Bitcoin Forum

I love Bitcoin and the ambition of a revolution from the banks BUT...

Does anyone think that one thing stopping it from mass adoption is the satoshi value?

If I was to buy a coffee it would be B0.00067
People would much just prefer to see $5

What do you think?

Your thought is right. You are comparing with fiat money. Think of digital transaction. There might be a solution for this decimal.

This is a great thought by you and I've read something about this a few days/weeks ago. A bitcoin developer made a proposal to use a different denomination for a better spoken terms(for a lack of better word).

Take a look: Topic: Jimmy Song proposes for "Bits" denomination to be adopted: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4266610

you don't even have to see the number you just ask for the shopkeeper to show you a pretty QR code which can also have a pretty coffee LOGO on top of it (the blow one doesn't have the pretty logo) and you scan it with your phone and pay for coffee. in your wallet you can change the setting so that it shows you the value in $ instead of in bitcoin or in any other unit you like!

https://i.imgur.com/2LWGQ3p.jpg
bitcoin:1PaymentAddress?amount=0.00067

If one coffee will be 76 satoshis, then the currency will be satoshis and that's easy to understand. Like any currency in the world.

If bitcoin would grow to be worth U$1 = 1 satoshi, it would be AMAZING, because, for example, you could convert any dollar bill to exactly 1 satoshi. And, of course, the great profit, with 1 BTC = U$100,000,000.. o.O

Agreed.

But most people don't even consider using another form of payment for purchasing than their local currency. They use a card most of the time, they know a price they are paying, that's all they care to know.

How do you get someone to stop using something that works just fine already? Fiat currency for every day transactions isn't broken, that's why people aren't interested in "a fix".

Fiat currency for larger transactions - wire transfers, purchases greater than $1000, cross border payments - is broken. This is where we can start to drive adoption. Think about how many migrant works wire money to their families in a home country and how much that costs and how long it takes for those transactions to clear, that's where we can really make a difference using bitcoin. We need to get those people to use bitcoin next!

Yeah, for this reason we express decimals in satoshi. 1satoshi = 0.00000001 btc. So 0.00067 btc would be  67,000 satoshi. So "your coffee costs 67k satoshi".  Sounds better right? Now if the value sounds too high, you will get used to it slowly. Think about the Vietnamese people. 1 USD is around 21577 vietnamese dong. So their coffee costs around 30,000 vnd.

Not at all, we know that Bitcoin is always divisible but that doesn't mean that we should use the extreme denominations such as 0.00000001 Satoshi or 1 Bitcoin. There are units in between as per our convenience and we can use those units as per our convenience, right? It has nothing to do with mass adoption, to be honest.

Well, bitcoin is a digital currency and the biggest advantage of bitcoin is you don’t need to carry it in your pocket. You can pay it through your wallet through online transaction. Moreover, I think that it is very easy to pay through bitcoin wallet instead of giving fiat money. As the world is upgrading we all should change our thinking.

Very good post, and this changes my perception on the adoption of bitcoin
And crypto. I have always thought there needs to be adoption by merchants
and buyers but it is the adoption of transferring funds where crypto can  hurt fiat.

The issue to consider is governments and banks can only regulate the entry
and exit to and from crypto so transfers could suffer from taxation because
without anyway to buy goods with crypto the only options are liquidate or hold.

It's true that people prefer the big numbers, and I do not think I see them in bitcoin, because the value or the bitcoin price is so high.

In mass the service of a product value will like little but we have to think about its value we don’t need to carry extra wallet or for transactions we don’t need to worry about theft or others also simple we can do transactions with mobile or web so bitcoin gives us this facilities to makes our life easier.

Yes.Bitcoin will not be suitable for smaller payments.Also with such a continuous increase in price,people will not be ready to pay with bitcoin at first.

no, that is not the reason for it.
for example if you ask random people in the street "why don't they have bitcoin" most of them will say they don't even know what bitcoin is. and if they do know what it is they are either scared of it because of high volatility and FUD that has spread a lot of misinformation about it. or they see it as an investment with a high risk instead of a currency so they don't get in.
hence the slow adoption.

This is the matter of payments if you pay to the sellers then it will be okay no need to concern about real money between crypto currency because 1 btc is 10000 us dollar so they payments will be cut from this money based this its easy to use and you don’t need to carry extra money or change for sellers.

Math as a bottleneck for bitcoin's mass adoption?? How silly is that! We have QR code in place already to overcome that issue. Every time you buy something using bitcoin, you don't need to calculate the bitcoin amount in your mind or smartphone calculator, there are services like bitpay integration to do that for you. All you need to do is to scan the QR code presented at the time of check out and complete the purchase. So it is not really an issue for bitcoin's adoption, the legal status of bitcoin is!

To me that doesn't matter. What matters is the value that the traders will both earn at the end of the day. For example, you used $5 as an example, what if you are in a country where $5 is worth about 500 of their native currency? So what I mean is that, at the end of the day both monies have the seme value. So whether Satoshi or not, Bitcoin can be mas adopted

As for me, it doesnt make sense for me. The cryptocurrency and electronic money in commn are the future anyway. The convinient of its using is solvable issue.

Bitcoin is new and unique feature to people.But, gradually there're a number of companies who're adopting crypto currency. So, the day is not that far that everyone would accept bitcoin and work with it.

That's right. That is very simple to do we don't need to be concius to that and I think even it's preferred in Bitcoin numbers it's nonsense as long it is the same price when converting into fiat then it's also good to me. It's definitely the same price and it's only writen in different term. So the issue is considered nothing.

I think satoshi value is not stopping it from mass adoption. IMO, people's lack of knowledge about crypto itself and lack of trust in it is what's impeding Bitcoin growth as of the moment. It will be solved soon though we just need to wait for more regulatory laws andany schools offering a college course related to it for mass adoption to happen.
You can buy goods online using crypto and Bitcoin though. As far as I know, you can buy goods online using crypto using Amazon and paying via purse.io's service, making options not limited to liquidating and holding.

I like Bitcoin barcodes like this, because if you have a barcode like this we do not have to count satoshi unit to Dollar. so as we go shopping to the Mall, when about to pay for goods, just scan the barcode of the goods and will appear the price. very efficient with there of barcode.

Bitcoin mass your post is quite logical. Because of these decimals, some people may find it easier to pay with fiats. Initiative should be taken against these procedures.

I think you are right. As bitcoin is banned in many coutries it cannot be adopted by the mass. This is a reason for it not growing as expected. But let's be positive hope soon it will be adopted by more people.

Bitcoin is the digital crypto currency .They have market acceptance because they are the pioneer of this industry. They also maintain a level of quality.

basically when you are using bitcoin you have to use a wallet on some device (phone, tablet, laptop, PC,...) and inside that wallet interface you should have any kind of conversion you like!
for example you may scan this  QR and your wallet GUI can show you the amount you are paying in Japanese Yen! it is just a simple multiplication that your wallet does and makes the unreadable QR dots into a user friendly number...

I don't think mass adaption or adaption are stopped with Satoshi's value.  Just spend time on it.  Bitcoin value fluctuates and investors do fall in investing into it with the certainty of its value growth. This causes the value grow more and more and this brings in many investors. This is the way this crypto currency and other currencies grow in the market.  What's the use of comparing fiat's with crypto currencies? If the coffee is 5 dollar then pay 5 dollar worth bitcoin. Who stops you from doing this?  Mass adaption would certainly happen down the line as everyone realises the benefits of adapting it.

Why bother looking at those numbers if most of the people in the world uses mobile phone just simple scan the quick response code then it's done. If there is a will there is a way, blockchain is the future no one can stop it

I agree with you.
Bitcoins are not suitable for small (daily) payments, the cost are high and need long confirmation time. Eventhough there are LN to improve it, but still there will be many difficulities to make this idea of daily transaction payment go south.

This is where we can start to drive adoption. Think about how many migrant works wire money to their families in a home country and how much that costs and how long it takes for those transactions to clear, that's where we can really make a difference using bitcoin

Till now it is not completely possible but after a period of time it might become mass adoption. Your idea is quite good but after make it $ it is tough to recognize between $ and bitcoin. When government start regulation of BTC bitcon then they make any kind of changes.

This is why we can't see bitcoin as part of the mass adoption in this world. It is just because, bitcoin's value. It fluctuates. And also, the transferring of funds. For example, you have to pay for your coffee? The coffee will go cold as you pay your coffee because of the transaction time.

You don't need banks or exchanges to use crypto buy goods. It only requires that people keep their crypto as crypto! That's not a bad thing, that's the point!

Sure, you gotta use a bank to buy something new, but there are a lot of banks. If your bank restricts you, move on to another bank. Some bank out there wants your business.

Yes, you are right but how could we overlook the advantages of bit coin, and the main thing is you don't need to carry it.

In my opinion mBTC is great for daily use. Community need start to use mBTC. 1 Bitcoin = 1000 mBTC

The increase in the number of coins mined will increase the supply of bitcoin, and hence with the lift of the ban and sanctions on bitcoin regulation on mass populations by countries in the European Union being lifted, billions of people are now allowed to use bitcoin supporting this increase.

I think that it is only issue about time. Some centuries ago people didn't think that a cup of coffee will cost $ 1-2. Today most people can't imagine prices in BTC. But nothing is impossible.

Satoshi does not scare anyone. What is the difference in how the amount will be displayed for payment. But imagine if you need to buy a product for 6000 dollars, it looks quite normal 1BTC.

Yes, I think that will not be a problem. If it will through digital transaction it will not be a problem. But if it will be compared to fiat transaction it is very different. Maybe it will be converted to fiat value for easy transaction also.

we would always need to revert back to the USD valuation because that is what we are use to and is widely accepted by all.A better denomination or nomenclature would have really helped bitcoin adoption.

i don't think this would be a problem since everything will be digital by that time, maybe just using your phone to pay, scan some qr code or something then you're good.

Well, you should not compare anymore dollars with bitcoin. Hopefully, 1 satoshi will be like 1 dollar ( or 5 dollars, just saying). I mean, that one coffee now usually costs 2$, and then , with btc, basically 1 coffee standard price will be 0.0005 satoshi. Just attitude, after some years will be all normal :D

There is a theory that the supply and demand principles do not work on a macroeconomic scale that with mass adoption comes the need for stability however in the case of bitcoin, not stability but volatility increases so it may not be ready for mass adoption.

 

A bitcoin developer has proposed using a different denomination for a better term, you do not even need to see the numbers you just ask the salesperson to show you a nice QR code that can also Have a nice coffee LOGO on top of it and you scan with the phone and pay for coffee.

right.! the developers of our phone app i think should make things easier for us. something like converting your btc to USD before paying would be good. Lets saying you scan a QR code to pay and then before you press send, there has to be fiat conversion displayed on the screen. this i think solves issues as what OP set an example.

Yes I agree with your statement but you must think that we are having different personalities and having different perspective that is why some are prefered to use bitcoin while others are not.

possibility It's true that people prefer big numbers, in bitcoin, because the value or price of bitcoin is very high. And Bitcoin is a new and unique feature for people. But, gradually there are a number of companies that adopt crypto currencies. So, that day is not so far away that everyone will receive bitcoin

In bulk, the cost of the product is not very much like, but we must think about its value. As for me, it does not make sense to me. Crypto currency and electronic money in commn is the future in any case. bitcoin gives us these opportunities to make our life easier.

That's right, there's still many people who are insensitive to the value of bitcoin because most of the users of bitcoin use it more as an investment asset rather than using it as a payment method, as a result the value of satoshi's almost untouched by them.

all over the world and in different works of life, we have recorded serious cases of massive bitcoin adoptions and many more still coming but one of the most significant is the case of the venezuelan government adopting the blockchain technology to alleviate their poverty situation by raising funds for their nation as they have declared been bankrupt

the satoshi value is indeed a thing of concern. those who are not good with figures will indeed find it diffuclt understand how to mathematically calculate the satoshi value. though bitcoin is great having so much to offer to the world, i still believe lots of people find it challenging to use.

It doesn't matter. If we will have ability to buy coffee with BTC, we won't pay attention to these details. I just want to spend my Bitcoin...

The satoshi value is basically a fraction of bitcoin, so this is not the cause of stopping mass adoption.
If bitcoin want to be mass adopted, then the value of bitcoin must be stable as the fiat currency. If bitcoin value still volatile, then peoples will afraid to use it as a normal currency.

The equivalent decimal value of bitcoin for a cup of coffee would not be a problem. Developers can easily think of a solution to that. But, the main problem here in mass adoption of bitcoin is the transaction verification time. It is one of the reasons why bitcoin haven't gone mainstream. One transaction in bitcoin, on average, takes 10 minutes. These should be solve first.

How can someone buy a coffee using bitcoin if the price of bitcoin varies greatly from time to time. It is very volatile in such a way it increase 10 times or more for a span of 8 months. This volatility would a huge factor affecting bitcoin's mass adoption. The number and how are you going to pay are just secondary problem that can be easily.

Let the CPUs do the computations. Don’t stress yourself with the math. Mass adoption of bitcoin depends on how fast they can’t think of simplifying the transactions.

Well said. We should be ready to embrace change and accept how technology can enhance our lives. Here is a virtual currency designed to be better than fiat. Why should we refuse to use it? Not taking advantage of its many benefits is a huge step backward, in my opinion.

A valid thought there i may say.  But such thoughts had already been considered and a solution has been placed by many other merchants and exchanges.

For instance, my favorite exchange would indicate that i am expecting to receive 0.67 mBTC instead of 0.00067 BTC to be able to pay for my coffee. So as you can see, this part of your worry is already addressed. Perhaps the only issue now is to make it a constant because as much as other exchanges are using mBTC, there also exist bits and satoshis where 0.00067 BTC would mean 670 bits and 67000 satoshis respectively.

Though for me, i think i'm happy with mBTC.

The world is going digital.  They will be herded into the system the elite wish them to be in.  I believe they have brought us crypto and as a result we will be using.  The sheeple will be nudged and that will be that. 

People just find ways to make things easier for them. Take Zimbabwe as an example, they had hyper inflation in their country and the government started to print Trillion Dollar bills. Now, imagine what a nightmare that would have caused in their country, having to deal with such massive calculations. How much change do you give someone, when they pay you with a 1 Trillion Dollar note for a cup of Coffee?

They also have a high percentage of illiteracy, so they just had to make a plan to make it work out for them. Some of them gave sweets for change and others just weighed the stack of bills. The solution for Bitcoin is that it is 100% digital and the QR codes is the solution for the lazy mathematicians.  ;D

Bitcoin is recognized by a small percentage of the world as a valid payment method which is why it still has a long way to go before being adopted on a massive scale across the globe. The cryptocurrency market needs to reduce the volatility of crypto coins and tokens in some way or another to make it more feasible and attractive in order to attract more investors over time. Bitcoin would surely attract more investors as its price continues to rise over time.

We are used to using fiat for all our purchases from time immemoral, which is the major issue we have now cause people find it difficult to accept or understand the Satoshi vaue of Bitcoin. If a cup of coffee is $5 fixed, and maybe B0.00067 fixed, does it really make a difference with respect to it's fixed rate?

The only aspect I feel people are worried about it is on the fact that B0.00067 could worth more or less in days/months to come. Thus a solution is needed.

First, there are some underlying factors to be straightened up before talking about the mass adoption of bitcoin.

The interoperability, scalability , security issues begluding the blockchain technology needs to be fixed .

It's not only different personalities, it more of understanding the investments and the market differences and seeing what suits you best.