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Title: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: bitmover on August 20, 2018, 04:08:37 AM Chaos and confusion erupted across Venezuela, and most stores were shuttered on Saturday, after president Nicolas Maduro announced that the government would enact a massive currency devaluation, implement a new minimum wage, hike taxes, and also raise gasoline prices for most citizens even as the country struggles with the greatest hyperinflation on record, surpassing even that of the Weimar Republic. As a result of the enacted actions, the new version of the bolivar will be pegged to the value of the state cryptocurrency, the etro, which according to Bloomberg amounts to a 95% devaluation of the official rate, and will trade in line with where the black market was; the government will also raise the minimum wage more than 3,000 percent, which works out to about $30 a month. Maduro said the new currency, set to enter circulation on Monday, will be called the "sovereign bolivar" and will be based on the petro, which is valued at $60 or 3,600 sovereign bolivars, after the redenomination planned for August 20 slashes five zeroes off the national currency. The minimum wage will be set at half that, 1,800 sovereign bolivars. The government would cover the minimum wage increase at small and medium-size companies for 90 days, Maduro added. It was not clear what happens after. "They've dollarized our prices. I am petrolizing salaries and petrolizing prices," Maduro explained in a Friday televised address. "We are going to convert the petro into the reference that pegs the entire economy's movements." .... The package of measures combine the necessary with the baffling, Luis Vicente Leon, president of the Caracas-based pollster Datanalisis, said in a Twitter post on Friday. “The government has recognized the need to anchor the economy to an external variable outside of its control, such as the international price of oil. A wise decision, but it does so by hiding it in a vehicle that suffers from lack of confidence and viability, such as the Petro,” Leon said.K After stealing the whole country economy, Maduro will try this plan of using the new currency pegged to Petro (crypto). I think that the idea to have a currency pegged to oil barrils is interesting. However he has no credibility, I doubt it will work. I believe that Soon his cryptocurrency will be worthless and this new Bolivar will face high inflation rates as well. He knows that. Soon people will be buying it a lot cheaper in the black market, not matter how much he says the new Bolivar is worth. So he plans includes create a very large exchange network (where government control the rates) . That's not how economy and free market works. People will always find a way to trade bolivars for dollars or any other currency for their real price rates. Maduro also said he intends to create a unified exchange rate across the country. The new petro-to-dollar-to-bolivar rate would bring the official price of one US dollar to six million (or 60 post-redenomination), which is about the same as the current black market exchange rate and about 25 times worse than the official rate. To implement the bizarre plan, information Minister Jorge Rodriguez said Saturday the government will open 300 currency exchange kiosks in hotels, airports and shopping malls as part of a bid to supersede the country’s black market.K Source: https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-08-19/venezuela-chaos-after-maduro-announces-massive-95-devaluation-new-fx-rate-tied Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: bitmover on August 20, 2018, 04:48:06 PM Bump
This subject is so interesting and crypto related that I can't believe nobody wants to say anything. My topic is lost in the spam sea that the economics board became :/ Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: KingScorpio on August 20, 2018, 05:43:13 PM Chaos and confusion erupted across Venezuela, and most stores were shuttered on Saturday, after president Nicolas Maduro announced that the government would enact a massive currency devaluation, implement a new minimum wage, hike taxes, and also raise gasoline prices for most citizens even as the country struggles with the greatest hyperinflation on record, surpassing even that of the Weimar Republic. As a result of the enacted actions, the new version of the bolivar will be pegged to the value of the state cryptocurrency, the etro, which according to Bloomberg amounts to a 95% devaluation of the official rate, and will trade in line with where the black market was; the government will also raise the minimum wage more than 3,000 percent, which works out to about $30 a month. Maduro said the new currency, set to enter circulation on Monday, will be called the "sovereign bolivar" and will be based on the petro, which is valued at $60 or 3,600 sovereign bolivars, after the redenomination planned for August 20 slashes five zeroes off the national currency. The minimum wage will be set at half that, 1,800 sovereign bolivars. The government would cover the minimum wage increase at small and medium-size companies for 90 days, Maduro added. It was not clear what happens after. "They've dollarized our prices. I am petrolizing salaries and petrolizing prices," Maduro explained in a Friday televised address. "We are going to convert the petro into the reference that pegs the entire economy's movements." .... The package of measures combine the necessary with the baffling, Luis Vicente Leon, president of the Caracas-based pollster Datanalisis, said in a Twitter post on Friday. “The government has recognized the need to anchor the economy to an external variable outside of its control, such as the international price of oil. A wise decision, but it does so by hiding it in a vehicle that suffers from lack of confidence and viability, such as the Petro,” Leon said.K After stealing the whole country economy, Maduro will try this plan of using the new currency pegged to Petro (crypto). I think that the idea to have a currency pegged to oil barrils is interesting. However he has no credibility, I doubt it will work. I believe that Soon his cryptocurrency will be worthless and this new Bolivar will face high inflation rates as well. He knows that. Soon people will be buying it a lot cheaper in the black market, not matter how much he says the new Bolivar is worth. So he plans includes create a very large exchange network (where government control the rates) . That's not how economy and free market works. People will always find a way to trade bolivars for dollars or any other currency for their real price rates. Maduro also said he intends to create a unified exchange rate across the country. The new petro-to-dollar-to-bolivar rate would bring the official price of one US dollar to six million (or 60 post-redenomination), which is about the same as the current black market exchange rate and about 25 times worse than the official rate. To implement the bizarre plan, information Minister Jorge Rodriguez said Saturday the government will open 300 currency exchange kiosks in hotels, airports and shopping malls as part of a bid to supersede the country’s black market.K Source: https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-08-19/venezuela-chaos-after-maduro-announces-massive-95-devaluation-new-fx-rate-tied maduro is your wizard, he does his hokus pokus tricks so he and his state apparatus can take what they want. if pedro is indeed exchangable for oil it might be used for oil trade. but oil is increasingly insiginificant with electrocars comming out. regards Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: just_Alice on August 20, 2018, 06:38:02 PM Well, the intentions are great, nothing can worsen economical situation in Venezuela already, I guess, but this looks more like a show-off, illusion that the government is implementing something for the good of nation, but for a fact it's just another opportunity to steal even more from the country. What's the point of full-controlling the exchange rates? It's market manipulation in your own country and people will get it very soon and won't buy much of Petro then. Due to this the demand will be minimal and the govs will probably make false prices, which will cause another inflation, you're right. Only IF they really make national currency pegged to oil, which I doubt, there will be some chances to prevent this case scenario.
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: DooMAD on August 20, 2018, 07:57:07 PM I'm still conflicted on this one. One the one hand, it's clearly an attempt by Maduro to cling to power. He's a despot. I sincerely doubt he cares in the slightest about all the people in his country affected by his total mismanagement of the economy. I don't think this initiative will do anything to help the average Venezuelan.
On the other hand, I like the fact they're giving the finger to "Team America: World Police". US foreign policy has pretty much become a blight on humanity at this point. They are categorically not making the world a safer place. More countries need to defy their increasingly absurd will. If state-backed cryptocurrencies become the new norm for doing this, I'm okay with that. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: hatshepsut93 on August 20, 2018, 08:35:18 PM If state-backed cryptocurrencies become the new norm for doing this, I'm okay with that. They won't. Economic pressure is much more than simply cutting a country from banking services, it involves control over all export and import. Companies from countries that impose sanctions won't do business with sanctioned countries like Venezuela because it's not worth the risk of committing a crime. And countries that oppose the US could have created their own alternative payment network long ago, but they probably already have a good way for settlement with each other, so even decentralized cryptocurrencies won't become a revolution here. Also, Russia is so paranoid that Bitcoin comes from CIA that there's no chance it will be officially recognized in the near future. Maybe other dictators share this feeling towards cryptocurrency. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: Samaaliu on August 20, 2018, 10:00:45 PM It is actually good to see a country having interest in cryptocurrency. But pegging an entire economy to it I believe is a much too risk which the government is about to take. What if the price of the crypto crashes badly and not in line with the price of oil? What would the government do?
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: Hydrogen on August 21, 2018, 11:03:58 AM Venezuela could print lower quantities of fiat currency to stabilize the value of the bolivar.
Why does this not happen? I would be interested to know if there is a good explanation. Unless Maduro's goal was to deliberately take one of the more prosperous south american nations, devalue its fiat currency and obliterate its economy. Its difficult to imagine how something like this happens. And continues to happen. Bitcoin gives people hope. It could be the only thing keeping many venezuelans from starvation. Bitcoin is a symbol of hope, solidarity and value. I don't know that I agree with Maduro taking something which symbolizes hope and associating it with the failure that is his regime. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: tomahawk9 on August 21, 2018, 12:22:12 PM Unless Maduro's goal was to deliberately take one of the more prosperous south american nations, devalue its fiat currency and obliterate its economy. Its difficult to imagine how something like this happens. And continues to happen. Bitcoin gives people hope. It could be the only thing keeping many venezuelans from starvation. Bitcoin is a symbol of hope, solidarity and value. No, Bitcoin isn't the only thing keeping them from starvation, the dollar is. People are selling dollars for fiat currency to survive, and from what I've read, those dollars come from Paypal, gift cards, Uphold, Bitcoin, pretty much any type of online payments system that uses the dollar is being used to sell dollars for their worthless Bolivar in the black market.Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: davis196 on August 21, 2018, 12:26:52 PM The oil production in Venezuela decreased a lot and actually Venezuela is importing oil anf gas.That's why the idea of the oil-backed PEDRO currency is doomed to fail.Anyway,why the hell there's no revolution or rebellion against Maduro and the government?It looks like they are still popular amongst 50% of the population of Venezuela despite all the hyperinflation and economic disaster.
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: jseverson on August 21, 2018, 01:06:38 PM It looks like they are still popular amongst 50% of the population of Venezuela despite all the hyperinflation and economic disaster. They really aren't. Millions have already fled the country, and there's a lot of discontent. Maduro effectively controls the entire government though, so little is done about his regime. As for why revolutions aren't taking place, well, he's basically buying the military's loyalty (https://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/world/americas/venezuela/article210233099.html), a typical dictator move. Either way, I'm pretty sure his days at the top are numbered. He's going to run out of band-aids at some point, not that they've exactly been effective up to now. Bitcoin gives people hope. It could be the only thing keeping many venezuelans from starvation. Only if they've already stashed some beforehand, and even then that will run out. The same could also be said about USD or EUR. What they earn is barely enough for necessities so it may be smarter for them to prioritize that. Their only real hope is getting the hell out, hopefully with more non-shit money to spare. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: vlad230 on August 21, 2018, 01:20:26 PM It still amazes me how one man can do so much damage in a countries economy, pushing its people into extreme poverty and nobody being able to do anything about it... It's sad that this is happening to the Venezuelan people.
I see this move to crypto as a desperate attempt to save the economy but he still doesn't get it. The more decentralized they go the worse it will be to the country as no one in their right mind would invest in something started by a dictator. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: Lucius on August 21, 2018, 02:07:40 PM The oil production in Venezuela decreased a lot and actually Venezuela is importing oil anf gas.That's why the idea of the oil-backed PEDRO currency is doomed to fail.Anyway,why the hell there's no revolution or rebellion against Maduro and the government?It looks like they are still popular amongst 50% of the population of Venezuela despite all the hyperinflation and economic disaster. I did not know and makes no sense that Venezuela which has the largest oil_reserves (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_proven_oil_reserves) in the world import oil and gas, is there any evidence for that, any link ? Why there is no revolution is good question, but in country which have dictator like Maduro this is not easy to achieve - any such attempt is crushed at its very beginnings, military and police take care that this does not happen. Also hundreds of thousands have left the country, by some data almost 1 million people emigrated from Venezuela-migration-situation (https://reliefweb.int/report/colombia/venezuelan-migration-situation-report-no-1-24-april-2018) . So a large number of dissatisfied already gone, critical mass has decreased a chance for some serious change is very low. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: markj113 on August 21, 2018, 02:16:53 PM Venezuela has "heavy oil" that requires significant additonal treatments to make it useable.
Quote Heavy oil usually contains significantly higher contents of asphaltenes The presence of asphaltenes, chemically altered fragments of organic chemical compounds, in oil can greatly complicate the production process. Subsequently, certain asphaltene elements require that the heavy oil also undergo a special refining process called deasphalting. The chemical composition of asphaltenes can consist of various amounts of sulphur, oxygen, hydrogen, nitrogen, carbon, and the heavy metals nickel and vanadium and are widely recognized as soluble. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: bitmover on August 21, 2018, 02:32:14 PM It still amazes me how one man can do so much damage in a countries economy, pushing its people into extreme poverty and nobody being able to do anything about it... It's sad that this is happening to the Venezuelan people. I see this move to crypto as a desperate attempt to save the economy but he still doesn't get it. The more decentralized they go the worse it will be to the country as no one in their right mind would invest in something started by a dictator. The population tried to remove him through protests, but they were repressed. They tried through election, but they were fraudulent. They tried to kill him with a drone last month, but the attack failed. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-venezuela-politics/venezuelas-maduro-says-drone-blast-was-bid-to-kill-him-blames-colombia-idUSKBN1KP0SA Now Venezuelans are refugees in Brazil http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2018-07/12/c_137319054.htm (they don't know we are fucked up too lol) Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: 1Referee on August 21, 2018, 03:39:32 PM They tried to kill him with a drone last month, but the attack failed. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-venezuela-politics/venezuelas-maduro-says-drone-blast-was-bid-to-kill-him-blames-colombia-idUSKBN1KP0SA It's actually more than questionable since a drone can be accurately tasked to do something, even when it's equiped with whatever explosives making its steering less responsive. With the right amount of training one should be able to overcome that difficulty, especially if the task is getting rid of someone of this nature. I strongly believe it's just Maduro himself that orchestrated this whole "attack" to justify his military spending and whatnot. The response of the guards quickly protecting Maduro after the explosions is just as questionable. It's not human's nature to react like that, regardless of how trained you are. They probably knew it wasn't an actual attack as well. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: omfg.xekcep on August 21, 2018, 04:10:43 PM The main idea is interesting especially if the new cryptocurrency will be bound with crude oil to reflect its price in some proportion based on a formula as, for example, 80% WTI or Brent. I guess this idea can help Venezuela to attract investor's money quite rapidly because there are lots traders who trade oil forwards and futures so they could be interested on buying the new asset which is based on crude oil. By the way everybody may make sure that crude oil is a superb asset for speculators because the most part of time crude oil is in a trend. I would like to caveat retail investors that in the current moment of time investing in crude oil is quite risky because crude oil has doubled its price from about 40$ to about 80$ (I mean Brent as an example) since this year and there will be probably a correction in this asset so be careful when investing in oil based assets.
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: audaciousbeing on August 21, 2018, 04:36:03 PM It still amazes me how one man can do so much damage in a countries economy, pushing its people into extreme poverty and nobody being able to do anything about it... It's sad that this is happening to the Venezuelan people. It's most times not about one man that is trying frantically to pull his country down. Its a function of either the economic status of the country and managers of that country. For a country that is import dependent throwing tantrums to several world power countries or a country that is oil dependent without any back up plan, the crash of oil price below their projected revenue couple with problem with world powers above, there is bound to be a problem. While there is need to apportion blame to the political head, most of the time they are helpless against the forces against them.I see this move to crypto as a desperate attempt to save the economy but he still doesn't get it. The more decentralized they go the worse it will be to the country as no one in their right mind would invest in something started by a dictator. Desperate times like they say calls for desperate measures and that is the case of what they are doing as they are trying frantically to stay above waters which is about to drown them the moment public outcry is added to the whatever they are facing currently. The result of this move might be counterproductive but to them, its the best course of action at the moment. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: pitiflin on August 21, 2018, 10:01:43 PM On the other hand, I like the fact they're giving the finger to "Team America: World Police". US foreign policy has pretty much become a blight on humanity at this point. They are categorically not making the world a safer place. More countries need to defy their increasingly absurd will. If state-backed cryptocurrencies become the new norm for doing this, I'm okay with that. They never were making the World a better or a safer place. Petro is going to be a big fail, there was not really much thought put into it, Venezuela is in a bad state, it always was, but things are only getting worse. The Government is outright thrash. They don't know how to do things, or how to control the public. It's most times not about one man that is trying frantically to pull his country down. started by a dictator. Trying? He already has pulled his country down, look how bad the state of Venezuela is. It's actually more than questionable since a drone can be accurately tasked to do something, even when it's equiped with whatever explosives making its steering less responsive. With the right amount of training one should be able to overcome that difficulty, especially if the task is getting rid of someone of this nature. The ISIS terrorists groups own a lot of these drones and have tested them, there are drones specially designed for these purposes. I strongly believe it's just Maduro himself that orchestrated this whole "attack" to justify his military spending and whatnot. The response of the guards quickly protecting Maduro after the explosions is just as questionable. It's not human's nature to react like that, regardless of how trained you are. They probably knew it wasn't an actual attack as well. As much as I would like to believe that Maduro orchestrated this attack,he probably didn't. A whole economy hates him, he's a total jerk. There are way too many motives to kill that one guy. Looks like that's the main objetive of the leaders (Maduro & co) that are causing such an economic collapse. They know that they'll have more control and power over the citizens the more chaos they create, the govt knows that by increasing the minimum wage so drastically, many private companies will need to dependant on the govt, I bet that's exactly what the govt wants: to destroy or weaken the private sector so that everyone depends on the state. This is gonna fuck things up for him in the future,is all I can say. I still have to read a little more on this topic than commenting any further. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: robbietobby on August 21, 2018, 11:50:50 PM "One likely outcome is that inflation, which already was forecast to reach 1 million percent this year, will get fresh fuel from the measures. Prices are currently rising at an annualized rate of 108,000 percent, according to Bloomberg’s Café con Leche index. A massive exodus of Venezuelans fleeing the crisis to neighboring countries will likely increase and with it, tensions and restrictions like the ones seen over the past few days."
-----> That is very intriguing. I've seen a lot of sacrifices in people and now the devaluation of money. What will now happen to the people living with their life and wants to live their own lifestyle. We are married to our own happiness and now this happen? It is suspected that the ISIS terrorists groups own a lot of these drones and have tested them, there are drones specially designed for these purposes. The population tried to remove through protests, but they were repressed. They tried through election, but they were fraudulent. How crucial that there is these belongings of Venezuelan immigrants burnt by residents of the Brazilian border town of Pacaraima. :( Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: stompix on August 23, 2018, 10:30:14 PM On the other hand, I like the fact they're giving the finger to "Team America: World Police". US foreign policy has pretty much become a blight on humanity at this point. They are categorically not making the world a safer place. More countries need to defy their increasingly absurd will. If state-backed cryptocurrencies become the new norm for doing this, I'm okay with that. Yeah, giving the finger to the ones that are keeping you and your country alive. The moment the US bans at least oil trade not a full embargo on Venezuela, the country will be sent from the stone age directly into the Mesozoic. Why there is no revolution is good question, but in country which have dictator like Maduro this is not easy to achieve - any such attempt is crushed at its very beginnings, military and police take care that this does not happen. Also hundreds of thousands have left the country, by some data almost 1 million people emigrated from Venezuela-migration-situation (https://reliefweb.int/report/colombia/venezuelan-migration-situation-report-no-1-24-april-2018) . So a large number of dissatisfied already gone, critical mass has decreased a chance for some serious change is very low. Its actually because, nobody wants a real revolution... The things are so bad in Venezuela that there are only two solutions -pray to the great Karhu that oil prices go up -massive cuts in government spending And since the first one is pretty obvious it won't work the second threatens millions of government employees. They won't let a revolution happen, they cling to their positions which at least now it grants them a bit of food, they will do anything to prevent it. With the support of those, with the military that is also dependent on government paychecks, with the support of fanatics that still believe the US is to blame for it, with the silence of the many that indirectly depend on the former and the fear of change from others...nothing will change. Even the opposition knows that even with Maduro gone, the way back out of this mess will be even harder than what's happening now. The only thing we will see in Venezuela is how the end of a country looks like. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: CaVO32 on August 23, 2018, 10:57:13 PM it's not all about crypto just to address what's happening with their current situation. political leaders should think of other solid solutions rather than focusing themselves in the technology that they are not really expert with.
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: DooMAD on August 23, 2018, 11:13:57 PM On the other hand, I like the fact they're giving the finger to "Team America: World Police". US foreign policy has pretty much become a blight on humanity at this point. They are categorically not making the world a safer place. More countries need to defy their increasingly absurd will. If state-backed cryptocurrencies become the new norm for doing this, I'm okay with that. Yeah, giving the finger to the ones that are keeping you and your country alive. The moment the US bans at least oil trade not a full embargo on Venezuela, the country will be sent from the stone age directly into the Mesozoic. In the sense that you could put a gun to someone's head and then claim that you're "keeping them alive" until the moment you pull the trigger, sure. But at some point you have to consider if the situation would be improved by removing your involvement from the equation. Obviously the US are incapable of that, though. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: camps74 on August 24, 2018, 05:07:47 AM It seems like Venezuela may be the first country to have its national currency be crypto. I have been hearing about them attempting this for quite sometime now. I believe the government run cryptos will start in South America.
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: bitmover on August 24, 2018, 10:25:27 AM Its actually because, nobody wants a real revolution... The things are so bad in Venezuela that there are only two solutions -pray to the great Karhu that oil prices go up -massive cuts in government spending Cutting spends is not enough at this point. Maduro, chaves etc, needs to be removed completely from the country. They have literally robbed the country economy. They have expelled all big private companies from the county and robbed their infrastructure. There is not even food anymore in the country, and corruption is on bizarre levels. Look at this news: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2015/08/10/hugo-chavez-daughter-is-richest-individual-in-venezuela-report-claims.html Quote On more than one occasion the late Venezuelan president Hugo Chávez declared that being rich is bad, often adding “Rich people attack me for saying that, but I claim it is bad.” His favorite daughter, however, may disagree. According to the Miami-based Diario Las América, Venezuelan media sources will soon publish materials showing that María Gabriela Chávez has bank accounts in the U.S. and Andorra with assets totaling nearly $4.2 billion. This what real socialism is about: robbery, corruption, hunger.. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: embargo on August 24, 2018, 10:58:43 AM It seems to me that the idea of attaching a currency to a crypto currency will be a failure for Venezuela. With hyperinflation, when the flywheel is tempted, it is possible to stop devaluation of the local currency only by fundamental reforms in the economy, which is not happening in this country. The fall will continue.
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: stompix on August 24, 2018, 02:16:12 PM On the other hand, I like the fact they're giving the finger to "Team America: World Police". US foreign policy has pretty much become a blight on humanity at this point. They are categorically not making the world a safer place. More countries need to defy their increasingly absurd will. If state-backed cryptocurrencies become the new norm for doing this, I'm okay with that. Yeah, giving the finger to the ones that are keeping you and your country alive. The moment the US bans at least oil trade not a full embargo on Venezuela, the country will be sent from the stone age directly into the Mesozoic. In the sense that you could put a gun to someone's head and then claim that you're "keeping them alive" until the moment you pull the trigger, sure. But at some point you have to consider if the situation would be improved by removing your involvement from the equation. Obviously the US are incapable of that, though. What gun is the US putting at Maduro's head? Threatening him that they won't buy oil? Probably the lamest threat ever.... And speaking of giving the finger to the US, there is another country that far goes above anything Venezuela has done. Vietnam, after 40 years of "giving the finger" to the US , writing books on how they defeated the US, on how strong they are, how the US is the evilest thing on this planet....are down on all fours wagging their tails and licking asses to make sure the US protects their country (https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-vietnam-carrier-vietnam/u-s-carrier-arrives-in-vietnam-amid-rising-chinese-influence-in-region-idUSKBN1GH0HL) The god if irony had a heart attacks when he heard of that ;D So why is Venezuela not cutting all the ties with the US? Probably because of the fact that despite all that propaganda about embargo and sanctions, it runs a trade excedent with the US? It's pretty easy to label the US as evil and blame it for everything, it's the coolest # this century, it's pretty damn hard to explain with fact why Venezuela is the only one experiencing this. Why is not Norway in the same situation? Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: magneto on August 24, 2018, 11:48:29 PM Pegging their national currency to Petro doesn't really do much to help.
It still relies on the price of oil to rise or at least stabilise in order for this to function. Also, don't forget that Petros are state owned, which means that they can essentially issue as much as they want if such drastic measures are called for. The hyperinflation crisis has been going on for ages now in Venezuela, and has no signs of stopping any time soon. I don't think that this is a viable solution by simply pegging it to another central bank issued currency, but bitcoin could definitely be useful to Venezuelans who want to store their wealth in the long run without having to worry about inflation. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: UNOE on August 24, 2018, 11:51:55 PM Venezuelans are started accepting Dash in their stores, so when your local currency is not good store of value, then cryptocurrencies could be good option. I hope that we do not need to wait Venezuelan scenario for cryptocurrencies adoption.
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: drm on August 25, 2018, 12:28:27 AM Venezuelans are started accepting Dash in their stores, so when your local currency is not good store of value, then cryptocurrencies could be good option. I hope that we do not need to wait Venezuelan scenario for cryptocurrencies adoption. They are honestly better off accepting bitcoin, instead of dash. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: Phil315 on August 25, 2018, 03:16:30 AM I don't think the government is actually getting everything right. There is no way they can force a crypto price on people. It will be determined by the market.
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: Lucius on August 25, 2018, 10:35:53 AM Venezuela has "heavy oil" that requires significant additonal treatments to make it useable. Quote Heavy oil usually contains significantly higher contents of asphaltenes The presence of asphaltenes, chemically altered fragments of organic chemical compounds, in oil can greatly complicate the production process. Subsequently, certain asphaltene elements require that the heavy oil also undergo a special refining process called deasphalting. The chemical composition of asphaltenes can consist of various amounts of sulphur, oxygen, hydrogen, nitrogen, carbon, and the heavy metals nickel and vanadium and are widely recognized as soluble. Thanks for this info, this somehow explains why a country rich in oil does not profit from it, or we may say that very small % of people make some profit, but but the rest of the population gets only crumbs. Of course there are also economic sanctions from USA, all in all a very bad situation. Its actually because, nobody wants a real revolution... The things are so bad in Venezuela that there are only two solutions -pray to the great Karhu that oil prices go up -massive cuts in government spending And since the first one is pretty obvious it won't work the second threatens millions of government employees. They won't let a revolution happen, they cling to their positions which at least now it grants them a bit of food, they will do anything to prevent it. With the support of those, with the military that is also dependent on government paychecks, with the support of fanatics that still believe the US is to blame for it, with the silence of the many that indirectly depend on the former and the fear of change from others...nothing will change. Even the opposition knows that even with Maduro gone, the way back out of this mess will be even harder than what's happening now. The only thing we will see in Venezuela is how the end of a country looks like. I would not say no one wants a revolution, but when millions of dissatisfied people leave the country those who stay are just too week to begin some changes. As you say it would be necessary that all people decide to go out on the streets, but those on government paycheck are just in fear of losing what little they have. But situation will touch the bottom at one point, something will have to change - if not by citizens in Venezuela then maybe with some outside help. We've all seen how "democracy" is introduced in Iraq, Afganistan, Syria and some other countries... Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: stompix on August 25, 2018, 11:26:31 AM something will have to change - if not by citizens in Venezuela then maybe with some outside help. We've all seen how "democracy" is introduced in Iraq, Afganistan, Syria and some other countries... Funny that you name 3 countries where socialism was introduced so peacefully by the URSS before the events you refer to /sarcasm But situation will touch the bottom at one point, something will have to change - No, it won't. There are tens of countries that are still dirt poor even with more resources than the whole of Europe and nothing is done. They keep on dying of hunger while fighting the evil westerners that want to plunder their resources.... Pegging their national currency to Petro doesn't really do much to help. They could have pegged it to whatever they wanted, to the euro to gold even to the USDT ;D The problem is how you maintain this value. What they've done is basically flood the market with another few million worths of $ coins (in theory) but with no money to back the value, so no wonder it will just make things worse...a lot worse. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: tomahawk9 on August 25, 2018, 05:10:44 PM Venezuela has "heavy oil" that requires significant additonal treatments to make it useable. Quote Heavy oil usually contains significantly higher contents of asphaltenes The presence of asphaltenes, chemically altered fragments of organic chemical compounds, in oil can greatly complicate the production process. Subsequently, certain asphaltene elements require that the heavy oil also undergo a special refining process called deasphalting. The chemical composition of asphaltenes can consist of various amounts of sulphur, oxygen, hydrogen, nitrogen, carbon, and the heavy metals nickel and vanadium and are widely recognized as soluble. Thanks for this info, this somehow explains why a country rich in oil does not profit from it, or we may say that very small % of people make some profit, but but the rest of the population gets only crumbs. Of course there are also economic sanctions from USA, all in all a very bad situation. The govt is unable to profit from the oil reserves simply because they destroyed PDVSA[1], the company in charge of refining and exporting oil in the country. Things went from bad to worse after Chávez died, not only the crude oil price has gone down over the last few years but PDVSA has had such a shit management under Maduro administration with some terrible policies that the company has started to import oil despite having large oil reserves. Things are so shit in this company that the oil workers have started to quit their jobs[2]. 1. https://www.forbes.com/sites/stevehanke/2017/03/06/venezuelas-pdvsa-the-worlds-worst-oil-company/ 2. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-venezuela-oil-workers-insight/under-military-rule-venezuela-oil-workers-quit-in-a-stampede-idUSKBN1HO0H9 Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: muslol67 on August 25, 2018, 05:46:58 PM Venezuela is having a hard time. I hope to recover soon. States can make economic mistakes. But it still has to attract people to get in trouble. Unfortunately, the hard days of Venezuelan citizens are waiting.
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: Akpuv on August 25, 2018, 06:01:54 PM The Venezuelan government really need to be careful with the way it is handling this its national cryptocurrency of a thing so that it doesn't plunge the entire country into financial crisis.
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: wxa7115 on August 26, 2018, 03:16:33 AM Venezuela is the perfect example of why stealing money from the productive members of society is not going to work for the long term, the government is trying every single thing they can think of to avoid their inevitable fate, in fact I am surprised the government is still in place when the economy is in such a bad shape.
If they cared about their citizens as much as they say they do Maduro and everyone in their government should quit immediately and accept whatever punishment the people imposed on them, but that is not going to happen, this is about power and if they need to destroy every single institution of Venezuela to keep their power that is what they will do. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: timerland on August 26, 2018, 04:34:46 AM Venezuela has obviously been in constant economic problems for a good amount of the decade.
By looking at this article, they seem to think that by having a national, centralized cryptocurrency to which they peg their fiat to will solve all the country's problems, which is far from the truth. Just because a peg exists, doesn't mean the government can't continue to print more and more Bolivars by the day. They can even create more Petro, if needed, without necessarily have to have an independent auditor to audit their reserves first. If you really believe that such a scheme is going to be successful, then you're just too naive. Venezuelans should not invest in the Petro token or keep any wealth in their currency, but rather, put it in something like bitcoin which is actually decentralized. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: chocolah29 on August 26, 2018, 07:19:23 AM Pegging their national currency to Petro doesn't really do much to help. Yes because as long as Petro is being controlled by the government it won't resolve anything from everything. Corruption is rampant and Petro will just end up like bolivar so nothing will be useful. Hunger and crimes will arise more and casualties and deaths will seen on the street. For once and for all, they needed a country that will step up from this and help them from their reserve and start all over again but of course US should be out of the picture first. When it's totally heart breaking seeing the kids suffer from hunger that could lead them to death. I hope Chavez can sleep soundly at night. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: zhanyiguai261315 on August 26, 2018, 11:13:40 AM Venezuela was originally a country with abundant resources, prosperous economy and strong national prosperity.
In just ten years, Venezuela has become a country with a sharp economic contraction, inflation, external debt, and extremely poor people's lives. The government of Venezuela is the biggest sinner! Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: ukloon on August 26, 2018, 11:19:25 AM It would have better if they have simply pegged the value to gold instead to ensure it is a more stable currency. At the very least peg it to the bitcoin! I'm sure that eventually the whole of the venezuelan economy will be crypto based, we will see the streets lined with prices in sats, petro, eth, and tether
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: wxa7115 on September 04, 2018, 09:09:51 PM Venezuela was originally a country with abundant resources, prosperous economy and strong national prosperity. The government of Venezuela is without a doubt guilty of everything that is happening in their country but at the same time the people that elected that government are also very guilty, the smart and productive people of Venezuela knew that the model that was being pushed by Hugo Chavez was never going to work.In just ten years, Venezuela has become a country with a sharp economic contraction, inflation, external debt, and extremely poor people's lives. The government of Venezuela is the biggest sinner! And yet people thought that the socialist model been implemented could work forever and we know that is not the case, you cannot steal the money, the time and the efforts of the productive people in society and hope that they will keep working as they did in the previous system, that would be slavery and people are not going to do what it's against their best interest, so many left the country and that is why there is such a shortage of basic products. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: xWolfx on September 05, 2018, 01:03:18 AM The huge inflationary rate was already there. However, it will get extremely crazy now.
Besides everything else they also "regulated" the prices of goods in a stupid way, setting them in insanely unrealistically low prices so it makes impossible for the private sector to sell them since they will be losing money. They said that they were going to help them with a part of the huge increase in minimum wage but it was a lie, they still didn't communicate any real measurements to them still. Also, it feeds the black market since a lot of people who resell the food went to the supermarkets who are still standing and raided them, for that reason now they are almost empty. Things are definitely not looking good for Venezuela. And it will get a lot worse if a big change don't appear soon. The only ones happy are the big amount of corrupts inside the country. Just to give you a reference, outside the unrealistic dollar price the dictatorship set. The real price for $1 in Bolivares it's around 13.000.000.000. For now. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: Indrawan77 on September 05, 2018, 05:27:18 AM I think Maduro is using everything he can to save the country, but the inflation has been gone to deep, the people are having difficulty to fulfill their basic need, using crypto as the savior can be double edge sword, in short it maybe can save the country, but in long term it will create new problem, but Maduro step need to be appreciated
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: The Sceptical Chymist on September 09, 2018, 05:51:21 PM This subject is so interesting and crypto related that I can't believe nobody wants to say anything. You got that right, bud. Economics is right behind Bitcoin/Altcoin Discussion in terms of mega spam threads. Not quite as bad as those sections, but still pretty bad.My topic is lost in the spam sea that the economics board became :/ As far as Venezuela goes, it's an interesting situation and there's some crypto news coming out of it. Looks like the number of merchants accepting Dash is increasing. Not sure why that particular coin is catching on, but I'm all for it. I think the Dash devs or whoever are trying to get more traction due to Venezuela's shitty economic condition. There are some good articles on it like this one (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwic35n_vK7dAhUFVN8KHfliCNEQFjAAegQILhAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.businessinsider.com%2Fdash-cryptocurrency-surges-in-venezuela-as-hyperinflation-explodes-2018-8&usg=AOvVaw39SlSC2vRhbOJRaCAl3C0U) and this one (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwic35n_vK7dAhUFVN8KHfliCNEQFjACegQIMBAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.coindesk.com%2Fdash-crypto-venezuela-zimbabwe%2F&usg=AOvVaw301E7t_yRfjxrpsDT5fBcZ). I know Dash has tons of haters, but I think overall it's a good sign for crypto adoption in general. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: Semosuchi Tesongrato on September 09, 2018, 08:56:37 PM A centralized cryptocurrency under government control is a contradiction in terms, so it doesn't make any sense.
Simply, Maduro is trying to save the savable, still deluding the population a little with an unrealistic proposal while preparing the escape plans. Too bad, Venezuela is a magnificent country and does not deserve the suffering it is going through due to incompetent and corrupt politicians. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: magneto on September 12, 2018, 08:59:25 AM A centralized cryptocurrency under government control is a contradiction in terms, so it doesn't make any sense. Simply, Maduro is trying to save the savable, still deluding the population a little with an unrealistic proposal while preparing the escape plans. Too bad, Venezuela is a magnificent country and does not deserve the suffering it is going through due to incompetent and corrupt politicians. Actually, centralised cryptocurrencies are not necessarily a contradiction. It's just that it makes no sense for anyone to make an investment or affiliation with any centralised cryptocurrencies because it essentially is the same as any other fiat. I honestly don't see where Maduro is trying to go with the Petro other than trying to lure in investment from overseas to finance their regime and escape sanctions, potentially. The thing with Bolivar pegged to Petro is that Petro is not backed by actual oil reserves, but land that has unmined oil reserves which need significant investment in mining to actually dig out of the ground. Tying the bolivar to this centralised asset will do nothing to help the hyperinflation going on within the country at the moment, in my opinion. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: bitmover on September 12, 2018, 12:05:38 PM A centralized cryptocurrency under government control is a contradiction in terms, so it doesn't make any sense. Simply, Maduro is trying to save the savable, still deluding the population a little with an unrealistic proposal while preparing the escape plans. Too bad, Venezuela is a magnificent country and does not deserve the suffering it is going through due to incompetent and corrupt politicians. Actually, centralised cryptocurrencies are not necessarily a contradiction. It's just that it makes no sense for anyone to make an investment or affiliation with any centralised cryptocurrencies because it essentially is the same as any other fiat. I honestly don't see where Maduro is trying to go with the Petro other than trying to lure in investment from overseas to finance their regime and escape sanctions, potentially. The thing with Bolivar pegged to Petro is that Petro is not backed by actual oil reserves, but land that has unmined oil reserves which need significant investment in mining to actually dig out of the ground. Tying the bolivar to this centralised asset will do nothing to help the hyperinflation going on within the country at the moment, in my opinion. I agrre that it's not a contradiction. Decentralized cryptocurrencies are important to be more resilient against government's interference. As petrol is made by the government, it makes more sense to make it centralized. I believe you are right too about petrol being just a way to finance his own broken government Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: drm on September 12, 2018, 12:40:08 PM It would have better if they have simply pegged the value to gold instead to ensure it is a more stable currency. At the very least peg it to the bitcoin! I'm sure that eventually the whole of the venezuelan economy will be crypto based, we will see the streets lined with prices in sats, petro, eth, and tether I can't take this "state crypto" serious, but I do think that just the technology being used is a step in the right direction. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: Andrej Peiboski on September 12, 2018, 11:35:12 PM Well, but then in this case there is no difference with any other fiat.
If the government controls money and regulates the issue, I do not understand the difference A centralized cryptocurrency under government control is a contradiction in terms, so it doesn't make any sense. Simply, Maduro is trying to save the savable, still deluding the population a little with an unrealistic proposal while preparing the escape plans. Too bad, Venezuela is a magnificent country and does not deserve the suffering it is going through due to incompetent and corrupt politicians. Actually, centralised cryptocurrencies are not necessarily a contradiction. It's just that it makes no sense for anyone to make an investment or affiliation with any centralised cryptocurrencies because it essentially is the same as any other fiat. I honestly don't see where Maduro is trying to go with the Petro other than trying to lure in investment from overseas to finance their regime and escape sanctions, potentially. The thing with Bolivar pegged to Petro is that Petro is not backed by actual oil reserves, but land that has unmined oil reserves which need significant investment in mining to actually dig out of the ground. Tying the bolivar to this centralised asset will do nothing to help the hyperinflation going on within the country at the moment, in my opinion. I agrre that it's not a contradiction. Decentralized cryptocurrencies are important to be more resilient against government's interference. As petrol is made by the government, it makes more sense to make it centralized. I believe you are right too about petrol being just a way to finance his own broken government Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: cescudero95 on September 13, 2018, 12:18:42 AM A real tragedy of socialism, it had been fueled by oil before the prices fell over the last couple of years.
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: Cryptoworld4 on September 13, 2018, 12:45:46 AM The government of Venezuela should take caution on how they go about this cryptocurrency for the country so that it does not throw the country into deeper recession.
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: Leyss on September 13, 2018, 03:53:09 AM An interesting attempt by President Maduro to downplay the role of the dollar in the country. He understands that traditional methods can not be done and started experimenting with crypto currency. I do not know if he is an economic man, but the experiment is interesting. True, in case of failure, the whole people will suffer.
Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: believe in BTC on October 10, 2018, 12:40:53 PM It would have better if they have simply pegged the value to gold instead to ensure it is a more stable currency. At the very least peg it to the bitcoin! I'm sure that eventually the whole of the venezuelan economy will be crypto based, we will see the streets lined with prices in sats, petro, eth, and tether Can we call it a crypto? Just because it is a digital currency or e-money of the government can it be called crypto? I do not like to call all of this crypto out of thin air. You can grind playing world of Warcraft or eve online and make money and than sell that money to fiat currency, would that make eve online in game currency a crypto? It is digital after all and can be turned to fiat currency, if these two are enough to call it a crypto currency than eve online money is crypto currency is that it? Just because Venezuela created a digital currency, that doesn't make it crypto if you ask me.Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: lightcar on October 10, 2018, 12:58:15 PM Venezuela was originally a country with abundant resources, prosperous economy and strong national prosperity. In just ten years, Venezuela has become a country with a sharp economic contraction, inflation, external debt, and extremely poor people's lives. The government of Venezuela is the biggest sinner! Ya, Venezuela has all the natural resources that it needs. The problem is the government which is mismanaging the resources. The people no longer trust government currency and any state crypto that is created will not be adopted. They will continue to use decentralized coins like bitcoin on the dark markets. Title: Re: Venezuela In Chaos - Massive 95% Devaluation -new Bolivar pegged to state crypto Post by: nur rochid on October 10, 2018, 01:47:45 PM Venezuela was originally a country with abundant resources, prosperous economy and strong national prosperity. In just ten years, Venezuela has become a country with a sharp economic contraction, inflation, external debt, and extremely poor people's lives. The government of Venezuela is the biggest sinner! Ya, Venezuela has all the natural resources that it needs. The problem is the government which is mismanaging the resources. The people no longer trust government currency and any state crypto that is created will not be adopted. They will continue to use decentralized coins like bitcoin on the dark markets. |