Bitcoin Forum

Right now if you want to buy a pizza with Bitcoin, you will have some problems, the delay it will take and the fees will make it impossible.

https://lightning.network

This seems to be a solution. What is your though about this? Is this going to be as secured and anonymous? Where are the source of this technology?

Every solution has its bad and good sides, so the same it's with this one. Complete security also doesn't exist so it surely has its downfalls and I don't think that it will be anonimous, at least not completely. KYC has become a must for legitimate businesses.
To my opinion Bitcoin debit cards are so far the best solution for easy and convenient Bitcoin payment. Except that we need more cards providers.

If you want to use bitcoin to buy presents, the most obvious solution is gift cards, via Gyft or eGifter. The recipient will then be able to spend the gift card at one of a wide range of retailers.

You can pay for flights and hotels with bitcoin, through Expedia, CheapAir and Surf Air. If your ambitions are loftier, you can pay for space travel with some of your vast holdings, through Virgin Galactic.

if you think it is "imracticable" to use bitcoin to buy a pizza then don't use bitcoin to buy a pizza, use it for something else and if you think it is like this for everything then leave it altogether. nobody forces you to use something you think is not practical. let the millions of others who know it is practical to use it.

the delay you are talking about is the confirmation and i have not seen any pizza shop complain about it or ask the customer to stand there until it is confirmed! they accept it and are happy and so far nothing bad has happened. it is all in your head.

The point was more about https://lightning.network
This thing pretend being able to process millions of transactions per seconds using the blockchain technology.

Maybe if certain people spent less time promoting shit forks forcing developers to focus time on countermeasures they instead could of spent time on fixing actual issues and we wouldn't be here right now.

Bitcoin fees to high? Unusable? Hate it?
Me too!
Could not download a CD in the early 90ies?
Hated it too!
You have invested in early tech!
Some people think and work day and night so solve this issue in a way Bitcoin can survive centuries!
Have faith.

well you started by complaining about buying a pizza and having to wait for confirmation. i say when you haven't even tried to do it why are you talking about it then?
same goes with LN. when you have not even bothered to test LN yet how are you complaining about it and use the word "pretend"?

Transactions fees aren't slow and expensive for months already. You're still living in December 2017 apparently.

"pretend" lol. Tell you what. Download the Eclair wallet right now and try it out.

The difference, of course, is that Bitcoin used to have low fees. It has regressed - gotten worse with time - whereas internet bandwidth didn’t.

The difference is that bitcoin was a lot cheaper back then, so obviously the fees would be significantly cheaper back then; and the fees aren't even that bad at the moment. The fees are low enough for online purchases, just not low enough for micro transactions. Maybe actually try transacting using bitcoin?

If we are buying pizza from bitcoin then transaction confirmation time is not a big problem because everyone know bitcoin transaction is not reversible and once payment send then transaction will be confirm on blockchain network but transaction fee will be a problem if some kind of changes is possible then banks and coinbase can issue bitcoin debit,credit cards and ATM's will be good options.

Let's reformulate the question.

What do you think about this: https://lightning.network

?

For small transactions, it is clear that bitcoin is not practical, because it loses fast using paper money. But for large transactions such as buying property, lambo, or investing in stocks, using bitcoin may be safer and more comfortable. The solution to overcoming bitcoin is impractical, one of which is by making bitcoin debits issued by exchanging bitcoin using an anonymous card, even though ultimately it's not 100% anonymous because identity is a must, at least fingerprints.

why don't you check it out yourself?
start by reading the lightning network paper or at least skim through it since it is long. then start by searching the internet and reading on how you can run an LN node and maybe start one yourself. this is a decentralized network, in the end it doesn't matter what others think about it. what matters is if you like it or not.

No, buying one pizza using bitcoin is possible:

 - Fees are currently cheap where you can pay 0.1 to $ 0.3 and ensure confirmation in 10 minutes.
 - The delay of 10 minutes can be ignored. If you are in the restaurant you can pay first and after you finish eating your transaction will be confirmed. Similarly, if you order it.
 
The impossible thing is to use a Bitcoin for the daily transaction or accept large stores using that currency.
Will lead to a lot of transactions and therefore more fees and so on "Lightning Network is one of the proposed solutions that are being developed."

Now many big company’s accept bitcoin but it’s not easy to that’s kind of payment available with butcoin and here no need to anonymous.

I am buying junk food daily without the use of the Lightning Network, so I do not understand where the problem is? The fees

are relatively low and it is very quick too. {Disclaimer : I am doing SegWit to SegWit transactions}  ;D  The Lightning Network

is Bitcoin on steroids and the next evolution in the Bitcoin experiment. The Lightning Network is also ideal for micro payments,

so this is the scaling solution for the future.  8)

this is not necessary at all. i think this way of thinking is only because bitcoin is new and different that what we are used to. but if you think about it when you go to a restaurant and pay with credit card for instance, the manager doesn't make you wait a month or so for the transaction to finalize. no, they let you go and maybe in a couple of hours or in a day the transaction was reversed and the restaurant loses money because the credit card you used was stolen one but that is the risk that a restaurant owner takes.
so why do we insist on having a different way of things for bitcoin?

Yep. That's the two things I really hate about bitcoins making it near perfect would mean solving these two problems. The two problems are the expensive transfer cost and the slow transfe rate. It just goes to show that even the king has some flaws in it. But I think someone would find a solution to this.

Bitcoin is not impractical payment. Using bitcoin credit card you can purchase your daily needs. Nowadays due to being mainstream many e-commerce sites, physical stores and retailers are accepting BTC payment. So there is lot of practical use of btc.

Bitcoin is easy to transaction and fee less and it’s decentralized that’s why anyone can be anonymous when they transect and avoid third party. It’s useful for big transaction but still not appropriate for this kind of payment`

"It is not fair to label BTC with “impractical” just because you could not use it for paying pizza. There are many more sectors where btc is practical to use. So think in a positive way.

"

Hope in future BTC will create some feature which will be able to this type of payment and give BTC holder ready to any kind of payment`

I think that this is a good solution for the current problems with bitcoin transactions but you need to move on and before the general acceptance of bitcoin is still very far away

Bitcoin are more usable and it make easy your transaction. it is payment system better than traditional payment system. if someone do not take payment by bitcoin you can try another. bitcoin are now widely used. it future are bright.

Every coin has its purpose. Bitcoin doesn't have to be used to buy pizza's when there are hundreds of altcoins that can be used for that purpose. However, prepaid bitcoin cards can be used if they will only take btc

I think that the introduction of this technology could solve this problem and then bitcoin will be able to take on more importance in the world

In my opinion, bitcoin to be used as a payment tool is currently not so much using it. but if there is a problem like that there may be a network failure or obstacle!

Probably because it's a lot harder to steal/clone a credit card than it is to attempt a race attack double spend. Both payment methods are imperfect and I'm not saying one issue is worse than the other, just that I understand the overall wariness on 0-confirmation Bitcoin transactions.

Lightning doesn't have this problem as far as I know though, so it's probably a non-issue at the end of the day.

edit: spelling

Lightning network is just a myth to delay the collapse of BTC scheme. It wont work.

Nice. Do you have any data to back up your claims? I don't know how you can call it a myth because its being tested on mainnet as far as I really don't understand your rationale, you say BTC will collapse and yet you are still here in the forum? What gives?

Not directly, because this topic is made overcomplicated, as many other schemes. When direct data comes available, it will be so obvious, my claims would be worthless from there on.

What are my indirect arguments? Math. For BTC to become a mainstream currency, many conditions need to be met at the same time. One of those is HUGE scaling into mainstream quantities, by means of network bandwith, storage space, computing power and all that same time and at reasonable price. If BTC really "worked" how it is claimed to be working now, achieving those criteria at the same time is impossbile.

I have never bought a Satoshi and I consider BTC a scam. Why Im here? Sceptics can also be interested in some topics at the same time, can they not? I was in a team, that busted KairosPlanet scheme. Bad news for You, but I see tons of similarities.

but it will take a long time. some countries have even banned bitcoin. so first we must accept bitcoin as a currency then integrate it

Bitcoin are now widely useful if someone do not get payment by bitcoin you can avoid them and try to another els. it will make your profit. it's more secure and potential. you have a lot of opportunity to use bitcoin.

If they do not take the Bitcoin payment, then use it somewhere else. Bitcoin is now widely used. Everyone has a lot of good ideas about this. You do this what  say your mind. Buy Bitcoin will give you something profitable.

I think certain people tired less time promotion shit fork forcing developers toview  time on countermeasures as a substitute could of used up time on fix actual issues and we wouldn't be here this time.

Online payment with Bitcoin has become very popular..There were some problems at first..Many of these issues have been resolved..The Lightning Network looks like a great technology and will completely remove the many problems.

It’s seems to be a good one but don't know whether to trust it or not as scam projects has increased a lot. We need to do a research on it so that we can understand that we can use it or not.

I don't believe in the claim made on that website or one pager or whatever it is.

It says the scalability of their project is such that it is capable of making million or billion transactions per seconds? Oh shut up! So you think bitcoin creator was stupid person?

And what about the Visa and MasterCard services who are able to make max 25 to 40K transactions per seconds! Lolz. They need to sell themselves to this company then.

Actually we should not use bitcoin in buying pizza and food items etc. as it has not so much popular now. This will take time to happen. Moreover you can use gift cards for buying presents etc.

finance purpose of bitcoin is for mass adoption. including for paying retail merchant
the future you will understand what is  bitcoin lighting and why many poeople still believe in bitcoin :)

You need to be very patient, all these practicality as a payment method, cheaper transfer and ease of sending Bitcoin will come with time. It is still in the developmental stage and slowly getting matured with time. All we need to do is wait for the right time when such technology will be there for Bitcoin to accept as a payment everywhere around the world.

Bitcoin had a huge transaction cost back in 2017 and early 2018. This has been brought to a minimal amount after numerous development and updates. It will surely take time to develop new technology but new modes of payments are being introduced. Experts say that investing in bitcoin now is like investing in google and apple back in 2005. So have patience.

Lightning network is a solution but how secure is it? To general people it might seem like a normal integration with blockchain, but do keep in mind that the transaction takes place off the blockchain! The lightning network does not have the same trust guarantee like the main bitcoin blockchain. And do keep in mind that the lightning network do need somewhat of central authority to work.

I cannot completely agree with you here as Bitcoin still has a cheaper transaction cost but yes, you need to purchase products or services in bulk for that. Small transactions might prove to be costly. But, hopefully, with time, all the features of Bitcoin will come to a favorable state for everyone to accept it as a ideal payment method.

Well, if the SEC regulation continues or there will be another set of regulations of bitcoin, then that will solve your issue :). What I meant from solve is that, they will create way for the tx will be faster.

If bitcoin developer cannot reduce the blocktime and fees, then the solution is simple. Just use another coins with a fast speed and cheap fee.
Litecoin is one of them. With a same algorithm to mine, it is the Lite version of bitcoin.

you're right, lightning network helps bitcoin transactions, becomes faster and fees become low.

You must understand that lightning has a basic element component, that is LND and BTCD.

I talked a little about lightning network daemons or LND. and LND functions as the main software that drives lightning network, and this is a basic component source.

LND functions to control data, create connections for each node, make and close transactions, and many other functions. and then the LND will need BTCD.

Bitcoin isn’t usable in every field till now. If you want to buy a pizza by bitcoin then it will create a problem because pizza companies don’t allow bitcoin as payment. For the regular purchase, you have to depend on the traditional payment system at least for now.

You should not buy a pizza by using bitcoin as payment method. It is not acceptable by many companies. You can use bitcoin where other party will take it without any hesitation and there would be no problem. Many businesses find it risky to accept bitcoin as payment.

If you find it problematic to pay for a pizza by bitcoin then you should not use it. Bitcoin hasn’t placed that position that a pizza maker will receive payment as bitcoin. You should look for the things that is directly associated with bitcoin.

It's not advisable using Bitcoin to make small payments. It's possible, but it is costly and slower. There has to be a way out though. I have not read much about lighting network. But is it ever going to be implemented? Only time will tell

Bitcoin is safer and more potential. If they do not accept Bitcoin payments, then use it somewhere else. Everyone has a lot of good ideas about this. Buying Bitcoin will give you something profitable.

This is exactly why the Lightning Network was introduced. The idea is for people to use the Lightning Network for all the applications that are linked to micro transactions and the Blockchain for the rest. You can still make your normal tx's on the Blockchain, but it will be a bit more expensive than tx's that are done on the Lightning Network.

The SegWit tx's are currently very cheap, so the settlement of the balances on the Lighting Network channels will also be very cheap.

Buying Bitcoin will give you something profitable. Paying online with Bitcoin has become very popular. Many of these issues have been resolved