Bitcoin Forum

There are enough signs that an economic crisis is going to happen soon in the next 3 - 5 years.

Whether China's bubble will burst or the dollar will implode.
Do you guys think crypto will be as good an investment as gold in time of crisis?

During the crisis, well it could be best place to put our money in because during that period crypto currencies might get hyped a lot. Just the way people buy gold and silver in the similar manner people might buy crypto this time and that too bitcoin specifically. This is new era and people believe in the moderation rather than old stuff now. So there is pretty high chance that crypto currency will be saviour of our world during the time of economic crisis.
I guess, those who are engaged in crypto toady will surely find crypto as best asset to buy in such time while rets of the world will follow the traditional ways.

What will be your position if you know that there is a crisis will happen? Will you gamble in a new currency or will you invest in a safe investment?
For companies, I expect they choose gold, but for individuals, few will take the risk.
The news is not entirely bad, but there will be more confident/trust in cryptos than the current banking system.
We will also enjoy some proper heights.

Some individuals can't afford to buy physical golds. So as casuals we are only left with one choice but to go to crypto. Only thing though is that crypto hasn't proved anything if its really a good hedge for a economic crisis so there's a big risk. But personally, I'm more willing to take that risk and see how it goes if ever a financial crisis strikes us again. At least we have something that can give us hope in case something worst happen.

I think it will be. While gold was very popular among the previous generation, they haven't been raised in the era of the Internet, like their children. What i'm trying to say is that every generation needs a store of value, chooses it. Gold has been on top for ages, but at some point people will look for other things that are also easy to carry and hide and can be easily valued on the go. Gold can't be. What if you can't find someone willing to check if this gold bar is actually made of gold and doesn't have a copper core? With BTC there's no such issue.

You can't call a safe haven a market like the crypto-market that is highly volatile and unpredictable. Safe means safe, what is safe to put your money in cryptos knowing that the market can crash at any moment? In December last year the BTC price was at $20k now at $8k, is it what you call safe?

Crypto could be a safe haven should there be a global economic crises, the good new is that the cryppto market does not move same pattern as other markets, not correlated, so happening in other sectors may not affect cryptos too

The economic crisis is already foreshadowed by many countries.As it seems to me, after this crisis, the mass distribution and recognition of cryptocurrencies will begin.Always before something new is the turbulence of the old.I do not think that during the crisis, people will run to buy cryptocurrency.The purchase will take place after the crisis

I'm not sure whether crypto will be a safe haven or not but many people may consider investing their money in cryptos if other markets crash or go down. Crypto investment always a high reward and high-risk investment so we can't say it is a safe haven to invest.

More investors may prefer to invest in gold than bitcoin during the crisis because cryptos still need to prove that it is worth to invest money during the crisis.

You have to have Fiat + Gold + Crypto + Food.  If you leave out one of these you may find yourself in dire straights as the collapse happens.  Crypto is a very key part of my strategy of surviving the economic collapse.  

The economic development of the United States is very healthy, the dollar is hard to collapse, and the trade war between China and the United States may lead to the collapse of China's economy!
The high volatility of cryptocurrencies also has the potential for bubbles, and only gold and silver have real storage value!

Valid point taken. I guess what they mean to say is to store your assets in investment opportunities to survive or even thrive during the crisis. I believe that when shit hits the fan again, the dollar will go down again, will people flock to crypto. If the dollar goes down, does that mean the price of bitcoin will go up? if so, that seems a solid investment.

Gold is considered safe, but if the dollar is strong, it's better to stay out of it. The crash of BTC last december is just euphoria running out of steam and mass panic cash out.

There will be no "economic crisis that will be so bad" that will make the world economy suffer hyperinflation. The Keynesians have already learned that to mitigate an economic crisis is to pump as much fiat in the system and the tax the consumers more later.

It has been working and it will work for the next 1000 years until the people are so taxed
and so poor.

I don't know what your sources are, but America is not doing that well. There are some short term economic patch ups done, but China owns 1/3 of America's foreign debt. Which means China has the power to influence the dollar at will. Peter Schiff was one of the few who predicted the crisis in 2008 and says there will be another 1 in the next 3 years. I'll say that America is gonna look for another war to cover up the upcoming crisis, but that's just me speculating

It think it is likely it will be before that. Probably next year. The S&P 500 is clearly in a bubble and in Europe the ECB is going to start taking off stimulus soon.

But going to the point, yes I’d say bitcoin, not crypto in general, will be a safe haven when  crisis come. Bitcoin appeared during the last crisis as an alternative to the current economic system and it has much better qualities of gold: imagine to have to travel with $1 million of gold, it is virtually impossible.

If we have a major crisis bitcoin will be a refuge.

It sure seems like it's coming. As to your question, that's really tough to say, isn't it? Given their decentralized nature, yet all the hacks and general instability. Another question may be, would the government try to impose a mandatory state cryptocurrency, or something else, which everyone must use? Scary times, some might even say Mark of the Beast type stuff.

As to cryptocurrencies: if Bitcoin, for example, were distributed widely enough, and was adopted enough as a payment option... and the web was still up and running, it might become a good alternative currency to use. If/when that day comes, it will probably not be the time for masses of people to HODL hoards of BTC, as you'd want more coins circulating in the economy.

Actually, one of the companies we've been doing some work for was offering blockchain-based tokens pegged to the gold spot price, tokenized assets may be something interesting to take a look at for this discussion.

Thanks for posting the question,
The Cyberius team.

Indeed, the world economy is getting worse as the two powers like the US and China are always at war. But I do not think Crypto will be a good investment. Because when the economy goes down, investors will fear and withdraw from this market to invest in real estate or gold. Since then the value of the altcoins will decrease significantly and it is not safe.

I dont think people will ever think about the crypto currencies when the time comes to safe guard your money during the crisis. I mean come on people cant even bear a stress of price drops within the crypto sphere and when it will be the time of economic crisis in the real world then they will never stand a chance to be here. They will think that if economic going down in the real world then their crypto's might get affected with it adversely and thus may not be good for the portfolio. That is it mate, this thought will keep most of the people away from the crypto.

That's a point that most people missed about BTC last December. It wasn't a crash, it was just the end of the first wave of massive euphoria that tripped it up. There's no saying that bitcoin is supposed to be worth this or worth that at this stage because it's still trying to find a ground for itself after such a huge movement.

The dollar has been way too high lately, people have been saying it's overvalued for the past year and a half. If I had any dollars right now they'd be in bitcoin or gold, because those are the ones that are quite low. But like mentioned above:


Gotta have a bit of everything. So the dollar still has some value in terms of exchange. People will still be interested in it, even if there is a collapse. Or something more secure, like Francs

I think it`s a win-win situation for the crypto community and the world economy.Every econocial crysis  is way to clean the economy from the bubbles and the businesses,that aren`t effective and profitable.
The crysis might cause unemployment and inflation,but the economy will grow stronger after everything moves on.Cryptocurrencies will be a safe heaven for sure.

It could be, it could be not. People would likely cling to gold if in case another crisis happens or look for another asset class in which they could stash their properties in. Bitcoin is a legitimate candidate for such a position but the question is whether volatility is still great by then. If it is, people wouldn't try to stash their life savings in bitcoin and will just move to gold. If it isn't, bitcoin and cryptocurrencies would be the strongest currency/asset class existing during the crisis until everything pans out. For now, going long in bitcoin with whatever spare cash one can shell out is a good thing, that's for sure.

As much as I would love for the dollar to implode, I wouldn't want for it to happen. The whole world will collapse and fall to misery. China's bubble is already on the verge to burst, its in the middle of a trade war. Crypto is not an investment. People think that, but its not. For me, at least bitcoin isn't. I use it as a currency and I proudly do so. But most people might actually resort to crypto as an investment. I watched Mr.Robot, and when everything failed and the entire banking system and credit/debit cards went down, people were hunting for crypto and hard cash. So you never know.

Appreciate your point of views. I really do wonder whether ppl will flock to digital assets.
I mean this is going to be the first crisis, where crypto is going to be an option.
Maybe the utilization of crypto as a currency will be really tested.
Who knows ... "The Big Short" was an awesome movie ... i wonder how such a movie will be in an era where crypto/bitcoin is available

It is because bitcoin is facing a valuation against dollar and not with it. For example when bitcoin falls down in price altcoins follow, thats correlation. However bitcoin is going against the dollar and not with it. So when dollar goes down that means bitcoin will go up because you bet against each other. That is why most people are bullish on gold and bitcoin, same idea.

If you invest in bitcoin for a long term in the end even if your purchasing power doesn't get better, the amount of dollar you get rises because when dollar gets devalued, bitcoin gets more valuable against it, so in 10 years bitcoin will most definitely be higher than this price however it is important to know how higher, will it affect our purchasing power or not.

Yes, maybe the economic crisis will come soon. I think the Chinese economic bubble and the collapse of the dollar will be at the same time. But my view is pessimistic, that is, when the economic crisis, digital money may not become a safe haven, and may collapse with the escape of money.

And why such confidence that there will be a crisis.  These are just guesses.

cryptocurrency in  general can turn into a Tulip mania bubble thing because in case of an economic crisis there will be a rush to buy them and since there is a lot of them (practically an unlimited number of altcoins) they will be in real big bubbles which will burst and damage the whole economy in general too! and it can even make things worse.

on the other hand things such as Gold and Bitcoin will shine in this situation because of their scarcity and security. specifically bitcoin because you won't have to rely on anyone for holding the gold you buy and storing bitcoin is easier and safer than storing gold! people would choose the easier and safer option meaning bitcoin and it can turn into their haven which has happened to some extent in the past too.

China has the power to manipulate the dollar but it wont. They are not willing to go to war with the nation that has the greatest military might in the world. Its more prosperous to cooperate in peace and through negotiations lol.

The trade war will be to the advantage of the Americans and we will see that in 10 years.

All signs are saying that it will be. For instance look at the S&P 500. It's at all time high right now. It looks just like BTC was in January 2018 forming a double top after a sharp increase. It's going to crash, especially that the US markets are outperforming the rest of the world. Are these companies really doing that great? I'd say they aren't but you may have a different opinion, just remember to back it up with examples.

I think that since bitcoin is indeed independent of all central banks and entities that are controlling the fiat's monetary policies, it is pretty much guaranteed that if a financial crisis strikes the fiat sector, bitcoin will be able to serve as a relatively safe store of value.

But it does depend on the level of adoption at the time of the economic crisis, and also what type of crisis strikes.

If we see a collapse in the value of the fiat currencies around the world, then definitely, bitcoin would not only hold its value, but may actually see a surge of adoption because the markets demand an alternative to fiat. To me, bitcoin is probably more feasible as a long term store of value and a safe haven during economic crises than even gold itself, due to its obviously advantages in terms of convenience, divisibility, and global nature, while retaining the same decentralized nature.

Just google or type in youtube "dollar collapse" or "china bubble crash", enough reports will pop up and from very legit sources.
These are opportunities for traders or investors, if you can anticipate it.

We have already seen economic crisis before and gold found to be a safe haven at such times.But after cryptos got introduced,we have never encountered such crisis and so we could not decide anything clearly.But I think that due to their instinct nature,people would once again choose gold to face such critical situations.

I really think that bitcoin will be one of the best places to have your money in the case of an economic crisis all over the world, we have already seen several local cases in which a country faced economic difficulties and people turned to bitcoin, people forget that the last time there was a crisis as big as the one that is coming the US confiscated the gold of their people and then made it illegal to hold it, I think the next crisis is going to be even worse and governments may seize Gold by force and in that case bitcoin will be the perfect form of money because no matter what governments do bitcoin cannot be confiscated that easily.

In times of economic crisis this crypto currency like bitcoins will help to stabilize the economic down turn and will help in improving the economic conditions of the world, as crypto currencies helps in providing a source of income and curtail employment issues when there is an economic crisis the value of fiat currency will get down due to increase in the bad debts this bitcoins and crypto currencies will help to solve the problems as the price of bitcoins is far higher than fiat currencies and will solve the financial problems of the economy.

You take the trade war far too seriously. It's nothing more than a circus where countries are measuring their d... The only negative aspect of this is that it always affects the average person, and they unfortunately don't have the buffer they need to get through this governmental ego cycle.

In 10 years no one even thinks about the trade war anymore.  ::)

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It's only a matter of time before pension funds allocate a few % of their holdings to Bitcoin in an attempt to hedge the risks the shitty world economy. I'm glad that I live in somewhat of a decent country, but there are countries that based on economical difficulties cut people's pensions with 10-25% which is pure madness. It could have been avoided easily by having a position in Bitcoin. Instead of constantly cutting people's pensions, they would be enjoying higher pensions over the long term. Pathetic.

When the economic crisis comes. They will choose Crypto as a substitute. Because crypto can meet their needs.
The problem is.
How to overcome those who do not understand crypto?

Cryptocurrency can become and exit from the global economy crisis, but it can be the opposite as well when people would be complaining saying that cryptocurrency is the reason why everything crashes.

That's a good point, we shouldn't be wishing for something that would cause misery for the entire world. The dollar isn't the best solution, but it's the only solution that is working at the moment. We can replace it further down the road. We shouldn't hope for another big market crash in order to do so, however. Just like that scene in "The Big Short" where the guy tells those two younger bankers "You do realize if you win this bet, millions of people in America are going to be homeless". It's not a bet we would want to win. It is one that we need to be prepared for though.

So many points in where I agree for sure. I would love to see misery spared, but actions have consequences. America, just like China btw are living with maxed out credit cards. The problem for the US is that 1/3 of its debt is in the hands of China.

The problem is also that overspending is just not sustainable, the bill will come. Our grandparents' generation and our parents generation have accumulated a debt that our generation can't pay off. I'm wondering if country heads think that their debt will be forfeited.

As a trader, we just play the markets. If the big short on the dollar comes, you're a fool not to try to make money off of it. I think Bitcoin will stick around and I do think the value of it could go down as the dollar will crash, but when economies will recover so will the value of bitcoin. Getting in at the right price, that's what I'm banking on.

In terms of protecting one's wealth in a hyperinflation/fiat depreciation crisis with an independent asset class, I think that bitcoin is really going to be the way to go as a safe haven to store your wealth for both the short and long term.

Even though right now, people may still think that precious metals are the true safe havens, once a real collapse brought by hyperinflation strikes, people will realise that bitcoin is decentralised just as gold, but is a lot more practical in transactions than gold. That could even bring in more adopters as a result. As bitcoin's supply is under controlled inflation instead of unregulated inflation in terms of fiat (every fiat has lost tens of times of its value from just a few decades ago), its value in real terms shouldn't falter when fiat currency's does.

But in a deflationary crisis, there really isn't much to look onto in the past, but it should definitely perform better than asset classes such as property and stocks, imo, and hold its value stable. After all, bitcoin was introduced directly after the 2008 recession, and gold and silver didn't actually perform that badly at all within that recession.

Probably in the time of global economy crash that you are predicting here with come and would remain stable because it is a crypto currency which has no things to do with a real one.

Is this really happening already? Is this causing the wealth divide?

On the crypto/gold safe haven, both have advantages and disadvantages.
Gold is more stable than bitcoin but is much more bulkier!
IMO its harder to buy Gold than Bitcoin and harder to store safely.

I will be having both metals and bitcoin.

Yeah and that's what trading is about. People tend to demonize the job because they think that traders are stealing money from the poor or causing assets to be overvalued but that's not true. Traders just provided added liquidity to the process. They inject money where it is useful.

We all have feelings too and cannot wish death and destruction for our own financial gain. We can, however, position ourselves accordingly and be ready if it does in fact happen. It's inevitable at this stage because we've borrowed ourselves into a corner, and everyone knows it. They're just plugging their ears and singing "this time is different!"

For the people who are wondering about the crash ahead ... just for context ... i found this video.

Economic Collapse Warning! $70 Trillion Dollar Dark Cloud Of Debt - Stock Market Crash 2018
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TV01S_haL0g

If we are going to unavoidable economic crisis in 2019 I don't think that people would consider cryptocurrency as the only exit from it, it would be good and positive for us if they would consider that as one of the possible ways at least.

I think it is the opposite, bitcoin will help to make things worse, why you may ask? Because now the middle class has something they can buy to preserve their wealth, in a economic crisis like the great depression, those that were poor before the crisis do not lose much, the rich do not lose much either since most of their wealth is in real estate, gold, jewelry and in the form of businesses, the middle class is the one that suffers the hit from the crisis.

But with bitcoin there will be people that will be able to escape the confiscatory measures imposed by the governments which means that governments will get even less wealth if they try to steal from you with taxes or inflation making the crisis even worse, I am sure that at that point the masses will cry for a windfall tax and all of those that got bitcoin or gold will be subject to it but at that point civil disobedience will be high and many will not comply.

Are you kidding? Please, look at the charts of ethereum and bitcoin. There are the very strong downtrends in these assets. I am already tired to watch these downtrends. Last several days I saw quotations and market was stably in the red zone showing from -3% to -20% by assets. I think that in such a situation it is strange to talk about a safe haven because I am sure that prices will continue slashing.
It is a pity that I am still holding ETH and I acknowledge that I have mistaken with this bought. Well, I am frank with you talking about the current market situation and I consider that crypto assets in the current moment of time is not a good choice for investing and I am not sure that crypto assets will be strong in a period of the further crisis.

Economic crisis is a very serious problem, the government must be able to anticipate and prepare carefully before the economic crisis occurs. the possibility of a dollar price that will explode, because at this time the dollar continues to strengthen.

You are only seeing things as they are now, we are talking about how the events may unfold in the future in the case of a crisis, and we have seen several local examples of this and one of the most notorious is Venezuela, the inflation in that country is terrible and people are looking for ways to improve their situation, some use dollars but dollars are scarce in their country and many people have began using bitcoin and other crypto to store their wealth.

In the case the US dollar fails what can you use to protect yourself from that? Gold and silver are good options but not many have them and can be easily confiscated, but cryptocurrencies can be held without no one knowing you have them and even if someone knows they cannot take them away without your keys so in that way crypto is safer to store than gold or silver.

Not necessarily the dollar will rise because of recent times it is still. The economic crisis will also be very unlikely when relationships are tight. In particular, the power of digital technology has changed the entire market.

Yes, the financial anonymity can be very important during the times of an economical crisis, so the crypto currencies can be useful for saving a wealth. But I don't see any failure of USD. In contrary, currently the US dollar is a very profitable asset in comparing to the fiat currencies of other countries. Recently some of these fiat currencies have crashed down to 20%. Who knows, maybe non-US investors sold their crypto currencies and bought the US dollars to exchange them later and gain profits. In my opinion, the investment portfolio should be diversified by crypto and fiat.

When the financial crisis broke out, stocks, gold and real estate all fell against the dollar. The dollar is still falling in value due to inflation until today. I think that it is better to keep living expenses for several years while exchanging it for other assets little by little. We also consider BITCOIN as part of assets,too.

It's true that crypto is the better option, but the main problem is that there isn't one single crypto currency able to handle mass adoption. We have seen how Bitcoin's network crippled completely due to the bull run last year.

If Bitcoin can't even handle a few hundred thousand people using it in a single day, it won't ever be able to handle one million users trying to have their transactions confirmed within one day.

We have to look at our crypto currencies without hyping them up too much. As it is right now, they are all incompetent and haven't gone through any upwards scaling improvements to even remotely allow more usage.

Yes, and this is how crypto is becoming the new gold. It is nothing like gold, but it shares the feature of being a secure way to protect money against extortion, abuse, taxes, devaluation, crises, etc. etc. There are many reasons why using crypto is more practical than fiat, and even gold, but unfortunately too much of the publicity focuses on the high profile hacks to make it appear as extremely high risk.





This is something that we need to look at more seriously. Sure, Bitcoin has the best concept, especially that being in decentralization, but does it have the capabilities to hold up its worth? There are big dreams around here for Bitcoin but there needs to be much more done to bring it to those levels.

Is it a joke? How cryptocurrencies can be a safe??? Crytomarket is too volatile and almost unpredictable! And safe investments require stability.You can quckly earn money on crypto, you can be anonymous using crypto, but you can not be in safety investing in crypto!

The real question is whether you think bitcoin will stay this low forever ... if not then it's an opportunity to invest in ...

Bitcoin on an equal footing with gold can become a reliable storehouse of your savings for the time of crisis. However, this way of saving will be chosen by fewer people.

Bitcoin is definitely not a bubble. And it can be equated to gold by basic characteristics, so we can assume that during the crisis bitcoin will become a reliable depository for your savings. The main thing is to protect your wallet, so that scammers do not steal our bitcoins.

Yes,the decenterlization for blockchain will slove the economic destroy degree.

You are right but the crash is not going to happen today or tomorrow, those kind of events take a lot of time to unfold so the developers have time to prepare for that, I am not trying to hype bitcoin I understand its limitations very well, and at the moment gold and silver are still superior when you take all the factors into consideration since they can be used outside of the banking system and you do not require of infrastructure like the electric grid or the internet.

But bitcoin can be used as a refuge by some people, especially us that already have some bitcoin in hand, since I really do not expect such a collapse to happen at least in a  decade or two so I have no doubts that bitcoin will be ready when such a crisis finally find us.

Gold is one of the best choices in putting up an investment in preparation in terms of crisis but if for me crypto may not be as safe as gold but the potential good income or return would be great . But I think it also depends on our choices whether we are more comfortable with centralized assets or in decentralized assets. For me there is a big posibility that crypto can change people's fortune unlike those stable assets like fiat and precious metals.

Fair enough. I'm reading into LN more regularly nowadays with how the developments and even adoption starts to pick up pace. Can't wait for the first proper client to pop up to allow even noobs to use it without problems.

Currently there are a few clients available in the app store, but they are everything but easy to use, and completing payments is a nightmare since the node they run has barely any proper routing channels to use.

My guess is that we have at least a few more years of LN development to go through before we can comfortably use it.

Yes.Bitcoin is an asset,so you can inverse your money in bitcoin.Your investment will be safe,irrespective of dollar value.If you had brought bitcoin for 1000$,your bitcoin had same value.At economic crisis, the value of dollar will reduce.It's possible to get additional dollar,for the same bitcoin at economic crisis.In economic crisis, you will be on safer hand.

people talk about the crisis all the time. I believe that it is not necessary to dwell on it, otherwise it is no good will not result. more will be spent nerves and health. I suggest just to learn something new, because knowledge is never devalued if they are updated and supplemented

I'm not sure that the crisis is going to go away but in any case I think that it's necessary to distribute your money between different investment assets.

Crisis tends to hit every facet of life, Crypto isn't gold so it might be affected by he economic crisis,  that doesn't mean it will die.  It's here for good, it will survive it.

I think it could happen, crypto become new safe haven beside gold or silver. If government regulation issued, i am believe financial institution will diversified their investment portofolio to cryptocurrency and crypto can be safe haven

since crypto is digital, i think it is the most practical investment if a crisis occur that, if the effect of that crisis is global, crypto will be considered as a good way to invest, depending on what crisis we are talking about, financial crisis is eminent if we are to look into out present data, inflation rates are almost everywhere in the world's economy, even gold seems not practical to invest with. 

Major and most reputable cryptocurrencies could indeed serve as safe heaven when crisis comes. However, volatility is what should concern us - nobody wants to put their liquidity in an asset that could change its value for +/- 25% per day.

I have many doubts too.

So wheres the signs that an economic crisis is going to happen?And seems like your pointing to a world crisis?You should put some links or proof about this because you are creating a panic and misleading to the community,economy in our region is getting better now and i believe in that three years span we will grow again and bring our country to goodness

But if that would happen?For sure better buy bitcoin now as this will be a safer place to invest,this is technology and not physical needs

maybe the crisis will happen because until now the trade wars of China and America have not yet met a point of peace, I am not sure that Cripto is the best choice compared to gold, looking at the market now in the fact that I see the crypto market does not show significant movement but in the gold sector according to the news that I read, physical or digital gold sales have increased while the exchange rate has dropped.
You know China has a lot of gold reserves which are believed to be a weapon to suppress the American economy, we just wait for who is the strongest but really this trade war has a negative effect on the world economy and the shadow of the monetary crisis haunts us today, even though I am pessimistic but I hope cripto is the way out for me to avoid the impact of the crisis

i think that with the economic crisis, it will impact on cryptocurrency, because investors certainly do not just invest in crypto. besides that, of course government will be unstable with onset of the crisis