbi-warning/article5504407.ece

The Central Bank however "stopped short of issuing a ban"

Personally, i doubt this will affect price much as i believe Indians are not invested in as much as China for example.


*****

Update: Indian government is now RAIDING Bitcoin exchanges

http://www.coindesk.com/indian-authorities-swoop-buysellbitco/

Thanks for the FUD.  Whatever shall we do without all those Indian investors.

Old news.  No one cares. 

its not old, the news is dated today.

China and now India..

36% of the world's population effectively blocked from purchasing bitcoins legally in their countries.

nice FUD

Lol. Keep waiting on those cheap coins.

+1,

Central banks are the root of all evil.

Look guys. Bitcoin is moving forward in America. As long as these other countries try to stop it, its only going to make the demand greater. The rest of the world still envies America and wants to have the American ideal for freedom and prosperity (whether you agree that exists or if its true doesn't matter, only perception matters). So if Bitcoin is killing it in America and other first world countries, then the rest of the world will want it even more.

Can you imagine the demand for Gold if it were banned in India and China? They would be dying to have it.

Prohibition does not work.

It is interesting that the US, in an regulatory way  :'(, is leading the BTC charge! Do we cheer or cry?
I think it will play itself out and make adjustments (e.g. China, India, etc.) as necessary.

Argentina, etc. where are you?

IAS

yes both are large markets for bitcoins and it's unfortunate to see them go that path.

It's already banned in India (gold imports):

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-12-23/almost-every-passenger-flight-dubai-india-was-found-carrying-1-kilo-gold

this is why they need Bitcoin

Yes, there Central bank is raping the people (no lube) with run away inflation.

-The Indian wholesale price index (WPI) rose by 6.46% in September.
-This was largely due to the fact that food prices have increased beyond control.
-Since the start of this year onions have increased by 322%, for example.
-Food prices have increased by an annual rate of 18.4% so far according to data released by the Indian government on Monday this week.

People may have had too high expectations from an authoritarian communist state.

coindesk version:

http://www.coindesk.com/indian-bitcoin-exchanges-suspend-operations-following-rbi-warning/

American idol for freedom and prosperity? Was that a joke?
Nothing against americans, but most of them don't even know what freedom is  ::)
Holding a gun doesn't mean freedom.

You miss my point. America is the world leader. In military and in money. The rest of the world looks to us to make the first move. Its been this way for years. You can argue and shake your head all you want, but today - Dec. 26th 2013, these facts are still true. It is MUCH more bullish for the US to be pro/neutral bitcoin than for China or any other country to be. 

I don't fully agree. Alot of european countries have also officially aknowledged bitcoin as money and have fully accepted it as legal tender.
If Europe and America unite in the adoption of bitcoin, it will have a good chance of being so big the rest of the world cannot ignore it and thus must accept it.
Survival of bitcoin will also depend on how countries adopt the taxing system to bitcoin. If a country fails to collect taxes that country will have no money to support it.

Although not nice I do believe drug countries like Colombia, Afgahnistan, etc. will probably also like bitcoin due to the fact that sending back money transfers after drugs are shipped is easier and near instant. In essence people using illegal substances will support bitcoin aswell.

Repressed countries like China, Korea and probably India will try to keep the power away from the people. I hope they come around or that people take a stand for their rights.

The advisory was issued two days ago and has been all over the Indian press.  Two days is a long time in bitcoin land. 

The world watches American Idol for freedom and prosperity? I don't know about that. There are too many singing shows on television, if you ask me. I'd rather be free to watch something else.

We don't have to imagine.  Gold is banned in India.  That's why they found 24 gold bars in an airplane bathroom worth $1.2m USD.  Some smuggler dumped it when he was afraid of being caught with it.

ITT: We learn why poor, crappy countries remain poor and crappy.  It's not an accident.

Maybe he dumped it by accident, after hiding them up there...

India wasn't buying bitcoins anyway. They have a lot of catch-up to do before bitcoin is even something they need to worry about.

Gold imports are NOT banned in India. The Indians were getting an influx of imports so they put a large tax on gold imports and limited the amount you could carry into the country to 1 KG.

Since the state terrorists are trying to prohibit Bitcoin in India, the download ranking goes up.

http://sourceforge.net/projects/bitcoin/files/stats/map?dates=2013-12-21+to+2013-12-27

Hey guys, looks like Indian Government is now RAIDING Bitcoin exchanges, LMAO:

http://www.coindesk.com/indian-authorities-swoop-buysellbitco/

oh man, i need a time machine right now  ;D

I love the income/house price ratio, really fun all the debt creation...

Gold imports are not free in India might be a better phrasing.

Fuck! that was the only exchange we had.

Looks like finally I'll have to wire my fiat to foreign exchanges  :(

Fuck you RBI

Numbers means nothing It's the purchasing power behind the poeple.
If the price of bread will double next year will see millions starving in china and india. In the us or eu? Probably buying a 107 not 108"  tv.

Wow, the hurt is strong in this one.

This is the same guy who had in a separate India thread was enthusiastic about India fuelling BTC rise based on 3-4 points, none of which was based on reality.

+1

I remember that

People all over the world are barely living paycheck to paycheck, living in tiny homes due to high housing cost even in western nations, food price increases have caused RECORD poverty in western nations. Its no more a case of Americans are rich, Indians and Chinese are poor. This fact is constantly ignored, everyone is having a hard time.

Higher price of food and cost of living will cause more difficulty for everyone in us and eu (not just india and china ) and lower the already low standard of living. No one will be rushing to buy 108" tvs.

Well, he has obviously never been to India
Anyone that has would know they are soooo far from widespread BTC adoption its ridiculous

You know what gets me most ... greedy people hoping that poverty stricken countries will make them wealthy

Yeah , the same is happening in my country , people are supposed to be poorer by the month but yet , with more than 30 hypermarkets in a 2 million city you can barely walk in any of them, and is you don't see a tv in a cart every minute these days you must change your prescription.

Lets not even talk about shopping in the malls as I couldn't even find a parking spot yesterday.

You can't compare what an European thinks is poverty with what a somali thinks of it.

Ps. and I live in a country with 500/month average wage.

OWNED

India and China are not Somalia lol, i've been to both places and if you go to any hypermarket it's the same scene ppl have tvs and electronics in their carts. China has even better infrastructure that most western nations. Remember these tv purchases are mainly based on debt (cc, monthly installments, etc). They also have massive malls in every corner of the city.

What i'm trying to say is that it's easy to imagine US and EU populations enjoying high quality of life with good incomes and able to absorb endless cost of living rises, when it's really not that different compared to many other "developing" nations anymore.

so , you're still insisting that the average Indian with a 200$ wage has more money to  invest in bitcoins than the average European with 1500?
The last famine was not in Europe not the previous one nor the one before.
Hmm , i wonder where they were , something like China ? =))))

It's not the amount of dollar. When I go to somewhere like Thailand or the Philippines my buying power is five times higher than back home. I mean that in the most literal sense, I can get five times as much stuff for my money in other countries than I can in my own. Those "poor" countries with "low" wages get the same percentage ROI on bitcoin as we do. It is exactly as good a deal for them as it is for us. So yes, those among them who have even a little cash to spare will buy bitcoin. And it will raise the price. How much is a different matter, but it is certain to go up over time.

It was a good opportunity for them and had a good chance of succeeding.  Until their government screwed them yet again...  I have friends that live in India...

You obviously don't live where I live.  Even during the height of the depression, Disneyland was absolutely FULL at $139 per person and almost $300 for an annual pass.

And on Black Friday, practically every shopping cart had a 40"+ TV in it.

No, I'm hoping that my friends that work in India can have a way to invest their money now that they can't invest in gold anymore.  I haven't been to India, but I know dozens of Indians that do live there.  At my last company we had Indians come over to work for 3 months in the US so they could understand the Title business better since they don't have that there.  I took many of them to Disneyland on my own dime.  They shared their wedding photos with me and pictures of their offices and we talked about the rising middle class in India, which they were excited about.

From the sounds of this thread, I seem to know more about India than a lot of people on here.

And I wanted them to have early access to bitcoin to maybe have a way of escaping the swirling cesspool of corruption that defines India.  But no such luck, their government prefers power and control over the well-being of their citizens.

Hubby, you forgot to mention that two of our uncles are Indian.  I would like to think we are not discriminatory since we are related to some Indians! ;)

In fact, I am seriously considering going on a trip next fall on my own dime (hopefully funded by BTC) to reach out to women sold into prostitution in India and bring much needed funds for various other things to improve the quality of life.

Why are we called "greedy" for wanting Indians to have the opportunity to have BTC?  It seems like a great opportunity for them, just as it is and has been for us too?

Make your money in BTC and then go start charities in India. That would be awesome. Start now ...
God only knows the downtrodden over there need the help. I have spent quite a while there (about 2 years), and though that by no means makes me an expert, it certainly left some deep impressions.

My comment about greed was not directly aimed at you (BitChick) or your husband. It directed at those who are looking at the next country to 'adopt' BTC in order to inflate the value of their own holdings (and buy Lambo's), not to do anything good with the fiat gains, which, at the end of the day are what people need right now to buy their food, or buy their way out of prostitution as you so rightly say.
Looking for the next crisis as a way to get rich and ignoring the suffering that comes on the other side of it ...

My general impression is that the majority of people on this sub-forum do not care so much for the welfare of others but for sticking one over on governments and getting rich quick. 

If that is not you, my comment does not apply  ;)

Other countries adopting btc makes the people in those countries richer. At the expense of the rest of the world, especially the bigger stakeholders (that would be the west and china). What's so bad about that?

Also fiat governance and socialism is the reason for most of the worlds current problems, so fighting the gov is a worthy goal all its own.

Really ? Remains to be seen ...


Greed and corruption is the root of most of the problems (along with a lack of compassion), not the system itself, which is merely a reflection of the participants. They are individual, human flaws. Far too easy to blame it on fiat and govs and thereby absolve oneself from any responsibility. It's much deeper than that ....

Haha, then they fight you! :D

It is more complicated, but what we need to look at is the current situation and future development given choices we can make now. Let's stick to the question of "poor" countries and money for now or we will be here for another twenty pages.

The facts are this: BTC is rising and seems to continue to do so (don't care to debate this point so please don't). Exchanging fiat to btc means you make money once you cash out at a higher rate. Everyone gets the same percentage ROI. Therefore, no matter how poor, investing money you don't immediately need in BTC, no matter how little, will make you richer. The increased wealth comes from everyone else who buys, in effect transfering money from other people to you.

It's the same with nations. The sooner they buy in, the more they stand to gain once slower nations join in. And everyone except holders of fiat benefit. Therefore, wanting "poor" nations to buy BTC is altruistic. And also greedy at the same time. One does not exclude the other in this case.

That what riles me too. Nerds sitting behind their screens hoping people will hand over money and make them rich.


In the last thread, I couldn't bother replying as you were so out of touch with reality. I wrote you off as another know-it-all kid, but seeing as you have an Indian connection the ignorance is baffling.

The government didn't screw anything - go read up before commenting. RBI is actually doing a good job.


Thats very heart warming - congrats and good luck, especially the issue you raised is a very sad one.


Thats your opinion, biased by your own holdings. You (and us all here) have a stake in BTC and so our opinions get coloured.

And while you may genuinely believe in a constant BTC rise and wish that poorer people also benefit from it, most on here shouting India is the next step have much more selfish motives. You may remember how threads coming up saying India will push Bitcoin now which coincidentally happened when the Chinese dream seemed to be over.

Alright on the purchasing power when it comes to living expenses.
But can you buy a Mercedes five times cheaper in Thailand? Or can you buy a Bitcoin five times cheaper?
NO.
And it's far more likely than an American will buy a BTC right now at the current price than 5 Indians 1/5 of it. :)

Greed is part of human nature.  If we consider greed a problem we are stuck trying to find a solution anywhere near as easy and effective as extinction.

If we are interested in sustainability and quality of life then we best view any system that enables corruption as faulty and take steps to improve the system itself.

This is the philosophy behind Bitcoin at least, which does not attempt to address our problems by attacking/conditioning/educating the corrupt bankers and politicians, but by attacking fiat itself, by providing an alternative that is highly resistant to corruption.

Yes. And not just in Thailand, it goes for most of the rest of the world too. Real estate in my country is 4 times as expensive as in the us. Cars, 4-10 times. Denmark has absolutely ridiculous prices. Which is why our apparent high wages don't account for much. There is very little left once tax (the highest in the world) and basic expenses are paid.

The price of bitcoin doesn't matter for investment. Why is this difficult?

+1,

There's enough satoshi's for everyone, it's all about the appriciation Percentages.

Cost of living is a Global issue affecting everyone, the vast majority of working people live paycheck to paycheck (debt doesnt count). If food prices go up in Europe, people won't absorb the cost their standard of living will go down.

people going to Disney land and buying TVs is irrelevant, People in India and China are spending the same amount of time in Massive Malls and theme parks and buying electronics (iphone and androids one of the biggest markets in the world is China and India). Standard of living has gone up immensely in "developing" nations the past 2 decades a fact people don't seem to grasp. The point i'm trying to portray is Higher cost of living doesn't affect JUST developing nations like india and china anymore, western population are also strongly affected and standard of living is going down along with purchasing power.

I do not believe people in the United States or Europe can easily absorb higher food, fuel, housing costs, taxes without lowering their standard of living, that's just fantasy.

+1

Exactly.

Btc usage by people as a payments mechanism makes Btc useful regardless of valuation.

If poor people held onto btcs and these appreciate in value, I dont see that as a bad thing, unless of course they are putting their life savings into it.

More likely, the rich in India will use btcs as a store of value... Eventually.

As long as btcs become more widely adopted as a payments mechanism, wherever this happens around the world, Btc values will rise due to max cap on btcs.

Therefore, I see no issues with early investors becoming wealthier at the same time as poor Indians gaining utility from btcs.

Let's assume hoarding goes too far, and someone dumps Btcs in the future. Well investors would get hurt in that scenario, whereas poor Indians could still derive value from btcs as a payments mechanism.

Even in that scenario it is unlikely that btcs will go to zero as long as it is used as a payments system somewhere in the world.

Thailand   Mercedes sl500  14mils baht 309,803.56
Germany   sl65 amg  237 000 euros.

It matters because even an average Romanian can save around 200 euros per month while in india most of them don't even get that much as their wage.

If somebody has 2000 euros /month wage and only can save 5% that is 100 euros.
A hindi with 200 /month has to save 50%  to get the same amount.

That's why i don't expect indians to buy more than 0.1% of the bitcoins.

Yeah , 2x price increase in food and they will lower their standard , nothing more.
For the rest of the countries , they will starve.

"Deaths from malnutrition on a large scale have continued across India into modern times. In Maharashtra alone, for example, there were around 45,000 childhood deaths due to mild or severe malnutrition in 2009, according to the Times of India.[131] Another Times of India report in 2010 has stated that 50% of childhood deaths in India are attributable to malnutrition.[132]"

Is this happening in Europe?

Looks like another mindless post lacking any real insight.  These exchanges were perhaps set up a bit prematurely, without getting the proper licenses, therefore not adhering to India's currency laws.  So yes, they were raided, just like they would raid any business who didn't obtain the proper licensing.  And obviously they are going to come down harder on businesses involving the transferring of money. 

Now there is a clear opportunity for someone who knows what they are doing to set up a proper exchange with the appropriate licenses and Indians will finally be able to buy bitcoin in a serious way.

There's nothing called proper licences in India lol , everything you do with virtual currencies is money laundering to them so I doubt there's so called Licences as such. As for them they only want people to work with fiat. Same as all the governments that oppose Bitcoins.