Bitcoin Forum

Bitcoin => Development & Technical Discussion => Topic started by: Altoidnerd on January 29, 2014, 02:29:37 PM



Title: Full node radio and offline verification
Post by: Altoidnerd on January 29, 2014, 02:29:37 PM
At a taco stand at which the customer wishes to pay with bitcoin, a merchant can verify an incoming transaction while offline if the sender broadcasts a multisig paying a small amount to a large radio transmitting node (a TV or radio station in the area).  

It would not take much effort for the radio station to broadcast (airwaves) a proof of the broadcast from the SPV android holding customer.  In many areas, several echoes could further confirm the validity of a TX to a brick and mortar merchant using only an offline, low grade computer with an RF receiver.

This is a method of verifying payments sent to "cold", offline wallets while still generating unique addresses each payment.



Title: Re: Full node radio and offline verification
Post by: deepceleron on January 29, 2014, 04:39:16 PM
It would not take much effort for the radio station to broadcast (airwaves) a proof of the broadcast from the SPV android holding customer.

This is the exciter and transmitter for a small community-run radio station:

http://www.well.com/user/dmsml/stonehenge/kboo_1s.jpg
http://www.well.com/user/dmsml/stonehenge/kboo_exciters.jpg
http://www.well.com/user/dmsml/stonehenge/control_matrix.jpg

I'm sure you have an open-source digital exciter code ready to install on many different transmitter stacks, and underlying protocols all written suitable for National Association of Broadcasters review committee, ready for them to submit to outside testing, so they can prepare a report to the FCC. After that money is spent, you are very lucky if you get an FCC notice of proposed rulemaking, which has many more administrative stages than that "I'm just a bill" cartoon would lead you to believe.

Anything doesn't take much effort if it's in your imagination.


Title: Re: Full node radio and offline verification
Post by: Altoidnerd on January 29, 2014, 09:37:03 PM
Yeah of course I have that ready. Duh. That's why I posted the idea here, because it's already a completely finished and implemented project.

A raspberry pi can run the oh so complex "digital exciter code." How much information to do you think a txid is? It's not a lot. Yes this is actually a trivial exercise for a station that characterizes their own standard shout out call for a received Tx. Not every transmitter needs to agree on what to deliver...

Do you see this? I built this. It's a better transmitter than that obsolete noobstack so yeah. It's ready.

https://i.imgur.com/G1RqRMi.jpg


Title: Re: Full node radio and offline verification
Post by: Altoidnerd on January 29, 2014, 09:51:50 PM
Here's how easy it actually is. Some dude at the channel 58.1.2 brings his laptop to the station and records a video with his iPhone of blockchain.info's rolling transactions, and they broad cast that instead of reruns of I Love Lucy.

There's my fuckin digital exciter code. Anything other brain busters?

A channel doesn't need to ask the FCC to start broadcasting a ticker at the bottom of the screen. I don't get why you think there needs to be this massive consensus.

Put it this way, if you run a station, you might make more money broadcasting the blockchain channel than old movies. So considering doing it.


Title: Re: Full node radio and offline verification
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on January 29, 2014, 10:54:09 PM
thats a nice looking workbench Altoid!!

related stuffs:
https://github.com/mossmann/hackrf
 (https://github.com/mossmann/hackrf)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AX.25
 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AX.25)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KISS_(TNC)
 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KISS_(TNC))
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdayzRIPEMk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdayzRIPEMk)


Title: Re: Full node radio and offline verification
Post by: Altoidnerd on January 30, 2014, 03:42:41 AM
thats a nice looking workbench Altoid!!

related stuffs:
https://github.com/mossmann/hackrf
 (https://github.com/mossmann/hackrf)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AX.25
 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AX.25)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KISS_(TNC)
 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KISS_(TNC))
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdayzRIPEMk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdayzRIPEMk)

That's for the repo I'll take a look. What do you think the minimal information sent would be? I think it's no problem for 800 MHz video. I really do imagine a sort of blockchain TV channel...

Just been kicking this around for a while. Any input is appreciated, even from meanceleron ;-)


Title: Re: Full node radio and offline verification
Post by: deepceleron on January 30, 2014, 09:30:57 AM
If you want to consider something that takes little work to send or receive, think audio stream. As it would have to survive MPEG2 compression, you'd probably be limited to 14.4k equivalent (that's about 4MB an hour, barely keeping up with the average transaction rate), but any dtv broadcaster would have the ability to add a low-bitrate tv subchannel; these digital TV "radio stations" most often include a static picture because lots of TVs won't tune unless there is a video stream (on FM radio, they like to use their audio capabilities for programming). Decoding equipment could be as simple as digital tv converter to audio line in.


Title: Re: Full node radio and offline verification
Post by: TheButterZone on January 30, 2014, 10:58:02 AM
On the iPod nano I just sold, it would apparently receive the artist - title from most local FM stations and display it onscreen.


Title: Re: Full node radio and offline verification
Post by: Altoidnerd on January 30, 2014, 06:14:23 PM
Deepceleron, work is needed to decide how to optimize the data exchange in this way. If anyone does have contact with a local broadcast however, and someone motivates the station to start trying things, it's a step in the right direction.