Bitcoin Forum

Are you guys going to hold on to your machines or start selling?  Turn off for now and wait it out?

My rigs gives me ~0.6$ per day from each 1060 card. Electricity cost ~0.2$ each card per day. Profit ~0.4$ per day for each 1060. If they will give me more then 0 - they will work. every day I sell extracted coins and hodl profit in btc.

Your question is retorical. To mine or not to mine - depends a lot on your electricity costs, PUE etc. and these things depend on other factors your rig, GPUs, cooling, which country you live in. Also, if you hold your coins, that amount is changing together with the market. Mining is a longterm investment and you can’t really say that it is unprofitable the day the prices drop. As long as you are covering your electricity costs, you are still fine )

As a second scenario, change your mining algo if your rig allows that.

If you are living in 3 world country with high electricity rate then better to stop and wait again for a few months until the mining become profitable again.
But if you still can make a good profit in mining at your current electricity rate why not stay mining and hold and then exchange them if the price increase.

For me, I stay mining even it is not really profitable these days because my power source here is free with a solar panel.

Remember that the new Nvidia cards will be coming soon that I think more efficient and higher performance than the previous cards.

No matter how efficient Nvidia has build these cards pretty much they can't do anything against the army of ASICS that have paralysed home and small farm mining for now. The extreme difficulty increase in pretty much every coin that can be mined with a graphic card cannot be increased that much without ASICS joining in.

I still continue to mine though, even I am at just 5% profit now after removing my electricity cost which is nothing, but I hope that the price of bitcoin will rise high enough in 2019 that my mining in these days would pay back itself then.

I’d find another hobby. Those with more morney than brains have taken this over.  Yea I’m sure the price will pump to some insane level at some point. But surely this goes down as one of the largest scams in history.  It’s all becoming clear why satoshi kept hidden.  Maybe the task force of private detectives will sort this scam out. BR

Time to get creative then mate. Your GPUs can be still used for many things. Like Rendering/Ai Training etc. If you own more than 30 GPUs you can easily get in touch with your local universities and offer their professors/researchers your GPUs to be used for AI training. One of my friends landed a 2 years contract with a local University this way. Same goes for the Rendering. You can look up for Local Animation Studios and get in touch with them. I am sure you will be able to sort something out with them. You may have to transfer these GPUs to their facilities, a small inconvenience but you will still make more money than mining at a loss.

If you believe you aren't comfortable doing this and you think that you can break even by selling your hardware. Then do that immediately.

What do you think is a scam the whole mining aspect of crypto?

GPU mining has certainly become unprofitable, at least for the time being. Has anybody looked into Bitmain's Equihash Antminer (https://www.asicminervalue.com/miners/bitmain/antminer-z9-mini)? It looks profitable to me, but how long it will remain profitable that is another question. Not to mention the noise, you can't mine at home. What do you think is it worth it?

Stfu with all of the noise bs.

I know people who got their investments back in one month with that thing mining zencash.

cry,cry and cry becouse you were so greedy.

Putting all of my cards on ebay this week.  Nvidia's new cards will be announced in about 9 days.  In the time between me selling my cards and the new cards becoming available, I can't see myself missing out on too much profit.

I don't know what next.
Mining is very unprofitable at this moment.
This cryoto market cap is like 1 year ago.

Proof of Stake will kill mining, but as long btc is above ~4.5k$ mining is still profitable for mining farms (or at least for me :p)

That’s good to know. And the Chinese with the cheap cost of machines etc can produce a bitcoin for about half that. So yes the market has a ton more correction left.  Not to mention more efficient machines means they can drop it lower yet.  I mean this is supposed to be a financial settlement protocol. If the price is thru the roof who will use it.  Not the little guy that’s for sure.  I know I waited several days for transactions to process during the 19k hype. Certainly most of that “traffic” was traders dumping on us rubes.  When you have enough money this is just fun for folks. Pump and dumping at our expense. Wealth transfer of the grossest kind. Stock market. Always has to be a greater fool.  Then when that doesn’t happen some more financial tricks come into play. Stock buybacks etc.  it’s such a game.  Yes I could play but that’s against my morals.  Sadly bitcoin is starting to conflict with my morals.  Once that line is crossed I find it hard to look past it.  POS doesn’t work either because again a person with more money than brain cells comes in buys up the stake and then just collects interest at us rubes expense. See a pattern here.  Realize that those saying bitcoin will solve some problem it won’t. What it does do is bring to light many more issues. Financial schemes that are pilfering us peons.  We are wising up tho:)

Mining is on the verge of becoming unprofitable when the market keeps crapping itself on daily bases. But remember, this is not the first time we are going through this situation. I'm not saying that it will become really profitable again, but still...maybe :)

If its anything like the repeat of 2014... then it will be 2 years before mining is profitable again.

At the beginning of 2014, is when mining started to level off and at the end of 2015, most already had shut off their rigs. Sometime in 2015 most people just Craigslisted them or eBayed them.

Then 2016 came around and it was profitable again. Took a while for the difficulty to ramp up because everybody had sold all their GPUs.

Mining with electricity price of 0,07€ kwh. Still profitable and still decent income / ROI if u look vs "normal" investments. Its all about "staying strong" in bad times and see if things gets better. More bigger player you are the more mining works for you, not easy for home miners at this moment if electricity price is high.

all of my rigs are still running until now sometimes I solo mining of shitcoins with a short time and selling all their coins and sometimes mining new coins before launching on the exchange market and those methods are still profitable after electricity costs.

as stated by other members above, mining is now dependent on electricity costs in each country. If the electricity in your country is higher than the income from mining, then you better sell it or turn off your rig.

PoS is garbage, if we were in it for PoS i would have stayed with conventional methods. If you are a firm believer in PoS coins and systems, you should have stuck with banks and investment firms. They are centralized, and its like the movement from a gold backed currency to a non backed government issued currency.

I am planning to mine one more month, and after that I will sell my gpus if mining doesn't become profitable again.
In the meantime I will mine some new coins which could rise in price in few months or a year.

which coins do you mine then? Where do you find them, and how do you select them?

I usually check on coincalculators.io because they show some coins that are not yet listed on whattomine so I can mine more coins at the beginning.
Also I check which coin are recently added to coinmarketcap or ANN threads on bitcointalk forum.
I spend some time to do my own research about the coin which I am planning to mine, but mostly I just pick them randomly.
I did the same with Zclassic in December and it turned out great for me.

Yes its still very profitable if you are willing to do your research and work.
Hint if you are using Nicehash, you ARE NOT doing your research and work.

In my case, I reevaluated the ALGOs my Pool offers, and the profitability of each.
I also checked around some other Pools to see how they performed.
All Pools are not the same.  Some Pools have faster servers, and connections, some have better fees.
But ultimately some pools have better members.  You are better to be in a pool with a bunch of guys with real mining Rigs, and Gbit Fiber connections, than a pool that has attracted the casual gamer who is trying to make money from a single CPU connected to his neighbors Wifi. 
I found better mining software for each of these ALGOs, which resulted in up to a 30% increase in hash rates for some ALGOs.
I put more focus on temperature management.  I moved my rigs to the floor where temps are cooler, and this keeps all my cards under 60C.
This is good both for keeping clock speeds high and the life of the card.
Make sure all Drivers were up to date.
I setup a script to log my Rigs every 60 seconds to make sure they were running, and to database their current ALGOs and stats.
If a Rig seemed to stop running during specific ALGOs, I would inspect it, and determine the problem GPU, and make adjustments on that specific card to the system would keep running.
One of the most important things, was I set a static diffculty for each ALGO on each Rig.  This ensures that auto Diff does not go to high resulting in lost shares on coins with very short block times.

After all these adjustments, I am averaging a little over $2 / day on a 1080 Ti  with occasional spikes of $6 / day on windfalls ( acts of god that take down other pools, network outages, DDOS, Coin Forks )

You have to look at mining as a long term endevor.  Make as many BTC as possible regardless of exchange rates. And Hold them as long as possible.

"Muh moralz"   looooool

mining never dies, because without mining crypto can not live.
Most of coins try change their algo to pos, but it always on mixed mode with pow

this is much worse i believe, unless another big boom(bitcoin price rise x10 or something) start i doubt there will be any profit

Out of curiosity, why do you believe this?
Do you think the (mining) market is saturated and the arbitrage window is closed forever (over-supply)? Or rather that there won't be enough money flowing into crypto in the future to create a sustained price rise (lack of demand)?

Selling the rigs yes.  But the plan is that this becomes unprofitable for most with one exception bitmain and their connections/back door deals.  Checkout canaan new Avalonn mining devices. They making heaters and tv now with mining chips so that people in high energy areas can mine.  Now the tv is stupid but the heater is a home run.  Tv just adds to what it’s needed to run.  Waste heat being reused is a no brainer. I’ve been doing this for years with my s3.  I’ll continue to do that till they quit. So no we aren’t going to shut them down. Even if it costs me more to mine than what’s its worth. It still makes a great heater.  Now tell me again how are you going to compete against that and be profitable.  We’re all ears.  Mining has become a rich mans trick. Beware!!!

BR

The Canaan Avalon 841 is a decent heater indeed. The thing isn't even profitable at the electricity costs I have in London. But for the winter it might work just as well as a Honeywell heat blower to get the laundry to dry quicker.

there is too much competition now you can't compare with the past

there are more gpu out there

Agreed. The washout will be bigger.
But that isn't to say it might pick up again afterwards. Now that could mean a year... or three.

mining ETH gives no profit today. In fact, i would be only 8$ a month after electricity, switching off the machines was a smart move. I don't think ETH will ever recover from this,so if you are mining at a loss, you´ll lose double. Someone in this forums deserves that. He should be eating his nails like hardcore zombie.

If you are thinking of selling, just do it know. Yesterday there was a huge pump of GPUS here in Spain, more than 300 appeared at the same time from the same seller, at 150€ sell. He/she has sold half of those in 1 day.
so selling the equipment will also be at a loss. I bought my 1060 for gaming at 220€ and you can buy them with garanty from seller for 150€ or even cheaper if you leave ebay and buy it personally.


Next? next is put my hands in my pockets and glue them. my rigs with 570's and 580's will get stay with me a bit longer in case by december everything changes, but i highly doubt it.

At today's price of the coins, there will not be any coin to mine profitably.

I think that in the future there will be opportunities not only for mining, but for rendering, you can also switch to other altcoins and mine for investment in the future.

When I sold my mining rigs in 2014, projected ROI was like years, so it just made absolutely no sense to keep mining - plenty of other investment opportunities out there. But we're still not at that point this time, "better" gpus like vega 56 are at about 2 years ROI right now, so it's sad, but not end of the world sad. Although I am thinking about selling a couple of higher-end nvidia rigs myself, just to diversify investments a little bit (or maybe even to get the new nvidia cards instead of those, if they're really good and affordable). And I'll also probably get rid of "weak cards" rigs, the ones that were built during the craze of winter 17-18 with rx 550/560 cards (cause nothing else was in stock).. doesn't seem efficient to run such weak cards right now in relatively pricey z370-based systems. I am keeping mid-range/older polaris/pascal cards though, don't feel like selling those rx 470/480 4gb and 1060/3 cards for peanuts, they're still good for mining.

This was all a huge mess and it ended in the worse possible outcome, people got so stupid at mining that common sense was nonexistent, buying titan v for $3k to mine, rx 580 for $1000, gtx 1080ti or vega for $1500, using celeron to mine ehhe, even integrated gpu, come on, it got to a point where stupidity was the only thing for those people. Here i'm hoping most of those trolls committed suicide and if not then are in debt and learnt their lesson.

At the moment high end FPGA's have an ROI of around 330-350 days, they have suffered like everything else, but they do have the advantage of consuming almost no electricity compared to their hash rate (gross revenue is about 9-10x electrical cost).

The quoted post probably sums up every immature gamer out there who wasn't able to take advantage of the GPU mining opportunity. So many mining haters are now coming out of the woods and bashing the hell out of miners.

Don't be afraid to sell your GPUs. The fact remains, mining was extremely profitable for those who got in early, selling GPUs now is a great way to hedge value or further increase profits.

make free electricity, then your miner will always be profitable (as long as Cryptocurrency is worth).

nah, far from that.

There is no free electricity in the world other than sunbath, if somebody does not receive the bill to pay then trust me somebody will pay that bill, also if people use solar power and they say they have free electricity then they are lying cause one way or the other they or somebody else have paid for that electricity they claim is free.

I said "make free electricity"
in the word "make" that is where you pay (invest).
you can "make" all that is required (cables, alternators, buildings, etc.) by your own strength.
If the case is like this then you "buy = pay" with your strength/energy.
or you can buy (use money) everything you need and pay people to do it, then you "buy it = make it" with your money.

then after that you will get what I mean by "free electricity".

If we describe the word "free" as you describe it, then even "sunbath" is not free, because we have to pay using the time we have, and in the end there is no need for the word "free" in this world.
And if there is a solar power user coming to you and he says he has free electricity, he is not lying to you. he just tried to say if he used electricity without paying bills. Trust Me ;)

This makes no sense. There are no ways to "make free electricity", not even cheap electricity. Solar electric systems are way more expensive than what standard electricity providers charge in most parts of the world, last time I looked into it the ROI on the equipment was 10-20 years or something at best, and even after that you're not getting "free" electricity with solar since you'll have to do regular maintenance and replace batteries and other components on regular basis. And converting petrol or some natural gas into electricity is also never cheap (and certainly not free). The only way to get "free" electricity is to steal it, but even that is obviously not free (and just a stupid business decision in general considering the risks involved).

I´m so happy  ;). All mining equipment sold.
Now, I have time for holidays   8) .

Something tells me that FPGA mining is still very profitable and brand new to the scene.  The devices cost a lot up front, but it's the future of mining with prices dropping and electricity costs being so high...... I even hear some countries have outlawed crypto mining.

It was once a long long time ago ... FPGA´s are used for Bitcoin mining.

So true and even if somebody steal it, somebody else will pay the bill.

Its still profitable. In any investment (not in crypto world only), depreciation and setup expenses should be counted as a cost for calculating the profitability. Only you can calculate repair/maintenance, electritic and if exist time*costs expenses.
Even in low market, for eample ETH still enough profitable.

it depends to what project you are mining.. if you are mining a coin that you think its unprofitable then you are so dumb lazy to mine that coin.. its much better to find a new coin that is really profitable :P

Turned off my rigs yesterday. Mining does not pay anymore.

please understand my words carefully
I tried to say that "make" = "buy/pay", to clarify the use of the word "free".
And yes, solar power is not free even if you can make all the components by yourself, you still have to exchange them for your energy.
Or even if your grandmother gives you a piece of cake it is also not really free because you have to pay it with your sweet smile.
but what I mean is that if you interpret the word "free" very critically, the word "free" doesn't need to be in this world.

As far as I understand, the use of the word "free" is not like that.

I do not feel guilty if I say : "hey, I found a cool site that gives free bitcoin, check this https://freebitco.in "
(unless there is a rule that prohibits this in this forum, but I don't know because I'm a newbie.)
Then you say : "it's not free, we still have to move our fingers to solve the captcha"

Truly we are seeing a lot folks shutting down rigs

unless the price goes up some machines could go rest

this bear market pours blood unto miners profit

Hope a pump for the new arrival of hardwares

It's only unprofitable because of electricity costs. So, eliminate your electric costs and go solar. After you break even, it's all profit from there!

Solar is okay-ish but it takes a lot of panels and a lot of batteries to provide for a good-sized GPU mining operation.  I'm still looking for an ideal power production solution.  Maybe there would be some incorporation of hydr, solar, wind, etc in order to produce say 10K watts continuous or more of power independently and off the grid.  Let me know when the price for installation of something like that gets down to about $1 per watt continuous (i.e. $10K for 10Kwatts continuous power)

Maybe by the year 2050?

I am focusing on market psychology, and where digital currency markets are trending.

Unless the carbon footprint can't be lowered somehow, then I wouldn't consider the hardware to be obsolete.

I am focused on efficient mining, along with an attached regressive value.

https://ebay.us/ZbWsl0

Got me thinking cause power is valuable with or without mining...guess like 3 or 4 years break even...self install and maintain is no problem

One thing we got in Texas is good sun.

These are just cheap Chinese panels. You do realize that to get stable electricity working you need a shitload of other expensive stuff? Batteries and all the controlling electronics etc. Solar power is not cheap, it's one of the most expensive ways to get electricity at the moment actually. People that go for it are mostly interested in being "off the grid", doing a fun tech project, and trying to be eco-friendly. No one in their right mind switch to solar power to save on electricity bills, cause solar is way more expensive than other sources in most parts of the world.

So true and like you said, mainly off-grid cause is stupid going solar if you pay less than $0.20 per khw but i guess some people will never understand what you said because for them once they break even they get free power which is a lie cause there a constant maintenance for that electricity and in the end is tends to be a lot more expensive than most power providers offer and a lot more work, mining is the same thing, too much work for peanuts right now, why mine while you can buy coins cheaper than you would pay to produce, these prices will not last long cause the people selling right now are losing everytime they sell/cash out for usd or other currency.

There are over supply of GTX Cards in the market. I highly suggest to sell it the lowest price possible(Competition Wise). Because you'll never knew the next day, the price you're trying to sell it, looks over price to others. I'm one of GTX 1070 holder here that has been selling it for month. No luck at all.

I will keep my cards as there could be a sudden rise of mining profit if the market turns.

Don't spread FUD.

If your'e scrappy and hustle you can get an 8kW array (US or EU panels) with hybrid inverter + mounting for $8000 USD. The battery depending on chemistry will be another $2000 - $6000 - also factoring in sizing, depth of discharge, etc.

Theres no maintenance if you install properly, maybe occasionally dusting off the panels if your climate is like that.

The payback ~2 years at 95%+ utilization if you're paying $0.10/kW from the utility

You have to change the battery often, it will last only few cycles, your 2 years is misleading, more like 10 years if you pay $0.10 per khw and 20 years if $0.20 per khw. Panels last only 10 years or so, some trolls say 20 years which is also misleading cause  okay 20 years and 30% of what used to offer at beginning, panels degrade with time, you have to change them. There is no end to solar power maintenance.

How much are you asking for it?

This is why new solutions like GRID-TIED solar arrays are more profitable and easier to maintain. Just freakin plug the inverter into your normal circuit and you are good to go. I feel that solar setups using batteries are not profitable and are for those doomsday preppers who expect the whole world to explode.

Solar can be profitable, if you know what you are doing.

Well my reply was for off-grid, grid tied totally eliminates the battery if done correctly, many power providers offer the service however most want to buy your electricity for much less than what they sell to you, they are such trolls hehe

Well if you're not careful you'll still blow something up but if you do you're research, power from the sun aint bad.

Use Lithium-ion or newer chemistries, you'll get quite a few years and 80%+ DoD, no  battery changing
Panels made in 2013+ degrade 10% after 6+ years and are rated to produce at least 80% after 20+ years or replaced free under warranty.


If you grid tie with solar you can usually negotiate time of day rates and negotiate <0.06/kW at night depending on the area.

Yea non-1:1 net metering is a huge rip off. gotta email your local politician to vote against that shit.

Sadly, you're wrong. There will be new cards in the market so technically there would be a huge gap between the new cards and older cards in terms of hashrate/power cost profitability. The Pascal cards will soon become not profitable for mining.

if you look at the fact that people don't always understand what you are doing, maybe not the price of production of a thing))) joke

it's easier to speculate. production has become too expensive and unjustified. for half a year of mining you can trade so much!

Sell the rigs before the price crash further, its already unprofitable before FPGA comes to market. I wonder what happen when it does.

There are still months away before FPGA being widely used.  The popular models are running into supply problem, and the mining software is limited so only handful of algo can be mined at the moment (except those programmed privately). 
I would say same goes to the new GPU, the supply will be very limited in the first few months.  You won't be in a huge disadvantage until a year later if you mine with current generation of GPU.

I have solar and save any were from 20 to 110 a month on Electricity depends on the weather and time of year, an i mine with four rigs and run a few outdated ASIC miner from time to time using solar and use more Electricity now and pay less. to me there full of it to ...I'm on grid were I live have to be by law i can't go off grid. my whole house is on solar.


Solar is cheat, unless you don't shop around . I hate to see others mislead others to  ...

an my power company is greedily an asking my state to raise rates for there investor get that there investor the power company doesn't need it but there backer do,greedily fucker.

solar was cheaper in the US and going down till trump put that lame ass import/export tax on it. on if they don't want to put solar on there house join a solar farm an save in most states you can, if you live in the US some states have to offer it the power company can't stop it by law,they do try though by trying to make some states charge a solar tax by lobbying.
The US is so Corrupt right now it's not funny, none of those trying to take out the US need the money it's BS if they say things cost to  much it's there greedy Corrupt ways that fucks us that includes mining and gear .

I Agree some one pays it, i dislike using the term " Free electricity" because i know some one pays it one way or the other so it's not free even if you have renewal it's not free and in most states in the US if you live here by law you can't go off grid.

The only future for mining is at scale. https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-mining_profitability.html  The trend of all mineable coins tell the real story here. Stop lining the pockets of these asic manufacturers. They understand this all too well.  I really think that this project could fall on its face. Yes some good things came from crypto but all in all I think we seen our ath.  ESP with it being a 2-3 year bear market this will be the end of most at home miners.  Unless your not paying the power bill. But someone has to right?   Your robbing peter to pay Paul at that point.  I’ve learned my lesson.  Try to take on the established system and you get a good hard slapping.  Right where it hurts the most. Your money. Or in another words your ability to live and eat is in jeopardy.  Yea they will say don’t invest more than you can afford to lose.  Damn were they right.  Cuz when it’s manipulated to the nth degree you are guaranteed to lose your ass.  Don’t be a rube to this system.  Mining is dead.  And if crypto really depended on decentralization like they all want you to believe then some if not all these coins should be worthless.  But as in this crazy world what’s right is wrong and what’s wrong is right so I expect nothing less here.  Just a great smoke screen to part people of their money.  It’s really a damn shame.  

Not really. The mining is not yet dead. There are persons who believe in it. They mine even at a loss and they pay the electricity bill because they look into a greater picture which is the long term profitability of the cryptos. I believe that the market will recover soon and smart people will be the ones who never stopped mining no matter the problems you pose in your post.

I have a bit of issue on the smart people mining at a loss.  They only look smart if this actually recovers.  What will you say of them if the price dumps to 0.  Anyway I shouldn’t have said mining is dead your right there.  Mining with possibility of roi and turning a small profit is dead.  Unless you can dump millions into it. So again this goes right up to those with money.  Yes crypto has a long long hard road ahead of it.  It’s ideals are falling on its face

I don't understand mining at loss too.  If you believe in future of crypto you should buy at market price, instead of mining at loss.  You can buy more coins for the money than mining it.

One more thing.  It’s not even the money I invested that burns my ass.  It’s the countless hours being up through the night worrying about whether I had anything left to my name.  Pump and dump overnight has ruined so many.  Checking on miners staying up t date on code etc. I gave it my all to help support the network.  I even overlooked technical flaws hoping that it would flourish.  I see now crypto has become a rich mans trick.  Mostly run by Bitmain.  If that doesn’t turn you off then you don’t understand what was trying to be done with crypto.  And that’s a sad story in itself

i

If your mining and not selling asap then you are not doing it with your best intentions in mind.  Do what’s best for you is what crypto is about.  Be your own bank.  Fuck relying on others to be the determining factor as to whether I make it or not.  That’s what your doing by mining and holding coins. Hoping that others will come along and give a boost to your profits.  I say mine and sell immediately. The juice isn’t worth the squeeze as I like to say.  The risks far outweigh the rewards in this game. 

I have some profit from mining. Every 100 mh gives me about 50 dollars per month at the moment while mining Ethereum. I think that in few months it will have better price.

Historically mining and selling during a bear market was never a good idea.

Bitcoin had many bear markets and the true hodl'ers mined and kept all their precious BTC throughout and years and they sold it during a bull market.

This is no different than mining last November where ETH profits were less than optimal. If you only held 2 more months you could of sold at $1400.

Keep in mind, when you are selling your ETH, obviously someone is buying it. And they are buying it to sell at the next ATH.